[Tank Shortage] Lv50 War/lv38 PLD resigning from ever using Duty Finder

[FurryFury]

Just wait till you DF the same dungeons as a DPS class, after loooong queue... and get a derp tank. Who don't understand your words. Who don't flash at all. Who will *walk* all the time in wrong directions. Mark targets? Pull cubes on platforms? Grab adds? Stun AoE? Haha. And then you ragequit after wiping repeatedly, getting 30 min DF penalty on top of DPS queue time. Sure, tell us more about "not tank-DF ever".

<- prefer doing roulette as a PLD, at least this way one can get some control of the situation.

[Kirinichibon]

DF as tank is 1000x better than other roles. 30-40 is a challenge as PLD, but it's good practice. Take a second to mark mobs and if DPS attack out of order regularly - let them die and let your healer yell at them.

[lxSch]

Just wait till you DF the same dungeons as a DPS class, after loooong queue... and get a derp tank. Who don't understand your words. Who don't flash at all. Who will *walk* all the time in wrong directions. Mark targets? Pull cubes on platforms? Grab adds? Stun AoE? Haha. And then you ragequit after wiping repeatedly, getting 30 min DF penalty on top of DPS queue time. Sure, tell us more about "not tank-DF ever".

<- prefer doing roulette as a PLD, at least this way one can get some control of the situation.

Never DF as a tanker is what i will do, since i have a healer and will still have 1-5 minutes long queues. I do not think i am the only one who made such decision, looking at how short tanker queues are.
Being on both roles, even if tanker is bad:
- WHM can sleep adds (sleeping add does not increase threat towards healing);
- dps can watch their threat bars and hold damage;
- sch can let the fairy heal and take majority of threat, then insta re-summon if needed;
- bosses get immunity to stun on the 4th interrupt, add there dragoons/monks who will randomly stun them too (being a part of their rotation or whatever), so often tanker simply cannot interrupt the boss.
Being a tanker for some time, my area of responsibility is mostly making pulls and maintaining aggro (+rotating CDs on bigger pulls) - here i can influence the outcome greatly, but this part of encounters is usually easy unless people are attempting a speedrun.
During boss fights tanker can dodge aoe, or can stand in it and healer will just have to heal more (i did several brayflox as whm with tanker eating every aoe and passed fine - i used freecure procs), so here tanker responsibility is usually very small. Good example is Titan (HM) party finder - i always see it filled with tankers + healers and waiting for DPS to join. AK - if team is wiping for whatever reason - tanker can do nothing and will keep wiping with them. Garuda (normal) - tanker can dodge slipstream or just stand in it and healer should be able to heal, but if healer cannot dodge garuda skills in p2 - team will keep wiping.
I would like to play a role that has a huge responsibility and outcome influence of the dungeon, but unfortunately it is individual per dungeon and tankers do not have that much responsibility.
Recently i did a Qarn run and was wiping for 75 minutes, we wiped twice at the last boss and ran out of time (i joined in-progress), but i did not leave since people were polite and not blaming each other. Few weeks ago i spent 90 minutes in copperbell (hard) without passing the 3rd boss, but didn't leave until the time ended. If people are not skilled enough to pass a certain encounter it is ok for me and i will wait until time runs out or they give up (i do dungeons for social experience, not exp/loot/whatever reward since it comes alongside).

DF as tank is 1000x better than other roles. 30-40 is a challenge as PLD, but it's good practice. Take a second to mark mobs and if DPS attack out of order regularly - let them die and let your healer yell at them.

Now i am thinking about using PF for low level dungeons (as tanker), i think there must be enough people willing to get a good social experience rather than a bit faster run, also it is better than x-server duty finder because i can befriend people i may meet there and later use the friend list to organize dungeon runs (like it is done in other mmorpgs).

[Warrlordd]

I think this OP has some learning to do about how he can effectively handle his leadership role in a dungeon. Losing hate in 30-40 as a PLD? no one to blame but yourself. If you can't notice that you have 2 DPS attacking 2 different targets that's your problem. Guess what. Some DPS know better than the tank what targets are more dangerous. So they attack the more dangerous one. It's up to you to handle aggro on 2 DPS.
As a friendly note, this is how its done:

1:Lob pull
2:Flash twice
3:Fast blade (identify your aggro needs now)
4:Savage Blade target #1
5:RoH target#2>Fast Blade>Savage Blade
6:ROH target#1>Fast Blade>Savage blade

Repeat 5/6 until the targets die. Insert Flash for 3+ targets so your healer doesn't get the hate.
Swapping targets as i suggest here ensures that you still get your 3 part combo off, but you are beginning and ending your rotation on target with extra enmity generators. You also are STARTING on target with RoH, which has insane enmity generation compared to your other skills.
Don't be lazy. Tank the things. Remember the DPS are at least as smart as you are and you can help them maximize their potential by being that tank that never drops aggro.

