We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

I clipped parts down to keep character count as low as I could.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

What you are failing to realize here is that maximum item level does not necessarily mean the best (the i370 Aiming body exists, after all)[cont.]

I’m not opposed to adding more options, but they may not necessarily be “the best”[cont.]

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I never said max ilvl equaled best! That's not what I was referring to. It takes ilvl and stats to make it best. The reason why I bring up ilvl is because an i360 piece lacks the VIT, STR/DEX/INT/MND, and Defense/Magic Defense gains and the higher secondary stat cap of an i370 piece. So a crafted i360 compared to the same crafted piece but augmented to i370 is worse. I didn't miss it. It simply didn't change my point. A 370 chest with Crit/Det is better than a 350 chest with Crit/Det. The means of obtaining it no one knows. I'm talking about no longer needing to have to deal with having i350 and i360 stuff and just being able to have it all be i370. So "Peak" status for those who are very into mathematical BiS.

And yes I stat options are random. I went more into that further down

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At that point, all other MCHs are looking at that MCH and scratching their head[cont.]

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That's that MCH's choice and other MCHs scratching their heads doesn't have to matter if they aren't in the same groups. They're irrelevant. I also highly doubt a weird build would weaken the player so much that they can't clear something like Kefka with adequate DPS. Savage isn't made to need BiS. Ultimate is a totally different beast there.

We may not have the resources necessary to create such extreme sets but that's because the game doesn't support enough gear options for that. That much is obvious. Doesn't mean it can't in the future.

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Your ire seems to stem from the fact that these options (there are more than 2 for BiS for multiple jobs; I’ve said that multiple times) require raid gear and aren’t completely reliant on gear you can get outside of raids[cont.]

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If you only cared about item level, this wouldn’t be an issue. But you clearly do care about more than just that. That’s kind of why your MCH example confuses me[cont.]

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I'm aware that the other options might not always have what I want. The point is that the bigger the pool of choices at random, the more possible combinations to make something new. If the pants I want have the stats I want but are from a raid? I'll do the raid just to get that piece because I want it. I've said that many times already in fact. I'll get my piece and likely not even continue the raid. You wouldn't see me in Ultimate either. I just wanted the piece and needed the raid to get it. My motive is mine alone.

Secondly, when I ask for more options, I'm also acknowledging that stats on gear pieces are random, and that others don't have to adhere to my BiS, your BiS, or theorycrafter's BiS. Simply because I don't care about what other people put on that's suboptimal because I have no business deciding what they put in. I'm not going to kick a MCH with 3,000 skill speed from my Kefka party because of their gear, I'll kick them because they don't know the fight of their job. None of that means you have to do the same. You want everyone to be optimal? Not a problem.

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I question why a player would willingly pick something subpar, if they are aware that it’s subpar. I can at least understand if they are unaware of how subpar something is, but if they already know? Why willingly choose it?

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Because they want to. That's pretty much it. If they want to be subpar they should have that choice. They don't have to associate with people who care more about proper stats and people who care about proper stats don't have to associate with people who have subpar.

Keep in mind that when I talk about people playing MCH with 3,000 Skill Speed(That was just a made up ridiculous number), I'm talking about what other people could do. I certainly wouldn't follow it because I'm aware Skill Speed isn't the best stat for MCH. But I'm not going to say that the game shouldn't allow that person to have that choice. Especially since there really isn't any reason not to because well.. because. If I want to have an all Critical Hit and Direct Hit build, I should have that choice. Not like I'd be in your groups and if I can do more than enough DPS(Or even just enough) to clear without issue, I am not a hindrance to the clear. At best I'd be a hindrance to a speed clear if my BiS isn't best. What really matters in a fight is knowing how to play the job and do the mechanics.

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If you’re referring to the ARR elemental weapons[cont.]

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I was talking about Monster Hunter: World. It has an almost endless amount of "suboptimal" skills and is very much an online game. If someone is kicked out from a group, big whoop. They aren't the leader. If the leader let's a naked person join their group it's the leader's choice. That naked person might even play better than the armored ones. There is only one best setup mathematically. Everything else is subpar, technically.

I know that some people are inherently luckier than others, but I must reiterate something I've been saying for ages:

SE needs to stop relying on heavy doses of rng, and rng should not be what decides whether or not you progress in anything.

I spent a good while accumulating 130 Command V materia so I could over meld it and be that much more ready for 4.4 crafting. Eight mainhand weapons' third slots at 10% each, a belt's last slot at 5%, and the headpiece's fifth slot at 5%; how well do you think that went?

I went into Eureka and joined a Louhi prep group that even agreed to do chimeras during the day. After an hour of killing lots of level 40 mobs, including two sprites at what is theorized to be the best times to kill them, I got all of two ticks of feeble light. Two! Compare that to an hour of doing the sleeping dragons where I could have filled a whole bar on their feeble lights.

Seriously. It's just wanton aggravation instead of good gameplay, and there's nothing I can really do to improve my odds on this stuff that is pretty much required to progress. That is one of my biggest gripes with this game is how much the devs love to bar progression behind RNG, which is already bad enough. Grinding out so much of anything, only for that same, unwelcome RNG to smack me down and say try again later? That is terrible design, not just "lol just get lucky." Do I want to wait until the content is no longer relevant to bother playing it? No. I don't even want to play Pagos, and am trying to get done with it already (I'm so close and yet so far). I don't want to keep grinding away a couple hours of my time for gathering and crafting 30-40 collectibles just for seven or eight materia that will only blow up, either. This kind of design is as lazy as it is lousy.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

That isn't a choice but an illusion. You're either ignorant to superior builds or purposely being a hindrance. In a single player game, it impacts no one else. In a MMO, you're actively making it more difficult because you want to feel special. Can a Machinist with 3,000 Skill Speed beat God Kefka? Yes. But all you've accomplished is weakening your own damage to the point why bother upgrading at all? There is literally no point to obtaining i370 gear if you're going to willfully gimp yourself with silly stat builds.

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I remember when I too, used to always say "illusion of choice" then FFXIV got boring. Look at PvP. It's trash right now and everyone is exactly the same. Same HP, same MP, same damage, same skills, same traits, and same flat rotation with no way to play differently from one another. They removed the cross-class system so everyone in PvE is exactly the same and the leveling experience is brutal. No more using Death Blossom on PGL to have an AoE advantage at a lower level because that's an illusion of choice. No more playing CNJ with Raging Strikes, Blood For Blood, and Internal Release doing ridiculous healer DPS because illusion of choice. No more Keen Flurry on BRD to possibly reduce incoming damage by 20% and save your life(it definitely did for me many times) because that's an illusion of choice. No gear progression or anything meaningful in armor because that's an illusion of choice. That's what happens when the "illusion" is removed. Flatness. Shallow gameplay.

