Can we get modern english translation?

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

What's his face from the Waking Sands, with the goggles. He's the worst.

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The elf guy Urandger something i think. Not all character are bad. Some are fine its only a few select characters(generally they are common and glued to the plot) and mainly 1 city, lominsa

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Originally Posted by Kisik

A good teacher wouldn't be a good teacher unless he pushed the student to learn more. Easymode is not good teaching.

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Knowledge is of little use if you dont understand its use. ''More more more learn more'' Got us to the current modern days where many people know a lot, and understand next to nothing.

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Originally Posted by Parryacg

I find it hilarious that one of my best friends in-game told me to stay away from the plague that is called the forums, but I'm here, and just like he said; it's filled with stupid.

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That is correct. And as irony would have it you are part of that stupid, just like the rest of us.
Hilarious indeed. (if it were not a bad joke)

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

What's his face from the Waking Sands, with the goggles. He's the worst. He's way too over the top. He'a not even old english, he's like pretentious about it.

MAYHAP WHERETOFORE AUGHT HITHER THINE THOUEST

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Urianger is on the extreme end of this, but that does make him a rather good example.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

just because its vague doesn't mean the info isn't there

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Quite a few people have made direct comparisons between dialogues now. Some info indeed isn't there. You can't argue a bloody fact. Altho often that does seem common here. :P I'm not sure either how characters being portrayed entirely differently is the same as ''vague'' or ''its there''

I think it says a lot that the people who are complaining the most about the English dialogue are the ones whose spelling and grammar leave something to be desired.

HWÆT, WE GAR-DEna in geardagum,
þeodcyninga þrym gefrunon,
hu ða æþelingas ellen fremedon!
oft Scyld Scefing sceaþena þreatum,
monegum mægþum meodosetla ofteah,
egsode eorlas, syððanærest wearð
feasceaft funden; he þæs frofre gebad,
weox under wolcnum weorðmyndum þah....

Just hitting you up with some REAL Old English and telling you it could be worse. I do appreciate all of the effort the translators put into this game, and I like that it even teaches me some new words, but the Lominsan pirate talk was not my favorite. Still, it's not as bad as the Cardians in FFXI, who speak in spam talk:

King of Hearts: Player name!
It iS gOoD to*seE yOu. Do*yoU rEmEmbEr*tHe KiNg?

King of Hearts: I muST*aPoLogiZE foR My*aCTioNs LAst*tiME We mET.

King of Hearts: I hAvE bEEn*rePaiREd aT tHE maNusTErY,*aNd wiLL nO*LoNGer bE*sO erRAtiC.

King of Hearts: As reCOmpEnsE, I*hErEbY pROmoTe*yOU to PRoViSionAL*JaCk rAnk!

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Originally Posted by LunaHoshino

I think it says a lot that the people who are complaining the most about the English dialogue are the ones whose spelling and grammar leave something to be desired.

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god forbid everyone on the interwebs doesn't have perfect english...

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Originally Posted by LunaHoshino

I think it says a lot that the people who are complaining the most about the English dialogue are the ones whose spelling and grammar leave something to be desired.

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Indeed. As such I shall leave it to the experts to comment on the above.

Incidentally, personally I never cared much for grammar. So little in fact, that I scored a c+ for every single exam in my mother language. (despite having an a+ in vocabulary) Even if I do not care how I write forum posts (I do believe I have not cared how I write on the internet in many years), surprisingly enough it seems that I do care about the text I read in the games I play.

Besides, if I (who mixes 3 different types of grammar subconciously: namely: english, japanese and my own language) can atleast manage this level of grammar; I would expect perfect grammar from you, before you start your grammar patrol.


Now normally I just dont care to give trolls what they desire. But here, you have a 7/10 effort from me. Just because tonight I care.

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Originally Posted by Edyth

King of Hearts: Player name!
It iS gOoD to*seE yOu. Do*yoU rEmEmbEr*tHe KiNg?

King of Hearts: I muST*aPoLogiZE foR My*aCTioNs LAst*tiME We mET.

King of Hearts: I hAvE bEEn*rePaiREd aT tHE maNusTErY,*aNd wiLL nO*LoNGer bE*sO erRAtiC.

King of Hearts: As reCOmpEnsE, I*hErEbY pROmoTe*yOU to PRoViSionAL*JaCk rAnk!