You also have issues with 'speed' running? I looked at your WP picture of the chats, and it looked more like a shaky tank situation with DPS/healer that figured they could handle more. you pulled only the 2 tonberries at the start, man. I mean, wake up, put your tank pants on, aggro t hem, run to the birds at the end of the hall at least and tank it. they'll take care of you. If that damage makes you nervous then tanking is just not for you.

Last tip: Always believe that you can do it. Even if people say you can't or its really hard. Being a tank is more about the brain than the gear. Good Luck out there!

[lxSch]

Well i can notice people not attacking in the predefined order, but normally it is not my problem until they start blaming me for not maintaining threat. If someone thinks he knows the attack order better - he should mark mobs so everyone would know which one to attack or sleep (though i know attack orders well since i ran low level dungeons multiple times, but is no reason marking should be tanker's only responsibility like it usually happens).
I disagree with some of your advice on maintaining threat, if you allow me i will state my opinion:
1:lob pull - waste of gcd, i run in and flash, so healer can start healing sooner (doing so due to my healer perspective experience), i only lob pull patrols since i cannot come close in that case.
2:flash twice - normally i do 3-4 flashes (pre-shield oath, half threat) and watch how healer threat goes, is individual per pull.
3:rotating targets - most pulls have 3-4 mobs, if people go full aoe - i cannot hold the threat back, if they do not use full aoe - i don't see a reason to cycle targets, flash is enough to keep the healer safe and dps should be attacking 1 target. But i try to rotate targets when there are 2 different mobs being focused, in the same order as you said + running after the loose add.
Regarding WP speed run, by having two healer jobs i know i50 healer is quite low to make big pulls, during last two days i had two WP disband because i70-i80 WHM and SCH didn't know how to heal and run WP in general (probably zerged only CT to 70-80 since weared CT gear), i went with the normal tactic of 2-3 groups per pull but we wiped and some people ragequit (normally i do bigger pulls in WP and attempt to skip adds if i think it may work).

[Cessna]

I think this OP has some learning to do about how he can effectively handle his leadership role in a dungeon. Losing hate in 30-40 as a PLD? no one to blame but yourself. If you can't notice that you have 2 DPS attacking 2 different targets that's your problem.

Well to be fair paladin sucks at aggro mangement between 30-40, you can't even effectivily cycle through mobs like a war can, you gotta flash and hope for the best and hope the dps attack the target your on that you marked. I mean paladin is up against a huge wall until shield oath, most of the dps have almost full rotation at that point and if they don't they are just on the verge of finishing it off. Paladin only has rage of halone sword oath and flash and provoke, which will only get +1 hate from the target they stole aggro from.

[Warrlordd]

well at that point there is a aggro desparity between war and pld to be sure
there's also a mitigation desparity.
WAR's dont get their keynote ability (infuriate) and CD's for a little while yet. all that is 40-50 iirc.
30-40 is the time to challenge yourself. learn to do it there and when u get shield oath you will be great. lvl 50 is not the time to learn your class.

[Pizzaparty7]

Really not that hard to manage threat pre 40. As someone mentioned, rotate the placement of both enmity strikes and lace in a few flashes. If you're having threat issues I suggest examining your rotation.

OP, if you can't handle people being mean, maybe multiplayer isn't for you. Toughen up, you're a tank!

[lxSch]

OP, if you can't handle people being mean, maybe multiplayer isn't for you. Toughen up, you're a tank!

From my experience community does not mean rude people, but each game has some places favored by bad or rude players (like duty finder and CT in ffxiv). I will just avoid it in the future and do my daily roulette as a healer that takes much less hate.
In my opinions tanker classes here are good, dungeons are good, but duty finder is bad for tankers.

[ClaraLux]

I have actually never gotten harassed in a dungeon as a tank. I believe it's because I usually go faster than your average tank, so no one ever seems to get impatient with me. As for the rude people who do the pulls for you etc, I understand that would be highly annoying.

To some degree, I understand people get impatient, but honestly if they really want to make sure to go fast, they should play the tank themselves, instead of wiping the group by pulling additional mobs for a tank who is unable to handle big pulls. That's just arrogant and rude.

And for the people who tell the OP to toughen up, you clearly do not understand the feeling of frequently being bullied or harassed by a group of people. Most of you all are acting like children with parents who are incapable of teaching you decent manners. You think you are entitled to be rude and arrogant to someone just because you happen to be a better video game player? Think again