An open discsusion on the consequences of death

[kukurumei]

Better then people death warping left and right.

There's a difference when people try as hard as possible not to die, and those that get inconvenienced when they die.

A tank dying so the party can escape, or a sacrificial pull for the greater good of the alliance gets a salute.
The same thing in FF14 would be a coffee break. Might not even bother to care, and let everyone die to start over anyway.

[Lusavari]

The weakness doesn't really bother me, but I hated the XP penalties sooooo much. The problem was I had a lot of people in things like Dynamis or HNMs, and they didn't have enough time to level every job they'd have to come on all the time. I had a PLD end up at 73 from Nidhoggs and Dynamis before. Of course... admittedly, I didn't much care for him and there's a lot of other nasty things I could say, but I won't.

The point is, when you move on into endgame, and you're not xping as much, it gets ridiculous. Right now, the gear condition combined with the Homepoint and Weakness issue is enough. Plus weakness in XIV is far more serious than XI. This is something that really just doesn't need to change. Dying twice can cost you an entire leve sometimes. I think that's perfectly fair.

[Lusavari]

Also, with the dev codes, the title doesn't matter. Remember to write it in the tag. Check the sticky.

[Overkill9000]

i don't think they should be so severe that it makes you downright violent when you die though. let's face it, there's gonna be some parties that you die in a lot and if you are too afraid of death that you wouldn't even try it, how fun can things get?

[AndyFox]

I agree, there's no real reason to fear death in this game. If I have nothing to lose, I am less likely to be careful or even care if I get killed. It really causes you to not have much of an emotional reaction when you're in a tough spot. The worst thing that happens is you have to run back to wherever you were standing, not much of a penalty really. There needs to be some consequence attached to death to make us care if we survive or not!

[Ark_mage2]

Kudos to the OP for the well worded and organized presentation of this controversial issue. I hope more threads follow your format. As far as the death penalty is concerned, the current system feels more like a time out than an actual punishment for death. I agree with the OP that throwing in a small but meaningful drop in exp/sp to the system would add a much deeper psychological fear of death. The fact that the xp can be relatively quickly gained back does not really matter, what does is that the player feels like they have lost something important to them, as opposed to being slightly inconvenienced.

[Kurokikaze]

I agree that there needs to be a penalty for death but I will draw the line on EXP/SP loss. I would hate to see that implemented again. Do not want to be in fear of de-leveling again.

What would work and is more in line with what we have currently in game is if you take a heavy damage penalty to all your equipped gear for each death. Something around 10-15% loss for every death.

[Grimoire]

Maybe they could add a debuff that limits the SP you can gain for a while after death? Not as bad as SP loss, but It would make me want to stay alive more. Plus it wouldn't make end game deaths so bad.

[Ark_mage2]

I agree that there needs to be a penalty for death but I will draw the line on EXP/SP loss. I would hate to see that implemented again. Do not want to be in fear of de-leveling again.

What would work and is more in line with what we have currently in game is if you take a heavy damage penalty to all your equipped gear for each death. Something around 10-15% loss for every death.

I would agree with you except for the fact that it is not instantly apparent that damage has taken place because of death. If a player has been battling for an hour or so without checking their armor/weapon damage then when they die they might not even notice. So if there was some notification that showed that items had been damaged then I think it could work. There needs to be an instant feel of loss as soon as a player sees their HP drop to 0.

[Arcell]

I am 100% against SP/XP loss. It's a horrible time sink and all it does is just make people frustrated. To me a death is a mistake, one that you should learn from regardless of the penalty. A few days ago I used a weapon skill on a Djigga and got myself, as well as a few party members killed. You can sure as hell bet I'm going to remember that next time and not do it again. There was no penalty there but I felt that it was a learning experience. Had SP/XP loss occurred you can bet those same people may have been rather angry about it and nothing productive would have come of it.

Most of my deaths, and the deaths I've seen, have been 1-hit KOs. No way anyone could have survived it, completely came out of left field and knocked them out in one go. There's no way to avoid that, especially with crits or multiple passes on a skill from a group. All an SP/XP loss would serve to do is aggravate people upon death and the state of things would deteriorate.

When I played Aion as a Templar I had no problem dying for my team but I would have liked to keep it to a minimum. Dying in that game drove you into poverty but all that served to do was piss me off when I did die. I learned just as much as I do now, it was just more annoying.

People should avoid death because a death means you made a mistake, it's the mark of a bad player to die and not learn. Personally I play well so that I am not a burden on the team and so that I can be happy knowing I did my best. People who only play well enough to avoid penalties worry me.