Not being able to buy single items from a stack on the marketward.

[oneshot]

Please do me a solid

Dood you are awsome just for using do me a solid lol, never heard anyone actually use this word besides on a cartoon! kudos ! and yes im being serious not trying to troll u lol

[Darlantan]

Welcome, have a seat, i've been at the conclusion for several of you for awhile now.

Funny how you said several of us... Why is it that several of us are in disagreement with you and your false-biased ideas but yet the several of us are all on the same page? Hmmmm....

[Geobryn]

snip

I get your point but problem is, the UI is not ready for that. You can not easily manage what you are selling and edit it
for example lets say i have 500 iron ore and want it to sell it one by one, there is no room for 500 orders at retainer!
and even if there was, just setting up those 500 orders would kill me, not talking about changing price at them :P
heck even the 40 is painful

adding "bulk only" checkbox would fix that aspect and made it manageable, because i could change the price for 99 sell orders at once, there could be even limit to how many of one material you can put on auciton, like 1 30x stack or something, that way it would prevent "flooding", because i cant seem to find "pages" at auction, its 100 things listed the END. If 3 ppl put up 120 sell orders of 1's for 10 gill you wont be able to even see stacks of 99 if they will cost more, and clicking to buy 100 items like that is also kind of .... or did i missed some button ?

also adding buy orders to the game could clear the market a bit, because whats wrong with saying i buy 10 iron for 5 gil each, if someone wants fast money they will throw it at me -> win win situation

[Kraggy]

Why can't we use RL comparisons? This maybe a game but it still simulates an econo

This is unlike the 'real world' in several crucial ways that make such a comparison futile.

[Wulfies]

Blizzy, my 2 gil:

1) FFXIV and/or any MMORPG is supposed to simulate RL, hence the "MMO." The effect is to try to simulate an enviroment that is near real-world while still having the fantasy aspects (magic...monsters...blah...blah...blah.) This is supposed to be a "watered-down" (no forex/futures/Derivities/ect trading, which I did while I was employed at a brokerage shop) economics. It has to be "watered-down" because there is no limiting factor on raw materials (I will always be able to mine say Copper Ore outside Ul'Dah.)

To your example of toilet paper, yes, I can go to Wal-mart and iI see that they have packs of Charmin Toilet Paper in 1 Pack, 4 pack, 8 pack, 12 pack, 24 pack, and 36 pack on their shelves. Staying with this, do you see how long the isle at Wal-Mart is for toilet paper? A single store can sell all different sizes and have a whole lot of each quantity. In the game, there is only a finite amount of space we as sellers have (2 retainers @ 20 spaces each.) Sticking with Wal-Mart, its like telling the store, "sorry you can only sell 40 "packs" at a time, and have them decide on what to sell." So if Wal-Mart decides to sell in their store only 36 packs (because their warehouse (our inventory) is filling up very quickly, what are you gonna do when you need 1 roll?

I have said this on all my posts THEY HAD IT RIGHT IN 1.0

2) In sticking with your antiques as a reseller, yes you see profitability and flip and make your money on the spread. This works for you becasue like you said, they are antiques, your not really gonna find more than 1. To prove a point, I will use an absurd example. Everyone knows what a Faberge Egg is (if not click on this link for pictures.) Sure there are alot of em out there, but the number has a limit, no new eggs are being made/coming on the market. You have a limited supply to force demand.

Question to all that have posted on this thread, are you all looking at this from BOTH the buyer and seller side? All I see are points that would lead me to beleive that youa re looking at this from one and not the other.

Comments are more than welcome.

[Bizzybeast]

First I wanted to thank some of you for creating discussion, not a pissing match of whose most right about things in a video game.

I get your point but problem is, the UI is not ready for that. You can not easily manage what you are selling and edit it
for example lets say i have 500 iron ore and want it to sell it one by one, there is no room for 500 orders at retainer!
and even if there was, just setting up those 500 orders would kill me, not talking about changing price at them :P
heck even the 40 is painful

Im not really sure what the User Interface would have to do with my point, to be honest. My point was simply how having it so someone can buy ANY quantity from a stack on the market, would ruin the diversity of the market. If you had 500 of something, with the intent of acquiring more, 1 by 1 is certainly tedious. That is why it is a diverse market, if someone took the time to list 1 by 1, 40 at a time, then they deserve the reward of a bit more gil per individual item sale.

