If you are a WHM without Swiftcast, you are holding back your team at endgame

[Aegis]

At the end of the day, even those defending not getting it know they should get it.

Either used as an emergency rez, a straight-up increase in HPS, the ability to make a cast uninterruptible or even for an increase in DPS or more rapid crowd-control the ability is one of the most useful in the game.

FCs/Statics/PUGs that require it (they aren't demanding it, you're perfectly free to not get it, just as they are free to not keep you in group) make similar demands for other jobs. WARs should have voke. BRDs should have invigorate/blood for blood. Black Mages should have Virus etc etc. All these abilities are required and you will be expected to level the relevant classes by any decent end-game group and none of them are as useful as Swiftcast.

Feel indignant that lowly melee are asking you to level another class if you want, but for heaven's sake, level the gorramn class.

[Hitome]

I wish people like these were around when I was playing ffxi. No need to lvl up my ninja sub. No need to break all my beastmen seals to try for an utsusemi ni scroll and then not having it drop at all and having to spend loads to buy the scroll instead. Because they will tell me it'll be okay.

It'll be okay.

This made me chuckle.

Anyways, I enjoy reading the responses from these healers who suggest that everyone needs to be perfect. It's like watching a college student learn about theoretical situations (where you often assume ideal conditions) and then get out into the real world where the theoretical situation occurs 0.0000001% of the time.

I admire this type of attitude. I can't wait till you start getting into content where a swiftcast raise would have made all the difference in the world. Or, even, a swiftcast medica/succor. Or cure 3. Or a swiftcast + summon pet. Ah they'll learn eventually once they join the real world and come down from their lofty perches in the land of perfection.

Besides, on my SCH, I often am swiftcast ressing other healers quite frequently. I wonder how many of them don't have swiftcast themselves.

[KHShadowrunner]

There's a difference between 'should' get it, and 'you are holding your team back if you dont get it'.

Or as you put it:

level the gorramn class.

That phrase just invites the following:

"Feel indignant that lowly healers and tanks are asking you to watch the floor if you want, but for heaven's sake, dodge the friggin fire"

[KHShadowrunner]

I admire this type of attitude. I can't wait till you start getting into content where a swiftcast raise would have made all the difference in the world. Or, even, a swiftcast medica/succor. Or cure 3. Or a swiftcast + summon pet. Ah they'll learn eventually once they join the real world and come down from their lofty perches in the land of perfection.

Besides, on my SCH, I often am swiftcast ressing other healers quite frequently. I wonder how many of them don't have swiftcast themselves.

It's one thing to suggest, it's another to flat out insult. Sorry that people get defensive when you attack them. Hey! They're tanks in disguise!

[Aegis]

There's a difference between 'should' get it, and 'you are holding your team back if you dont get it'.

Or as you put it:

level the gorramn class.

That phrase just invites the following:

"Feel indignant that lowly healers and tanks are asking you to watch the floor if you want, but for heaven's sake, dodge the friggin fire"

And you would presumably agree that someone standing in fire is holding their team back in endgame?

It seems we are on the same page. If a healer or a tank dies you could fail to raise them because you don't have swiftcast and wipe; basking in the knowledge that it wasn't your fault. Alternatively you could raise them instantly and recover and win. Should they have died? Probably not. Should you have the ability to get them back on their feet as quickly as possible? Yes.

Cases like this happen. People die to avoidable stuff. Refusing to raise someone who did is like refusing to cure someone who got hit by something avoidable. Your job is keeping people alive and bringing back those that die. Anything that helps you to do that is required of you. Honestly, any self-respecting healer should be absolutely salivating at the chance to get a tool that increases their ability to do their job to the best it can be done.

[nitram]

Don't die. If u r dying in any end game content. Someone is doing something wrong.

[KHShadowrunner]

Cases like this happen. People die to avoidable stuff. Refusing to raise someone who did is like refusing to cure someone who got hit by something avoidable. Your job is keeping people alive and bringing back those that die. Anything that helps you to do that is required of you. Honestly, any self-respecting healer should be absolutely salivating at the chance to get a tool that increases their ability to do their job to the best it can be done.