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One npc does that in FFXIV as well, and I think its worth mentioning his dialogues are some of the funniest in the game.
Stuff like that all depends on how you deliver it. (and how often)

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Originally Posted by ScarecrowJames

http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...ersus_english/

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Expect similar comparisons to be done for heavensward. :P Midgartsormr has more lines again! Icehearts lines also gave a different view on her character (yet again).

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Indeed. As such I shall leave it to the experts to comment on the above.

Incidentally, personally I never cared much for grammar. So little in fact, that I scored a c+ for every single exam in my mother language. (despite having an a+ in vocabulary) Even if I do not care how I write forum posts (I do believe I have not cared how I write on the internet in many years), surprisingly enough it seems that I do care about the text I read in the games I play.

Besides, if I (who mixes 3 different types of grammar subconciously: namely: english, japanese and my own language) can atleast manage this level of grammar; I would expect perfect grammar from you, before you start your grammar patrol.


Now normally I just dont care to give trolls what they desire. But here, you have a 7/10 effort from me. Just because tonight I care.


One npc does that in FFXIV as well, and I think its worth mentioning his dialogues are some of the funniest in the game.
Stuff like that all depends on how you deliver it. (and how often)


Expect similar comparisons to be done for heavensward. :P Midgartsormr has more lines again! Icehearts lines also gave a different view on her character (yet again).

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Any source for these lines completely changing character views? Plus I've yet to see a link that shows that stuff is missing in keeper of the lake I'm sorry you can't put together the context and need everything force fed to you to understand what he said.

The french Midgardsormr scene is exactly like the English one, they are direct translations of each other. The french and english scripts pretty much say the same thing with some minor differences throughout.
I wish people would stop saying otherwise, it makes them seem like they are trying to prove the english version is bad using false information

I don't really know what to say. 100% of the game's text is legible. It makes sense and is grammatically sound. I suspect a good portion of the player base /hasn't/ read classic lit, but even then I'd like to see some examples given.

Like, which lines are too hard to comprehend and how would you write them instead?

I really think a lot of people forget that it's not just English native speakers playing on the NA and EU servers. There's a lot of ESL peeps too. Yes, the game covers a lot of bases being translated into French, German, and English, but that still leaves out a huge portion of language learners out of the picture. The English we use today can be difficult enough for people to understand at a fluent level, let alone anything like earlier modern English that the game uses.

I don't think we should be given a second version or more direct version of the English dialogue purely because "people don't like it." But I do think that if there's enough of a problem for ESL from native languages not already supported, then it should be considered. Personally I like how the script is now, but I could see how it would be intimidating.

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Originally Posted by DreadRabbit

I really think a lot of people forget that it's not just English native speakers playing on the NA and EU servers. There's a lot of ESL peeps too. Yes, the game covers a lot of bases being translated into French, German, and English, but that still leaves out a huge portion of language learners out of the picture. The English we use today can be difficult enough for people to understand at a fluent level, let alone anything like earlier modern English that the game uses.

I don't think we should be given a second version or more direct version of the English dialogue purely because "people don't like it." But I do think that if there's enough of a problem for ESL from native languages not already supported, then it should be considered. Personally I like how the script is now, but I could see how it would be intimidating.

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At that point I'd rather them to continue porting it to more languages instead of making a secondary English script.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

At that point I'd rather them to continue porting it to more languages instead of making a secondary English script.

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Now that I agree as well. It would be a better solution. However if it's enough of a problem and it'd be cheaper to just have the secondary English available, I see no harm in it.

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Originally Posted by ScarecrowJames

http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...ersus_english/

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The validity of that "translation" has been called into question in numerous prior threads by people literate in Japanese and not trying to push an agenda. And that's completely ignoring the fact that none of the information is actually missing in the English text. It's simply implied and suggested, rather than beaten over the head with.

So I guess this will go on for 10 more pages, die off, someone bumps it, and we start all over again. Oh well.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

So I guess this will go on for 10 more pages, die off, someone bumps it, and we start all over again. Oh well.

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Its teh never ending story CALL FALCOR IN HERE

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Originally Posted by Scarecrow2

text limit op.

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No, childish would me directly attacking you (or anyone else). Calling it for what it is is something else entirely. As the quote goes; "Hate the discussion, not the person."

This can go on for who knows how long but it's not going to change the fact that the original complaint itself is asking for costs over something that is neither a quality of life improvement or benefits to the game in anyway. With that said, I've shown I can be quite amicable in other threads. It's also been shown that people have been shut down due to their attempts to implement something stupid with limited resources Yoshi P and friends have.

