Healers that don't want to DPS are like DPSes who refuse to move out of AoEs.

[Vorx]

You can't really think in such a micro sense because the game isn't single-player, you're playing with so many other people who think /their/ way is the /best/ way, they're also paying their sub, so if 7 people say the 1 is wrong, does that make them wrong? But they're paying their sub too? it's almost impossible to come to a compromise where everyone agrees on something and that's the end of that.

It's still that person's money, does it suck for those who can't dodge or have crappy gear? Yes, but it's still their account NOT YOURS! So deal with it, or either leave or kick them. Don't complain and talk like you know the "right way" just makes you people look and sound like pompous A-holes.

[VeliusVire]

It's still that person's money, does it suck for those who can't dodge or have crappy gear? Yes, but it's still their account NOT YOURS! So deal with it, or either leave or kick them. Don't complain and talk like you know the "right way" just makes you people look and sound like pompous A-holes.

Well, to be fair, the /Right Way/ has Statistical evidence and data that /proves/ it's the right way. But that's not the point, the point is this game is never about /one/ person, and if that's how that person thinks, then there's the door and this isn't the game for them. When you play an MMO, you acknowledge that this is an expanded community of different voices and methods, but when it comes to /game mechanics/, then yes, there's usually the /correct/ way of doing things, as was proven through research. It's not pompous, it's fact.

[VeliusVire]

Alright, tone down the 2002 text style of random caps, you're looking childish. Secondly, I've never told anyone how to play, in fact, if you went back and actually used your eyes to read, you'd find that I'm not against anyone playing their own way but I do remind them that there /IS/ an optimal way to play. If that bothers you, that there's a best way of doing something, well then tough luck, that's not how life works and time for you to grow up. Before you come with such an accusatory tone with nary a shred of any intelligent debate, I recommend you take a look in a mirror and pick up a book and do educate yourself.

[VeliusVire]

What...the hell are you even saying? I'm genuinely confused right now, I've never /told/ anyone how to play, and if I have, I'd love to be quoted of where I'm directly attacking someone for not playing how I do. Just because something /works/ doesn't mean it's /optimal/. A BLM spamming Blizzard /works/ but it's not /optimal/. A PLD spamming Flash /works/ but it's not /optimal/. Do you see a pattern? You're demonising something meant with good intentions.

EDIT: And since you seem to be lacking in education, here, let me help [This is me /actually/ being pompous now]
optimal
ˈɒptɪm(ə)l/Submit
adjective
best or most favourable; optimum.
"seeking the optimal solution"

[Welsper59]

Alright, tone down the 2002 text style of random caps, you're looking childish. Secondly, I've never told anyone how to play, in fact, if you went back and actually used your eyes to read, you'd find that I'm not against anyone playing their own way but I do remind them that there /IS/ an optimal way to play. If that bothers you, that there's a best way of doing something, well then tough luck, that's not how life works and time for you to grow up. Before you come with such an accusatory tone with nary a shred of any intelligent debate, I recommend you take a look in a mirror and pick up a book and do educate yourself.

I'm fairly sure what he's trying to get at is that what is factually more effective, isn't always necessary. I actually think there's an implied misunderstood definition going on lol. You are arguing "optimal" and is apparently coming off as "mandatory", even if not intended to be. It's pretty easy to derive that conclusion when you define the optimal way as the "right" way, as you did earlier.

I think we can all agree though that min/maxing in XIV is ridiculously overrated in almost all content forms. I get that my mention of "min/max" might be looked at as though I'm saying to always perform to literally the best possible, where even a single point of DPS loss should be a shameful thing that would ruin the rest of your day, but outside of such an extreme... I think we'd find that realistic middle ground.

That being said, it really isn't a big deal if someone does or doesn't do something when it comes to DPSing as a healer. If doing your daily routine is resulting in wipes because healers are not DPSing, I'd argue something is wrong with your DPS (or tank). Likewise if those routine things take 20+ minutes longer, I'd strongly argue the same problems with the DPS themselves (or tank). Would it help for the healer to DPS? That should be obviously "yes". The problems that come up however overlook the primary issue of the party or showcase an illogical/unreasonable expectation for the situation. Not just of the players, since it's not that unreasonable to think someone should do a little more than minimum, but of their own objectives. Why is it a problem that they don't DPS? The answers are typically petty, with very few that actually matter to a given situation.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Again with the optimal, you elites are so full of yourselves..

Its not even about being optimal, its about being barely competent. If you can't do more dps at 60 than many could at 50, there's something wrong. At that point, you arent even part of the dungeon run anymore, and the run wouldnt slow down hardly at all without you.

[RaijinSupreme]

Its not even about being optimal, its about being barely competent. If you can do more dps at 60 than many could at 50, there's something wrong. At that point, you arent even part of the dungeon run anymore, and the run wouldnt slow down hardly at all without. you

except for like... if everyone died.

[ananda]

This is just a difference is what metric is used to measure what's "optimal". VeliusVire, you are probably measuring it as "resulting in the fastest run possible". Vorx is probably measuring it as "the most stress free run possible". I would say that both are valid metric, as long as both of you enjoy the game more by utilizing said metric. The problem comes when two players with different mindset are put together in the same party, which is the crux of the issue here.

[Lilyth]

Omg how is this debate still going. x_x

Just look at the facts:

- Does every healer have to DPS? No!

- Are healers who DPS (when there's nothing to heal) AND successfully keep their party alive objectively better healers? Yes!

These are the stone cold facts. Having said that, people can indeed play the way they want.

But, just like that, the rest of the community can freely choose whether to accept you in their party or not. If you eventually get dismissed from a group because of disagreements around the way you handle your class, you'll just have to suck it up and understand those are the consequences of your preferred playstyle. Not everyone has to agree with having you around as this have already been stated as a valid reason for kicking.
Simply go and find another group of people that are ok with you doing "X" or "Y", instead of complaining on the forums.

Now can we go back to Diadem ilvl280 weapon mentor rage pls.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

except for like... if everyone died.

I mean, losing a dps that isn't contributing at all might actually prevent everyone from dying.