I ask again, if someone not adhering to the BiS build "extra attack choices" that theorycrafters created is being suboptimal and a detriment to groups and that makes deciding to have "different" stats pointless and an illusion of choice why not just have all gear be just VIT with a STR/DEX/INT/MND stat on it? Boom no more illusion of choice. No more suboptimal players.

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Your example omits the fact most people want to become more powerful. And in a team, your expected to bring your A game. While it may be entirely possible to kill things in MHW practically naked, if you showed up like that most people are going to kick you for wasting their time. You're not experimenting with new builds, you're simply being a detriment because again, you want to feel special. Do that on your own time; with other like-minded people. Don't waste mine.

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I certainly don't have whatever is the supposed best and I never got kicked from any parties. If not looking up the mathematically best set up and copying it is detrimental to your team then I won't be wasting your time for sure. I would never end up in your group. But I can assure you I beat things just fine.

To whoever thinks getting rid of Yoshi P will fix the game I got news for you. It won't. I don't care who replaces him it won't do anything. Yoshi isn't the person who needs to be replaced... he has bosses you know. He answers to them and suits. So whoever you think will - make the game better- won't if the suits keep on with their same plan. The ONLY way to change anything is for the game to drop insane numbers to where the SUITS and YP's bosses worry.. until then you could put anyone in his seat. Won't change much at all.

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Originally Posted by ko_

To whoever thinks getting rid of Yoshi P will fix the game I got news for you. It won't. I don't care who replaces him it won't do anything. Yoshi isn't the person who needs to be replaced... he has bosses you know. He answers to them and suits.

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Tanaka had the same bosses for 1.0 than Yoshida for ARR, so...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Tanaka had the same bosses for 1.0 than Yoshida for ARR, so...

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That follows what i said. The bosses wanted a change too. It was failing. Xiv isnt in that state so expecting the same results is Kind of odd. Now when we get to 1.0 type failing. Then we'll talk. But expecting someone else to do what yoshi did just cause you hate the current systen is crazy. The current system as flawed as it is is making those same bosses happy. That needs to change. Which is my point.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

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I question why a player would willingly pick something subpar, if they are aware that it’s subpar. I can at least understand if they are unaware of how subpar something is, but if they already know? Why willingly choose it?

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Because they want to. That's pretty much it. If they want to be subpar they should have that choice. They don't have to associate with people who care more about proper stats and people who care about proper stats don't have to associate with people who have subpar.

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In this game i'd say for a lot of people it just doesn't matter. the general rule of thumb is just equip whatever the highest ilevel and go. Gear just doesnt last long enough to worry about tweaking stats or melding or any of that junk. I generally don't even look at the stats anymore because they're ultimately meaningless. my sam has a full set of 370 tome gear with a hoh weapon. zero melds.. my scholar has a full 360 set from lighthouse zero melds my blm has a load of tome stuff at 370 some unaugmented at 360 zero melds. my pld has 360 lighthouse stuff zero melds..

With perhaps a small handful of exceptions higher ilevel is virtually always going to be better just because of the increase in primary stats... and generally speakingit's never going to matter anyway as gear is generally always 20-30 ilevels higher than content... so even with apparantly sub optimal stats players still massively overpower encounters.

Stats just dont matter at all which is why more and more people are getting fed up with the treadmill and endless grinds for trash gear thats incredibly dull and boring.... also why players have been asking for more interesting stats since even the earliest days of 2.0.

The current stats basically do nothing. a level 50 blm with 300-350 spell speed casts flare the exact same speed a level 70 blm does with 1600-1700 spell speed. there is literally no difference.. crit is the same. a level 50 bard with a few hundred crit lands just as many crits even on a level 1 striking dummy as a level 70 bard with 1700 crit... all these extra stats but they literally do nothing.

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Originally Posted by ko_

The current system as flawed as it is is making those same bosses happy. That needs to change. Which is my point.

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If more and more people point out that the current direction is less and less appealing, it might reach their ears. The problem is that it feels like Yoshi-P isn't even aware of the problem when you read some interviews, so even if a decision is taken, he might not even know how to "fix" the game. Funny thing though, he stated in an interview that he was free to take the game wherever he wanted back in Heavensward.

Finally, we don't expect the same kind of shift from 1.0 to 2.0, since the game is still in a much better shape than back then, but having someone new either as Producer or Director might bring something fresh to the game. IIRC, Yoshida himself said that he would be glad if someone else took one of his role (Can't remember which one).

I agree a large part is the suits that like to pocket the money and use our sub money for other SE projects rather then re-inject into this game, this needs to change though i know it will not.

Bringing in a new Director can be a double edge sword, it could all go to hell rather then be new and improved.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

I remember when I too, used to always say "illusion of choice" then FFXIV got boring. Look at PvP. It's trash right now and everyone is exactly the same. Same HP, same MP, same damage, same skills, same traits, and same flat rotation with no way to play differently from one another. They removed the cross-class system so everyone in PvE is exactly the same and the leveling experience is brutal. No more using Death Blossom on PGL to have an AoE advantage at a lower level because that's an illusion of choice. No more playing CNJ with Raging Strikes, Blood For Blood, and Internal Release doing ridiculous healer DPS because illusion of choice. No more Keen Flurry on BRD to possibly reduce incoming damage by 20% and save your life(it definitely did for me many times) because that's an illusion of choice. No gear progression or anything meaningful in armor because that's an illusion of choice. That's what happens when the "illusion" is removed. Flatness. Shallow gameplay.

I ask again, if someone not adhering to the BiS build "extra attack choices" that theorycrafters created is being suboptimal and a detriment to groups and that makes deciding to have "different" stats pointless and an illusion of choice why not just have all gear be just VIT with a STR/DEX/INT/MND stat on it? Boom no more illusion of choice. No more suboptimal players.

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Except every job doesn't play the same in PvP. It's trash now because they pruned far too many skills, removed all CC aspect and left it an imbalanced mess. Likewise, while the end result may be the same jobs play different in PvE. The old cross-class system didn't work any better than what we have now. You took the skills that best suited your job or you looked foolish. A Monk too lazy to level Dragoon for Blood for Blood wasn't trying out some special new build, they were simply lazy. Just like healers who refuse to slot Esuna now are frequently yelled at when content demands that skill and they don't have access to it. None of your examples refute the fact it's all an illusion of choice. That doesn't mean we should remove all choice entirely, but to willfully gimp yourself because you want to try something new is just you screaming "I want to be special!!!!!" If you have a group of like-minded people, go nuts. But if you're grouping with randoms, it's just inconsiderate.

