Let's keep Character Crossovers from other Square-Enix titles out of FFXIV.

[Neasa]

It's a short-term event and they have already stated there will be a reasoning/story for Lightning appearing. No one is forcing you to participate.

[KaMuiSouZou]

First, of all, this issue has nothing to do with if you like/hate Lightning or if you liked/hated XIII. So please don't argue she should be in there because you liked her or she shouldn't because you don't like XIII. It simply doesn't matter.


Here's my thoughts on the whole matter... (bold is my points, non-bold is just supplementary)
Each new Final Fantasy accomplishes two things, 1-How it develops it's own identity and 2-How it further develops the overall Final Fantasy identity. EVERYTHING in each game must do one of these.

The overall identity of Final Fantasy is reiterated and developed through the use of recurring themes (light/dark, chaos/harmony, crystals), recurring character names (Cid, Biggs/Wedge) and other things like Chocobos/Moogles, Summons, weapons (Excalibur, Masamune), items (potions, antidotes, elixer) and battle elements (job system).

At the same time, certain things in each game establishes the unique world of each game. Primarily this is the story (with it's specific characters), story weapons (buster sword), game systems (FF8's draw system), etc.

Fundamentally by nature, a single thing CAN NOT do both - something that makes one game unique can't develop the overall series without detracting from the uniqueness in the original game. Likewise, something that appears in every FF cannot make a single game unique from others.

There are some things which may not seem as clearly black and white, but this still stands. For example, simply having Moogles in the game adds to the overall FF feel. However, each race of Moogle is different in each game. Therefore, XIV's Moogles add to the uniqueness of XIV's world. If it was the same race of Moogles in every FF, it would add to the overall FF series and NOT add uniqueness to XIV.

Let's take the draw system from FF8. This is something that is currently only in 8, therefore it is an identifying part of FF8. If it is used in another game, it is no longer a FF8 battle system. It is a Final Fantasy battle system that is used in 2 games, which includes 8. Similarly, materia used to be a FF7 game system. Now, it's in 2 games and the name can be reused in future games as long as the mechanics are similar. It's essentially turned into the job-system, a recurring FF thing slightly different in each game it appears in.

Whenever you take items that are unique to one game and add it to another for nostalgia, you are increasing a homogenous feel to the overall FF series, but at the cost of sacrificing the original uniqueness of said item and game. This is what we call fanservice. The degree of this depends on how the fanservice is done. So the ultimate question becomes "What is the right balance? How much uniqueness are we willing to sacrifice for fan-service?"

We finally arrive at Lightning in XIV, the fanservice in question. For me, directly placing an actual story character into another universe is one of the BIGGEST ways to detract the uniqueness of the original game for the sake of fanservice and promotion. This stays true no matter how well it is written into the lore and story. These effects can be "minimized" or lessened by saying it's just a temporary seasonal event where the actual lore of the game is "suspended." However even then, by simply being there it's detracting from both XIII and XIV's uniqueness to a degree.

Gilgamesh is often noted as being a character that does this, so therefore it should be ok for Lightning to cross-game travel as well. But people fail to think that having other characters also do this detracts from the uniqueness of Gilgamesh as well. The more you "pull out" the dimensional rift card the less unique it gets, like a joke told too many times.

In the end, everyone has different opinions on what the right balance is and it's just that - opinions. But everyone should be aware of this question of balance when they ask themselves what they're willing to sacrifice when Lightning is in the game, as well as moving forward in XIV with future fan-service.

For the record, here's my opinion: I don't like Lightning in XIV because I think it sacrifices too much uniqueness from both XIII and XIV. It's much better if it's a temporary seasonal type event like I've heard where the lore of XIV is "suspended." Regardless, while I'm reluctantly okay with the clothes and weapons, having her actually appear is a bit too much for me.

[Keyln]

I'm wondering about those who argue that having cameos and characters from previous Final Fantasies are going to ruin the game ever played IX...

[Katella_Avenlea]

Its notable that Yoshi has already said they will be very delicate with when/if/how they add character cameo's from older titles. If you take Yoshi at his word... this isn't going to really be an issue. I think he has a good handle on what he's doing.

I agree totally with Denmo, and am not worried at all.

A small and totally optional side story quest line addition (which is what this is reported as being), or even the addition of a small vanity item that will be thrown in the armoire (with all my heat resistant gear) when its newness wears off does not equate to those characters "taking over" or "usurping" our existing FFXIV main storyline where the real Lore is.

My character gathering eggs for an NPC's breakfast is not really "Lore impacting" and I don't personally really see that Lightning appearing in some small corner of the world for a brief blip would either. I think people may be over thinking this issue a bit at this point in time.

[Obsy]

I'm wondering about those who argue that having cameos and characters from previous Final Fantasies are going to ruin the game ever played IX...

Why does it matter whether they did or didn't? Or FFT for that matter? That's not the point being made by OP; your argument is a red herring.

