Why not abolish the Class system entirely in favor of Jobs? [@ Devs]

[AJ_Anyia]

This isn't a bash on XI or its system

Since I have increasing doubts that you have any significant experience with FFXI, I'd prefer if you don't bring it up in your arguments. There is tremendous flexibility in the subjob system merely because of how valuable certain traits/abilities were in FFXI. A Sam/War would do considerably more damage than a Sam/Nin, but be far more fragile. A Sam/Thf would have great aggro control and great burst damage, but weaker sustained DPS and slower TP gain. In ANY example, the subjob significantly augments the performance of the base job. This leads to many meaningful choices. Do I want to do more raw DPS? Can my tank handle me going war sub? Should I play it safe and help my tank with threat with Thf sub? Should I go Nin sub to lessen the burden on the healers and keep myself alive? When soloing, Dnc sub or Nin sub?

I challenge you to find any class abilities in FFXIV which so fundamentally alter your gameplay experience the way subjobs did.

That is a lop-sided challenge considering the content comparison between the two games is astronomical 22 Jobs versus 7 classes, of course the one with the higher number has more to work with. I still think that you're missing what I'm saying so I'll word it like this and use your examples. If XI's system played like XIV's then you wouldn't have to choose between DPS SAM, Utsusemi SAM, or Hate Control/Burst Damage SAM and you'd have the ability to have all of the above. You'd be able to do high burst damage with hate control and have high damage output and have shadows being able to be cast. And, again, that is a lop sided challenge considering the time that XI has been out and how long it's been developed and worked on and how much it has to offer. In other words, it has worlds more because it's been out longer. More jobs, more options, etc. All I'm saying, simply and to the point, is that I prefer this system because you have access to everything. All this illusion is just a lack of comparable content. If we were to copy and past all of the jobs from XI to XIV then we'd have SAM's that could SATA/Boost/Souleater weapon skills and Beserk/Focus/Last Resort for DPS all at once and have Utsusemi on. PLDs would be able to use Sentinel/Defender/Provoke/Perfect Counter/Chakra/Utsusemi all at once.

I'm not bashing the subjob system because it did revolutionize how the game was played and did indeed allow people more customizing options and flexibility in how they played their main jobs. But if I was on my SAM and someone told me, "You have two choices. You can either have just the skills from this other job here along with your own. Or, have all of the combat skills from all of your jobs plus your own." I think I know what I'd pick. But again, we can't do that with XIV yet because the jobs aren't there yet and it's still being worked on/fixed/tweaked.

Again, this isn't a bash on XI or its system because I am fully aware of how it impacted the game. And again I'll say this, I am fully in favor of a job system to go along-side the armory system; but not to replace. I am willing to admit and take a look at the job system for XI and am ready and willing to admit for that game it's fantastic. But this isn't XI and I don't think that XI's system should come to XIV and replace the system already in place.

[Shikyo]

I wanna see main/sub the ish just works lets you have a specialization with some resrticted versitility IDK why they wont use the main/sub method =/
Crap that method was perfect it let you have a specific role while giving some but not too much secondary ability options.
Plain and simple main/sub is much better then the damn mix and match crap that makes everyone able to use any skill

[Quills]

I wanna see main/sub the ish just works lets you have a specialization with some resrticted versitility IDK why they wont use the main/sub method =/
Crap that method was perfect it let you have a specific role while giving some but not too much secondary ability options.
Plain and simple main/sub is much better then the damn mix and match crap that makes everyone able to use any skill

Because it's restricting... and old. I'd rather pick and choose my abilities from everything I've learned rather than be forced to play SAM/WAR. This is just how life works, you cannot and will not satisfy everybody. To each his own.

[AlexNiculaie]

I wanna see main/sub the ish just works lets you have a specialization with some resrticted versitility IDK why they wont use the main/sub method =/

What they are doing will give just as much, if not more specialization. It's not as if there wasn't any restrictions in the main/sub method. Fact is, there is no need to go to a XI system. I will never get this inability to adapt to a new system for XIV when almost half of the FF titles has had a unique system that allowed pretty much any character to learn any abilities. this isn't that vastly different. Seriously. Mountain out of a molehill.

[KalaKenshu]

What if a Glad wants to do damage or back up tank? Then he can't be a paladin with offensive abilities.. the system is fine as it is right now. It allows for diversity among the classes, and jobs will allow for specialization and class uniqueness. What you are proposing requires a whole mess of convoluted changes that just aren't necessary, or even worth the effort to change.

[Firon]

Also it seems like we are gonna have less AP in the future when all skills are set to the bar auto, which has got me to think that we might have something like 25 ap @ max rank to cross class skills

[Kyra]

you really think that archers still getting bard? lol it be funny and dumb if they do.

Lol I would rage quit so fast you wouldnt believe.

[Starflare]

What if a Glad wants to do damage or back up tank? Then he can't be a paladin with offensive abilities.. the system is fine as it is right now. It allows for diversity among the classes, and jobs will allow for specialization and class uniqueness. What you are proposing requires a whole mess of convoluted changes that just aren't necessary, or even worth the effort to change.

Lemme know a GLA that does damage in any group situation in this game.

Don't worry, I'll wait.

- Kurokikaze

[Sovereign]

Or just stop the job system completely, re-do the classes and go from there. ATM the job system really doesn't sound so great, we with only like 6 classes that can become 6 jobs, there really isn't much customizability at all... Ever gladiator will become a paladin, they will all wear the same armor and use the same skills. It just kind of sounds dull. =/

[Starflare]

Or just stop the job system completely, re-do the classes and go from there. ATM the job system really doesn't sound so great, we with only like 6 classes that can become 6 jobs, there really isn't much customizability at all... Ever gladiator will become a paladin, they will all wear the same armor and use the same skills. It just kind of sounds dull. =/

In the end, after all the min-maxing is done... This outcome will always occur. Doesn't matter what system they use.

- Kurokikaze