A perfect example of this is if I queue into Ridorana right now on Lancer. Sure, I'll clear just fine, and probably out-dps some people since I know the job equivalent, but my having fun is putting more work on the group.

Now you're just being willfully obtuse. Secondary stats do allow for some customization. In fact, most jobs have at least two BiS sets, though several have upwards of 4-5. Your example of just been silly extremes because again, you want to be special.

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I certainly don't have whatever is the supposed best and I never got kicked from any parties. If not looking up the mathematically best set up and copying it is detrimental to your team then I won't be wasting your time for sure. I would never end up in your group. But I can assure you I beat things just fine.

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There is a stark difference between not having access to better gear and purposely choosing to make sub-optimal decisions because you think it's fun.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

There is a stark difference between not having access to better gear and purposely choosing to make sub-optimal decisions because you think it's fun.

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It also depend on how "sub-optimal" it is. If you can have more fun by only losing a fragment of your efficiency, no one will really care about that. Besides, you could also have builds more inclined toward soloing, with more emphasis on self-preservation, that would be gimped in group content, but that could still be interesting.

And finally, since most people probably level several jobs, it's not that surreal to think that they would probably chose the optimal setup for their main job, while retaining more freedom when doing less demanding content with their alts.

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Originally Posted by ko_

Tho I'm curious... other then Rath being puinshing what issues does it have? All it tells me is the playerbase is HORRIBLE.

I love you btw.. don't hate me. I'm not attacking you. I just love rath being so different... hell I'm farming it. And I DON'T farm primals. Rath got me to farm. Thats a win for me.

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Lol, it's ok I don't hate you or think you're attacking me.

Rath being different is great. My issue with Rath is the healing concept. I understand why they did it, I just don't like it. Others echo'd the same sentiment. DPS jobs are barely engaging, so when you fetter a healer to basically be a DPS (more than they already are) and their rotations consist of 1-3 skills spammed ad-nausea it shows negatively.

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Originally Posted by ko_

To whoever thinks getting rid of Yoshi P will fix the game I got news for you. It won't. I don't care who replaces him it won't do anything. Yoshi isn't the person who needs to be replaced... he has bosses you know. He answers to them and suits. So whoever you think will - make the game better- won't if the suits keep on with their same plan. The ONLY way to change anything is for the game to drop insane numbers to where the SUITS and YP's bosses worry.. until then you could put anyone in his seat. Won't change much at all.

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This is your opinion and that's fine to voice it, but you mention "suits keeping on with their plan". Do you have any clarification on this? What plan? is this something you know for a fact?

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It also depend on how "sub-optimal" it is. If you can have more fun by only losing a fragment of your efficiency, no one will really care about that. Besides, you could also have builds more inclined toward soloing, with more emphasis on self-preservation, that would be gimped in group content, but that could still be interesting.

And finally, since most people probably level several jobs, it's not that surreal to think that they would probably chose the optimal setup for their main job, while retaining more freedom when doing less demanding content with their alts.

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Those options exist though. Warrior has builds which favor a very fast paced GCD or slower. VIT melds sacrifice some damage for self-preservation in terms of higher HP. While we don't have solo focused builds, that's by and large because the devs prefer people play together given it's a MMO. That being said, you can easily solo everything 50 and below, and even some 60 stuff.

And again, you can do that. There is a difference between having sub-optimal stats because you can't obtain the gear (weekly locks) and doing something like 3,000 SkS on Machinist which accomplishes nothing except reducing your damage for no good reason. It's being unique for unique's sake.

I agree we need to talk about the state of the game and how it's working right now. I started playing recently (+- one year ago) and i'm already not excited how it used to be, because of the lack of content.
But I try my best to see both sides, the side of the community and the side of Square Enix, I think they got a lot of decisions to do right now, the community in this is complete unbundled in terms of feedback to the developers and this makes things really hard about how to proceed. I see people complaining about raiding and how it ruins the experience, but I raided the entire 4.0 tier with a fix group (4 times a week) and being amoung raiders I can feel the game also needs changes in raiding stuff (Would love to see more bosses per tier, not much but 6 instead of 4 would be great). And that's what I talking about, the unbundled of the community is making things harder than it should be because people always disagree with something, people who raid cried quite sometime because after farming savage there was nothing good to too, so they launched ultimate and people who even don't raid savage wanted to do ultimate (because reasons). I mean, if we are a community we need to see not only our/one side, Final Fantasy XIV is the first MMO I ever played where the developers are actually trying to listen to the playerbase (see other big mmo's GD, WoW it's a big complaining about everything right now, ESO, GW2, BDO, and the devs don't even bother to anwser to players and receive/implement the feedback).
That's all for me folks, I hope someday the community of Final Fantasy XIV unify together to take huge steps in terms of developing a better game for everyone, maybe people need to stop concentrating on themselves and start to concentrate as a whole.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Those options exist though. Warrior has builds which favor a very fast paced GCD or slower. VIT melds sacrifice some damage for self-preservation in terms of higher HP.

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Problem is that apart from a very specific value, those build only do raw damage...mainly because all stats only increase damage. It would be different if each stat had some kind of unique flavor. For example, let's take Critical Hit. In Dragon Quest, doing a critical is not just more damage, it also ignores defense. You could technically have some targets with a very high defense that would favor critical builds, even if the damage on paper would be lower than a Det or DH build. If Skillspeed actually increase the number of auto-attacks instead of their damage, it would also be helpful for effects such a Sword Oath or Blood Weapon...

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

While we don't have solo focused builds, that's by and large because the devs prefer people play together given it's a MMO. That being said, you can easily solo everything 50 and below, and even some 60 stuff.

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With content like Deep Dungeon, Eureka, and the decent number of solo duties, I think those kind of builds could be useful.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

\Stats just dont matter at all which is why more and more people are getting fed up with the treadmill and endless grinds for trash gear thats incredibly dull and boring.... also why players have been asking for more interesting stats since even the earliest days of 2.0.

The current stats basically do nothing. a level 50 blm with 300-350 spell speed casts flare the exact same speed a level 70 blm does with 1600-1700 spell speed. there is literally no difference.. crit is the same. a level 50 bard with a few hundred crit lands just as many crits even on a level 1 striking dummy as a level 70 bard with 1700 crit... all these extra stats but they literally do nothing.