Remember, development and implementation costs MONEY and while Yoshi P and friends have made a hell of alot of it with ARR, they are not an independent company; they're a dev team under squeenix. If Squeenix suddenly says "shutdown FF14", they're going to have to do it, no "ifs", "ands" or "buts".

And while I'll be the first to admit I honestly don't want something like that to happen, it doesn't change the fact that it can and will happen if Squeenix desires it.

Modern english translation? No way. The use of well-directed use of dialect is one of my favorite parts of this game.


One of the main reasons i stopped living by Japanese Translations only is because one of the best parts of a good English translation is the bredth of dialect you can choose from. It changes everything. If the Ishgardians, Lominsans, Rouges, Gridanians and Ul'dan natives all spoke the same, they would lose a massive amount of their character.

Yes, I have A LOT of trouble understanding Urianger. Yes, Midgardsormr is hard to understand. But, they're using grammatically correct English, and speaking in coherent sentences and by trying to understand him, i'm actually learning something I wouldn't be getting from a typical JP-with-subtitles translation.


Honestly, translations like these just give me alot more respect for English, and the history of it as a language. The Japanese may simulate the same thing, but there simply is not as much diversity in Japanese than there is in English, because so many different people have spoken it. FFXIV was designed with a more broad western fantasy background, so it makes full sense that they would take that to their advantage in the translation.

Please, no. It's one of the best parts.

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Originally Posted by DreadRabbit

Now that I agree as well. It would be a better solution. However if it's enough of a problem and it'd be cheaper to just have the secondary English available, I see no harm in it.

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Implying that all English native speakers prefer the current adjustments to the text. :P

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Originally Posted by Edellis

Modern english translation? No way. The use of well-directed use of dialect is one of my favorite parts of this game.


One of the main reasons i stopped living by Japanese Translations only is because one of the best parts of a good English translation is the bredth of dialect you can choose from. It changes everything. If the Ishgardians, Lominsans, Rouges, Gridanians and Ul'dan natives all spoke the same, they would lose a massive amount of their character.

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Fair enough, but that exactly my gripe with it. It changes everything. (btw a good English translation chooses dialects only when they are appropriate, not just because they are available)

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Originally Posted by Parryacg

No, childish would me directly attacking you (or anyone else). Calling it for what it is is something else entirely. As the quote goes; "Hate the discussion, not the person."

This can go on for who knows how long but it's not going to change the fact that the original complaint itself is asking for costs over something that is neither a quality of life improvement or benefits to the game in anyway.

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Thats not entirely correct, current way of speech is because the english translators are taking a rather broad approach to translation. Using modern english would bring it more in line with what its supposed to be, rather then how theyd like it to be.

Incidentally, you mention cost increase and how its not worth it. Consider that ''modern english'' is how it used to be in 1.0
What we currently have was changed (for the english localization only), and one might argue your same arguments could have been used there.



And I'll say it again: its anyones right to prefer one or the other. But dont be presumptious and say things like ''for none native english speakers'', as if all native English speakers agree with your opinions.


My opinion: I dislike the way the localization changed into the current. The translation team takes way too many liberties at altering the text to fit their own ideas, and it shows as well in the way that ''old english'' is used.
I'd rather have an understandable ''modern english'' text with hints of ''old english'', as at the end of the day the reader has to be able to understand what he/she is reading. And I'd much prefer they stick to translation instead of alteration, so I can appreciate the good translation I knew they are capable of.

I like the pirate speak but the old english is very annoying. Like someone said. Feels like they speak in riddles

Moden english?

"Yo dawg, they call us dark-knights up in this hood. Those soldier thought they had gatted me down but as you see homes I'm up and willing to teach you the ways of the streets. Be carefull it ainst easy living the dark-knight style. Let me explain the rest of this to you in a freestyle rap."

I just wish that they would get some better script writers if they insist on keeping the dialogue like this. They use quite a few phrases incorrectly and it feels clunky and awkward.

Forsooth! What new mechanism of perception doth thou bringest upon these forums?

Thine inability to distinguish thy own language, doth attest to thy lack of educational endeavors.

Perhaps a tipper novel or a rousing conversation art what thou needest?

Or, you know, pay attention in any English class where they taught Shakespeare.

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Originally Posted by UnaverageWalrus

Or, you know, pay attention in any English class where they taught Shakespeare.

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I've never read Shakespeare, horrible I know, but it's certainly not needed education to understand Olde English.

Yeah better fill it with yolos, your/you're, yus, and other "modern" words.

