The issue nobody wants to address

[Colorful]

snip

Could you please list one legitimate reason as to why someone would hide their data after a wipe caused by a DPS check? I can't think of any, other than performing poorly. But hey, I'm waiting for your answer. Why is it okay to make people wipe over and over again because you can't meet a DPS check, and you're too hesitant to show your parse?

[Kosmos992k]

I'm glad you all responded in that manner because I see it as simple as this. In real life an innocent person has nothing to hide, correct? But, we don't expect the authorities to be allowed to just listen in on our phone calls, look at our emails, and watch our every move through hidden cameras without a court order and/or our consent. Do we?

It doesn't matter whether someone has anything to hide or not, there should never be the presumption that because they don't wish to undergo inspection they are guilty of something. I view this issue the same way. I have nothing to hide, but I don't wish for my numbers to be parsed because, among other reasons, I don't want to be given unsolicited advice by someone about improving my performance. Quite apart from anything else the corollary of offering someone advice to improve is saying that their performance is poor.

But it doesn't matter, if I don't want to participate in parsing, I should not be forced to do so.

[dank1]

I'm glad you all responded in that manner because I see it as simple as this. In real life an innocent person has nothing to hide, correct? But, we don't expect the authorities to be allowed to just listen in on our phone calls, look at our emails, and watch our every move through hidden cameras without a court order and/or our consent. Do we?

It doesn't matter whether someone has anything to hide or not, there should never be the presumption that because they don't wish to undergo inspection they are guilty of something. I view this issue the same way. I have nothing to hide, but I don't wish for my numbers to be parsed because, among other reasons, I don't want to be given unsolicited advice by someone about improving my performance. Quite apart from anything else the corollary of offering someone advice to improve is saying that their performance is poor.

But it doesn't matter, if I don't want to participate in parsing, I should not be forced to do so.

This isnt a court of law though, it's a player set community if the standard comes to be to kick combative players who refuse to show their numbers due to some sort of entitlement issue and an underlying fear of being exposed for laziness, then so be it. I just hope those same combative entitled players dont complain when it happens

[Whiteroom]

I'm glad you all responded in that manner...

Is this some kind of a "checkmate!" comment?
I distictly recall people saying things like "in the event of a failed dps check", what about numbers is difficult to understand? If a group of four people are sent out to get a total of 20 apples, but are allowed to hide how many they bring back, three come back showing that they brought six each, but only 19 get brought back in total. I don't know about you, but I don't need to see the forth persons basket to know they brought 1 back.
If 24 come back noone is annoyed with anyone are they.

[Archaell]

But it doesn't matter, if I don't want to participate in parsing, I should not be forced to do so.

So let's say that parsing would be optional. How would you feel about the other players booting you out of the group for hiding your data? You are the one who decided to not participate. They would note that you do not want to participate.

Personally I see parser as an order for 100 cakes. There are four workers so every single one should make 25 cakes. Of course some get the job done faster so it can be 20-30-25-25 cakes per person. It isn't entirely fair, but it is acceptable. What isn't acceptable tho is when somebody decides to bake only 10 cakes. In that cases the other bakers deserve to know what was the reason that they had to bake more than just 25.

[dank1]

So let's say that parsing would be optional. How would you feel about the other players booting you out of the group for hiding your data? You are the one who decided to not participate. They would note that you do not want to participate.

Personally I see parser as an order for 100 cakes. There are four workers so every single one should make 25 cakes. Of course some get the job done faster so it can be 20-30-25-25 cakes per person. It isn't entirely fair, but it is acceptable. What isn't acceptable tho is when somebody decides to bake only 10 cakes. In that cases the other bakers deserve to know what was the reason that they had to bake more than just 25.

That's a great comparison, unfortunately those who are opposed to parsers will counter that with "its just a game not your job though!!"