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If the stats “didn’t matter”, why is it that tank BiS for the last two tiers has chosen pentamelded crafted accessories over the Savage or Tomestone accessories? Clearly they do for jobs to favor gear 20 item levels below cap over the ones offered that are at cap. If they don’t matter, why do jobs like NIN and DRG avoid Skill Speed? Why does BRD favor Crit so much? Why does MCH have builds with varying amounts of Skill Speed (and varying GCDs) just so that they can perform without too heavy of an impact from latency/GCD clipping?

I can also tell you with certainty that my alt with her BRD in Poetics gear does not have a consistent 40+% crit rate with regards to her rotation the way my main does in her High Crit BiS. There is a difference; just because you don’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there. BRDs wouldn’t sacrifice DEX if Crit didn’t make a difference for them, yet they do. Take a BRD with a buff that enhances critical hit rate and they suddenly have spikes in damage—if the stat increase (or the stats in general) didn’t matter, that increase wouldn’t be there, nor would it be significant enough for BRDs to warrant clipping their DoTs early to snapshot.

Again, just because you don’t personally see the gains doesn’t mean that they aren’t there.

I wouldn’t mind having more stats, but it would probably end up just like critical hit rate always does: by the end of the expansion, it is the most valued because it scales the best, where as the others usually always have thresholds where they stop becoming useful and start becoming useless. This has already happened with some jobs and critical hit rate over direct hit—they take enough direct hit to hit a threshold and then start stacking crit.

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Originally Posted by Nezerius

Which is why I said that raiders were partially to blame, not to be blamed entirely for it
Like I said earlier in this post, partial blame.

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You don't have any proof to claim raiders had even partial blame, you do realize that right? Full or partial doesn't matter for my point from the beginning that you have no proof to put blame.

We simply don't know the full reasons for anything SE does. So, like I said before, you cannot place blame on anyone except SE because you lack the facts to do that.

Either prove it with facts (which you have no access to since you don't work at SE), or give up (you might as well since again you have no proof), you can't win this argument that raiders deserve any blame for anything. The truth is you don't know, we don't know, no one but SE knows. So you can't throw blame or anything else to do with SE's decisions on to any one group in the player community.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Except every job doesn't play the same in PvP. It's trash now because they pruned far too many skills, removed all CC aspect and left it an imbalanced mess. Likewise, while the end result may be the same jobs play different in PvE. The old cross-class system didn't work any better than what we have now. You took the skills that best suited your job or you looked foolish. A Monk too lazy to level Dragoon for Blood for Blood wasn't trying out some special new build, they were simply lazy. Just like healers who refuse to slot Esuna now are frequently yelled at when content demands that skill and they don't have access to it.

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I didn't say all jobs are the same as other jobs in PvP. Maybe I said it the wrong way. All BRDs are the same. All MNKs are the same. Everyone follows a very restricted rotation. Even against high level PvPers you know exactly what every monk will do because they have nothing else they CAN do. It was all deleted. Did you forget all those skills and CC actually made a difference? You can't differentiate yourself from others now. But that seems to be the problem you have. Wanting to be different = wanting to be special = not needed because it's not the best math-wise

You glossed over everything I said about the early leveling experience which is totally bad right now. Yes there were things like Raging Strikes, Blood For Blood and Internal Release that people took because they were pretty much needed but there were other skills like Foresight, Keen Flurry, Bloodbath, Feint, Mercy Stroke, Flash etc, that actually affected the gameplay. Unlike the 60% of every role ability each class has that are completely useless in any content which used to just be regular attacks with an effect before anyway. Why they removed all the abilities just to put them back in but with no damage attached and deleting the cross class system is BEYOND ME.

As a BRD duoing PotD, Feint was a staple for me because the Slow effect completely gimped casting enemies making them easier to defeat. I got rid of Invigorate for Second Wind and another skill for Bloodbath. Can I do that now? Nope. They took my choice away. Remember when SMN and SCH had Blizzard II and SCH had Aero? Bye bye choices.

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Now you're just being willfully obtuse. Secondary stats do allow for some customization. In fact, most jobs have at least two BiS sets, though several have upwards of 4-5. Your example of just been silly extremes because again, you want to be special.

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So basically... the illusion of choice because there's always one that's mathed out to be the best. It's an illusion of choice because any other armor set up is "wrong" and those few BiS armor sets are the right ones. Making it pointless to wear anything other than those certain sets, therefore making it not a choice.

Also I'm not trying to be special. Do you see me putting in Skill Speed into my MCHs and DRGs? No. I do tend to follow what makes me the strongest. However if I have an idea to make something and it doesn't harm my do to broken extents I, and anyone else should be able to do so. Maybe I should push my BRD Skill Speed to 2.29 GCD. Just so you can be upset that I exist even though you don't see or interact with me.

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There is a stark difference between not having access to better gear and purposely choosing to make sub-optimal decisions because you think it's fun.

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Is anyone hurting your feelings doing so? Is a person with a stupid build clearing Kefka in Mateus hurt your feelings over there in Cactuar in what I assume to be your static?

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None of your examples refute the fact it's all an illusion of choice. That doesn't mean we should remove all choice entirely, but to willfully gimp yourself because you want to try something new is just you screaming "I want to be special!!!!!" If you have a group of like-minded people, go nuts. But if you're grouping with randoms, it's just inconsiderate.

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1. Implying randoms will 100% always be pure BiS and peak performance and will care or even notice a person's stats. Lol. If a Lancer is in Ridorana doing high DPS and even outdpsing others, I guarantee you you're not the problem and no one will kick you. At most people will be laughing at the fact a Lancer is there.

2. You seem so against this "illusion of choice", okay. What's your idea of an online game that's done correctly that doesn't have a theorycrafted solution to render everything else subpar and creating an illusion of choice? Name one online game.

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Originally Posted by KaldeaSahaline

Lol, it's ok I don't hate you or think you're attacking me.

Rath being different is great. My issue with Rath is the healing concept. I understand why they did it, I just don't like it. Others echo'd the same sentiment. DPS jobs are barely engaging, so when you fetter a healer to basically be a DPS (more than they already are) and their rotations consist of 1-3 skills spammed ad-nausea it shows negatively.



This is your opinion and that's fine to voice it, but you mention "suits keeping on with their plan". Do you have any clarification on this? What plan? is this something you know for a fact?

