SQUARE-ENIX, remember not to marginalise crafters

[Renshi]

They are supposed to be classes too.

The recent NMs that drop ready-to-wear gear which rivals crafted gear was one insult to the crafting profession. Let's not repeat mistakes.

With the Public Companies page shedding light on the possibility of rewarding players with items and gear, make sure you don't screw over crafters a second time.

You have a point.
In this game, crafters are classes that need to do something too. Hopefully, the Grand Companies of Eorzea will give some real sh*t to do for crafters. Also for gathering classes.

I wonder what's the problem on having those as classes =)

Ah anyway, that was the zombie talking.

[Physic]

If crafters werent full classes then SE wouldnt really have to cater to them because crafting would be something people just did on the side..

heh, you still have to design around crafting, in a game where crafting is as difficult as it is here. Unless they make crafting easy and fast, people are going to expect some good returns for doing it, even if it doesnt have its own tab in classes. Even aion has to worry about balancing the craftable items with the drops.

One thing that i think the crafting classes kind of mess up is the storyline quests, which have you taking back seat to your npc because the charachter could theoretically be only able to throw stones. They really should have given crafters some basic battle abilities, or at least the ability to use some cross class skills, even if they got no exp for leveling.

either that or created different content for crafters.

[InuraBera]

Here is the thing. I don't like crafting much. Never has been my thing. On the other hand, Gathering is where I spend the majority of my time - and like crafting, I feel they will attempt to push them aside. Now, until we get more information I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, but it is nice for once being able to actually progress in a game as something that isn't purely Combat.

If I wanted to always play fully as Combat, I'd be playing one of dozens of other games out there. The fact that for once, you get a full blown MMORPG (With players supposed to support each other) rather than a watered down dungeon crawler seems to be too much for many folk. The addition of the Notorious Monster gear is already placing us on the path of everyone looking the same, wanting the same, and doing the same - I don't know how many people I see with the blue Lancer chestpiece, or the Lancer spear.

Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to the combat changes and such as much as anyone else, but at least before the armour and such made sense, rather than hundreds of people wearing the same 'unique' and 'rare' gear, yet I see more of them than I ever have Hempen Berets. I enjoy the fact that the materials I gather go forth into the game, and people eventually make them into items, used by other players - that is part of an MMO as well, not just gathering a few others to stab a monster to death. In terms of skills, my highest Ranked class is Botanist at 42, which I enjoy greatly - with my next highest being Lancer, which I've levelled to 27 yet don't enjoy at all.

I hope that the changes to crafting and gathering in the future put an emphasis on helping crafters Skill up by crafting things that the market needs rather than purely grinding it out on a high skill point material or such - same with gatherers. Remove the Crafting and Gathering as classes and we have just another MMO, and trust me, I'm getting tired of that formula.

I guess I have to trust in the developers.

*Edit* I love being my own class and having my own gear - in the same way you may feel pride for being a Gladiator, I can feel that for Botanist, don't kick us just because you don't care for it.

[Chory]

All they have to do is make crafters not full classes anymore. They can do this when they take away our physical levels. Will several people quit? yes. But being that only 20k-30k people currently play who cares if 10k of them quit if it makes a system that makes more sense for the incoming PS3 players who are the games true bread and butter not the very few PC players still playing.

Couldnt agree more.
Turning DoH/DoL into classes is one of the biggest mistakes SE made.
RPG fans dont play MMORPG to MAKE weapons/armor - they wanna USE them.
So far FFXIV is more about crafting stuff than using it.
I dont really think we should call it MMORPG, its more like MMODIY.

[KaiKatzchen]

They have to do it this way

or they'll have only crafter nerds play their game

When the games goes P2P 'crafting nerds' will be paying for the game just like everyone else. So what makes the people who don't craft or don't craft main better than the crafter's? Money is the same and it will suck if people can't find anyone to fix their gear because no one wants to craft anymore.



And while the 100 font text is annoying... I do agree. While I'm not threatened by the new gear drops off the NM's, they need to make sure not to forget the crafter's.

Early on they promised that crafter's would have a key role in this game and would not be pushed off at the wayside.

Anyway it not only effects the crafters, but the gatherers as well. If there isn't a lot for the crafter's to do then newer people don't get into crafting as much, and older players won't need the supplies as much.

This effects the gatherer's who now aren't needed as much or now have to lower their prices to rock bottom to get rid of their supplies that they have gotten.

Also at this time there are only 7 DoW and DoM classes vs. 11 DoH and DoL classes. That would be a really LARGE group of people and classes to totally dump on and make useless, it's more than half the game class wise.

Also I would like to point out that they said they were going to make items that needed multi-crafter's to make working together such as wedding cakes, boats and ships... oh yeah boats and ships! Yet people want to say they aren't real classes and should be popped down.

Maybe all the crafter's should get together and make their own boat's and ships and leave everyone else to walk. LOL

Myself, I do crafting and fighting classes and I feel both should be treated equally.

[Physic]

Here is the thing. I don't like crafting much. Never has been my thing. On the other hand, Gathering is where I spend the majority of my time - and like crafting, I feel they will attempt to push them aside. Now, until we get more information I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, but it is nice for once being able to actually progress in a game as something that isn't purely Combat.

If I wanted to always play fully as Combat, I'd be playing one of dozens of other games out there. The fact that for once, you get a full blown MMORPG (With players supposed to support each other) rather than a watered down dungeon crawler seems to be too much for many folk. The addition of the Notorious Monster gear is already placing us on the path of everyone looking the same, wanting the same, and doing the same - I don't know how many people I see with the blue Lancer chestpiece, or the Lancer spear.

Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to the combat changes and such as much as anyone else, but at least before the armour and such made sense, rather than hundreds of people wearing the same 'unique' and 'rare' gear, yet I see more of them than I ever have Hempen Berets. I enjoy the fact that the materials I gather go forth into the game, and people eventually make them into items, used by other players - that is part of an MMO as well, not just gathering a few others to stab a monster to death. In terms of skills, my highest Ranked class is Botanist at 42, which I enjoy greatly - with my next highest being Lancer, which I've levelled to 27 yet don't enjoy at all.

I hope that the changes to crafting and gathering in the future put an emphasis on helping crafters Skill up by crafting things that the market needs rather than purely grinding it out on a high skill point material or such - same with gatherers. Remove the Crafting and Gathering as classes and we have just another MMO, and trust me, I'm getting tired of that formula.

I guess I have to trust in the developers.

*Edit* I love being my own class and having my own gear - in the same way you may feel pride for being a Gladiator, I can feel that for Botanist, don't kick us just because you don't care for it.

i can see how gathers and crafters can make the game entertaining in some respects, but i dont think that NM or crafted changes anything in regards to people all wearing the same item. I see dodore and tricornes all over the place, dont kid yourself that crafted items are somehow immune to being over abundant for stats

[Gramul]

They cannot be treated equally because they are unequal things.

I feel part of the reason the game faltered is because they tried to please everyone and ended up pleasing no one (or rather very few). We need to provide separate content for the fighters (the majority of the game) to keep them happy like uncovering lost equipment that can't be made by crafting.

However, content for Crafters could be upgrading these items to make better equipment (which they should. Some of these lost items aren't very good for their level range.) Separate content that provides equal importance.

[LlenCoram]

Here is the thing. I don't like crafting much. Never has been my thing. On the other hand, Gathering is where I spend the majority of my time - and like crafting, I feel they will attempt to push them aside. Now, until we get more information I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, but it is nice for once being able to actually progress in a game as something that isn't purely Combat.

If I wanted to always play fully as Combat, I'd be playing one of dozens of other games out there. The fact that for once, you get a full blown MMORPG (With players supposed to support each other) rather than a watered down dungeon crawler seems to be too much for many folk. The addition of the Notorious Monster gear is already placing us on the path of everyone looking the same, wanting the same, and doing the same - I don't know how many people I see with the blue Lancer chestpiece, or the Lancer spear.

Don't get me wrong, I'm looking forward to the combat changes and such as much as anyone else, but at least before the armour and such made sense, rather than hundreds of people wearing the same 'unique' and 'rare' gear, yet I see more of them than I ever have Hempen Berets. I enjoy the fact that the materials I gather go forth into the game, and people eventually make them into items, used by other players - that is part of an MMO as well, not just gathering a few others to stab a monster to death. In terms of skills, my highest Ranked class is Botanist at 42, which I enjoy greatly - with my next highest being Lancer, which I've levelled to 27 yet don't enjoy at all.

I hope that the changes to crafting and gathering in the future put an emphasis on helping crafters Skill up by crafting things that the market needs rather than purely grinding it out on a high skill point material or such - same with gatherers. Remove the Crafting and Gathering as classes and we have just another MMO, and trust me, I'm getting tired of that formula.

I guess I have to trust in the developers.

*Edit* I love being my own class and having my own gear - in the same way you may feel pride for being a Gladiator, I can feel that for Botanist, don't kick us just because you don't care for it.

Well said. A game like this is built for people to have fun the way they see fit. If you don't like gathering, you don't need to bother with it. I don't like crafting, so I don't do it. Plain and simple. I'm proud of being a fisher and take pride in helping out my LS.

[Kuroguma]

I believe if SE removed crafting all together and marginalized repairing at NPC's they would lose only 1-2% of their current subscriptions yet they would gain more than 10% of those who have already quit.

My question to people who craft is why do you craft? What is your goal?

As Gladiator my goal is to tank the most difficult enemies in the game with my friends. And yes, if a good looking piece of armor drops or weapon that help me do that better then I get really excited, the items dropped by said enemies are like trophies of accomplishments for me and my friends. It is a virtual display of my skill and the skill of those of whom are in my company.

The ONLY time I would ever desire to level a craft is if it helped me accomplish my goal.

As my friends and our ability to accomplish our goals increase then so should our rewards.

This is, from my 13 years of MMO experience, what we call FUN.

My question still is what is YOUR goal people who craft?

There are only a few possibilities that I can see:

1. You want gil. But why? It's worthless. Only thing you can buy in game with gil is gear. And why would you need gear... to craft more gear? There is no goal in this cyclical reasoning. So either you are selling gil or your goal is something else.

2. You want gear. But why? You're a crafter. If a enormous dragon appears over Ul'dah are you going to throw stones at him and then blind him with you shinny gear? The point is you have no skill that matters. What skill does it take to craft? It requires zero skill, zero strategy and no coordination with others. I could train a mouse to rank up a crafting class 1-50 as it is now. So what do you gain as a crafter if gear is useless to you?

3. You are masochistic. You do painful things for sexual pleasure. Please stop playing this game and see a psychologist.

4. You want to manipulate the market for your own personal gain. AH here's the truth... and probably describes most people who craft. You want to craft difficult items for profit so that you can buy what ever you want in the game including gear to help you damage/tank/heal in scenario X. You are the same kind of people that believe money buys friends and happiness. You want people who have talent to need you because you yourself have zero talent. Please GTFO.

[Jinko]

They need to make crafting less important in this game anyway, it should have never been a class, that was a stupid fantastical mistake on Tanaka's part.

DEV team please make crafting less important and make it a side profession and not a class !!

I can use big letters too !

I agree with Kuroguma pretty much.

The only reason why people are levelling crafting so much is to fix their own gear, make repairs NPC only IMO and make it a decent gil sink, lord knows the game needs one.