My absence and return - thoughts on demolished houses

[Dark-Saviour]

Your quote has absolutely nothing to do with his comment. :X Pretty sure he is referring to the following:

I'm aware. It was just another example of them blatantly contradicting the initial concept for housing.

[C-croft]

I can be mad at SE for choosing a solution that severely punishes players, when it never had to be that way, when they promised it would never be that way. SE decided to demo houses to take care of their other issues, and SE deleted the content. So I decided not to pay for the game any longer, unable to support such a terrible design. You can say that was "my choice" all you want, but SE developed and implemented that strategy. I was not the one who deleted my content. Just because they said they were going to do it does not absolve them of any wrong-doing.

But it does absolve them because they gave you recourse. Look I read through the thread and I knew what to expect and found it. You made the choice, willingly let it go. They said you can get your stuff plus 80% of you investment, and you declined. It sucks that they had to make the decision to change the way housing was done. It's terrible for everyone. But it happens. The fact that you and others in this thread are upset about the change is clear. And I agree, I get it. However, design changes are always a necessity.

But that is a different issue. You need to acknowledge your lack of responsibility. You say you willingly let this happen. You put your money where your mouth is. Your choice left you with loss, compounded by your own choice to let your stuff then get deleted. This wasn't a surprise but your own act of free will to disregard the warnings. And now, you have come back to voice your distaste with the system. Much of this thread is wasted due to your "second and most important point" in your OP. Had you left it out, this whole topic would have been better presented and we wouldn't be having these posts of people saying too bad so sad. You posted a choice that you made and want to blame SE for your own shortcomings. Other than that I agree with some of you guys, housing isn't in the best of places.

On a side note, I don't think people understand just how much work goes into system changes. It's not like you can just flip a switch and the system changes for you. This is a universal fact. Video games, banking, google, even your local high school's network. It takes way more work than people realize. That is why changes happen so often in all facets of technology and design. And once the design change has been settled on, it gets pushed through. If you deal in technology and networks, systems, ERP, you know what I am talking about.

[Skivvy]

I'm aware. It was just another example of them blatantly contradicting the initial concept for housing.

Oh, sorry! I whooshed on that one I guess :X

[C-croft]

Oh, sorry! I whooshed on that one I guess :X

Nah it should have been clarified a little better, but now that he clarified it makes sense.

[Geryth]

But that is a different issue. You need to acknowledge your lack of responsibility. You say you willingly let this happen. You put your money where your mouth is. Your choice left you with loss, compounded by your own choice to let your stuff then get deleted. This wasn't a surprise but your own act of free will to disregard the warnings. And now, you have come back to voice your distaste with the system. Much of this thread is wasted due to your "second and most important point" in your OP. Had you left it out, this whole topic would have been better presented and we wouldn't be having these posts of people saying too bad so sad. You posted a choice that you made and want to blame SE for your own shortcomings. Other than that I agree with some of you guys, housing isn't in the best of places.

Just a difference of opinion, then. I don't feel like I've had any "lack of responsibility" on this issue. I let my house get deleted and I own that. And I put SE's feet to the fire with my financial decisions. And I'm staring back at the game, wanting to play it, but there's a heap of ashes that used to represent hours of work, care, and fun. It's not the best of strategies to reclaim players who left. That's all I'm saying.

On a side note, I don't think people understand just how much work goes into system changes. It's not like you can just flip a switch and the system changes for you. This is a universal fact. Video games, banking, google, even your local high school's network. It takes way more work than people realize. That is why changes happen so often in all facets of technology and design. And once the design change has been settled on, it gets pushed through. If you deal in technology and networks, systems, ERP, you know what I am talking about.

I do understand, I'm a programmer who has designed and coded projects big and small for the past 7 years, and I work closely with end users to find and fix bugs and make the enhancements they want. I'm involved in the process from inception to delivery. And I strongly believe SE took a half-ass easy way out, and really hurt thousands of their players.

[C-croft]

I do understand, I'm a programmer who has designed and coded projects big and small for the past 7 years, and I work closely with end users to find and fix bugs and make the enhancements they want. I'm involved in the process from inception to delivery. And I strongly believe SE took a half-ass easy way out, and really hurt thousands of their players.

The side note was mainly for people who expect a fix now as if switching to instanced housing would actually fix anything. Both systems have their pros and cons, and SE happened to go with the current housing. With that said, I am sure you also understand the concept of vision for their 'system' and if you look at it as a single item, it may look half ass to you, but it was meant to be a piece of a puzzle to fit in with the rest of the game. Their band aids on the problem, some of them are definitely half ass.

