Yoshida, The Creator: Savage is the worst tuning ever in an MMO

[Kyne_Lyons]

I think this one is the perfect one in the entire raid series. I don't think is easeri then others. Just the same, at least in normal.

Normal seems to be the exception this time around. I'm all for a bit more challenge in Normal Mode.

[Hyrist]

Over-defended hyperbole at its finest. I wonder how many threads by the same ten individuals will we see over the next six months.

May be worth while to keep track.

But, it may actually be more worthwhile to keep track of the new player metrics as we get close to 4.0. The measurement of success of this choice of Yoshidas will not be done by the opinions of a select few, but by the metrics of the playerbase itself. Crying havok before the first week is concluded is, honestly the best way to discredit oneself.

[Kyne_Lyons]

I'm interested in hearing from people who raid Savage to weigh in on this.

[OMGAFLYINGPENGUIN]

You are simplifying the issue way too much.

Now they nerfed WAY TOO MUCH both and insted of a correction, they basically ruined the content by going all the way to the other extreme (that is the problem, extremes). This is why we need player testing servers for content, for better balance and correction, SE doesn't know how to do that job clearly (just look at how they handle classes for example)

I've played games where players tested out the content for a company and trust me it has brought alot of problems. Especially when the world race involves money. If you brought in the world's best players they'll set the standard of how high the dps checks are or how tedious the mechanics are that the average community will not be able to handle. If you brought in a group of average players, then the standard will be too easy for the skilled raiders.

Regardless if players get to test content before it was actually out and words get out to the community Square enix will have its reputation tarnished and if this players who have tested the content were to aim for world's first obviously it would give them an edge. Don't say it can't happen because it has happened in the game I came from, and they lost almost half its playerbase because of this.

Any professional company will understand that having players involved in testing their content comes with a ginormous risk and if the players are temperamental and words get out majority of the player would call it foul play. But if Square Enix were to made an official announcement that they got players to help them test raid content out, players will still call it foul play.

[Windi]

snip

Players will "test" this content either way, regardless of whether it's behind closed doors or not. This is a game made for players, and a development company want's to be sure their audience will respond to their game in a positive manner. The chances of players being one-sided or unhelpful is an inevitability, so what really do they have to lose by allowing players to test their content?

[ColorOfSakura]

Oh look, it's the exact. same. complaint. as from when Final Coil was released.

The exact complaint that led to Gordias. The exact complaint that led to the raid scene effectively being destroyed and killing half the servers on the game because the raiders all moved to Gilgamesh in order to actually accomplish anything.

I'm not saying that SE isn't partially at fault for way overtuning stuff, but come on - no one has been satisfied with raid difficulty in this game since day one. It's a nightmare.

They are NEVER going to strike a balance where everyone is going to be satisfied. EVER. It is impossible. The raids are either going to be too hard for everyone that isn't the super hardcore groups, or they're going to be too easy for the hardcore groups while being tuned fine for the midcore groups. There's no way for them to win with you people unless they make like 10 different versions each to cater to your very UND PRECISE expectation of difficulty.

[Windi]

snip

I'd like to argue that it is impossible to be truly precise with game difficulty in general due to its relative nature. People who are more experienced/knowledgeable about the game's working mechanics will always have an easier time dealing with this content then others.

These people are in the minority, though, and it is always a bad idea to design anything catered specifically to hardcore players due to how it excludes a massive amount of people and how very often leads to an un-immersive experience where the focus is too much on numbers and mechanics rather than the actual thrill of the content itself. In that regard, I wouldn't mind if they were all toned down in difficulty.

[KaitlanKela]

If you think savage is too easy you just need to accept that you are in a very small, very vocal minority and SE simply cannot cater to your needs because they do not have the resources to do so. Sure, everyone would like more content of the difficulty level they prefer, but you have to temper that desire with the reality the SE has to sell this product relative to the people who consume said product. They have the stats of the clear rates. They aren't going to spend their time making content only 2.5% of the playerbase will play, it's not cost-effective.

The end. /thread

[Velhart]

Again like I said in the other thread this exact conversation is going on. The intent of Creator's difficulty is in response to complaints according to the developers over complex rotations for lv.60. Easing raid difficulty and then when jobs are more simplified in 4.0, then the possibility of raising the difficulty again there.

Something I wonder is how WoW gets it so right when FFXIV doesn't. Even FFXIV did okay with the first three Coil turns. FCoB may of been easier, but it at least had better scaling. Now SE feels the need to jump all over the place, almost like they don't know what they are doing right now in attempts to make the impossible by making everyone happy, which won't happen. Raiding is always going to be niche with low numbers. I argue that you make strong, rich content over trying to please numbers and charts for your higher ups to look at. But hey! Maybe that is just me being idealistic and not realistic.

[Lambdafish]

I'd like to weigh in and say that the creator is NOT too easy. The mechanics are engaging, and most importantly, fun. The issue comes from the insane gear check that renders most gear this patch (and next patch) irrelevant. The first two instances are fine as they are, but the last two should definately have posed more of a gear check problem than it did.

People should be able to reasonably clear it, however, people should not be able to reasonably clear without at least a few pieces of scripture gear, and I feel that the ilvl plan for this patch is the part that is broken, not the difficulty of the raid.