It seems you would agree with that. In the system being discussed it will only be the person ruthless enough to go the lowest, then everyone else waits and HOPES they don't have 500 more to sell after those 500. Lets pretend they do..

Do you truly think the market should be about ONE person selling in each category? Or should it be diverse and allow for many people to sell at once?

adding "bulk only" checkbox would fix that aspect and made it manageable, because i could change the price for 99 sell orders at once, there could be even limit to how many of one material you can put on auciton, like 1 30x stack or something, that way it would prevent "flooding", because i cant seem to find "pages" at auction, its 100 things listed the END. If 3 ppl put up 120 sell orders of 1's for 10 gill you wont be able to even see stacks of 99 if they will cost more, and clicking to buy 100 items like that is also kind of .... or did i missed some button ?

also adding buy orders to the game could clear the market a bit, because whats wrong with saying i buy 10 iron for 5 gil each, if someone wants fast money they will throw it at me -> win win situation

I like that you are offering ideas, even if I disagree with them, it is a step in the right direction. Buy Orders is something ive thrown around in other threads and is a great suggestion.

Blizzy, my 2 gil:

1) FFXIV and/or any MMORPG is supposed to simulate RL, hence the "MMO." The effect is to try to simulate an enviroment that is near real-world while still having the fantasy aspects (magic...monsters...blah...blah...blah.) This is supposed to be a "watered-down" (no forex/futures/Derivities/ect trading, which I did while I was employed at a brokerage shop) economics. It has to be "watered-down" because there is no limiting factor on raw materials (I will always be able to mine say Copper Ore outside Ul'Dah.)

Well since you called me Blizzy, I guess I will call you Waffles.

Personally I very much disagree with what you're saying here, in most cases people play a Massively Multiplayer Online game to escape Real Life, to be someone else for a little while through roleplay, and I cant think of any real correlation between an MMO and Real Life. So I truly dont think any MMORPG is aiming to simulate RL, however I think I can kind of understand how some players mistake that.

To your example of toilet paper, yes, I can go to Wal-mart and iI see that they have packs of Charmin Toilet Paper in 1 Pack, 4 pack, 8 pack, 12 pack, 24 pack, and 36 pack on their shelves. Staying with this, do you see how long the isle at Wal-Mart is for toilet paper? A single store can sell all different sizes and have a whole lot of each quantity. In the game, there is only a finite amount of space we as sellers have (2 retainers @ 20 spaces each.) Sticking with Wal-Mart, its like telling the store, "sorry you can only sell 40 "packs" at a time, and have them decide on what to sell." So if Wal-Mart decides to sell in their store only 36 packs (because their warehouse (our inventory) is filling up very quickly, what are you gonna do when you need 1 roll?

I think your example would make more sense if it was Walmart toilet paper, but its not, its a lot of different companies (retainers) all selling many different versions of the same thing; toilet paper. So technically it would fall under very similar restrictions of our 2 retainers, 40 sell slots. What you see on those shelves isnt the world supply, its but a tiny fraction of the supply. If the demand is high enough, the single rolls, the 12 pack, the 36 pack- all will fly off the shelf.

Honestly we should probably flush this analogy, before I have to make another bad pun.

2) In sticking with your antiques as a reseller, yes you see profitability and flip and make your money on the spread. This works for you becasue like you said, they are antiques, your not really gonna find more than 1. To prove a point, I will use an absurd example. Everyone knows what a Faberge Egg. Sure there are alot of em out there, but the number has a limit, no new eggs are being made/coming on the market. You have a limited supply to force demand.

I dont think I follow your example, im sorry, I dont really know what youre trying to say or what its relevance could be.

