DPS meters and why they're necessary

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

There is no functional difference to me. I see what I encounter. And I see a lot of prideful players who aren't as good as they could be.

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I've played games and watched DPS that can raise allow a party wipe because they don't think of rezing, because it hurts their DPS.

Players stupidly over DPS and not use hate reduction because their race against the meter is more important.

I've seen good players not allowed to raid with their guild because they aren't high enough on a meter while no-one is teaches them to improve.

I've seen friends that join a game together not able to group together because one of them can't make a number crunch.

I've seen tanks & healers under geared for their job because they are focused more on DPS.

FC's that fall apart because the leaders are too good to group with their own members.

Those that can't learn without a meter will not learn with one.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Those that can't learn without a meter will not learn with one.

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If a meter is validated, maybe they'll listen. If they don't, at least the reasons for excluding an underperformer won't be so hush-hush. Maybe then they'll take a long look at themselves and look for self-improvement.

Right now, "everyone" doesn't think being chased out of a party for poor DPS is valid because parsers are "not allowed". The device for measuring the result doesn't change the result: underperformance.

Yes there are other factors where DPS is not king. But someone who can't play to at least 80% competency on DPS isn't usually going to fare well in those areas either.

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Originally Posted by nyyyyy

And I have raided high end content and went for top 50 world kills in a vast amount of titles and I can tell that youre full of shit. Unless you provide some proper evidence your statement basically is irrelevant. You wanna argue or make a point? Then provide arguments. Unless you do that your post is nothing but a waste of bandwidth.

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I've played almost every major MMO launched in the past 20 years.
I was topping MMOs when they were text based, ran the most successful raiding guild in WoW on Shadowsong for 3 years which I built. Pulled server firsts that unlocked content for our faction and finished end game that 90% of our faction couldn't even put together a group to walk into.

I did this without DPS meters...

I'm sorry you need addons to do what I've been doing since before DPS meters existed.

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

If a meter is validated, maybe they'll listen. If they don't, at least the reasons for excluding an underperformer won't be so hush-hush. Maybe then they'll take a long look at themselves and look for self-improvement.

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Historically, it's never been this way... ever.
People don't stop to teach pugs how to improve, they just kick people.
In games where they are allowed... this has never changed.
Wow has had DPS meters for years... guess what... it never changed there and it won't change here.

This theory would only work if most people used them which would never happen.

The real reason people want DPS meters but will never admit is simple.
They first validate themselves then others.
Use that to determine who is worthy to party with.

There's no teaching involved, just elitism and bragging rights for having a bigger "ego".

If you truly NEED a DPS meter to improve then you're not that good to begin with.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Historically, it's never been this way... ever.
People don't stop to teach pugs how to improve, they just kick people.
In games where they are allowed... this has never changed.
Wow has had DPS meters for years... guess what... it never changed there and it won't change here.

This theory would only work if most people used them which would never happen.

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In that case the "legality" of the meter doesn't even matter to them then, does it?

DPS in this game is almost entirely straightforward. Good gear (to an extent) doesn't matter as much as good play. Someone who parses highly is doing something "more right" than someone who parses lower. It's up to them to figure out how.

Not everyone wants to be a teacher/learner.

I've already seen problems because of people trying to top meters in this game.

SMN don't want to resurrect because they don't want to use the MP or Swift.

Heals that run OOM because they blew their MP DPSing.

Bards that won't restore MP because it hurts their DPS.

Healers abusing bards that do use it so they can DPS, which basically makes the healer higher on DPS and the bard lower.

DPS in general not allowing tanks to get agro because they think everything's a DPS race.

These things will cause other players to have to work harder while in the end you will look better.

That doesn't make you better, it makes you a douche.

I've already seen this and worse.

I was in a party in DF on Garuda EX some time ago.

There were 4 people in a premade.

I watched them vote kick more than 20 DPS as we eventually hit 50% echo.
I must have been okay on their meter, IDK, but they never said a word, just kicked people.