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I mean other than what're they are doing now, buisness being what it is. OTher than that I mention that only cause Yoshi's mention in the past about bosses. Not in a bad way but things like the mogstation being a good example. He has no say in that what so ever. A completely different team is in charge of that and nothing he says will change what they do. Do I have hardcore facts no, but I do know he's not the big wig for SE which means he has to have a boss. Even if it's justt the dudes in suits collecting a check not knowing how any of this works. But they aren't goign to randomly change the game cause a few fans want them too. Money has to stop to a point where they stop being happy with their amount. If we want REAL change. Can someone come and offer fresh ideas that makes most of the playerbase happy. Sure. I bet they can, but simply thinking getting rid of YP is the answer to all answers from a buisness point of view is the wrong answer I feel, and knowing how companies are, changing him will do little if anything at all. Hell in most cases it'll doom the project more offen than not. YP doing what he did for ARR is not a normal thing. Thats one of the reasons he's so loved. Saving a game that DIED is not something everyone can do. - But that is just my opinion on the matter with how companies work. Also PLEASE DON'T HATE ME T.T!!!!!!-

PS. I only say that cause words on the net are horrible displaying tone and I want to make clear even tho I seem to be on the other side of this debate I say my opinion with all the respect for you and the other person. T.T I know things get heated and I'm no better as I mgiht be known to a few people as jumpingthe gun and getting hostle... so yeah. PLEASE :O-- I could be wrong so who knows. I just don't think booting YP is the answer.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

Maybe I should push my BRD Skill Speed to 2.29 GCD. Just so you can be upset that I exist even though you don't see or interact with me.

Is anyone hurting your feelings doing so? Is a person with a stupid build clearing Kefka in Mateus hurt your feelings over there in Cactuar in what I assume to be your static?

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Nice strawmans. Try to refute the points instead of posting nonsense like this. Or, perhaps, you respond like this because you have no argument?

I'll maybe address the rest of your points later when I have the time (heading to class), but this literally made me pause and then laugh out loud. It's real hard to take any arguments you have seriously when you resort to comments like these.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

If more and more people point out that the current direction is less and less appealing, it might reach their ears. The problem is that it feels like Yoshi-P isn't even aware of the problem when you read some interviews, so even if a decision is taken, he might not even know how to "fix" the game. Funny thing though, he stated in an interview that he was free to take the game wherever he wanted back in Heavensward.

Finally, we don't expect the same kind of shift from 1.0 to 2.0, since the game is still in a much better shape than back then, but having someone new either as Producer or Director might bring something fresh to the game. IIRC, Yoshida himself said that he would be glad if someone else took one of his role (Can't remember which one).

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This is true too. I'm not saying it can't happen, hell this game existing is something that shouldn't happen if we're all being honest here. Games that die don't get second chances cause suits HATE taking risk. So it could very well happen, and I'll cheer if it ever does. I just don't see it happening. Not with the current status anyway. And whoever steps up is taking a HUGE shoe to fill. I dunno many people can step to that roll and produce something fresh that turns the game around. But one of the reasons I say that is alot of the issues people seem to have are problems mmos as of late haven't fixed so expecting someone to fix those.. if they did.. they would be rich as jones. But thats just me. - don't hate me T.T-

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

As a BRD duoing PotD, Feint was a staple for me because the Slow effect completely gimped casting enemies making them easier to defeat. I got rid of Invigorate for Second Wind and another skill for Bloodbath. Can I do that now? Nope. They took my choice away. Remember when SMN and SCH had Blizzard II and SCH had Aero? Bye bye choices.

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I kind of glossed over everything else as I have no interest in retreading ground ad verbatim, but I find this part mildly hilarious because many raid Bards actually took Feint for an entirely different reason: It let them cram 2 oGCDs per GCD with Wanderer's Minuet turned on during their opener, back when bowmage meant that using Heavy Shot in WM meant that you were only fitting 1 oGCD without incredible amounts of DPS loss clipping. It also had the advantage of letting the Bard continue attacking even when they knew they had to move with no way to avoid doing so.

There were a select few Bards that practiced 'stance dancing' with Wanderer's Minuet, but they were few and far between, what with netcode delays and all. The vast majority of the top Bards in the HW days always ran Feint.

SMN and SCH also only used Blizzard II because it was a DPS gain over Ruin against 3+ mobs back in those days as well, and applying Aero was also a DPS gain over using another Ruin (and maybe Broil).

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

I didn't say all jobs are the same as other jobs in PvP. Maybe I said it the wrong way. All BRDs are the same. All MNKs are the same. Everyone follows a very restricted rotation. Even against high level PvPers you know exactly what every monk will do because they have nothing else they CAN do. It was all deleted. Did you forget all those skills and CC actually made a difference? You can't differentiate yourself from others now. But that seems to be the problem you have. Wanting to be different = wanting to be special = not needed because it's not the best math-wise

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That has always been the case. 3.x PvP only allowed mild CD reduction and potency changes based on how you allocated points. You were still the same Monk as every other Monk. What you're essentially asking for is a system where the same job can be completely different skills based on player choice. This is where illusion of choice comes into play because once people figure out the best abilities, there is literally no reason to take anything else. Taking something else is you wanting to be different simply to be different. You aren't benefiting the party, you just want to say "I'm different than that other Monk!" FFXIV simply doesn't work like that and it never will. Our equivalent of "specs" is being able to switch jobs whenever we want.

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You glossed over everything I said about the early leveling experience which is totally bad right now. Yes there were things like Raging Strikes, Blood For Blood and Internal Release that people took because they were pretty much needed but there were other skills like Foresight, Keen Flurry, Bloodbath, Feint, Mercy Stroke, Flash etc, that actually affected the gameplay. Unlike the 60% of every role ability each class has that are completely useless in any content which used to just be regular attacks with an effect before anyway. Why they removed all the abilities just to put them back in but with no damage attached and deleting the cross class system is BEYOND ME.

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Because it wasn't relevant. Keen Flurry and Bloodbath on Dragoon aren't going to make the leveling experience any better, especially seeing every dungeon 60 and below was nerfed, thus rendering those abilities far less effective. Would being able to Flash on Warrior be nice? Sure, but it makes absolutely no difference from simply using Overpower. Leveling below 50 is boring because the game is horrendously paced both in needless fetch questing and how long it takes to obtain game changing abilities. If Dragoon learned Chaos Thrust earlier, you now have two full combos. That's far more interesting than using Mercy Stroke when a mob's HP drops below 20%.

