New Lucky Bancho Census 12/1/17

[basketofseals]

Were you just making a general statement? I interpreted your reference to Warlords of Draenor as WoW losing subscriptions based primarily on their raid being too difficult, hence the comparison. If that wasn't the case, my apologies.

It looks like it's partly my fault. I was more trying to use that as an example of development resources being too focused on one vocal minority can easily cause problems. WoW's raids aren't too difficult. In fact at their lowest difficulty setting, they're even easier than FFXIV 24 man raids, but they still have a relatively low clear rate. What makes WoD a good example though is because raids were essentially the only completely developed content for the entire expansion. Nearly all other features were cut, dropped, or just otherwise under performed. From other's confusion it appears I just didn't explain myself well enough.

Because the original post in the chain isn't just blaming the dev's for making content aimed at a relatively small % of players. It's blaming the players that content was made for, which is insane.

I'm sorry, I didn't catch that. I would never think that players are the problem. In fact I'm very glad FFXIV got super savage even though it's the kind of super niche content that I'm wary about. It's nice that it's in the game. I just don't want it to be something the devs spend a lot of their time on. Unless of course it's beneficial to the game in other ways. There was a lot of twitch coverage on people doing Ultimate Coils, so maybe I'll have to wait and see how that turns out.

[loreleidiangelo]

It's a shame that Dzian's excellent point about reward longevity has been mostly dismissed as "XI nostalgia" and nothing more, because I actually think it's the right idea. "Stuff" doesn't have any feeling of permanence in this game. Why raid when you can play other games for 3-6 months and come back for two weeks and spam some faceroll stuff to get the same item level? Gear isn't a motivator for everybody, sure, but I guarantee it's a motivator for a decent number of people and right now a maybe 5% difference in output from BiS vs full tome gear isn't enough to make people give a crap.

Now, nobody HAS to raid, of course, but you can translate the same feeling over to crafting and whatnot too - investing in full max crafting "twenty-star craft capable" or whatever it is now doesn't have any damn permanence to it. Enjoy being the top of the food chain for three months (minus the time it took for you to get there even, of course), knowing that the devs will release a new pile of upgraded x values that render all your previous hard work meaningless.

I get that they're afraid that too many "walls" makes it hard for people who took a break to get reinvested again. But I have to wonder if they wouldn't have vastly better player retention if SE just made your hard work actually worth something for a while longer.

[BluexBird]

Not sure if it's been said, but I really like raiding. Even now, months after Deltascape Savage has been out, I still enjoy doing it. However, there's a problem:

99% OF THE PLAYERBASE DOESN'T WANT YOU IN THEIR PARTY AFTER YOU CLEARED IT!

You have to pretty much wait a whole week, or get lucky enough to find a party who doesn't want 2 chests. And this system pretty much KILLS it for people who like to raid. It basically makes it so that we only get to play 2-3 hours a week, and then we're done. The rest of the week is logging on and checking the Party Finder to see if there's any people looking for a 0-chest clear so that you can actually have some fun.

But raiding isn't the only thing, tho. I miss doing a lot of the older content the way it was meant to be played - synced. But now, everybody does it unsynced, as there's no real incentive to do it otherwise. Which SUCKS, seeing as how some people are looking for the challenge.

If only they made old content still relevant by implementing certain incentives towards syncing it, this would make the game lively again. I have a couple of ideas but I don't want to get into too much detail in this thread.

[odintius]

I don't bother looking for a raid group anymore the gear/reward itself doesn't interest me at all! I'll lot on whatever 230 drops that week and go play something else. I'm sure the challenge of it will be mention, but again I don't find the reward to keep repeating challenging content worth it to me. /Shrugs

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Not sure if it's been said, but I really like raiding. Even now, months after Deltascape Savage has been out, I still enjoy doing it. However, there's a problem:

99% OF THE PLAYERBASE DOESN'T WANT YOU IN THEIR PARTY AFTER YOU CLEARED IT!

You have to pretty much wait a whole week, or get lucky enough to find a party who doesn't want 2 chests. And this system pretty much KILLS it for people who like to raid. It basically makes it so that we only get to play 2-3 hours a week, and then we're done. The rest of the week is logging on and checking the Party Finder to see if there's any people looking for a 0-chest clear so that you can actually have some fun.