See, having now leveled a DD (BLM), Tank (PLD), and Healer (WHM), I've found those 'cases' to be less and less frequent. The higher up in content you go, the more often being raised is just a faster ticket to more repairs, and wasted MP. I mean, as others have said, if you die in titan it's 90% of the time over, especially before heart. In KB, the guaranteed tick damage has put more people at double digit numbers before the first heal, just silly. This goes for other fights as well, Hydra seems to like to randomly put DPS down after they've been raised. We had a good laugh at a healer during an ifrit run whom was swiftcast + raised -7- times before we won. But would I say that all those raises were for victory? not really.

To answer the first question, I would say no. I would say that the mechanics can be hard, but they can be beaten, practice hard and you'll get it. I wouldn't outright tell them 'Sorry JimBo, You're not doing your job and you are failing everyone as a whole'.

[Artemiz]

pretty selfish to tell someone to not play since you dont like the way someone chooses to experience the game. Also your analogy is pretty pathetic, a healer is not going to stop being a healer/support just cause they choose not to get swiftcast or do some dps or w/e other reason. But nice try.

I used an analogy to make the point that you can't just play how you want in a co-op game. That was the point I was contesting, nice strawman though.

If you seriously think being a team player is selfish then I honestly don't know what to say to you, you really should spend time reading a dictionary so you know what words mean.

[Aegis]

See, having now leveled a DD (BLM), Tank (PLD), and Healer (WHM), I've found those 'cases' to be less and less frequent. The higher up in content you go, the more often being raised is just a faster ticket to more repairs, and wasted MP. I mean, as others have said, if you die in titan it's 90% of the time over, especially before heart. In KB, the guaranteed tick damage has put more people at double digit numbers before the first heal, just silly. This goes for other fights as well, Hydra seems to like to randomly put DPS down after they've been raised. We had a good laugh at a healer during an ifrit run whom was swiftcast + raised -7- times before we won. But would I say that all those raises were for victory? not really.

To answer the first question, I would say no. I would say that the mechanics can be hard, but they can be beaten, practice hard and you'll get it. I wouldn't outright tell them 'Sorry JimBo, You're not doing your job and you are failing everyone as a whole'.

Actually, I do Titan donation runs and people dying before Heart (while it rarely occurs, everyone knows the fight backwards and forwards, but everyone gets the occasional lag spike) doesn't have any noticable impact to us. Insta rez whenever, accept rez as soon as plumes appear on the ground. You always have 3-4 GCDs (depending on phase) before stomps. More than enough time to get them sorted.

And that's the difference: No swiftcast (In your own words) If you die in Titan 90% of the time it's over. With swiftcast, it's a minor inconvenience.

Yes, KB has unavoidable AOE floor damage, but hard raise followed by insta-cast cure 2 and they're fine (especially with 5s invulnerability now) or insta cast raise followed by other healer insta casting Cure 2 and you're good again.

Honestly, I don't think I could think up better examples of how SC is useful than those you posited about how it isn't.

I wouldn't outright tell them 'Sorry JimBo, You're not doing your job and you are failing everyone as a whole'.

What if they refuse to move out of fire, as long as it doesn't one-shot them they can say "I'm doing DPS, that's my job. Moving out of fire lowers my DPS. Healer's job is to heal me"

It may not seem it to you, but the argument that you shouldn't do something because it's somebody else's role to make it so that you don't need to do it is the same across both scenarios. Now, the DPS is of course being more unreasonable, but it's only a matter of degree.

[wildgalax]

I used an analogy to make the point that you can't just play how you want in a co-op game. That was the point I was contesting, nice strawman though.

If you seriously think being a team player is selfish then I honestly don't know what to say to you, you really should spend time reading a dictionary so you know what words mean.

I dont know what world you live in but someone coming with all their cross class skills is not going to make me think they are a team player. For me its more the attitude they bring and how well they can sync with everyone, and a lot more i dont think you would understand anyway. And nice 1 dimensional thinking and poor logic to think 1 variable illustrates the whole picture, maybe you should go back to school.