Would you like an in-game parser?

[Kaurie]

This can be solved with a personal parser too. The developers have already made training dummies for instances with a certain intended entry item level. They have the knowledge what different jobs can do at different item levels. So instead of players having to guess if their team members are a standard worth aiming for (you don't always get paired with your own job, you don't know the item level of others and you don't know if they are craptastic or legendary players), the personal parser can give (A) red-yellow-green colour scales for your dps number, (B) a tickable box in the window that reveals a good dps goal for your current ilevel or (C) a dynamic percentage that compares your dps to the optimal.

The issue is that if it is not shown to you, the only people who are going to know comparative values are those that are already working to improve their DPS. There is no new added incentive for people to improve. Having it in their face that their DPS is less is the added incentive. Having a look at a static number and comparing is where what you noted would be exaggerated. That is, if you ask what someones DPS should be in X environment, people will give you a number - but these numbers vary depending on many factors (i.e. buffs, length of fight, positioning with tank etc.). If you have a constant parser with constant comparative values that you see from the get go, you will see and understand the differences. You'll know that Monks generally have better single target DPS and Summoners have better AoE. You'll know that sometimes the difference in damage output is due to ilvl variations. However, you'll have hundreds of runs of sample sizes to see how things have changed. That is why a group parser would be far more beneficial to addressing the problem than a personal parser.

[Ghishlain]

I think what a some people fail to realize or perhaps it's not really explained very well is a lot of players understand that there's more to damage dealing than "here's your number". The information provided by the DPS measuring tool is just one piece of a larger puzzle and gives the player something measurable to see if they're doing better. The players in question have to understand the fight and know how to do the mechanics of the fight or else their DPS will drop or they wipe the raid. What the measuring tool does give is a measure of how well that player is doing as well as a gauge on how they're improving (or perhaps getting worse) as they progress through the fight and perhaps try different thing to see just how much their number changes (whether good or bad).

Any player making an argument for a DPS measuring tool and using only the number as their argument without considering the rest of the skill sets that makes a player good is doing themselves a disservice and shooting themselves in the foot.

[Pastel_Orchid]

Awesome. And if you and I was on same server, I would gladly spend days, hours, weeks even months helping you improving, because you seem to be one of the people who like to improve. Kudos to you!

Yay for helping people !

I should expand upon this I think as the initial answer was lack luster. The thread reads would I want a parser in game? Yes I would like a personal one to see where I am sitting as numbers are the thing that makes the most sense to me. That being said I know many people are looking for a non personal one to be able to gauge other people. I am really fine with this as well, its just not something I would personally use as I am not a top player and I don't feel like I could judge anyone else's dps or be in a place to offer them any advice. However, if someone wanted to use it on me and saw I was doing subpar then great! But the numbers are just the first inclination that I am doing something wrong. I want people to be able to look at my rotation and be able to say "Hey you're not using such and such correctly have you ever though of doing xyz" something along those lines. I mean I could have bomb gear and not know what in the world I am doing.I think any way the cards are dealt there are going to be sassy peoplewho will judge you and offer no help whatsoever and also people that you will try to help who will refuse it because of whatever reason. That happens now, it will happen forever. But if this could be implemented in a way that the community could actually utilize it to build better players then awesome!

Could it be tied to mentor status or something along those lines? I mean aren't mentors supposed to be able to know different classes and be able to mentor people and help them(in theory of course)? Maybe have a check box where you could turn off the ability for other people to view yours? Maybe in the beginning you have the ability to use it on yourself and not others but after a certain criteria is met you can use it on others? You can report people for abusing it?

Ideas Ideas

[LadyCeles]

You can compare seeing your dps with others like how first person shooters show there kill death ratio. But would that work in an mmo. Too many sensitive people and too many mean people that wronfully point blame without knowing why. I wont stop saying it. Will work in savage and use fflogs. Can make it an option for SSS but u can just go to website to get that info

[Reynhart]

Wow, lots of things to adress here...

1: Great dps and mechanics
2: Mechanics is fine but dps isnt
3:Not so much dps and no mechanics :P

You forgot "Great DPS but no mechanics.

Denying players that learning instrument just because certain others don't want to learn their jobs

I don't deny it. I just don't want others to force that on me.

It... sounds like you think that skill and parsers are mutually exclusive? Or that a parser has a negative effect on skill?

Absolutely not. It's just that with only a parser and no skill, you'll be bad. With skill and no parser, you'll be good. So, a parser is not mandatory.

People complain that adding in a parser will cause toxicity and will knit pick each other's dps, but why not choose the personal parser option?

Not causing toxicity. Just allowing those toxic people to be more vocal.

I might be raid leader but i wouldnt make a cut without my group wanting it.

Imagine this (Numbers don't accurate, they're here for the sake of making my point) :
You're in a static on Midas Savage with an average DPS of 1000. You know the content by heart, you farm it every week with ease.
One week, your static can't play, so you join a Party Finder to get your loot. But in this party, there are seven uberstuffed uberskilled players who do constantly 1200 DPS.
After two wins, the leader says that you can't stay with them because your DPS is too low and the runs take too long.
Will you go "Ok, it's fair, I'm bad", or "Dude, WTH ?! We won two times, and I farm it every week" ?