Question to all that have posted on this thread, are you all looking at this from BOTH the buyer and seller side? All I see are points that would lead me to beleive that youa re looking at this from one and not the other.

Comments are more than welcome.

That I think is the biggest problem, is too many people are quick to say 'YAH THAT SUCKS NOT BEING ABLE TO BUY HOW MANY I WANT FROM A GIVEN STACK, CHANGE IT NOW AND WITHOUT CONSIDERING THE CONSEQUENCES!' and obviously couldnt care how damaging it would be to the sellers. As both a buyer and a seller, I have no empathy for the buyer as they already have all of the control. /shout Looking to buy a single roll of toilet paper. Its that simple, ruining the entire market system because people are too lazy to seek what they want, when they want obscure things, is just does not sit well with me.

Its become apparent in this thread that some people refuse to allow the common sense of it in their thick skulls. Adding this mechanic in would destroy an already troubled market board system.

[Maroite]

As someone who sells large stacks, Leve turn in 3xstacks and single leve turn in stacks as well as singles I can't disagree with this more.

If I put something up as 9x<item name> and someone snatches one out of the stack I would be seriously irritated. I put those up for specific people looking for specific amounts of items. If you don't want my stack don't buy it and find/make your own item but SE better not allow people to F up my stack.

Not to mention that this seems terrible and easily exploitable with the 3/9 leve quest turn ins. Example: Sally puts up 5 stacks of 9 items. Bob has 5 stacks of the same 9 items, goes to the board and snatches 1 out of each of Sally's stacks. Now Sally's stacks are incomplete and Bob puts his stacks of 9 up and gains favor with the market of people looking to by 3x leve turn-in items.

[MagicZelda]

i will try and balance my selling of stacks and single items. Hope that helps

[Maroite]

<snip>

People should be able to decide how large a stack they want to sell and if they want to sell a stack at all. You should not be able to swipe individual items out of a stack the someone is trying to sell.

As a buyer and seller this is how I feel because as a buyer I've seen plenty of single/small stacks of items and as a seller I don't want someone messing up my method of selling because its slightly inconvenient for them to scroll through 50 items to find the (usually more expensive) single listing.

And if you need a single item thats not available there are multiple ways of going about getting it outside of the market: the forums, using in game chat, using friends, or making/gathering the item youself.

[Jinko]

I get your point but problem is, the UI is not ready for that. You can not easily manage what you are selling and edit it
for example lets say i have 500 iron ore and want it to sell it one by one, there is no room for 500 orders at retainer!
and even if there was, just setting up those 500 orders would kill me, not talking about changing price at them :P
heck even the 40 is painful

Agree a UI were you could put in X amount of X at X each and click ok and the system sort the bundles out and post them to your retainer atomically would be awesome.

Problem is SE never think of anything intuitive, even when they do it turns out cumbersome and convoluted, so I am not even sure I would want them to try this.

I'd sooner wait for add-ons and someone with slight common sense to design something instead.

Also agree with you about having selling limits, for example. iron ore:-

(BASICALLY A MAXIMUM OF 99 ITEMS OF ONE SORT PER RETAINER)
20 x single (ore of the same sort) per retainer - maximum (because we only have 20 slots)
4 stacks of 24 (of the same sort) per retainer
3 stacks of 33 (of the same sort) per retainer
2 stacks of 49 (of the same sort) per retainer
1 stack of 99 (of the same sort) per retainer

or any variation of selling 99 items in multiple stacks.

This would stop one single person (RMT) from flooding the market, it would also make people more likely to gather multiples of different items instead of non stop levelling off of one resource and crashing prices.

Buy orders :-

The above suggestion would also make buy orders more fair as once someone's stack of 99 sold, the next person in line would be up for grabs, buy orders suffers the same undercutting problems as buying singles from a stack, because the system is automated to buy the cheapest price a buyer specifies, so if 1 person puts up 40 stacks of 50 of 1 item for cheap they have basically screwed everyone else over.

Buy orders are pretty useless when it comes to small stacks, for the time it takes for the order to be filled you may as well have gone out and mined it yourself.