[Moonlite]

instanced housing? thats literally what people DON'T want in a housing system.. people want actual plots, actual space, and an actual neighbourhood. many other games have fully instanced housing and those feel like a single player housing simulator rather than housing in an mmo. ffxiv has 1 of the better mmo housing system.

secondly, housing is luxury, something you never need in the game, and something that only 10% of players have, while like 80% of players want, theres a huge demand for them.. as someone waiting to buy a house, i can't wait to see plots get demolished lol..

You and I completely disagree about housing. The idea people want neighborhoods is also a bit of an untruth considering apartments give you no more a community feel then going to an inn room.


Also why if it is a luxury, does SE advertise it as a game feature? Do you seriously believe that only 10% of players should have a house? I am honestly, not sarcastic, 100% confused by that statement. Where does that come from locking players out of game features. If they had a skill threshold that only 10% of players could get, I am fine with skill gates. You can't do the next floor until you finish the last floor. But arbitrary 10%, just because we can't design any better.

[Geryth]

The side note was mainly for people who expect a fix now as if switching to instanced housing would actually fix anything. Both systems have their pros and cons, and SE happened to go with the current housing. With that said, I am sure you also understand the concept of vision for their 'system' and if you look at it as a single item, it may look half ass to you, but it was meant to be a piece of a puzzle to fit in with the rest of the game. Their band aids on the problem, some of them are definitely half ass.

I can accept that maybe my perception on their decision has been through a bit of tunnel vision and that maybe they had a bigger picture they are still working on or something that had to be scrapped. But as a developer, my biggest pet peeves against my peers are when they code half-assed projects simply because doing it "the right way" is hard. Doing it right, despite the difficulty, is always better for everyone.

And I'm actually giving SE the benefit of the doubt by believing that they did what they did because changing what was there was more of a technical feat than they wanted to deal with. Part of me believes it was a malicious design with the goal of keeping players subscribed, and if it were possible to confirm that, I'd never give them another dime.

[Paladinleeds]

Also why if it is a luxury, does SE advertise it as a game feature? Do you seriously believe that only 10% of players should have a house? I am honestly, not sarcastic, 100% confused by that statement. Where does that come from locking players out of game features. If they had a skill threshold that only 10% of players could get, I am fine with skill gates. You can't do the next floor until you finish the last floor. But arbitrary 10%, just because we can't design any better.

Exactly. And there are game features such as cross-breeding and workshops (FC only), locked behind such a limited resource. Want to cross-breed? Better hope you can get a house. Want to get company airships going? Better hope your FC can get a house. If we must keep the current community feel of wards, then convert the wards to instances (so they're only generated as people enter them, plus with the bonus of if everyone leaves the ward, it degenerates it, freeing up some resources), and then get it so once a housing area (such as Mist) fills up entirely, generate a new ward automatically. Or maybe even make it so all housing areas must fill up first, then an extra ward is automatically generated to each. Apartments won't count towards this limit, and each new ward opened will not allow apartments until the previous ones all fill up.

Or, add instanced housing as an option for those that can't get neighbourhood housing. Upgrade apartments to have a little outdoor areas so you can put in a gardening patch for some cross-breeding (upgrade cottage/house/mansion to support 2/3/4 garden plots respectively to give the feel of the housing being more flexible), make it limited to 10 items (small house has 20), make it a stone floor (so less a garden and more a balcony type thing). Then add instanced housing for FCs that can't get a house. Similar restrictions to apartments if required to keep main houses better (but put a delivery moogle and a chocobo stable inside the instance in a fixed position).

There you go, 2 systems that can offer better housing options so more people can access it, but allowing the neighbourhood aspect to remain for those that want it. There's a potentially fair compromise there. But when gameplay features are ocked behind such a limited resource, there's a problem. And I honestly don't care if you think it should be limited for the sake of having a status symbol. If they make the gameplay elements (cross-breeding for all, FC wheels and workshops for FCs) available elsewhere for all, then we can talk about keeping them limited. But until then, a fix needs to be made for housing. Anything else is just locking out content for the sake of exclusivity.

EDIT: And before anyone calls out Savage as exclusive for the sake of exclusivity, not the same. There's nothing stopping anyone stepping foot into Savage and trying the content (other than ilvl), and learning and perfecting it. Super Savage is gonna be a slightly different story, but if you beat Savage (and let's be fair, with better gear it'll become easier), you can try Super Savage. That's not an arbitrary gate, that means anyone can try it if they dedicate themselves to it (disabilities notwithstanding). But housing is limited simply by how many wards SE can be bothered to generate and it is always extremely lower than demand. And they lock gameplay elements behind this arbitrary number of houses. Gameplay elements not covered by apartments.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

So not only did they create this terrible system, they explicitly said they wouldn't before they did.

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