Friction between casuals and raiders - One Lala's weird trick, GMs hate her!

[azura84]

I like the idea of the scoring, but I tend to agree with Nixxe in that it's implementation, as far as dungeons are concerned, seems minimal at best. Currently if you expect to speed run with DR you're out of your mind, if you want to speed run do it with friends who know what they're getting into. I don't suggest even with this system you should have the mindset that some random person on the internet is going to share you ideals even with a higher rank. I do see the merit in scoring, say total dmg dealt and total dmg taken comparatively with others, perhaps even rewards to those who push for a leader-board. But this is a very casual game even for the veterans and expecting more from DR or SE to change DR for this sake is kind of, no offense op, selfish regardless if you're MLG or Casual. Now if you're talking competitive content such as PvP or Savage then sure, I could see the utility in such a system, just don't hold your breathe with this dev team. Scrub friendly XIV!

[Sebazy]

Well, the point of a mentor is to help people that are struggling, so ideally you'd want to put them together with people of very low or negative scores while they put themselves on mentor status.

I'd have thought that people with particularly low ranks are equally as likely to simply not care about their personal contribution (They might just be mindlessly hitting a combo whilst watching netflix, that's not really something this system can figure out). Getting thrown in with mentors eager to 'help cure them of being bad' might run the risk of getting frustrating for both parties no?

The main issue with the rating idea IMO is: You need to make it somewhat elaborate.

If you only go off personal DPS, a DPS that does a perfect single-target rotation in small pulls will be rated lower than one that spams their AoE spell in a mass pull.

You misunderstand, this isn't meant to be a rating that reflects skill. A BLM would be a perfect example of this, performing and maintaining a perfect single target enochian rotation for the duration of an expert would be an incredible feat of timing and skill, but it'd also be painfully sub par for the purpose of the content at hand. At it's most basic level, Expert boils down to grinding away at a fixed HP pool that's more often than not spread across a significant number of targets, so whilst it may not be as challenging, doing a basic aoe rotation is generally going to be the optimal way to go and will yield the best results.

Your point regarding inter job synergy is very valid and frankly I don't think it's something that a system like this could ever account for without causing an issue somewhere else. Rather I think the better solution would be to go with the complete opposite option and keep it as simple as possible, let the law of averages sort it out.

Blizzard have built Overwatch around a ranking system at it's very core and it purveys through all facets of the game, yet I still occasionally end up playing against people who are good enough to effectively shut me out of the game. The same applies here (just in a much more subtle manner of course), this isn't ever going to be able to form flawless like minded groups that can swagger off into the sunset singing kum ba yah Rather it's a metric to try and ease off the extremes and reduce the likelihood of a keyboard turner getting thrown into the deep end against a pro level player.

It's not perfect, but I'd like to think it'd be an improvement over the absolute random anarchy we have right now.

[REPROBEAN_CHILD]

If the GMs hated you, you wouldn't be able to play the game, let alone post on the forums. Just sayin'

[Aramina]

Your heart is in the right place, but I think you are trying to fix a problem that doesn't actually exist. Yes there are complaints on the forums because human nature dictates that people more readily remember the negative than the positive, but within the game itself I really do not think the issues are as bad or nearly as frequent as it may seem at first glance.

[Ama_Hamada]

There is several issues with this.

1. Not all casuals are "toxic free" No matter how you word something to help someone, they will get toxic defensive.
2. Not all outsiders of the conversations are toxic free. I am not sure if this person would be called "raider" but they had some kind of end game status. My friend was trying to help this new person to the game who said "I got 50 yesterday" (we where in msq roulette) She was simply talking about how weapon is important even to a healer (had some level 45 NQ)and how it should be a goal to get all slots 110+ The person she was talking to was fine and asking questions and other things. Meanwhile this person who d/c came back and was laying there dead. This person was attempting to chew out my friend for advice giving while still laying somewhere dead and not releasing. At one point said "With as name like that you are an attention seeking person" and right after the boss fight we were in ended, the person was kicked
3. Not all "raiders" are elitist
4. If we assume this system can be perfect, then who will the "casuals" learn from?

If the GMs hated you, you wouldn't be able to play the game, let alone post on the forums. Just sayin'

its a joke based on those spam ads

[Sebazy]

The current setup simply throws people at a wall and lets them figure out what sticks. You yourself have made large numbers of posts mentioning elitist players that have chewed out more casual or newer individuals. Surely you'd be glad to see a system in place that takes some steps towards reducing the likelihood of putting people in that situation with conflicting play styles in the bread and butter roulette? Or do you genuinely prefer the current lottery situation despite your posts stating otherwise?

Regarding point 4, this is covered by the mentor system and is mentioned on page 2.

[thegreatonemal]

I'd be happy enough to see a simple performance grade at a dungeon/trials end (a boring old score you get in countless games, just for the user alone). Really with games, all people need is a little feedback, then they are spurred on to improve themselves. At the moment, there is zero feedback of any kind to encourage players to improve.

Improve for what though? Improve for what though? Players that want to get into raiding and harder content do it in one of two ways. They either do their research prior or just go into the content or the test things for said content and get stomped by it and then begin to look for ways to improve which for an MMO translates to either going to the official forums for that game or a top rated fan based site and look at a class guide. which you have to do for no other game genre because they all teach you how to play their games the tools to improve are in house and not hidden like they are in mmos. All these threads about this topic need to stop addressing the symptom and get right to the cause which is:

This game needs to teach rotations, no tool tips are not enough.

The devs balance their hardest content around those rotations why hide that rotation from your players

[Skyrior]

The whole point of roulettes is to encourage endgame players to help new players so they can clear content though.

If endgame players don't do old content, new players will have to suffer from longer queue times.

[Derio]

The point of a roulette was never so elite players can play with elite players.

[Ama_Hamada]

The current setup simply throws people at a wall and lets them figure out what sticks. You yourself have made large numbers of posts mentioning elitist players that have chewed out more casual or newer individuals. Surely you'd be glad to see a system in place that takes some steps towards reducing the likelihood of putting people in that situation with conflicting play styles in the bread and butter roulette? Or do you genuinely prefer the current lottery situation despite your posts stating otherwise?

Regarding point 4, this is covered by the mentor system and is mentioned on page 2.

lolno, more of my posts is newer people chewing out the experience over "do not tell me what to do/ my sub/etc" (unless there is a specific one I am not recalling at the moment?) That is why I had it as my first point, some newer people will not have a fun time with new people or other casuals that act like that. It is that or kick abuse from premades where the premade might be not experienced or doing it to troll, I saw that trying to do a thonk for relic on a different chr, my main. That was fun, seeing a tank MPK my friend who was the only one trying to kill the adds.