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As a BRD duoing PotD, Feint was a staple for me because the Slow effect completely gimped casting enemies making them easier to defeat. I got rid of Invigorate for Second Wind and another skill for Bloodbath. Can I do that now? Nope. They took my choice away. Remember when SMN and SCH had Blizzard II and SCH had Aero? Bye bye choices.

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Feint was only good because BRD lacked auto-attacks in Heavensward. Now it'd simply be a DPS loss since you'd be giving up Quick Nock for a slow that has very little benefits. If dungeons had any teeth to them, CCs like that would be cool. They don't. And you do realize Blizzard II and Aero were taken only because they were a DPS gain in certain circumstances, yes? People who did that weren't trying to be unique, they were trying to be helpful which runs entirely contradictory to what your entire argument has been.

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So basically... the illusion of choice because there's always one that's mathed out to be the best. It's an illusion of choice because any other armor set up is "wrong" and those few BiS armor sets are the right ones. Making it pointless to wear anything other than those certain sets, therefore making it not a choice.

Also I'm not trying to be special. Do you see me putting in Skill Speed into my MCHs and DRGs? No. I do tend to follow what makes me the strongest. However if I have an idea to make something and it doesn't harm my do to broken extents I, and anyone else should be able to do so. Maybe I should push my BRD Skill Speed to 2.29 GCD. Just so you can be upset that I exist even though you don't see or interact with me.

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That doesn't even begin to make sense. If there are multiple BiS sets, then you have a choice. You're simply demanding to do something extremely different because you want to, and claiming being unable to do so is robbing you of a choice. No, it's you simply being stubborn.

I couldn't care less what you do. I'm merely pointing out your argument is essentially "I want to be special." You want to do something different for no other reason than "because I want to." Even if it doesn't benefit the time.

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Is anyone hurting your feelings doing so? Is a person with a stupid build clearing Kefka in Mateus hurt your feelings over there in Cactuar in what I assume to be your static?

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Not at all. I'll merely call them out if they start arguing this is just player choice and their stupid build is perfectly fine because it's objectively wrong. You want to gimp your own damage for no reason? Have at it. All that does is make you look foolish. Nice strawman, by the way. One of many.

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1. Implying randoms will 100% always be pure BiS and peak performance and will care or even notice a person's stats. Lol. If a Lancer is in Ridorana doing high DPS and even outdpsing others, I guarantee you you're not the problem and no one will kick you. At most people will be laughing at the fact a Lancer is there.

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I never implied nor insinuated that once. In fact, if you bothered to actually read what you quoted, I outright not having access to better gear is one thing. Likewise, if you're ignorant to better alternatives, that's also fine. Both scenarios are far different than your examples. And maybe some will, others might not find it so amusing because you're little more than a hindrance hiding behind others picking up the slack. You can do it, but don't try to argue it's anything except you not giving a damn about anyone else.

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2. You seem so against this "illusion of choice", okay. What's your idea of an online game that's done correctly that doesn't have a theorycrafted solution to render everything else subpar and creating an illusion of choice? Name one online game.

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They don't really exist. That's why skill trees and specs are generally an illusion. WoW has the same problem except stats play an even bigger role. You will get kicked if you're preferred spec has been deemed useless. Playing a build you think is cool works fine in single player games where it's only you effected. Doing so online for no benefit other than yourself is you being a jerk. If you want to do it, again, go for it. But call it what it is, you want to feel unique even if it's a detriment to the party.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

If the stats “didn’t matter”, why is it that tank BiS for the last two tiers has chosen pentamelded crafted accessories over the Savage or Tomestone accessories?

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The only people where those stats matter are the world-first contenders, because any advantage they can have is worth it. The game itself doesn't require this kind of min-maxing to beat.
So, denying character builds because 0.00000001% of the population would actually kick you for not being optimal is a very weak excuse...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

The only people where those stats matter are the world-first contenders, because any advantage they can have is worth it. The game itself doesn't require this kind of min-maxing to beat.
So, denying character builds because 0.00000001% of the population would actually kick you for not being optimal is a very weak excuse...

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Plenty of non-world first raiders optimize because they do matter in the content they're participating in, and in the context in which they are participating is said content for. Just because the rest of the game makes them irrelevant with its faceroll content doesn't mean they don't exist.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Nice strawmans. Try to refute the points instead of posting nonsense like this. Or, perhaps, you respond like this because you have no argument?

I'll maybe address the rest of your points later when I have the time (heading to class), but this literally made me pause and then laugh out loud. It's real hard to take any arguments you have seriously when you resort to comments like these.

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I am just going to second this. The whole thing has giving me a headache but to magic mal, homin is right, that statement is a .. well I would call it more of a red herring but regardless I agree with the point. Lets try to keep comments like that out of the conversation?

For the topic itself, they really really need to stop repeating the same content, with the only difference is a new ilevel increase. I been doing the same thing since ARR, that really needs to change, same idea behind doing expert, same 450 tomes, same 24 raid, same overall format. People have different tolerances of doing something like that, but everyone has a breaking point.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

The only people where those stats matter are the world-first contenders, because any advantage they can have is worth it. The game itself doesn't require this kind of min-maxing to beat.
So, denying character builds because 0.00000001% of the population would actually kick you for not being optimal is a very weak excuse...

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so gimping yourself is ok because the game is not hard? sounds legit.

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Originally Posted by Hamada

so gimping yourself is ok because the game is not hard? sounds legit.

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Calling "losing less than 5% of your personal DPS" gimping is still the same overreaction everybody has. Basically, if you don't have a parser, you won't even notice...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Calling "losing less than 5% of your personal DPS" gimping is still the same overreaction everybody has. Basically, if you don't have a parser, you won't even notice...

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Hmm, let's ask how the Machinists and Bards feel about not having a Dragoon around seeing 5% is precisely what they lose without Disembowel. Seeing how it's been a frequent request the devs remove piercing entirely even from the JP side, I'd say a lot of people care. Saying "well don't parse" is basically saying "remain blissfully ignorant." It's a non-argument.

I mean, if you're going to say it doesn't matter. Why bother getting the higher ilvl to begin with?

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Calling "losing less than 5% of your personal DPS" gimping is still the same overreaction everybody has. Basically, if you don't have a parser, you won't even notice...

