What makes WHM special? Nothing anymore.

[mp-please]

How about you do yourself and everyone a favor and stop trying to silence people on an internet forum? You're not going to succeed as people can have uneducated opinion all they'd like and they're free to share.

Would be nice.

Silence people? No, im telling him to get experience before he jumps on a argument. Then he can talk as much as he wants.
All my posts on this thread are my concerns about the future of the class when it comes to party composition on endgame raids and he replies to me with random DF crap nobody cares about.

They are not the same - can confirm playing all three healers.

Ok i probably mispoke there as i don't believe on that myself, maybe to save post lenght.
Anyways, they're extremely similar though as we may know, even you say it that some of their skills play exactly the same. Ofc the main differences being buffs vs burst heal+burst dps.

[Rewind]

Ok i probably mispoke there as i don't believe on that myself, maybe to save post lenght.
Anyways, they're extremely similar though as we may know, even you say it that some of their skills play exactly the same. Ofc the main differences being buffs vs burst heal+burst dps.

That's fine.

I agree their foundation spells (direct heal) are relatively the same, and that's okay. It makes the classes easy to approach for a beginner. I think tanks are very much in the same position as healers in this regard (and maybe BRD/MCH though I haven't played much MCH to know if this is 100% true)

It's when you start managing CDs, stance dancing and micromanaging other players (through cards) and yourself (being very strategic with timing of cards and buffing cards/your own abilities) that take the classes to another level.

So yes, at a very basic play-style all three healers are the same. As soon as you take it to an intermediate or advanced level they all play very differently.

Do we need to complicate the beginner level by adding gimmicky spells? I personally don't think so. I think it is up to the individual to take the job to a new level and push their limits in game-play.

[mp-please]

Do we need to complicate the beginner level by adding gimmicky spells? I personally don't think so. I think it is up to the individual to take the job to a new level and push their limits in game-play.

I've never said to add gimmicky spells or mechanics. They just need to take the new traits, shove it up some place of the dude who thought them up, and replace for stuff that makes white mage reliable such as cleric stance accuracy and, i dunno, maybe bring granite skin back at a lower %. Japanese OF is all about that these days.

For the billionth time, white mage doesn't need core changes. It's a viable healer as it is, but when it comes to party compositions, as gear grows and burst healing requirement diminishes, it will become exactly like how PLD is now. And every class should be considerable on every single endgame party.

PLD needs a buff, WHM/SCH shouldn't be the only progression healers and that's why AST got a buff, monk got buffed to also be usable since DRK was making dragonkick useless and now whm needs a slight change so it's not just viable as a progression healer.

[Rewind]

snip

This is where I disagree. The granite skin and cleric stance accuracy are gimicky things. They don't really that much value, though I guess accuracy would make DPS less frustrating to do as WHM though there are other ways to achieve accuracy and will be addressed in the upcoming content patches according to Yoshi P . I also disagree that WHM is not as a viable progression healer. WHM is the most reliable progression healer, as it always has been, and the changes to AST in no way diminish this.

As gear grows and healing diminishes (presumably you'll have things on farm) you could easily swap out your accessories to DPS accessories for accuracy and heal & DPS. If you don't have it farm obviously there are other issues healing or otherwise that need to be addressed and a WHM is always going to be a solid choice for solo healing so that a SCH could assist DPS.

[winsock]

Lightspeed and proc'd Bene II are not oGCD heals, which is what you were trying to compare. Try again, maybe?

I was comparing insta-heals, maybe read?

[GideonHighmourn]

I was comparing insta-heals, maybe read?

Maybe understand that all of the heals you listed were oGCD heals, and all in the instances of the quotes you were responding to were as well.

Lightspeed has its uses during movement phases, but Bene II proc is very rarely useful, especially compared to Freecure procs, which are always useful.

[mp-please]

I also disagree that WHM is not as a viable progression healer. WHM is the most reliable progression healer, as it always has been, and the changes to AST in no way diminish this.

I just said that. WHM and SCH were the preferred healers for every single raid group so far, AST buff only brought them to the table as well.

This is where I disagree. The granite skin and cleric stance accuracy are gimicky things. They don't really that much value, though I guess accuracy would make DPS less frustrating to do as WHM though there are other ways to achieve accuracy and will be addressed in the upcoming content patches according to Yoshi P .

While gimmicky, it was something yoshida had to remove from the game because it would be somewhat broken.
To be fair i actually ask myself why that change was made. Stoneskin is based on target hp, a tank with 20k hp would have a 3.6k shield, something that goes away relatively fast considering everything hits like a truck on heavensward.

About accuracy, back on 2.0 gear didn't had accuracy either, they later added it when scob was added and the accuracy cap raised. Healers have always been with a gap of 100 ish accuracy between the instance and the BiS gear so nothing changed there. Him saying that accuracy will be on gear later is no surprise to anyone lol..

As gear grows and healing diminishes (presumably you'll have things on farm) you could easily swap out your accessories to DPS accessories for accuracy and heal & DPS. If you don't have it farm obviously there are other issues healing or otherwise that need to be addressed and a WHM is always going to be a solid choice for solo healing so that a SCH could assist DPS.

That's the thing, like i said previously, solo heal is viable but not the best solution because when stuff gets outhealed by simple fairy power + aoe HoT + occasional aoe heal (medica I/indomitability/helios) people will start asking if its not better to take a astrologian that can do that instead of a whm because astrologian can increase people dps by using their cards.
On the same situation but when both healers can dps, whm odds increase but accuracy issues lead to dps losses and mp wasting.

Melding wise, maybe when overgear is a issue i200 crafting gear will be out because right now melds are a huge waste of stats as you'll lose 73 mind, 81 piety and some other less important stats (actually gain +1 det over BiS i210 yay) for a +120 accuracy that is still below alexander savage requirement. And then another issue comes by, at this huge loss of stats, is it really worth it to force WHMs to meld or make them change to astrologian since they have dots that don't require accuracy and make up most of their dps by buffing others.

[Brightshadow]

The solution to make white mages as favorable as the other two healers And keeping them unique is really simple just give them more healing power. And something for cleric stance.
1.) Increase cure potencies (Cure1: 500 / Cure2:700 / Cure3: 600
2.) Enhanced Cleric Stance (Trait) (Lv30): Converts X percent of the damage done into a healing effect to the party member with the lowest MP. Also increases your magic accuracy by X percent.

[Alu79]

The solution to make white mages as favorable as the other two healers And keeping them unique is really simple just give them more healing power. And something for cleric stance.
1.) Increase cure potencies (Cure1: 500 / Cure2:700 / Cure3: 600
2.) Enhanced Cleric Stance (Trait) (Lv30): Converts X percent of the damage done into a healing effect to the party member with the lowest MP. Also increases your magic accuracy by X percent.

lol.. um no kthxbai


Something that could be added with out completely breaking the game (like the guy above me) is allow for Divine Seal to affect all spells and abilities (Tetra Assize and Asylum), have PoM reduce mana costs by 10%, successfully using Bene (on targets below 15% hp) resets Tetra or triggers a proc to cast stoneskin 2 instantly in combat at 15% vs 10% hp, trait that allows for SoS to be reset if on cd if you've been rezzed or maybe a trait that allows you to be raised with 50% hp/mp.

Some of these (not all of them) could help prop whm's perceived weaknesses/lack of identity with out overpowering them or making them mandatory in raids.

[J-Dax]

Silence peopl....

A few words to live by; from one who said it much better than I.


"Let your Conversation be without Malice or Envy, for 'is a Sign of a Tractable and Commendable Nature: And in all Causes of Passion admit Reason to Govern."

-George Washington