Would you like an in-game parser?

[RobbieH]

I thought I made myself clear, that the parser would help you realize how changes to your rotation affect your DPS. Just because the numbers are 60 vs 80 doesn't mean you're not doing 33% more damage. It's a great feedback tool to tell you how you are doing as you level.

Before i start i'd like to say that so far you're the only one worth replying to, then i'd like to point out that these forums are indeed a bad place as stated in both in-game and reddit, it goes as follows:

- Someone disagrees with your ideas, gets burned alive
- People make an argument, others take it personally
- People skip arguments when they have nothing to counter them, or start going around in an attempt to dodge the argument
- People rarely read a big post, then they post one liners or whatever they can make an argument out of it leaving whatever they can't argument against behind.
- People find someone disagreeing with them and will like any post that's made against that person whether they have a point or not.

People learn by trial and error. You use logic and tooltips to think up ways to adjust your rotation and then you use feedback from a parser to determine if it made a difference.

Then can you explain me how i was taking aggro from Tanks as Monk in Binding Coil when there were no parsers (that i'm aware of)? Yes, tank aggro was buffed in a patch but i was the only one getting aggro in the static, i don't think i could possibly know if my DPS was good or not besides getting that aggro.

Considering you are advocating using logic, this is a fairly illogical conclusion. I am advocating that parsers will help the general community improve. Having the ability to improve doesn't mean that everyone is bad. That said, the vast majority of DF players do play poorly.

I never said everyone was bad, i simply said parsers won't make players much better.

How can you expect people to learn from parsers, parsers don't teach them rotations, guides or other players do.

Yeah ok, they do 1-2-3 and get 300DPS, now what?

Do you expect them to go from 1-2-3 to 15 button pressers by looking at the parser numbers?

It's not going to happen, from here they have two choices, they can go read/watch a guide and do some testing and/or they can start pressing more buttons.

The numbers might tell them that their DPS is bad, but no way they're going to become much better just with the numbers parses give them, looking at parsers advanced statistics is useless as well because those people probably don't have much clue on what they mean (yet).

I thought I made myself clear, that the parser would help you realize how changes to your rotation affect your DPS. Just because the numbers are 60 vs 80 doesn't mean you're not doing 33% more damage. It's a great feedback tool to tell you how you are doing as you level.


People learn by trial and error. You use logic and tooltips to think up ways to adjust your rotation and then you use feedback from a parser to determine if it made a difference.


Considering you are advocating using logic, this is a fairly illogical conclusion. I am advocating that parsers will help the general community improve. Having the ability to improve doesn't mean that everyone is bad. That said, the vast majority of DF players do play poorly.

This likely depends on the player, the content and their current level of skill. It's also an odd argument as the two are not mutually exclusive. I am fairly certain plenty of players who watch guides also use parsers.

Reading guides while using a parser makes sense, but expecting someone to learn a proper rotation from a parser doesn't, they will have to either do like me and a lot of people and read tooltips and follow logic, and from there test again, afterwards if they feel like they aren't doing enough for what they want they can go read a guide.

It's interesting you have this perspective, as between the two of us, you're being the jerk. In this post alone, you've insulted me by calling me dumb, saying I'm stroking my epeen and have made several other negative assumptions about me. Yet, between the two of us, you're the one advocating for no parser and I am advocating for a parser.

Well i'm sorry you read that like that, i apologize, wasn't my intention, but please don't make it look much worse than it is.

Just so you are aware, every single person who is seen doing poor DPS in games like WoW are not kicked, or even mocked. The vast majority is simply ignored.

Can't comment on that, i simply read the statement made by someone a few pages page, but that's good to know.

That is great for you. In a way you did you use a parser, the SSS, to determine your level. A parser would provide this feedback in all content. That way you could see how things change throughout. It would provide feedback as you are learning your class. It would provide your AST feedback to know who to buff - and so on.

On this i can agree, especially in Savage, and especially by looking at stats in the parser itself, such as auto attacks, uptime, crit values etc

But the thing is, people want the parser for themselves so they can see their DPS and also expect other players to become better with it, and it's here that this isn't actually true, i already explained why, but going to add on it, people get better with both parser and guides, but then the try Savage and their DPS isn't enough even for first turn, and their gear is at least enough for 3rd turn (this is just a sample scenario i'm creating), so what went wrong?

They either didn't follow the guide, didn't test SSS or dummy rotation (SSS is still better than normal Dummy because after 3m mark some Jobs can repeat their burst and thus increase their DPS).

I'm strongly in favor that people should help bad players to help them become better being with or without parser.

It kind of sounds like you think that a parser would replace SSS, video guides, written guides and so on. These are not mutually exclusive.

I don't know how you got to this conclusion and i'm sorry that you did, maybe i explained myself wrong, i simply like SSS for the reason mention above, 3m mark so people can't get a new burst to increase their numbers, obviously in a Raid scenario they can do this, not going to question that.

But that's what dummies are for, to test rotations and perfect them and gain experience from it without being interrupted, so that then people can give Savage a shot while having an idea if their DPS is enough for that specific turn.

@RobbieH i want a parser so I can track my own dps. It's very simple. Nothing i said went against that.

--insert insult here--

Yes i already got that, what you don't seem to get is that my point besides the possibility of toxicity towards bad players is that the parser alone won't make bad players good players, the parser won't teach them a rotation or remind them that they need to press more buttons.

@RobbieH

Are you worried that people will get kicked for doing low dps?
Let me ask you this, 'Have you ever kicked a player for playing poorly in DF?'

Yes it worries me that bad players get kicked in DF, DF isn't serious content, and it's a place for everyone to enjoy, thats why it exists, that's why there's no current Savage on it.

Kicking someone offline and AFK is ok, s long as that person is afk for a long period, if they had someone knocking on their door they would go for it, anyone would go for it.

It can take time, it's not their fault some random person went to knock on their door.

Can also be someone taking care of baby and the baby starts crying.

There's a LOT of something that most people don't understand it's meaning: circumstances.

Offline people:

Someone might have poor internet connection, it's not their fault their ISP is having issues or is simply a bad ISP, which might also be the only one available to them.

Then there's the issue where the game tells us we are still logged in when coming back, i guess this is also players fault?

Majority of people don't. They simply go with it and then complain about it here.

Majority? These forums is maybe frequented at most by 10% of the player base, lol.

The only time I see a player getting kicked is when they go offline, AFK for a long time or start acting salty to others in party.

On DF for the most part this is true, but not always, in DF Trials and Raids poor players still get kicked being them DPS, Healers or Tanks.