On a related note:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...fb3cb04ff8.jpg

My only issue with the way they translate into "old english" is that they butcher the script. I play in japanese audio and there's so much left out in the english text box it makes me cringe. I'm amazed the story is even coherent in the translation. There's SO MUCH left out of the games plot from japanese to english. Why does the translation team cut so much out? Its not like they have to worry about lip syncing or anything.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

My only issue with the way they translate into "old english" is that they butcher the script. I play in japanese audio and there's so much left out in the english text box it makes me cringe. I'm amazed the story is even coherent in the translation. There's SO MUCH left out of the games plot from japanese to english. Why does the translation team cut so much out? Its not like they have to worry about lip syncing or anything.

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Really I have yet to get someone to link a post where it says things are missing in the dialog

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Really I have yet to get someone to link a post where it says things are missing in the dialog

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Isnt there one in this very thread? In all threads about this topic in fact. For that matter, just listen to any dialogue with Midgartsorm with japanese audio and english text enabled. Or iceheart having a 180 degree different personality.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Isnt there one in this very thread? In all threads about this topic in fact. For that matter, just listen to any dialogue with Midgartsorm with japanese audio and english text enabled. Or iceheart having a 180 degree different personality.

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we already discussed Midgardsormr and proved that to be false for the 800th time so give me this link to the changes with iceheart

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Originally Posted by Ransu

I play in japanese audio and there's so much left out in the english text box it makes me cringe.

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Gee, it's almost like two languages from opposite sides of this giant blue marble don't sync up perfectly in the course of translation.

For a lot of reasons, some cultural and some grammatical, there are times when English can convey an idea or message in significantly less words than Japanese. The reverse can also be true.

When you try to do exact 1:1 sync ups, you end up with "All your base are belong to us".

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

we already discussed Midgardsormr and proved that to be false for the 800th time so give me this link to the changes with iceheart

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I'm sorry, allow me the one to be surprised here. (honestly surprised, unlike yourself)
You proved it to be false that Midgarsorm said more in japanese? oO How does that work when he literally has entire sentences of which not one word is translated into english?

As for your request for links, blimey. Is it too hard to believe the people that can actually understand both languages (to some degree, or fluently), unlike yourself who can apparently only see the english text and hear the english voices?

You want proof, its in the game, theres your source. Just watch any scene with both options enabled and you will see either example yourself.


Midgartsorm isnt exactly a side character with meaningless dialogue either, so its a pretty big thing if things he says are omitted.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

How does that work when he literally has entire sentences of which not one word is translated into english?

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The script in many places is made in English, and then localized into Japanese, rather than the way most people think it works due to it being a JP game.
In fact, the entire dragon language was made by the English loremaster of the game.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...to-Dragonspeak

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

I'm sorry, allow me the one to be surprised here. (honestly surprised, unlike yourself)
You proved it to be false that Midgarsorm said more in japanese? oO How does that work when he literally has entire sentences of which not one word is translated into english?

As for your request for links, blimey. Is it too hard to believe the people that can actually understand both languages (to some degree, or fluently), unlike yourself who can apparently only see the english text and hear the english voices?

You want proof, its in the game, theres your source. Just watch any scene with both options enabled and you will see either example yourself.


Midgartsorm isnt exactly a side character with meaningless dialogue either, so its a pretty big thing if things he says are omitted.

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Its almost like you didn't read this thread


You proved it to be false that Midgarsorm said more in japanese? oO How does that work when he literally has entire sentences of which not one word is translated into english?
That statement shows how ignorant your are to how things work in this game. Plus just because they "say more" doesn't' mean it actually says more

Well in all honesty this thread and any like it are pointless. I'm sorry that people that aren't native speakers are having a hard time with the English in the game (other then pirate speak its a pain even as a native speaker.) i can understand that a lot but they're not going to change it. Just hope that they port it to your language then you can have a fight over what was Supposedly left out in the translation to your language

problem is... not everyone who choose to use the English client is a native English speaker.

naught thou thee wtf I don't like it. just be normal.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

The script in many places is made in English, and then localized into Japanese, rather than the way most people think it works due to it being a JP game.
In fact, the entire dragon language was made by the English loremaster of the game.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...to-Dragonspeak

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This argument keeps being used. But it seems to ignore that the Japanese thought it needed to add entire sentences. Sentences also added in the French and German translations. It also seems to ignore the changes in personality some characters are seeing between one character and another.
In other words, repeat it all you want; it wont suddenly make sense one day.
I find it laughable that the arguments are always ''english was localized into japanese'' and ''japanese isnt better!, this is a part of the localization!''

