Summoner pet egi's are a disgrace to the job!

[D_C]

/Sigh

Another day, another wannabe "summoner".

Another day, another “summoner” that accepts that just ‘cause they been eatin’ shite this long, it’d be a shame ta stop now. Sure it’s a design that’s been around for a long while, but seeing as yer complainin’ about the constant complaints, you know the backlash against the stupid design is just as old.

As someone who has gotten ta 70 an’ really enjoys certain aspects o’ this class, I agree wit Chris. Summoner bein’ based offa DoT class was always a fine idea, but it struggled ta find a ‘payoff’ that it finally got in HW, which was only furthered by the bahamut summon in SB. That concept is, what I and a lotta other people, think summoner should be more like.

The pets are boring. Not just visually. Ya don’t utilize ‘em enough. They’re just another DoT, but fancier, an’ with crap AI. What would ya miss if they were gone? Further ruin? Tie it ta Miasma ticks. Devotion? Make it from the summoner. ALL of their abilities would be better served bein’ from you instead.

That said...! I don’t think the class should change drastically just ‘cause I want it to. Plenty of people like Warlock how it is. Maybe make a Caller job an’ split it up that way.

[Exodus-E]

Snip.

Once again, another idea that would limit us even further as to what we could actually summon (in your case, limiting us to ARR's Primals), instead of taking into account every other one introduced post-Heavensward.

That said, I agree that the last thing we'd need would be a purely aesthetic glamour without including its own effects (like what you said: Shiva using Inferno).
Can you imagine the outcry that would make?

We shall see in due time if future, proper Egi glamours actually have some effort put into them (elements, signature attacks, etc.)...

Snip.

The problem here is that those that do the complaining against this game's "implementation" of the job tend to forget/ignore crucial things about it.
Things such as the job's lore and its (mechanical) integration within the game.

The very concept of "Summoner" is not that it "summons" actual Primals. Like, at all (remember that most of the "summons" in this game are hostile and all of them slowly killing the planet).
What they do is create aetherial constructs based off the essence of a given Primal at the moment of their dispersion.
That's been hammered unto our heads over and over (in both, the game proper, and the Encyclopedia Eorzea).

Can you imagine having to re-work (from the ground up) the entire job in both, game-play and associated lore at this point?
Bards had a pass because their songs were still the same; just handled differently.
Here, we'd have to change the official artwork, the NPC's dialogue lines/combat behavior, Egi models, etc.

Again, it'd be like asking to remove fairies from Scholars (and/or changing them into another role).

One way or another, Egis (as both, concept and aesthetic designs) are here to stay.
Now whether there will be more "alternatives" to summoning (like the Trances -> Demi-Primals) or reworks around the idea, it's something else entirely.

[Delily]

Everyone wants a variety of egi's to be available and to do so summons could be a 30sec. or 1min duration. As the egi is present it fights using auto-atks/spells and assorted abilties as the egi is fixing to disspate it launches its ultimate move and then is gone, going out with a bang. No more enkindle to activate. Also as egi's are present they can generate a certain amount of enmity to draw aggro over the summoner regardless if caster/melee/tank type because after all a primal essence demands attention due to its powerful nature.
With this concept you can add many different egi's without using glamour while having more types and visual abilties to make the job great. This would be more similar to the demi Bahamut style just more refined.

You'e just described a modification of XI's summoner. There are reason the devs didn't implement that.

[Sylvain]

snip

I don't know what they'll do for 5.0 but I really like the path they ve chosen for the smn. Much more than the pet/dot like like job it used to be in ARR (I mean, we still have a pet but having demibahamut put things into perspective)

Altough it would purely be for visual pleasure, I'd like rouse to increase the pet size and change its appearance to be closer to the actual primal and more threatening. (a weaker demi bahamut feeling)

It would also be nice if we'd get another kind of super move the pet can do. But much cooler than doing a small fireshockwave or burst of wind.

Heck, I wouldn't mind if they'd actually make the egi work more like the bard song where you'd alternate which one you summon. They'd stay for a short period of time and do extensive damage.

