parse for ps4 users !

[Gilraen]

Chif... you will want to remove that link before a moderator notices it. So far this thread hasn't needed moderation as noone's been hostile, but that link is promoting third party software which will get this thread locked if not you temporarily banned. As many keep saying, you're not helping your case... with any of your posts. And this latest post is practically you shooting yourself in the foot.

[Whiteroom]

@ whiteroom

sirdarts chif drayer i can't spell everyones name. Anc acts like it a bit. Pretty much every pro parser person who replied to me since i said VERY NICELY parser are not needed. I was picked apart, and called a troll. Even thought what I said was the truth, they just don't wanna see it as such. Or rather don't believe it.

You also can't rebuff what you stated, thats contradicting yourself.

this has been what has been (paraphrased)

1) parsers are needed for dps checks
2) anyone against parsers are scared their low dps will be kicked. (stated as all people who don't parse suck)
3) parser figure everything out from rotations to stat waights.
4) parser are needed to improve.
5) anyone against parser is a fear mongering troll
6) parser are not against the ToS


those are stated as facts time and time again. Thing is they are not facts at all, just assumptions/conjecture.

What is fact is human nature, people will set rediculous standards based on personal performance, and exclude anyone who can't reach it, this has been going on fir Eons. Given the tools and ideals people will exclude others. I don't care if people do it in pf. I don't want to see it in DF, and if a parser is put ingame all content will be subjected to it.

And people undermind the reality of that down playing it for their cause (again human nature) or going as far as to say, who cares if people are excluded it forces them to be better.

Thing is you can't force a person to learn, nor should you force your ideals/mindset/playstyle them.

I have autism, it effects my coordination, should I be excluded for something i can't control? Should i be treated poorly over something arbitrary?

I'm not lazy, and do everythinbg i can to improve. I'm not good at reading numarical data outside %'s geomarty and trig, so i should be penilized?

Did you really just do this? I ask you to provide quotes where people have made these claims, that you have been claiming they are making all along, and you just restate your false claims!?

Think about that, just think about. You are in fact, putting words in peoples mouths, and then arguing those points. The only one that has come close to being stated is the TOS one (aside from what chif has said, but really, has anyone taken him seriously in this discussion?). Which really has no bearing on parsers being a positive or negative btw.

Directly quote where this has been said or stop claiming it. You are making false statements otherwise. Thats why people have called you a troll. You are making wild claims that your assumptions are scientific fact, thats why you have been called a Fearmonger. And that you have been "NICELY" stating things?!? For real? Didn't you tell someone to:

GROW THE F UP

On top of that you have used your claim that your "27 years of gaming" gives you more insight into them then us lowly plebs, despite not knowing anything about our gaming history, while stating that others don't even need a fully leveled character to have a correct opinion. ( Of course, that only seems to matter when their opinion is the same as yours.)

[Kosmos992k]

Look no further than when you brought up selective parsing as a prime example.

I suggested opt-in parsing where parsing is available in-game, but each player can choose whether or no to participate by optinG in -- setting in their options. This was shot down by suggestions ranging from people saying they would kick anyone 'hiding' their numbers and that it would lead to more toxicity, to people who demanded to be able to see the numbers for players who did not opt in.

A solution that gives those who want to parse their data the ability to do so, and protects the option of players who do not. And yet it was rejected out of hand with the suggestion that it would create more toxic behavior. Ironically those suggesting that were the ones categorizing not opting in as 'hiding' something.

If you wish to call that selective parsing, go ahead, I'll continue to refer to it as optional parsing, since that is literally what was suggested. I also note that the principal alternative discussed amounts to forced/mandatory parsing of everyone. Archaell made a suggestion that slightly altered the idea of optional parsing, by segregating the DF Q based on parse options. I disagreed with that because splitting the Q in DF is a bad idea IMHO.

Really, I have read back over my posts a couple of times now because I take criticism seriously. I don't honestly see where, or why you take such offense at my posts. As an example, you've taken huge offense because I said you need to learn more about human nature.

Why is that something that you consider either offensive or an attack on you, it's neither, it's simply a response to your statements, the strongest interpretation of it would be that I doubt the depth of your understanding of human nature, and yet you bring it up here as an instance where you're saying I attacked you.

