I hope I'm wrong, but the Zodiac weapon quests..

[Zumi]

Looks like the quest takes a crafted weapon and there are pieces of crafted weapons in dungeons.

[Kiroh]

People think the game is too easy. Put in extreme primals.
People think game is too hard. Put in echo.
People think game is too easy. Put in difficult quests.
People think game is too hard.

Hard =/= Tedious
Tedious =/= Hard
Random Luck =/= Progress

[Issachar]

Hard =/= Tedious
Tedious =/= Hard
Random Luck =/= Progress

Low skill =/= tedious
Progress =/= instant gratification

[Spellbinder]

Long-term progression, not praying to the RNG.

What would you consider to be long-term progression? Genuinely curious.

[Kiroh]

Low skill =/= tedious
Progress =/= instant gratification

Insults =/= valid arguments
Lack of understanding =/= facts

If your endgame content ever EVER causes someone to say "that's just how RNGs work" the only player skill you're challenging is the ability to do the same thing 200x and not make any progress whatsoever, in other words their patience/tolerance for abuse. (Thought I'd spell it out since your response shows a clear lack of understanding this concept.)

Anything where some players clear it once and get something, while other players clear it several hundred times and get nothing is not about skill.

Luck is not skill.

[Shioban]

I can assure you, you'll be doing a bit of grinding;

As 'Atma' is a portion of the quest-line, you'll be gathering these it seems!

[Issachar]

Insults =/= valid arguments
Lack of understanding =/= facts

If your endgame content ever EVER causes someone to say "that's just how RNGs work" the only player skill your challenging is the ability to do the same thing 200x and not make any progress whatsoever, in other words their patience/tolerance for abuse. (Thought I'd spell it out since your response show a clear lack of understanding this concept.)

Anything where some players clear it once and get something, while other players clear it several hundred times and get nothing is not about skill.

Luck is not skill.

Luck is not skill, but manipulating the luck into your favor is.


And strawman =/= valid argument

[Kiroh]

What would you consider to be long-term progression? Genuinely curious.

Token systems are long-term progress, something that makes a noticeable dent in getting to your goal even if you don't reach it right away. (obviously not in the amounts that tomes are given out or anything, but say even if you don't get the lucky drop, you won't kill an enemy several dozen - several hundred times without any progress whatsoever.

For instance, challenging enemies or battlefields that drop either the item you need, or if that doesn't drop, a token which a certain number of can be traded for the item you need. Some people get lucky, but luck isn't the determining factor in whether you're allowed to progress.

[Kiroh]

Luck is not skill, but manipulating the luck into your favor is.


And strawman =/= valid argument

Name a single way you have any ability to manipulate a series of random numbers from a computer you have no access to.

Also stating facts =/= strawman, but arguing that you can somehow alter the random outcome of a computer program as a defense to crappy game mechanics is.

[Issachar]

snip

Easy. Make sure that you are the victor the first time, every time, when the RNG pays out. Don't approach from one direction, but many. Prepare many jobs. Play your groups like a fiddle, make sure you are first in line for that drop, and never accept anything less. This has been the rule for many years. If you cannot abide by this mindset, then struggle and watch your spoils go to somebody else. Once you are on top, then you can help the others. Don't confuse dominance for elitism. The difference between the two is elitism comes with unwarranted self importance. Dominance is intelligence and conviction, and the drive to push yourself above the norm. If you lose your golden egg that the RNG spawned to somebody else, you have no one else to blame but yourself. That is what it means to play the RNG.

And facts =/= opinions.