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

In that case the "legality" of the meter doesn't even matter to them then, does it?

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What "Legality"?
This is a game, not a country.
There are no laws inside FFXIV other than what Square puts there.

They make the laws, they make the rules, it is their game and their choice.

The only say we as players have is whether or not we decide to play the game.

You can sing about your feelings on DPS meters until the end of the earth, they're not going to unban you if they catch you.

You could all leave and obviously they wouldn't care. If they cared that you keep paying, they wouldn't ban you for it.

Sure they'd rather you keep paying and playing, but they've made it clear that this is not a negotiation.

For all I care you guys can stay in fight club, never talk about fight club, and live in fight club.

Just remember in the end, fight club was just some crazy fool beating himself up over nothing.

DPSing without a meter is like driving without a speedometer. You could (I guess), but it makes it awfully hard to see how precise you are.

Just the same, paying too much attention to the speedometer (DPS) and not to the road (fight) leads to accidents (wipes). Good driver pays attention to both. Good raider pays attention to both.

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

Not everyone wants to be a teacher/learner.

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I agree... however this is the method 95% of people use to justify why DPS meters help the game.

I'm pretty sure you aren't winning any votes with the masses advertising their most common purpose.
Determining who to kick out of the party for not being good enough...

If SE was okay with this there would be an option to vote kick people in DF because they're not good enough to finish the content.

I've grouped with people that simply sucked and were ruining my daily MANY times... the ones that are borderline worse than bots.

Believe me I looked, "They Suck" is NOT an option when vote kicking someone. I kinda think that's intentional.

Use your meters in fight club premades and statics all you want and no one but you and SE will care.

There's a lot like me though that will report you before you can blink you pull that crap in Duty Finder so remember the first rule of Fight Club.

Anyway as I said before, not sure why I'm even talking about this.
It's a meaningless subject as the rules are what they are and I don't see SE changing that ever.
Lots of games don't allow addons, FFXI didn't allow them and it didn't kill anything.

This has become a 18 page & growing thread of people bantering something that none of us have any say over.
People don't change, they just argue.
This thread alone has officially wasted more of my time than DPS meters are even worth.

So please feel free to flame on with whatever meaningless garbage you can come up with knowing I'm done replying and going back to the game.

Just know, it truly is meaningless... the devs know how you feel about DPS meters.
They also know how everyone else feels about them.
And they know what they are and how they work.
They don't care.

SE isn't going to allow them here just like they didn't in FFXI.

Build a bridge and get over it.

Then the law needs to be changed. If breaking it regularly is okay, then it's not something to be followed, no?

Cruise control at the speed limit and just enjoy the ride.

Aside: Cruise control is the best invention.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Believe me I looked, "They Suck" is NOT an option when vote kicking someone. I kinda think that's intentional.

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I class being terrible at dps as "harassment". In order to prove it's harassment, if things are taking a million years to die, I (politely) let the other person know that they need to use a better rotation/look up a proper rotation. This goes one of two ways: 1) They do so, and their dps improves or 2) They start trolling the hell out of me, and I kick them. I've yet to see 3) They say nothing and just continue to dps poorly. It's a theoretical possibility, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Malric

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SE isn't going to allow them here just like they didn't in FFXI.

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Cool story. So, whenever people don't like something, they should just shut up and accept it? If people did that, we'd all have accepted that FFXIV is complete garbage thanks to 1.0, the game would have died, and no one would have cared. Good argument.

People complaining are how customers inform the business that something isn't right. The business then decides if it makes sense to listen. The business runs the risk of 1) doing something they heard people say they want but is actually a really bad idea that will lose them business and 2) not doing something they heard people say they want and is actually a really good idea but since they refuse to do it people are frustrated and take their business elsewhere. Saying it's stupid to complain is... stupid.