[Sapphic]

I have autism, it effects my coordination, should I be excluded for something i can't control? Should i be treated poorly over something arbitrary?

I'm not lazy, and do everythinbg i can to improve. I'm not good at reading numarical data outside %'s geomarty and trig, so i should be penilized?

If content is being cleared, no one really cares unless you are doing a quarter or even a 5th of your expected DPS. But in content that requires a minumum amount of contribution and you are physically unable to meet that requirement, then unfortunatelly you cannot expect random players to make it up, especially if it is preventing the rest of the party from being able to clear content. If everyone is awars initially and fine with it then thats different. If I'm doing 1300 DPS and you are doing 700, it wouldn't matter if content is being cleared. If I'm doing 1300 DPS and your doing 200 and content is unable to be cleared, then you are preventing 3 or 7 other people from enjoying the game how they want to by clearing content. Is that fair?

Theres a video taken from an infamously more toxic community then FFXIV on youtube that proves a point in regards to people caring if content is still getting cleared with having someone making nigh on zero contribution to the success of the endeavour. I'm taking about WoW. Aka, no one does.

Theres no solid, facual, indisputable evidence saying the community toxicity will increase or decrease or even stay the same. All we can do is predict (which is far from an accurate science) based on personal experience.

But what we should not do is exagerate to prove a point, or devalue "evidence" that is garnered the same way as what you have stated to, yet again, try and give your opinion higher credence.

Just remember though, we already have parsers in game.

I suggested opt-in parsing where parsing is available in-game,

I have no issues with that whatsover. It wouldn't take a genius to figure out if the required content DPS is 1000 one person is doing 1100, the other DPS opted out and the DPS check is not getting met to figure out where the weakest link is. Plus it would still give the other DPS an average result of what they should be aiming for. If it was set to private or public they would be able to still compare (the person using it private). To see if they are close to or nowhere close.

[Valkyrie-Amber]

well on a side note parsing is reason I don't bard duty's no more and instead I learned to master another class that for me feels easier and that is a monk btw and yes I also have a drg and can play that but the style is far to straight forward for my liking and a bard is all about cat reflexes sitting caster mode and hitting all procs while monk is simple really start hitting rear 4 hits go side 3 hits use all gcds in between well in style 1 cd then 1 gcd then another cd the usual.

So the result a dummy parser should be implemented cause not all people are going to do well at one class and its important with all dps checks to know what your most suited optimal class is.

Everyone is different but dps checks mean same for all so we need to be able to pick our best class without the need of 3rd party parsing and harassment in duty's.

I 100% agree all striking dummy's should come with a dps meter cause then there would be no reason if you pick your optimal class that can hit recorded average dps + to use a 3rd party parser in duty and be a prick about peoples dps.

Main issue is the fact there are so many dps checks end game.

[Jynx]

NOW! on the real topic YES PS4 NEEDS A PARSER ASAP

Need does not equal want.

People who want to parse pay to play the game.

people who don't want to parse pay to play the game.

Sadly your opinion is no more valid or important than anyone elses here. You can't demand a parser because you "Need" it when the game is designed to be played without it. Parsing is not "Required" for savage progression it's a usefull tool for sure but it does not actually make you play better it's a tool to digest data. Some people can use that data to great effect others may not be able to and improve themselves in other ways. I know it may blow your mind but it is totally possible to beat anything in this game including savage without a parser.

Am I dead set against parsing? Not really but when you attempt to state something as a fact when it clearly is not it's just wrong.

Personal parser for training dummies sure, why not it gives people tools to parse themselvs in a environment of their choosing without unwaranted pressure. If your in a Savage progression group and somehow can't trust your group is doing all they can then you may need to not pick up randoms for such important tasks.

[Whiteroom]

I suggested opt-in parsing where parsing is available in-game, but each player can choose whether or no to participate by optinG in -- setting in their options. This was shot down by suggestions ranging from people saying they would kick anyone 'hiding' their numbers and that it would lead to more toxicity, to people who demanded to be able to see the numbers for players who did not opt in.

God I hate doing this on a phone. It really is a hassle, especially with the 1000 char limit.

I did not see anyone suggest they would kick based on someone not using a opt in parser. What I did see, were these words, which I can quote if you really want me to:

In the event of a failure due to dps checks not being met, they would kick the one who was hiding their dps.

