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  1. #1
    Player
    Zetsumei_Tsunarashi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Shadowlord Server
    Posts
    1,601
    Character
    Zetsumei Tsunarashi
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Miyha View Post
    Literally everything you're questioning is addressed in the 30-50 and 60-70 DRK quests.
    I have done all the DRK quests. To me that narrative is not about justifying your actions, but merely points out the flaw in your character. The fact that you are a merciless killer who has no issue with taking action to appease your own sense of justice despite what effect it may have on others. It really just exemplifies the issue that I've brought up in the OP, but doesn't address the reasoning behind it.

    We do things we believe to be right, but not always with the full knowledge of the impact our actions will have on others. When faced with the realization that our actions have in fact caused suffering to someone, our character shrugs it off as if nothing happened, or withholds damning information in order "spare" the individual of further pain. What I'm questioning is whether or not our character actually feels remorse for what they have done, or if they in fact believe they are justified in doing the things they do despite sometimes having a negative impact on people's lives.

    In cases where your character might be faced with an internal moral struggle, we usually opt to kill first and ask questions later. This is what leads me to believe that our character is simply just a mindless drone with no moral compass to speak of whatsoever. After all, we are Hydaelyn's chosen warrior and our purpose is to serve her will. It could be that our character does not in fact have a will of their own, and we are merely Hydaelyn's thralls. In much the same way that Minfillia has become merely a puppet through which Hydaelyn speaks to us, we are merely a puppet through which Hydaelyn's will is done.
    (1)
    Last edited by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi; 08-28-2017 at 04:19 AM.

  2. #2
    Player Dualgunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,942
    Character
    Lilila Lila
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    The real question: is your Warrior of Light a mindless killer? Because mine isn't. I'm somewhat picky and choosy about which quests I consider canon, with MSQ being always canon, and sidequests never being canon unless its a chain that I really liked and felt would have an impact on her, like going out of her way to help cure a friend of the voidsent plague in the aftermath of the Shisui dungeon.
    (4)

  3. #3
    Player
    Mysterysword's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    735
    Character
    Siesta Fiesta
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 80
    The fun part is: The Warrior of Light is a mindless drone, beholden in service to someone else's will. That someone being you, the player. Every step the WoL makes, everything they do, everything they say, every fight they get into, every attack they make, it's all decided by you. You were the one who decided to take on that sidequest, to talk to that NPC, to fly up that cliff and poke around those nests and kill that mother bird.
    (10)

  4. #4
    Player
    Zetsumei_Tsunarashi's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Shadowlord Server
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    1,601
    Character
    Zetsumei Tsunarashi
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterysword View Post
    The fun part is: The Warrior of Light is a mindless drone, beholden in service to someone else's will. That someone being you, the player. Every step the WoL makes, everything they do, everything they say, every fight they get into, every attack they make, it's all decided by you. You were the one who decided to take on that sidequest, to talk to that NPC, to fly up that cliff and poke around those nests and kill that mother bird.
    You can look at it that way, and see what you want to see. I'm looking at it from a purely narrative perspective. Assuming that the WoL is his/her own person, and that each action taken was their own doing.

    You also have to assume that the WoL accepts all tasks given to them, because from a narrative stand point, you can't experience the whole story if you ignore some of the quests. It would be like skipping pages in a book because you didn't like what the character did on those pages.
    (1)
    Last edited by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi; 08-28-2017 at 06:47 AM.

  5. #5
    Player
    Miyha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    The Azim Steppe
    Posts
    290
    Character
    Miyha Manaya
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi View Post
    You can look at it that way, and see what you want to see. I'm looking at it from a purely narrative perspective. Assuming that the WoL is his/her own person, and that each action taken was their own doing.
    If everything like this was fleshed out and apparent for you then there would be no point in having the WoL be your own character. If you wanted something deeper/more direct than what the DRK quests had to offer, an exact answer as to why or their reasoning or a deeper justification, then you may as well play a RPG with a fully developed, "pre-made" character as the protagonist. Your character is yours: they leave some of this vague/open to interpretation on purpose. If they layed all of this out there would be absolutely zero room to make your character your own, and I can see a lot more people upset over the fact that they can't decide for themselves what their motivations are, or how to justify what they must do.

    It's a MMO, but it's also a Final Fantasy game. They're trying to strike a balance between having a set story to follow and having it progress in a certain way while also trying to allow some kind of creative agency to the players of their own unique characters. Because it's still a MMO, you really can't take everything at face value or look at everything "purely from a narrative perspective", as you put it.

    I short, you decide what your character's reasoning is. You decide their motivations, how to justify their actions. If you think they're a mindless killer or drone, they are. If not? Choose another path.

    Also... sidequests are... sidequests. It's a MMO. There are lots of "kill x amount of y" quests in MMOs. I never really took them as being any significant part of the story or the WoL's (or rather, my WoL's) development. There is plenty of room for you to make your character more than the "mindless killing drone" you're describing. Your questions regarding Hydaelyn and such will likely be answered as the story progresses, but expect some level of vagueness to remain.
    (13)


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  6. #6
    Player
    Kohdo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    387
    Character
    Kodoyaki Takoyaki
    World
    Sephirot
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 64
    Friendly reminder that the Garlean Empire did nothing wrong.
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player
    Cilia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The Hermit's Hovel
    Posts
    3,713
    Character
    Trpimir Ratyasch
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Zetsumei_Tsunarashi View Post
    I have done all the DRK quests. To me that narrative is not about justifying your actions, but merely points out the flaw in your character. The fact that you are a merciless killer who has no issue with taking action to appease your own sense of justice despite what effect it may have on others. It really just exemplifies the issue that I've brought up in the OP, but doesn't address the reasoning behind it.

    We do things we believe to be right, but not always with the full knowledge of the impact our actions will have on others. When faced with the realization that our actions have in fact caused suffering to someone, our character shrugs it off as if nothing happened, or withholds damning information in order "spare" the individual of further pain. What I'm questioning is whether or not our character actually feels remorse for what they have done, or if they in fact believe they are justified in doing the things they do despite sometimes having a negative impact on people's lives.
    The 60 - 70 DRK questline directly addresses the negative impact our actions have had on the lives of others and our regret about things turning out the way they did. As Thancred bluntly points out to Emmanellain, you make your choice and live with the consequences. If you choose to do nothing, the people you wish to protect may very well be harmed or killed, and it will be your fault. Indirectly. With great power there must also come great responsibility.

    "Myste" from the 60 - 70 line is our doubt and remorse, not at how things turned out but that we were forced to do what we were to try and minimize the suffering. You can't predict the consequences of every action, what we do is with the best of intentions, and is generally meant to minimize suffering and death. Our personal moral purity is a small sacrifice to make for that.

    As for sidequests? Nobody's forcing you to do any of them. You don't have to agree to assist that guy in getting the stuff from the bird nests. You don't have to kill the birds (you can always run away). You. Choose. To. You, the player.

    Please play Spec Ops: The Line if you have not done so. It really examines this issue in great detail.
    (12)
    Trpimir Ratyasch's Way Status (7.4 - End)
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    "There is no hope in stubbornly clinging to the past. It is our duty to face the future and march onward, not retreat inward." -Sovetsky Soyuz, Azur Lane: Snowrealm Peregrination