Comparing FFXIV to FFXI is pointless. No one from the FFXI team is on the FFXIV team. SE isn't a big faceless monster. FFXIV is run by humans. Different humans from the ones who run FFXI. Also, FFXI is not exactly a game rife with tight dps checks. You can TOTALLY carry swarms of awful players through EVERY content in the ENTIRE GAME.

That is nowhere close to the reality of FFXIV. Carrying people is undesirable in the extreme. Sometimes it's difficult/impossible. Bad dps is bad, and people need to be aware.

Build a bridge back to reality and stop accepting that everything awful must remain awful forever "just because".

@LetBloodline
Those are exactly my thoughts, he kept telling people off about parsers and telling them how they are wannabes and how they will never reach his greatness while backing his words up with empty claims of his godlyness in other MMOS he has played in which he has never used a parser.
In my eyes this is nothing but ignorance, he would never know how well he'd perform or whether he is pulling his weight or just doing barely acceptable damage at best.

People don't kick DPS who don't pull their weight left and right without reason, if they perform moderately it's already enough to keep them.
The ones that are getting kicked are mostly not only underperforming but the ones that "bark", underperform and take unnecessary damage at least that is what I do, I don't expect greatness aslong as someone understands his class, role and abilities it's fine.
But when I see a Melee only at the rear of the enemy or only the flank I already know they obviously underperform.
If a BLM is only casting Ice spells, you know he is underperforming.

You don't need a parser for that to know it, so much is true BUT that's exactly what makes the parser necessary, most underperformers don't even know they suck.
You don't have numbers to prove, that their way is the wrong one so they go on the defense, now you have a person with ill feelings towards you because YOU dare to tell them they could perform better!
The same person will go to the forums and call off "Elitists" for using parsers, telling how they are bad for the community and should be banned!
If said person would see his own numbers he would actually know the difference and eventually seek guidance from the person outperforming him by a mile with same or lesser gear. (i.e. 180 vs 320 for example)
We don't want a parser to show everyone how great we are, far from it. We want it so that others can actually improve and seek guidance from more experienced players with numbers to back it up.
Of course there are elitist jerks but there are just as many if not more ignorant jerks who have never used a parser and just say it's the devil and witchcraft and everyone that uses one should be burned on a stake or drowned!

On the harassment case I don't know when it is fine for bad tank and bad healers to get abuse when they mess up because there mistakes and so noticeable but when we talk about a means of pointing out that a dps is not doing there job right it is totally wrong.

We can see flaws in tanks and healers so why not see it in dps 2

The logic behind not wanting DPS meters available is like saying that we should learn to read without the aid of books. It makes zero sense. Let's arbitrarily limit the possible data we could use in the interest of not hurting someone's feelings.

I am a PS4 player and I want a parser really really badly.

I just connected with a PC player that was using a parser, and from running a few T6s with him, I was able to identify I wasn't as good as I thought I was, find the problem, fix it, and increase my DPS in a single night by roughly 14%.

Those of you who think that people want parsers so they can go, "heh heh heh, you NOOBS SUXORS!!! Now I have proof! Vote Kick Vote Kick Vote Kick!!! MUHAHAHAHAAA!!!!" Are either way overly self-riotous, or dirty commies that don't believe in the competitive spirit of capitalism #elistist.

Seriously, maybe there are some people that would use a DPS meter and yell at people who aren't as good - but there are already people that do that. I can already freakin' tell ABOUT how much you are DPSing by your rank on the enmity list. I just want to see my OWN numbers so that I can make myself better.

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Originally Posted by Ehayte

I am a PS4 player and I want a parser really really badly.

I just connected with a PC player that was using a parser, and from running a few T6s with him, I was able to identify I wasn't as good as I thought I was, find the problem, fix it, and increase my DPS in a single night by roughly 14%.

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Nice boost there. good job =)

But you know, parser won't improve your playstile... or so i heard.... u.u

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

Nice boost there. good job =)

But you know, parser won't improve your playstile... or so i heard.... u.u

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I have no idea what you are trying to communicate here.