I have been complaining about this all tier. Because Savage has become borderline midcore content, many more PFs now want two chests even on a Monday. Even Creator had enough 0-1 chest parties just looking for their weeklies and you rarely see them nowadays. I understand they want to limit people carrying a friend to easy gear upgrades, but I wish they would change the system so 1-2 previously cleared players won't impact coffers. Two good players can only drag dead weight so far, thus SE wouldn't have to worry about sales and the like. It just sucks how if I feel like running alt jobs in actual difficult content, I'm mostly SoL

Also, heya Blue!

I get that they're afraid that too many "walls" makes it hard for people who took a break to get reinvested again. But I have to wonder if they wouldn't have vastly better player retention if SE just made your hard work actually worth something for a while longer.

I suspect it's that and how do you incentivize the next tier if all the current gear remains relevant? The latter of which I understand to an extent. If Omega 5-8 is tuned towards gear we already have, what's the reward for clearing it? Games like FFXI or even WoW get away with a more horizontal focus by gating progression behind enormously long grinds. If I recall, the Artifact equivalent WoW weapon you build takes ages to finally reach max level. Another side-effect of doing that is it promotes focusing on a single job since very few people will want to repeat said grind on multiple jobs. And you will be expected to have this better gear for raids.

Now I certainly want to argue FFXIV's system is better, especially I do find it a little stale. I just don't think arbitrarily adding length to gear tiers will accomplish much.

[HyoMinPark]

Not sure if it's been said, but I really like raiding. Even now, months after Deltascape Savage has been out, I still enjoy doing it. However, there's a problem:

99% OF THE PLAYERBASE DOESN'T WANT YOU IN THEIR PARTY AFTER YOU CLEARED IT!

You have to pretty much wait a whole week, or get lucky enough to find a party who doesn't want 2 chests. And this system pretty much KILLS it for people who like to raid. It basically makes it so that we only get to play 2-3 hours a week, and then we're done. The rest of the week is logging on and checking the Party Finder to see if there's any people looking for a 0-chest clear so that you can actually have some fun.

Not sure if you are interested in them or not, but there used to be speed/parse/for fun runs listed in the PF frequently for some of the floors. However, last I heard in one of the raiding discords I’m in, someone was going around reporting the PF owners for parsing/advertising “parse runs”, so people have stopped putting them up, or set them to private and give out PWs to interested players in the raiding discords.

But I know what you mean. Sometimes I would like to go back into a fight and do it again, either for funnsies or to try and get a good or better parse or to just work on my rotation for the fight, but everyone wants 2 chests. Even some of the first-time clear parties just want 2 chests so it’s kind of like, welp.... I understand wanting the gear but at the same time, makes it boring for raiders that have already cleared for the week and just want something to do.


Unrelated, but pretty sure you were in a V4S clear group I was in this weekend. You were a great WAR, btw. :3 It’s too bad that you weren’t our first WAR, because then we would have gotten the people that wanted a clear their clear. :/

[Mature]

I just cleared v4s yesterday with other 12 people. So add that on too please :V

[Dualgunner]

Not sure if you are interested in them or not, but there used to be speed/parse/for fun runs listed in the PF frequently for some of the floors. However, last I heard in one of the raiding discords I’m in, someone was going around reporting the PF owners for parsing/advertising “parse runs”, so people have stopped putting them up, or set them to private and give out PWs to interested players in the raiding discords.

This depresses me.

[BluexBird]

That would be great. 5+ clears: 0 chests. 3-4 clears: 1 chest. 0-2 clears: 2 chests. And in each of these cases, players who have already cleared can't roll for the items, even if they didn't get anything.

[Zeonsilt]

Not sure if it's been said, but I really like raiding. Even now, months after Deltascape Savage has been out, I still enjoy doing it. However, there's a problem:

99% OF THE PLAYERBASE DOESN'T WANT YOU IN THEIR PARTY AFTER YOU CLEARED IT!

You have to pretty much wait a whole week, or get lucky enough to find a party who doesn't want 2 chests. And this system pretty much KILLS it for people who like to raid. It basically makes it so that we only get to play 2-3 hours a week, and then we're done.

This is so true, damn.

My best IRL friend quit FF XIV simply because of this one reason. (he was a top-tier raider too)
He complained how he can only play about 2-3 hours per week in actual content and then there's nothing to do for him.

At first he wanted to buy a Jump potion and level another Ninja, but then he will play 4-6 hours per week and he gave up.
He's not interested in farming Susanoo 99 times and such "repeatable" activities for mounts/etc.

And another female friend of mine log-in 1 time per week, clears O1S-O4S in 3-4 hours and then i won't see her till another reset. She also told me "there's nothing to do" and i "should quit till 4.2 in late January".