Now that player has shown themselves not to be completely incompitent with regards to parsers, so I made the obvious conclusion that this was to have the unnessasary add on of:

As long as nothing was glaring wrong with the visible parsed dps.

Now as for yours second paragraph there. It was stated that you were, "ironically" as you like use, making an adjustment to parsers, that would have the effect of giving that abusive portion of the community a target. Your whole thing is abuse, and you make a suggestion that would make the tool more prone to abuse, than less prone, which you should be doing. And then you, oh so grandly, turn aroun and say "I thought they didn't cause abuse!"

Now I keep bringing up that "human nature" statement for various reasons:

1. You say it to me for saying people who do not know they are playing poorly are likely to try to improve if they find out they are. And then turn around and ignore the very obvious point of how people would view a team member who hides their contrabution in failing content.

2. You state that you dont put people down, yet that is your introductory statement.

3. You continually point out only negative behaviour of human nature, and ignore positive. That ironic word again.

Now the suggestion of seperate queues fully negates the negatives of your "solution" and also has the effect of removing any of those a-hole from harrasing people, unless they intentionally join the other queue to troll. Yet you discard it. This also take the people who would hide their numbers to cover a lack of effort out of the hair of people who do want to show their numbers.

[Ercapote]

Why is that something that you consider either offensive or an attack on you, it's neither, it's simply a response to your statements, the strongest interpretation of it would be that I doubt the depth of your understanding of human nature, and yet you bring it up here as an instance where you're saying I attacked you.

YOU! lady/gentleman/whatever I want to pick you off all the people. And just so be clear I'm not "ATTACKING" I'm going to simply state and answer some of your question of WHY YOUR POINTS ARE NOT VALID...

fisrt of all just because you have lvl 50 characters doesn't mean you are a reliable person, whether or not you had time to play doesn't take out the fact that you have not touch ALEXANDER SAVAGE which means you are completely ignorant on what those fights are, which I will care to explain to you why you are limb to express your opinion regarding PARSERS for end game...

-for one the META of the game has changed, there are 2 raids, ALEXANDER NM (more like derp mode) and SAVAGE (more like god why mode) currently "end-game" lays on SAVAGE and if you haven't done SCOB (SAVAGE) which I'm just gonna assume you haven't, you have not experience this kind of difficulty anywhere else in game since the closest difficulty to AS will be FCOB (SAVAGE) which if you take a look....it doesn't even exists. that reason alone takes out your credibility or validation to any disscusion since you simply not experienced on this... you cannot be a HEALER and tell me how to CRAFT... same as you cannot be a PROGRAMMER and tell me how to be a DOCTOR (apples and orange i know, but you get the point)

- now the META has change in the following reason, For one fights aren't heavily focus on mechanics as they are a joke to learn and handle, BUT the fights on AS are EXTREMELY HEAVILY punishing on DPS CHEKS, fight where tanks can dance with their estances and WARRIORS can even TANK without tank stances, and healers need to dps more than heal, The DPS checks on AS are incredibly insane ( invite you to take a look at the incredibly WORLD FIRST for A3S) and take a close look at how the beat that fight with most breath taking timer ever..... did any member dies? no, did they miss the mechanincs? no...the simply beat it because of their high skill to dps the highest numbers possible making them the first ones able to beat that fight... will they be able to do what they did without a parser LAUGHABLY no, no and no in a million years no...

- with you not able to know where the current meta of the game is, and how it currently workes and how classes has evolved then yes, your point is invalid.

you might have be able to do content in ARR but that has change and te current difficulty relies on extreme DPS whether your anti-parser point relies on being used in easier is still invalid since there are bigger content that the core continuous communities relies on that requires that tool. especially us in ps4.

besides...care to look at my other post will speak by himself.

and again I'm not attacking you

[Chif]

it is totally possible to beat anything in this game including savage without a parser.
.

You know any pt clearing any new contents on " time " with out useing parse?

[Jynx]

You know any pt clearing any new contents on " time " with out useing parse?

Of course the world firsts are going to use the path of least resistance and parse. It gives them the data they want faster than without.

Just because it's not usually done, doesn't mean it's impossible. Does the parser running in the background when they finally have the fight down mean anything to the people playing? Not really they know what they need to do and the numbers just support that they are doing things correctly. Would these clears never happen if people didn't parse? That's the real question.