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Originally Posted by Ehayte

I have no idea what you are trying to communicate here.

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sarcasm.

Arguments in this topic where that DPS meater whould not improve the way you play

I don't understand why folks get so up in arms over the thought of UI enhancements. XIV is very, VERY far behind the curve here in terms of accessibility for the game. There's a HUGE untapped community of modders that would take a lot of stress off the devs if SE would just relax this stance of "no" to everything.

This weekend I went looking for an update on whether they were going to allow parsers or not and was disappointed that for all of Yoshi-P's knowledge of modern mmo gameplay, this one aspect continues to elude him. I just want a lightweight little box I can put in an inconspicuous corner so I can eyeball how I am doing in relation to the rest of the damage dealers and healers. Something like recount, which barely uses any resources and doesn't affect gameplay. It's really not fair to force better players and players who want to improve themselves to have to guess just so some others can get away with being carried more often.

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

How can you tell wich is better between determination, spell speed or critical? I guess a dps meater was not involver by you or others or your "i'm amazing without a dps meater" is only shit. How can you tell if it's better double flare in t8 even without convert and you get stuck to wait in UI1 or not?

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I'm guessing his claims/delusions of grandeur are similar to how an amazing percent of people become "developers" or "game designers" when it suits their argument.

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Originally Posted by Atreides

People don't kick DPS who don't pull their weight left and right without reason, if they perform moderately it's already enough to keep them.

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First off this is complete and total bull. It's some line of crap people that want their crutch use to say "they are not bad".

It happens all the time. Parsers are bannable and people still use them and for this.

I seen people kicked over it with no explanation after 1 wipe because their DPS was are low.

I've group with people using them, some that I don't like the way they use them and a few that use them for themselves primarily.

The problem is when parsers become allowed and spread, they set the "standards". Kicking people becomes the norm and you can say it doesn't but anyone that has played games like WoW has seen this or they're lying to themselves. I don't even know anyone that hasn't seen this.

tbc

If SE built a parser of sorts into the game that measured / gave feedback to players with even something as simple as low/average/high ratings then sure, I could see it being not too horrible.

However you people want to judge what is good and what sucks by a criteria set by a 3rd party addon that only a small fraction of the game uses and it would not become overwhelmingly adopted if they did allow it. (Most of you that would use them if they were allowed use them now anyway).

If it were built in the game, everyone would be on the same playing field.

As an addon, it's elitest crap and the people using it telling the rest of the game if they're good enough.

Parsers haven't even been in FFXIV that long yet somehow people have been finishing end game content this whole time. How does that make them "Needed"?

Maybe a better suggestion for you all is to ask them to put one into the game rather than allow 3rd party ones. That is the only way I could see them doing any good.

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Originally Posted by Malric

If SE built a parser of sorts into the game that measured / gave feedback to players with even something as simple as low/average/high ratings then sure, I could see it being not too horrible.

However you people want to judge what is good and what sucks by a criteria set by a 3rd party addon that only a small fraction of the game uses and it would not become overwhelmingly adopted if they did allow it. (Most of you that would use them if they were allowed use them now anyway).

If it were built in the game, everyone would be on the same playing field.

As an addon, it's elitest crap and the people using it telling the rest of the game if they're good enough.

Parsers haven't even been in FFXIV that long yet somehow people have been finishing end game content this whole time. How does that make them "Needed"?

Maybe a better suggestion for you all is to ask them to put one into the game rather than allow 3rd party ones. That is the only way I could see them doing any good.

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I need build in one, i'm from ps4. We don't want "bah ok use it", we want a good official parser. Anyway parsers are around from 1-2 month since release

Plus, please don't forget to explain how did you choose you BiS equipment in this game. How did you weighted secondary stats without any information gotten out from a parser by you or other people?

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Originally Posted by Malric

As an addon, it's elitest crap and the people using it telling the rest of the game if they're good enough.

