Hopefully Alexander/Savage will be 24 mans.

[Selli]

If your 8 man has drama. Get a better 8 man.

I never said it was my static. Did I? But you hear about it all the time, especially if you have friends who are all raiders. I've had to break up a few static dramas, and I've heard of big FCs who have it carried into there. Getting 8 people together and trying to get them to work together for a few hours a day can be difficult. Adding more people just makes it worse.

There are fcs with 20+ on all the time with nothing to do together.

Not all people are form big FCs. My FC has 10 people online max. It's been around for a year, but it originally belonged to the FC leader's daughter and her friends, but they're long gone now. I personally dislike big FCs anyway.

If you really want to stick 24 people into something challenging, try running CT in i55 gear. I joined in on one for a bigger FC once shortly after Second Coil came out and it was pretty difficult.

24 man savage doesn't need team jump rope. It needs large scale coordination.

You ever try jumping rope with someone who isn't co-ordinated? It doesn't end well.

This will allow is lesser skilled players to join in and broaden the activities large groups can take part in. It can drop gear equal to 5 ilvls above the Df tower gear.

We already have 24-man raids that drop gear that (was) the same ilevel as stuff you got from your weekly tomes. It was basically on par with the end-game stuff. And they later added the ability to upgrade the tome items via these 24-man runs to be on par with the end-game stuff without having to do end-game content.

You can't handle doing content with people not in your "static" don't do it.

Gladly.

But don't down New content ideas with such a weak argument.

It's not a weak argument. Working with other people causes tension when they are on different levels of learning, comprehension, and execution. The more people, the worse it gets. Have you ever done group projects in school? Or worked with other people in the workplace? Or worked with children, even. Working with children can really wear on your nerves if you're not prepared for it.

I have friends I want to do end game with but they aren't good enough to do the current style of current. I want it to be challenging but Not too hard that I can't make up For their slack.

That's what the current 24-mans are for. That's why they're adding two different versions of Alexander.

Savage implies that it is harder than the extreme primals. Their level of co-ordination is very strict. That's why the SCoB Savage titles are so rare. There is no need to suddenly throw content harder than EX primals (which some people have a hard time clearing anyway) at people who "aren't good enough to do the current style of current".

[Damie]

A true 24-man raid just does not fit with this MMO. Just like open-world pvp would not work in this MMO. However, I agree that there needs to be some kind of content that engages FCs. For example, what about a CT level difficulty dungeon that you can only do with 24 FC members. The rewards could be something cool but not gamebreaking like endgame raid gear.

[Tremara]

I'm fine with 8-man Alexander. Sometimes it's hard enough to get raids scheduled with 8 ppl because of job, family, etc.
Also I prefer 8-man raids because it's more familiar, you get to know your fellow raider better - if you aren't friends before.

And even if I get flamed for that: I raided in WoW with 20+ pll ... it was not fun (most of the time) - not because the content was hard, no, the hardest part was that all 20+ ppl showed up. In my opinion the hardest part of raiding shouldn't be the orginization and reliability of ppl.
I raid to have fun, not to wait if all ppl will make it.

[LTEvil]

A true 24-man raid just does not fit with this MMO. Just like open-world pvp would not work in this MMO. However, I agree that there needs to be some kind of content that engages FCs. For example, what about a CT level difficulty dungeon that you can only do with 24 FC members. The rewards could be something cool but not gamebreaking like endgame raid gear.

Yes I agree. It would need to be harder than ct was because most fcs are made around statics. So they tend to Have voips and more focus than df groups.

[LTEvil]

I'm fine with 8-man Alexander. Sometimes it's hard enough to get raids scheduled with 8 ppl because of job, family, etc.
Also I prefer 8-man raids because it's more familiar, you get to know your fellow raider better - if you aren't friends before.

And even if I get flamed for that: I raided in WoW with 20+ pll ... it was not fun (most of the time) - not because the content was hard, no, the hardest part was that all 20+ ppl showed up. In my opinion the hardest part of raiding shouldn't be the orginization and reliability of ppl.
I raid to have fun, not to wait if all ppl will make it.

Do you do all content in game? Ok then this would be one thing you Don't do. Organizing would be hard if you lack numbers. But even then it wouldn't be top teir ffxiv raiding. So you could plug in a few people and clear.

[Martin_Arcainess]

AS the talking cat would say no no no no no no.

1. If just 1 member dose not show up you might have to pug just that 1 person and only 1 person can mess it up.

2. More dose not mean better if anything less can be better, I mean look at CT1 boss 1, Dragon Zombie, that fight can be done so much easier with just 1 party.

3. Roles? Most of Coil if not all fights require 2 or just 1 Tank so what the other 4-6 thanks going to do do?

4. Same as above for other roles.

5. Organizing. Sometimes 9 is a crowd and most coil fight requires TS. Can you imagine 24 people on TS all talking at once?

6. Fallout awesome game but more people has a chance higher chance of causing fallout's in groups.

[Ryans]

Why are you guys arguing? Even if you "win" the argument you aren't going to get your idea implemented. State what you'd like to see, pray that it becomes popular enough for SE to take notice, and stop berating others.

[LTEvil]

It's not an attack you are using "I" as reasoning for content not being placed in. That is how you come off. And my responses Are formed as such because of your snide remarks in your other post. Can't take it don't throw it. Savage is the only forever Df locked content in game. I said this already. And this is about future content. Not making previous content. You still haven't supplied a reason why this content should not be added. Ct when it first came out was easy. It was intended to be since it was meant for Df. So no it was never hard But that is perspective. WoW had top teir raiding and still does. It only recently started to fail. You really want to start bringing up WOW? Replying to selli.

[LTEvil]

Why are you guys arguing? Even if you "win" the argument you aren't going to get your idea implemented. State what you'd like to see, pray that it becomes popular enough for SE to take notice, and stop berating others.

Yeah but the idea need to be rounded more.

As far as what Martin says.
1.That one person can mess up. Large raids aren't as strict as small ones generally.
2.Well you wouldn't have to do it. It's Mainly something I want for fcs to take part in.
3.That's easily sorted out due to fight mechanics. Plenty of ways to put extra roles to work.
4. I can't imagine 24 man speaking on TS because usually raids have a leader and. A few others who speak and that's it. Even for 8 man's. To have other talk is inefficient.
6.Then you find new people. It's not do or die content. More like variation.

[Sapphic]

I'd like to see the 24 man and the 3.1 and onwards be released at the current ilvl so everyone doesn't over gear them again like in 2.x.

Just that change would make it more challenging.

Changing 8 person to 24 person content? You probably want to be carried like it's possible for the rest to carry some players through CT. (Which, imo is why 8 person Alex normal will find players struggling as they are used tobeing carried by 20+ people and overgearing).