So I guess to put this as simple as possible, you and a group of 3 or 7 other people attempt to slay this magical beast in an online fantasy setting and you do 50% of said beast's life in terms of damage, now another player (who DOES NOT have a disability or any other life situation that would impair his ability to slay said beast) only did 10% of that beast's life, both of these adventurers have the same tier of equipment and let's say they're even the same class for simplicity's sake, wouldn't you want to know why you had to do more damage than the other adventurer? Shouldn't you also have a right to remove said player from your group if they refused to cooperate?

[CosmicKirby]

But, we don't expect the authorities to be allowed to just listen in on our phone calls, look at our emails, and watch our every move through hidden cameras without a court order and/or our consent. Do we?

No, we don't. We just allow the feds to do that to us in the name of "safety".

Oh, ow, no. Bad lalafell, no politics on the General Discussion forums.

[dank1]

Could you please list one legitimate reason as to why someone would hide their data after a wipe caused by a DPS check? I can't think of any, other than performing poorly. But hey, I'm waiting for your answer. Why is it okay to make people wipe over and over again because you can't meet a DPS check, and you're too hesitant to show your parse?

Because they probably have a disability (sarcasm) as 99% of the ffxiv population with bad dps seems to have according to the naysayers.

The facts speak, most players arent disabled so I cant think of any other reason that anyone would be underperforming other than not wanting to.
For some reason though no one wants to admit that plain and simply they want to be lazy, which is ok you play how you want but when you're playing with me that better stop and I'm sure other players can agree with that. Yes this is a FF title but no it is NOT a single player game. Carry your weight *IF* you have the physical/mental capacity to do so please

[Colorful]

snip

This may sound rude, but frankly if you're disabled and unable participate to the expected standard of the content you're doing, at least the bare minimum required, you should not be doing that content. Farm some gil and pay for a run or the like, but do not expect other people to carry you because of your disability. If a friend of mine had a disability, I'd be more than happy to try to set up a party with a few FC members together and carry them through the content if need be, if it's a stranger who comes in and expects a clear like they deserve to get carried by strangers who have no ties, you're going to get kicked.

snip

There is a huge, huge difference between revealing your personal information or having people go through your belongings and a number. I'm honestly surprised you've come up with that, it's a rather poor comparison whereas your other posts were a tad more reasonable. If you don't want to be given advice on how to improve, then either a, start your own party with a no parse rule, or b, stop joining parties where you can't perform to the standards required.

[Kosmos992k]

There is a huge, huge difference between revealing your personal information or having people go through your belongings and a number. I'm honestly surprised you've come up with that, it's a rather poor comparison whereas your other posts were a tad more reasonable. If you don't want to be given advice on how to improve, then either a, start your own party with a no parse rule, or b, stop joining parties where you can't perform to the standards required.

The principle is the same.

This isnt a court of law though, it's a player set community if the standard comes to be to kick combative players who refuse to show their numbers due to some sort of entitlement issue and an underlying fear of being exposed for laziness, then so be it. I just hope those same combative entitled players dont complain when it happens

Actually now, the standard is set by SE, SE decides what constitutes harassment or abuse. I if someone abuses parser data and causes a problem for another player, they may be reported and SE may take action against them. It's their rule set that matters, not the kangaroo court of the online community and a 'community standard' agreed by one group, but not others.

No, we don't. We just allow the feds to do that to us in the name of "safety".

LOL yes, we have allowed our rights to be abrogated in the interests of 'safety' and security haven't we? And in this case, essentially parser proponents are arguing that we should abrogate our rights to decline parsing in favor of *their* interests.

So let's say that parsing would be optional. How would you feel about the other players booting you out of the group for hiding your data? You are the one who decided to not participate. They would note that you do not want to participate.

Premade or pickup in DF? If it's a pre-made and the others want to parse then either I allow them to parse me, or I leave of my own free will, there's no reason to annoy anyone by being a pain if the rest want to parse. If this is a pickup group in DF, and they boot me specifically for not allowing my data to be parsed, I might well report them, if that's the reason they give. If I'm randomly booted, I have nothing to say about it, and if they ask while we're in the instance, I get to decide at that time. It's my choice, not theirs.