Parsers haven't even been in FFXIV that long yet somehow people have been finishing end game content this whole time. How does that make them "Needed"?

Maybe a better suggestion for you all is to ask them to put one into the game rather than allow 3rd party ones. That is the only way I could see them doing any good.

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Elitist crap? Hahahaa, I think you are ignorant to what an elitist is. Parsers haven't been in FFXIV that long? They've been in since basically relaunch (August 25, 2013). So it's been here for basically the entire time. The reason why you can only see it doing any good in that way is because your vision is limited to what you've done for the past 20 years and your acceptance of anything outside that vision is wrong.

What class and server did you play in Aion? What year did you quit?

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

I need build in one, i'm from ps4. We don't want "bah ok use it", we want a good official parser. Anyway parsers are around from 1-2 month since release

Plus, please don't forget to explain how did you choose you BiS equipment in this game. How did you weighted secondary stats without any information gotten out from a parser by you or other people?

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I don't think he said that he didn't get his information from people who used parsers. That he personally doesn't use it. That's fine for him because he's just one person in the hundreds of thousands. People who actually care about improvement will find any way to refine their skill, as long as it is within reason. I said this already though, there's three ways to go about this;

1) Get a pen and paper handy, and recording software. Some kind of timer then record yourself doing rotation with combat log up. When you're done, do math. Total damage done over time = damage per second.
2) Get parser which does it a fraction of the time.
3) Read the tooltips and just guess which is the best rotation and if you get lucky, you're right. If you get it wrong, you're still doing better than majority of players who don't do 1 or 2.

I think there are a lot of of short-tempered people and scared by being kicked from partys.

I understand the reason why SE doesn't want Parsers ingame. Players can be selfish and accusative. But the parser is a fantastic tool showing your damage, healing and mitigation. Not only a e-peen meter

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Originally Posted by Malric

snip self esteeem boost

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So let me recap it.
You choose rotation based on studies done with parser
You choose your BiS based on studies done with parser
You play with a friend with parser up and probably calling life % of boss and mabe even incoming attaks

But yes, you don't use parsers yourself...
yes...

Sorry but seriusly, what attention wore are you? Blabbling about how great you are since you don't use parser when you use it like everybody else. Parser are primarly tools for optimizing rotation (you studied work done by others with parser) and gear (same)

Reality is that if no parsers whold exist you whould not be as effective as now. So stop being so full of yourself elitist fake great player

Parsers will lead to players getting kicked out of groups far more than to players being helped - even if said "help" is a simple "read a guide". Most people who want parsers do not want to help other players, they simply want a quick way to kick "underperformers" so they don't "waste time".

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Originally Posted by AerysDarkstrike

Parsers will lead to players getting kicked out of groups far more than to players being helped - even if said "help" is a simple "read a guide". Most people who want parsers do not want to help other players, they simply want a quick way to kick "underperformers" so they don't "waste time".

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Some (i hope few) ppl that are alredy harassers and alredy kick you out without explenation want parser to give you an explenation. They get reported now as they whould get reported after

Many ppl like me want parser to improve their play and to test by themselfs slight variation to rotation, equip change, cooldown usage and such.

Every player that entered the mentality of MMO endgame of improving themselfs and their gear will get advantage to be able to parse themselfs

The ppl you are talking are not nice now. They open "animus or better weapon" for brayflox, they alredy use a parser on PC and they alredy kick ppl out not giving explenation

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Originally Posted by AerysDarkstrike

Parsers will lead to players getting kicked out of groups far more than to players being helped - even if said "help" is a simple "read a guide". Most people who want parsers do not want to help other players, they simply want a quick way to kick "underperformers" so they don't "waste time".

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Precisely. It's so people can go "welp, we're going to fail this DPS check so I'm going to bail." Pros outweigh the cons huh? Can't wait for all PFs to be "X amount of DPS or your out!!!!!!" and people bailing on DFs.