[AnimaAnimus]

B) doesn't know that the whole "Egi" concept (and overall design choice) is backed up by this game/universe's lore.

Not taking sides here (I hate egi too tho, they are just awful) but....

lore is always a poor argument. The devs literally write the lore and can change it at any time for any reason and they do, often and at a whim. Sometimes either retconning something or just flat out ignoring it.

Whenever someone says "SE cant do <insert random thing here> cause lore!" its facepalm worthy. Lore literally has no meaning, they could make you a dinosaur with an arm coming out of your belly button, a peg leg and two heads and it would still fit the "lore" if they wanted it to. It's time to admit, they do a swing and a miss sometimes.

[Kaimishi]

I wish egis were reworked to be integrated in the job itself. However, I really don't see how they would implement that in the rotation. Maybe during the transition from 2nd DWT to bahamut but else, we're kind of busy already. What I would like to see tho, is a semi-obey where you could have radiant shield and contagion on obey mode while the rest is set to sic.

[gumas]

If by cool you mean you want your egi look like bahamut summon all the time or maybe like primal garuda or ifrit then you can forget that part at least. Because a lot of people will complain about your egi blocking their view and seeing a horde of summoner in town with their super size egi idling in town make it look like we are playing somekind of cheap F2P mmo.

[Neela]

What I would like to see tho, is a semi-obey where you could have radiant shield and contagion on obey mode while the rest is set to sic.

hell no!... we need better interaction with egis not even less... "semi-obey" cmn... this would be mega lame. I guess you are one of the Sicfrit ones as well hm...? q.q

[Dyvid]

I know! Let's completely tear down a core job and redesign it completely! I'm sure nobody in the community would hate that right? MMO's do it all the time without any backlash from the playerbase...... Seriously get over it. Summoner is Summoner in FFXIV and 4.0 did a lot of changes to the job to make it more pet focus and add more interesting pet designs. Most of this changes should have been for 3.0 but what's done is done. Maybe people are too new to remember the why to the way SMN is.

[EllieShadeflare]

lore is always a poor argument. The devs literally write the lore and can change it at any time for any reason and they do, often and at a whim. Sometimes either retconning something or just flat out ignoring it.

Whenever someone says "SE cant do <insert random thing here> cause lore!" its facepalm worthy. Lore literally has no meaning, they could make you a dinosaur with an arm coming out of your belly button, a peg leg and two heads and it would still fit the "lore" if they wanted it to. It's time to admit, they do a swing and a miss sometimes.

Yes, sure, disregard lore and only focus on gameplay. I'm pretty sure that turned out well when Blizzard decided to turn Thrall into a messiah and left an angry, frothing bigot as a commander just so that there could be another Alliance Vs. Horde conflict, and part of which made one of the most likable and most tolerant characters, Jaina Proudmoore, turn into another angry, frothing bigot, only human. [/s] Or when Warhammer Fantasy was almost entirely scrapped and turned into Age of Sigmar.[/s] Or when it was revealed that Principal Seymour Skinner was really some chucklehead named Armin Tamzarian.[/s]

Okay, only the WoW one was really a MMO one, but you get my point. Continuity matters to many people, and deciding to throw that away will kill off your audience's belief that there's any good will in your creation.

People enjoy the thought and care that the developers and the lore writers put into creating FFXIV. It's what seperates Eorzea from Azeroth (and whereever the hell Blizzard takes those players next), Nirn (the world of Elder Scrolls) and Vana'diel (FFXI) and why people choose those games over others and why people choose FFXIV vs. those games. Because each game has a different setting that people really sink their devotion into.

Deciding to say "Screw the lore! I wanna do it anyway!" is basically jumping the shark, and nobody wants to do THAT. Unless, of course, you have no respect for what you're making.

I'd suggest making SMN's Egis work more like a combination of Demi-Bahamut and the stance dance of BRD, and give Titan something to do that ISN'T just tanking in solo content.