...While completing ignoring that there are 4 different languages not 2. And there is only one with radically different text.

Out of the 4, it is only the English translation that doesnt use the suffices ''aga, aja, ra'' anymore.
Out of the 4, it is only the English translation that alters characters personalities (by changing the responses they give in the dialogue).
Out of the 4, it is only the English translation where they felt the need to omit half of a major characters dialogue.


4 Languages, not 2. Dont forget that.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Its almost like you didn't read this thread



That statement shows how ignorant your are to how things work in this game. Plus just because they "say more" doesn't' mean it actually says more

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I thought I wrote it very clearly? He literally speaks more sentences. There is absolutely no valid translation in any language that translates an entire sentence of 2 dozens words into ''nothing''.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

I'm sorry that people that aren't native speakers are having a hard time with the English in the game (other then pirate speak its a pain even as a native speaker.)

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Just hope that they port it to your language then you can have a fight over what was Supposedly left out in the translation to your language[/QUOTE]

Its mostly a pointless thread because it attracts responses like your own. What do native or none-native english speakers have to do with this?

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Just hope that they port it to your language then you can have a fight over what was Supposedly left out in the translation to your language

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I dont honestly understand anymore sometimes. Ive spend years on the WoW forums. But even there, they arent obstinate enough to argue an outspoken fact.

I tire of arguing against a a hollow space tho, so I'll refrain from responding to more flamebait.


PS: I do love how you complete ignored your own lack of experience with the Japanese, French, or German text.

Your point is about me not knowing Japanese French or German is not relevant read the damn thread title Its called Can we get a modern English translation. Also I play on a jpn server I know enough to get by in pugs and I play with jpn players who speak english I'm telling you there is damn info left out in the damn story around the dragons.

here you go http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...to-Dragonspeak

Just because your precious Jpn dub doesn't match up to any of the other languages subtitles for Midgardsormr doesn't' mean anything was left out

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Originally Posted by UnaverageWalrus

Forsooth! What new mechanism of perception doth thou bringest upon these forums?

Thine inability to distinguish thy own language, doth attest to thy lack of educational endeavors.

Perhaps a tipper novel or a rousing conversation art what thou needest?

Or, you know, pay attention in any English class where they taught Shakespeare.

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Methinks the OP would be best served by going to summer school for some literature classes. Mayhap some time with books rather than games would be a great boon to them.

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Originally Posted by Orspeth

Methinks the OP would be best served by going to summer school for some literature classes. Mayhap some time with books rather than games would be a great boon to them.

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Indubitably, mine astutely gifted acquaintance. The nature of such a game of the digital variety to have a narrative and dialogue doth seemest to be escaping the grasp of the OP's rationale.


P.S.
This thread now has a fancy Lala. Deal with it.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Out of the 4, it is only the English translation that doesnt use the suffices ''aga, aja, ra'' anymore.
Out of the 4, it is only the English translation that alters characters personalities (by changing the responses they give in the dialogue).
Out of the 4, it is only the English translation where they felt the need to omit half of a major characters dialogue.


4 Languages, not 2. Dont forget that.

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Did you play the french version? because you are completely wrong here.

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Originally Posted by Intaki

Gee, it's almost like two languages from opposite sides of this giant blue marble don't sync up perfectly in the course of translation.

For a lot of reasons, some cultural and some grammatical, there are times when English can convey an idea or message in significantly less words than Japanese. The reverse can also be true.

When you try to do exact 1:1 sync ups, you end up with "All your base are belong to us".

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I don't think you understand whats being said....No one expects perfect 1:1 translation, but there's a difference between that and straight up removing dialogue. There is literally parts of the script being completely left for no reason at all. There is nothing stopping the team from translating it, its just cut out. As someone that understands Japanese it makes me scratch my head whenever I come across those sections.

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Originally Posted by Pluvia

Just because your precious Jpn dub doesn't match up to any of the other languages subtitles for Midgardsormr doesn't' mean anything was left out

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And I'm telling you as someone who speaks both Japanese and English that a significant amount of context was left out in the English translation to the point that major plot points from that scene were not even translated. What he says in English when you first meet him barely makes any sense. So yes, parts of the script was left out. Take it as you will, but for me personally, I find the translation to english to be terrible. Being in that pirate/old english style language doesn't excuse omitting significant plot points in a script.