Numbers do not equate to skill. Tested it on Titan Ex. He had higher DPS because he would manawall the landslides and fire extra spells. BUT, he often blew the timing and was out mid fight, where I wasn't.

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Originally Posted by Zaero

Numbers do not equate to skill. Tested it on Titan Ex. He had higher DPS because he would manawall the landslides and fire extra spells. BUT, he often blew the timing and was out mid fight, where I wasn't.

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Even in worst case scenario, now we are even worse. "Animus weapon or more" for brayflox. Where exactly this is more accurate than "350+ dps"?

Plus if said BLM was out of fight his dps was NOT high at all

You whine and don't see that now we have all the cons anyway just we don't have the pros

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Originally Posted by Zaero

stuff

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The thing is most people that underperform don't even realize to what extend that is, more likely than not we're not only talking about 10-20% but a far higher gap even with equal gear.
If those people would realize that and see numbers to work with they could improve by themselves and actually work on their damage.
No one expects anyone to play perfectly moderate is already enough but some people get rightfully kicked because they just don't care about their performance at all and this is just as rude as the person kicking them because they're dragging down a whole group because said people don't take any advice either as they "play how they want" and don't care if they give others a headache.

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Originally Posted by Zaero

Precisely. It's so people can go "welp, we're going to fail this DPS check so I'm going to bail." Pros outweigh the cons huh? Can't wait for all PFs to be "X amount of DPS or your out!!!!!!" and people bailing on DFs.

Numbers do not equate to skill. Tested it on Titan Ex. He had higher DPS because he would manawall the landslides and fire extra spells. BUT, he often blew the timing and was out mid fight, where I wasn't.

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Wait, are you saying that he did higher DPS than you even though he was out for half the fight? Because that's sad (for you) if true. Also, how the heck do you mistime a 2 minute buff?

Also, I like how you ignore that, even at launch, it was "LFG AK, must have relic!" So, yeah, the level of stupid you're describing has been in game since about a week after launch, if not sooner.

ETA: Besides, at least "XXX DPS or kick" would be a valid metric. That actually makes it better than the current "ilvl 95 or gtfo" that we have, which is one of the most useless measurements we have.

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Originally Posted by Zaero

Precisely. It's so people can go "welp, we're going to fail this DPS check so I'm going to bail." Pros outweigh the cons huh? Can't wait for all PFs to be "X amount of DPS or your out!!!!!!" and people bailing on DFs.

Numbers do not equate to skill. Tested it on Titan Ex. He had higher DPS because he would manawall the landslides and fire extra spells. BUT, he often blew the timing and was out mid fight, where I wasn't.

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- Well, if you are definitely going to fail a DPS then that person is doing you a favor by leaving so no one wastes their time...
- If he did that, his DPS would not be as high as yours... did you seriously not think that through? Also that is anecdotal evidence that has nothing to do with proving anything one way or the other. If someone does more DPS than you and preforms mechanics as well as you do, they are better. Same goes for me, and everyone else.

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Originally Posted by AerysDarkstrike

Parsers will lead to players getting kicked out of groups far more than to players being helped - even if said "help" is a simple "read a guide". Most people who want parsers do not want to help other players, they simply want a quick way to kick "underperformers" so they don't "waste time".

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- How the hell could you possible know that? Are you omnipotent? Can you read the thoughts of 1,000,000+ people simultaneously? That. Is. Amazing.
- The same mechanics are in play for Tanks and Healers currently. Do you think that a group of 7 experienced and competent players that are online specifically to get a clear should let a WHM stay in their group that can't heal enough to keep up the tanks under normal circumstances? Then why would they allow a DPS that can't do enough damage to kill the boss in time for the DPS checks to stay in? Its really not fair.