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It doesn’t change that the difference is still there. In a raid setting, which we were talking about a raid setting, you will be hard pressed to not find at least 1 individual parsing. Usually there are more than just one, and a lot of raiders do care about things like damage. There’s a reason people that enjoy optimization follow BiS and practice optimal rotations and align their damage buffs for bursts. As for the “losing less than 5% of your personal DPS”... well BRD/MCH loses 5% simply by not having a DRG, and we all know how much they dislike that. People care: about damage, about substats, about whether or not they’re being gimped; just because you may not doesn’t change that.

People are more than welcome to gimp themselves if they so please. I don’t understand it, but I don’t control them. However, they will be suboptimal and there is no other way to argue that. Just like advocating for STR on a RDM is wrong and suboptimal, advocating a pure Skill Speed build on a job like MCH is also wrong and suboptimal. People can do whatever, but don’t advocate that what you’re (general) doing is revolutionary.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Calling "losing less than 5% of your personal DPS" gimping is still the same overreaction everybody has. Basically, if you don't have a parser, you won't even notice...

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I assume you've never wiped to a low % enrage? Or, inversely, killed something as it's enrage was casting?

5% can literally be the difference between a clear and a wipe.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

People can do whatever, but don’t advocate that what you’re (general) doing is revolutionary.

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It's not revolutionary it's just showing ignorance to facts and disrespect to any party they join.

Stuffing your fingers in your ears and running around melding what is clearly suboptimal especially if you intend to run content with an enrage is inconsiderate at best and malicious at worst.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Calling "losing less than 5% of your personal DPS" gimping is still the same overreaction everybody has. Basically, if you don't have a parser, you won't even notice...

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Funny how you should say that. I do runs with my GF and the last expert we did she was left confused. The bard appeared doing good rotations (rare) but the expert was flowing slower then it should of been with someone playing like that. She checked the gear and that is exactly what the issue was, a bit lower ilevel then you typically see now a days in expert + wrong melds. So you are wrong on that front, people can notice without parsers.

So try again? Also take a look what bourne and hyo are saying. If you are going to meld at all why not do it correctly in the scope of best? Not doing so is simply doing this:
https://img.memecdn.com/my-mom-says-...e_o_909771.jpg

>complains about raiders getting gear
> doesn't even understand how gear stats actually work


What a time we live in.

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Originally Posted by MoroMurasaki

I assume you've never wiped to a low % enrage? Or, inversely, killed something as it's enrage was casting?

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Sure, it happens sometimes in Savage...so now, we're talking about occasionnal occurences in content that an extreme minority of people are actually interested in...

Sure, let's deny the option for the whole playerbase because of that...fun be damned !

Why not removing ex primals then ? After all, their reward are always lower than savage, thus, not BiS, and thus totally gimping your character, right ?

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Originally Posted by Hamada

She checked the gear and that is exactly what the issue was, a bit lower ilevel then you typically see now a days in expert + wrong melds.

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Having a lower ilvl means having lower main stats. And whatever meld you use will never make up for it, especially if your weapon is low. Again, with the proper ilvl, she wouldn't have noticed.

Oh, by the way...according to this calculation, my 5% example was if I took my lvl 70 DRG in full Anemos set, and meld every left slot to Det VI going from 1200 to 2400 (Which is impossible). So, we're really far from the "tank pentameld acc or gtfo". So, in your picture, you're kicking the rightmost fork cause one of its teeth is one millimeter shorter...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Sure, it happens sometimes in Savage...so now, we're talking about occasionnal occurences in content that an extreme minority of people are actually interested in...

Sure, let's deny the option for the whole playerbase because of that...fun be damned !

Why not removing ex primals then ? After all, their reward are always lower than savage, thus, not BiS, and thus totally gimping your character, right ?

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More strawmans.

The primal weapons exist to give alternatives to Tomestone and Savage weapons, or to act as progression weapons until you get the one you’re after—Suzaku’s weapons will likely be i385, putting them above the i380 weapons simply due to weapon damage alone, and will serve as good progression weapons for raiders that aren’t aiming to clear the tier within a month until they can get something better (an Augmented Tomestone weapon, for example) or their Savage weapon.

They will also serve as good interim weapons for people who can’t/don’t want to buy a crafted weapon from the market board (or who can’t craft one themselves) until 7 weeks pass and they get the Alphascape Crystalliods and 1,000 Genesis tomestones for the i390 Tomestone weapon.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Sure, it happens sometimes in Savage...so now, we're talking about occasionnal occurences in content that an extreme minority of people are actually interested in...

Sure, let's deny the option for the whole playerbase because of that...fun be damned !

Why not removing ex primals then ? After all, their reward are always lower than savage, thus, not BiS, and thus totally gimping your character, right ?

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As a heads up getting sarcastic and condescending when you are also demonstrating a truly hopeless lack of understanding and information only serves to make you look really, really ignorant.

As far as I'm concerned many people have much larger hurdles to overcome to put out respectable dps in any content (Savage or otherwise) than poor gearing or materia choices. If you aren't performing something akin to the correct rotation or prioritization for your class that should be your primary concern, though extreme examples like a 3k sks build on a MCH (where you are actually hurting your damage instead of just not helping it) may deserve special consideration.

If you think only Savage has enrages you are very, very wrong on that front as well. We see enrage mechanics as early as Ifrit's nail and throughout content as we progress through the game. There are dps checks to save specific party members (Gaols on Titan and Susano, healer chains in Gilgamesh and Baelsar's Wall) and ones that require group dps to be high enough to avoid ultimate attacks which have only become more and more common throughout Stormblood like most 24man add phases and even dungeon boss mechanics like the end of Ala Mhigo. The end result is the same - do the required damage in the predetermined amount of time (so Damage Per Second) or you die.

You are making all of those things harder on yourself (and your parties) by deliberately going against the best choices for your class. This is bad. It should not be seen as equal to striving for BiS. It isn't.

As for EX primals you show your ignorance again - EX primals released on raid patches like Byakko and Suzaku will have weapons that are generally BiS to enter the new raid tier with and in many cases will remain BiS as a group progresses for quite some time. Even if a static clears turn 2 during week 1 and every week thereafter it will still be 7 weeks for everyone to receive the new tomestone weapon key (for 4.2 was Prototype Tomestone) or save up the requisite turn 4 normal raid drop item (so Sigmascape Crystalloid) to get the new tome weapon. Depending on substats that new weapon may not even be an upgrade on the EX primal drop.

Is there anything else you want to be wrong about?