[Fatestorm]

First, of all, this issue has nothing to do with if you like/hate Lightning or if you liked/hated XIII. So please don't argue she should be in there because you liked her or she shouldn't because you don't like XIII. It simply doesn't matter.


Here's my thoughts on the whole matter...

(snip)

Thank you very much for this contribution, sir. I'm a big fan of your work, and this is extremely thoughtful and well-reasoned. I agree with you completely.

Well, I would change one point of emphasis. You say this:

Fundamentally by nature, a single thing CAN NOT do both - something that makes one game unique can't develop the overall series without detracting from the uniqueness in the original game. Likewise, something that appears in every FF cannot make a single game unique from others.

I agree with the point you're making--that if you take something unique to one game and make it "common Final Fantasy property," then you're no longer using that item to make THAT game unique; and vice versa. However, I'd like to note that things unique to certain games can still advance Final Fantasy as a whole and as a brand. That is, unique characters and plots and so forth, great soundtracks, etc. A great soundtrack to a Final Fantasy generally isn't reused fully and completely in another game--and yet a good soundtrack, unique to a given game, still can advance Final Fantasy as a franchise and as a series.

Which goes back to something I said in my original post--Yoshi wants to facilitate greater collaboration between all of S-E's dev teams, and advance Final Fantasy as a whole and not as individual titles. I agree completely with his goal, but not his method--making each title special in its own way will, in fact, advance the brand as a whole. Pursue excellence in the details, and the series as a whole will be excellent.

[Vilhem]

Well, whatever. If they're really insistent on doing this crazy thing, then there's only one thing I have to say. If Sephiroth ever becomes involved in the story, he'd better be a marriageable NPC.

Cool. I can have Thancred all to myself then.

[Vilhem]

I have to disagree with this post. Like the OP sad, it's not whether or not Lightning can be well-written into the story of FFXIV (as we all know well she can). It's whether or not she should be written in. And I personally don't think it's a very good idea.

Each Final Fantasy, while connected in the way that it continues the series, is it's own story set in it's own universe. FFXIV is a good enough story. So, why have Lightning in it at all? It's just a move that seems to me to pander to the fan service of other Final Fantasy games, and that, in my opinion, makes the story you bring that kind of stuff into seem dated, at best.

And no, having a coliseum-like arena in which you fight with or against old Final Fantasy characters from other games doesn't seem to me like a good idea either. I think A Realm Reborn is good enough to stand on it's own legs without needing to pander to fan service. While it might be okay to have a character come in for a second and then leave (like how I hope Lightning ans Snow in this game will be handled) having them become an integral part of the story or a mainstay for any reason is just... well, it gives a lackluster "meh" quality to the story. And yes, I'm sure the story will still be good. But having a cameo by another main FF character will be a cheesy spot in the story.

That's just my humble two cents on the subject.

Oh man...an XIV-ARR coliseum/arena with just XIV characters....oh my! Fighting against Thancred, Yda, the lalafell miner twins...that'd be HOT. Devs plz consider! >.>

[Lucke]

Why all the butt-hurt? Why attack Lightning? Why not attack Costa del Sol, The Gold Saucer, Crystal tower, Raubahn who is OBVIOUSLY named after the BLU from XI, those Mammets that are Automatons from XI, who knows what else? Oh! But those are places... so places from other FFs are okay, but heaven forbid Yoshi puts Lightning in a small role no-one knows anything about. Really guys?

If you guys don't like Lightning, then you have to dislike all the other homages XIV will have to the series. You can't just pick Lightning and be fine about all the other things, regardless if they are people or not.

While I agree I don't want her to be a part of the main story, she's in a completely different side quest that has NOTHING to do with the main storylines. If she is revealed as a *PLOT TWIST* Legatus, then you can moan all you want, I'll moan with you. As of right now, it's a one off event like they have every year with gear that will prolly be level one and only useful as fashion clothes.

I don't wanna offend anyone, but this is the cold hard truth: Yoshi already stated multiple times she's coming to ARR, there will be a series of side quests with lore friendly reasoning as to why she's here. Deal with it. "Oh, but I'm addicted to ARR! I can't leave! I HAVE to play these side quests!" Well, if you don't have enough self-control to NOT do these quests then I dunno what to say.

Yoshi is in charge, and while he's open to opinions and stuff, nothing you say will make him change his mind. That's fine by me. He does things that I'm not pleased with. I know he can't please everyone. I just deal with it and try to enjoy as much as I can. Besides, this is mostly to get people excited for Lightning Returns, and people playing Lightning Returns to show interest in ARR.

Thanks alot guys for making me all mean!

[Keyln]

Why does it matter whether they did or didn't? Or FFT for that matter? That's not the point being made by OP; your argument is a red herring.

Not really, as the OP's argument is that the inclusion of characters from previous Final Fantasy games somehow weakens XIV. My point is that there have been all sorts of inclusion other characters in previous Final Fantasy games (IX, Tactics) haven't weakened the story of those games, so why should it here?