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

So let me recap it.
You choose rotation based on studies done with parser
You choose your BiS based on studies done with parser

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I know it's easier to assume than it is to state anything that exists outside your own little mind but let me recap this for you:

I don't use parsers
I choose my rotations based on skill times, damage of skills, mana cost & cooldowns
(not a damn thing to do with parsers)
I've never studied a damn thing with a parser

In Aion it was like WoW, you couldn't get into a serious end game fight without someone in the party broadcasting a parser.

My improvements were based on upgrades to my gear and learning the fights
(once again nothing to do with the parsers)

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Originally Posted by Malric

I know it's easier to assume than it is to state anything that exists outside your own little mind but let me recap this for you:

I don't use parsers
I choose my rotations based on skill times, damage of skills, mana cost & cooldowns
(not a damn thing to do with parsers)
I've never studied a damn thing with a parser

In Aion it was like WoW, you couldn't get into a serious end game fight without someone in the party broadcasting a parser.

My improvements were based on upgrades to my gear and learning the fights
(once again nothing to do with the parsers)

You've been playing this game over twice as long as I have and made less than 1/3 the progression I have...

Why hasn't your parser let you to greatness yet?

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What is better for BLM equip? det? crit? spell speed? How do you choose?

after that
1) i don't brag to be king of world
2) i can't use a parser, i'm from ps4
3) i don't have much time to give to this game
4) i don't have a static of pro players uber word killing bragghing in the forum like you
5) i don't have a "talent" for gaming. I think of me as less then avarage gamer in terms of skills, attention, rectivness so i must study really well the fight and i do it but i'm sure i need more time than you to learn a fight
6) My internet sucks balls

If you are satisfied to be better then me how all this is releated to you being a elitist attention wore that say "i can do all i want without it so anyone have to do the same" and with you being worse of those that kick ppl for 200 dps?

Plus if a party member was leading the way with the parser you used it and if no one in your group had it you whoudn't be able to do the same. So your point is null

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

What is better for BLM equip? det? crit? spell speed? How do you choose?

after that
1) i don't brag to be king of world

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I don't brag to be king of anything. There are MANY more experienced and more skilled players than myself.
(and I'm sure many that don't need parsers to do so)
I however do have the capacity to learn without a calculator, it's really not all that hard. LOOK at your skills, USE them!

When you reach end game gear, you don't have as many choices as you seem to think.
Maybe when you're in i90 or below crafted and you are dropping mad gil on material, but not really beyond that.
Much of the additional gear is an extreme farm so by the time you're sitting on enough choices to matter at this point it likely doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Malric

I don't brag to be king of anything. There are MANY more experienced and more skilled players than myself.
(and I'm sure many that don't need parsers to do so)
I however do have the capacity to learn without a calculator, it's really not all that hard. LOOK at your skills, USE them!

When you reach end game gear, you don't have as many choices as you seem to think.
Maybe when you're in i90 or below crafted and you are dropping mad gil on material, but not really beyond that.
Much of the additional gear is an extreme farm so by the time you're sitting on enough choices to matter at this point it likely doesn't.

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How the hell i'm supposed to know if i did better with cooldown in a certain point versus hope it for a flare? How can i esteem in fight if it's better to trow a schate or wait 1-2 seconds?
Those are not something that change a loss in a win. This is deire to study and improve even by a little. I can get the result or each run from a parser or theorycrafting numbers while i'm at work....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LetBloodline

"i can do all i want without it so anyone have to do the same"

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That is EXACTLY what DPS meters do!

They force the server to perform to standards they say or be kicked from groups.

So then everyone needs one to be able to group because YOU say they are needed!

When people start setting an amount of DPS for a fight, they're determining the gear people need as well.

OK for statics - Evil in DF

When they run DF and people trying to gear & learn are kicked from the groups that's good?

People join DF to learn & gear up and get kicked because of their freaking DPS? Where do they go now?

I don't give a crap about being better than anyone.
I give a crap about people using a calculator to say they are better than everyone else.

Like I said before, I don't care which of you all wants to be in fight club
Just remember the first rule of fight club

Leave the rest of the server that don't care about fight club out of it.