I stopped reading at "Flying ruined things"

I agree with far too much of your OP. Especially about

8 man raids
Lazy 'trial' design and too easy on normal. The 8 man raids becoming trials. I noticed that right away. Was sorely disappointed and feel it really took away the identity. They were also too easy right out of the gate for anyone that was not a hardcore savage runner. So unless you joined a savage party, there is no medium difficulty 8-man content anymore. Cleared all 8-man raids on day one. With only 1 or 2 wipes per all 4 floors on day 1 and that was with PUGS! At least with Alexander, even normal was difficult for casuals and unless you were good, you were highly incentivised to get some new tomestone gear as it made Alexander runs progress-able. Gave people a REASON to get the gear. Bunch of folks I know do NOT play savage so after easily facerolling the first 4 8man raid 'trials', they quit. This shit is not my opinion to be agreed with or not. It is a fact. More people left than they did with HW simply because they lacked incentive and got bored. FYI, I have been told the savage content was really great! Very cool for those that run savage, but most do not and so this is relevant to the health of the game.

Gear design
Saved almost NO gear from SB. So many re-skins. I don't mind gear that I find ugly. Hell, SOMEONE likes it, right? But this stuff is all the same. MOBs out in the word and in many of the dungeons shared the same fate of re-skinning. It was obvious and stuck out badly. We all noticed it.

Predicable gear progression
You nailed it. Predictable and thus boring. Its getting harder to get folks to come back because they are bored unless they savage but even then, as you made very clear, much other content is ignored.

The new relic kills old content. Its been stated before but Many of us liked how were were given so many ways of grinding for the relic in HW. Now there is Eureka and there is ONLY Eureka for relic grinding. Its cool that it is new content, but many hate it and it is a singular thing rather than the many varied paths of content presented before.


New Characters
I have a bunch of experience with this. You are right that this MUST be fixed. They don't need to skip most things, but they should cut out all filler and even start combining quests and story. Basically have 1 quest that combines the story event from the next 10 artificially bloated sub quests. There is just no reason for these anymore. They are killing new players. Period. Not an opinion. I have struggled to get people through it. Look, I loved the 2.0 story, but it can be drastically cut down without actually cutting any main story.



Summary of the state of 4.x
1 of these alone is not damaging to the health of the game, but all of these together is killing it. I miss playing with my friends and adding new ones. The above reasons combined are why.





You have some really interesting ideas for fixing progression and I hope the Devs shake it up or at least realize that they need to.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

The only people where those stats matter are the world-first contenders, because any advantage they can have is worth it. The game itself doesn't require this kind of min-maxing to beat.
So, denying character builds because 0.00000001% of the population would actually kick you for not being optimal is a very weak excuse...

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....It's this kind of mentality that gives me low level tanks with accessories that have spell speed and mind in them in level roulette because they wanted to play a "mage tank".

Christ....

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Originally Posted by Sigma-Astra

....It's this kind of mentality that gives me low level tanks with accessories that have spell speed and mind in them in level roulette because they wanted to play a "mage tank".

Christ....

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Easy way to fix that is to make it so certain job types can't meld materia they can't use. Like prevent physical melee DPS from being able to meld Spell Speed, Intelligence, and Mind since those are stats incompatible with their job. Especially since melding the materia actually can't affect them. Tenacity and Piety also shouldn't be able to be melded onto anything but healer and tank gear because the description specifically says they're only applicable on those roles so the fact that they can be melded on anything seems like an oversight. If the devs are worried about true mechanical(and player error), preventing them from melding those things entirely is the first step to fixing that issue as well as more freedom with role-specific stats and materia.

All Gear accepts:
-Critical Hit/Critical Aim
-Direct Hit/Heavens' Eye

Physical DPS gear accepts:
-Skill Speed/Quickarm

Caster DPS gear accepts:
-Spell Speed

Healer gear accepts:
-Spell Speed
-Piety

Tank gear accepts:
-Skill Speed
-Tenacity

I'm on the fence about the STR/DEX/INT/MND/VIT materia since STR and VIT are currently used for tanks and HP optimization in high level content like Ultimate or progression through survival but.. even those two stats are extremely limited to just jewelry. Outside of tank jewelry, STR is a pointless materia and DEX/INT/MND see absolutely no use at any point in the game. Getting rid of the "STR Tank" was a poor decision imo because it was yet another choice/advantage players lost. One of many. But I'm not sure how to replace it..

EDIT: With Tenacity and Piety existing it's possible the devs might get rid of main stat materia and start making more Role Stats with materia. But the thought doesn't excite me because I know whatever stat it would be, it just wouldn't change gameplay all that much. FFXIV stat system is truly in a tough spot

But anyway point is that we won't be seeing BLMs with Quickarm V and DRGs with Craftman's Command VI if the devs simply nipped the issue in the bud by preventing it from happening at all, and lock materias to certain compatible roles/jobs. A change that doesn't affect gameplay in the slightest but does prevent melding that has no effect.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

Easy way to fix that is to make it so certain job types can't meld materia they can't use. Like prevent physical melee DPS from being able to meld Spell Speed, Intelligence, and Mind since those are stats incompatible with their job. Especially since melding the materia actually can't affect them. Tenacity and Piety also shouldn't be able to be melded onto anything but healer and tank gear because the description specifically says they're only applicable on those roles so the fact that they can be melded on anything seems like an oversight. If the devs are worried about true mechanical(and player error), preventing them from melding those things entirely is the first step to fixing that issue as well as more freedom with role-specific stats and materia.

All Gear accepts:
-Critical Hit/Critical Aim
-Direct Hit/Heavens' Eye

Physical DPS gear accepts:
-Skill Speed/Quickarm

Caster DPS gear accepts:
-Spell Speed

Healer gear accepts:
-Spell Speed
-Piety

Tank gear accepts:
-Skill Speed
-Tenacity

I'm on the fence about the STR/DEX/INT/MND/VIT materia since STR and VIT are currently used for tanks and HP optimization in high level content like Ultimate or progression through survival but.. even those two stats are extremely limited to just jewelry. outside of tanks STR is a pointless materia and DEX/INT/MND see absolutely no use at any point in the game. Getting rid of the "STR Tank" was a poor decision imo because it was yet another choice/advantage players lost. One of many. But I'm not sure how to replace it..

But anyway point is that we won't be seeing BLMs with Quickarm V and DRGs with Craftman's Command VI if the devs simply nipped the issue in the bud by preventing it from happening at all, and lock materias to certain compatible roles/jobs. A change that doesn't affect gameplay in the slightest but does prevent melding that has no effect.

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This isn't about materia though. Low level tanks can equip those low level gemstone accessories because they're for "All Classes".

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...m/2c7ec61c874/ This is a problem in leveling roulette.