You can compare seeing your dps with others like how first person shooters show there kill death ratio.

Is the FPS community really an example to follow ?

[Kaurie]

Absolutely not. It's just that with only a parser and no skill, you'll be bad. With skill and no parser, you'll be good. So, a parser is not mandatory.

Ah that is fair, and I completely agree. That said, a parser can help you improve your skill. It's just a tool.

Imagine this (Numbers don't accurate, they're here for the sake of making my point) :
You're in a static on Midas Savage with an average DPS of 1000. You know the content by heart, you farm it every week with ease.
One week, your static can't play, so you join a Party Finder to get your loot. But in this party, there are seven uberstuffed uberskilled players who do constantly 1200 DPS.
After two wins, the leader says that you can't stay with them because your DPS is too low and the runs take too long.
Will you go "Ok, it's fair, I'm bad", or "Dude, WTH ?! We won two times, and I farm it every week" ?

Personally, I'd probably be miffed and confused, but also acknowledge their right to kick. Then I would join another party and go on about my day. I don't feel that story is an adequate enough reason to not have parsers. I also don't think that would be the norm.

[Seraphix2407]

Wow, lots of things to adress here...
You forgot "Great DPS but no mechanics
Absolutely not. It's just that with only a parser and no skill, you'll be bad. With skill and no parser, you'll be good. So, a parser is not mandatory.

Well if you are bad at mechanics you aren't excactly a good at dps either, mostlikely dead.
Also how can one person know they are good in fight besides SSS? I do agree with you there and parser isnt a miracle tool, far from it, it helps you improve in fights, in terms of dps, heal raiding dmg etc, it's not only numbers, because that' not what a parser is. Yes you can be good without parser and you can be having a parser and have no skill. But that's the thing, we want people to improve

I read this on reddit earlier:
Some people think that just doing mechanics correctly means they are doing their job, these are the same people who argue against parsers in the OF and proceed to be outdamaged by a tank in tanking stance. And we all know this happens quite alot.

Now, it's up to a person if they want to improve or not. But if they decide not to, that's their choice but they can't expect people to drag them in content where dps actually matters. Other day in seph I was PLD tanking it most of the time in the stance and dropped it off in last phase and I got told I did more than 2 people, should it be like that? Keep in mind, I don't know those 2 random dps as it was a helping group, but I can't say it, you know why? Because suddenly im a toxic person. And also we never killed it because dps was extremly low, I talk about seing 3 purple in phase 1. They did nail the mechanics fine but the dps was just way too low to even beat it. When adds appereared boss was at 40% after lb.

Earlier I was stuck in seph for 1 hour and half. And we downded it before timer ran out and we cleard it and farmed it after. Wanna know the funny fact? 6 out of 8 people parserd and KNEW BRD, MCH and NIN doing 900 or less wasn't excactly good. While WAR was behind DRG (1400 ish and WAr 1.1k) we still didnt mention their dps. What I did say was the dps is a bit low and people said nothing about it becaue I also told them we cleared it and it never mattered. But keep in mind they had a luxery OT and healers doing 400-500 dps as well, to make sure enrage wouldn't happen either. Funny thing is, I actually sent the MCH off to a guy I know, because hes a great MCH and they are both going through rotations and situations etc, testing out on dummy, parser on it etc. Now, that's what a call a person with amazing attitude, if there was more of those and less of those who take offense when we play nice and give them a hand, this wouldn't even be a topic between you and I and we both know it. I'm not going to say I respect when super hardcore pro parsers attitude is acceptable because it's not, and if people do that, just report them.

Edit:

Yay for helping people !

Haha love your post, it's a positive one for sure. I think mentor in this game somewhat half done. Sadly many uses the crown for pure vanity/cosmetics rather than telling people. There are far more people who arent mentors and know more than those who are. I wish people would take it more serious. I actually have decided at some point to make my own linkshel and train up people who are willing to

[Cherie]

All I say say in regards to people worrying about harassment... Harassment is going to happen regardless. Sure, if parsers were implemented, people might use them during harassment.

Right now we don't have parsers... Can we say harassment over performance isn't happening now? How could *true* information given to us as far as performance hurt us? Right now, harassment is still happening, but people will just base it on anything that suits their arguement. Like "your gear sucks, you are therefore terrible" "omg, a bard? Bards suck, kick them".... etc A parser would actually prevent unfounded harassment over things you can't control. Yes someone might harass you over dps, but that is something *within your power*...where-as they would instead harass you over something else arbitrarily that you can't control (like what job you chose, what gear you have, if you were saying things they liked or not, etc).

I think if we got parsers, then people will see: "The truth with set you free"

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

I think if we got parsers, then people will see: "The truth with set you free"

The truth will set us free... To harass others! OK, sure, why not, let's have parsers. Could be fun.

[WeekendSoja]

Lol, if I could from my phone I would...but let's hashtag for good ol' times

#gitgudcommunity #onebuttonrotationyo