Requesting Information on Jobs: Preparing for 1.21

Yes please! I also would like to know if AF is just dropped or we get the great quest lines we got in XI for them. I'm assuming Yoshi ditched the whole story based gear direction :(

I'm assuming artifact gear is U/U, which brings me to my question - will there be any sort of storage for U/U items. Over half of one of my retainers inventory is filled with U/U items. Makes it very hard to manage my inventory.

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Originally Posted by Keftenk

Yes please! I also would like to know if AF is just dropped or we get the great quest lines we got in XI for them. I'm assuming Yoshi ditched the whole story based gear direction :(

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Want to say I thought he said they are all quested, and that the quest that will release for the af weapon in 1.22 will be very difficult. Not 100% though

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Originally Posted by Keftenk

Yes please! I also would like to know if AF is just dropped or we get the great quest lines we got in XI for them. I'm assuming Yoshi ditched the whole story based gear direction :(

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The initial set of job specific gear will be obtained after completing the last job quest. The quests are supposedly challenging as well so we shall see.

Oh, well I'm dumb I guess.

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Originally Posted by Sigmakan

I'm assuming artifact gear is U/U, which brings me to my question - will there be any sort of storage for U/U items. Over half of one of my retainers inventory is filled with U/U items. Makes it very hard to manage my inventory.

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They said they're working on making a storage for them, I don't remember an ETA though.

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Originally Posted by Rubicon

My thought with cross classing is that the classes used to unlock the job will have allowable skills in that job. For example, according to one of Yoshida's early interviews PLD is unlocked by 30 GLA/15 MRD so my expectation is that all GLA skills are allowable for PLD and all or half of MRD skills are also allowable. For PLD this works since both GLA and MRD can tank, so it's complementary. If BLM is THM/CNJ then, once again, it's complementary a far as cross class skills go.

There has been other interviews where Yoshida didn't mention the 2nd class requirement with regard to unlocking jobs (Live interview 2 maybe?) so I'm not even certain that unlocking jobs is a lvl 30/15 situation or just lvl 30, but if we go with Yoshida's first comment which was 30/15, then there ya go.

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That's another curious thing. I'm thinking they were in the concept stages back then, so I really wonder what they ended up going with. Perhaps it's worth putting in as a question even if only because the info we've received involves two different answers.

There are a few things I am concerned about in regards to the new Job system.

1.) The AF Armor is going to be town gear due to lack of good stats, and being un meldable. Essentially making it worthless.

2.) Not being able to use abilities from other classes. I understand that on the job you excel at that role. However almost all content in this game requires second wind, sentinel, and cure. This will make soloing much more inefficient for almost every class (EXP, and farming). I hope they at least allow 5 abilities to be used from other classes (Speculation post here, this information hasn't been confirmed).

I want to play as a Dragoon, not a Lancer. :/

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

There are a few things I am concerned about in regards to the new Job system.

1.) The AF Armor is going to be town gear due to lack of good stats, and being un meldable. Essentially making it worthless.

2.) Not being able to use abilities from other classes. I understand that on the job you excel at that role. However almost all content in this game requires second wind, sentinel, and cure. This will make soloing much more inefficient for almost every class (EXP, and farming). I hope they at least allow 5 abilities to be used from other classes (Speculation post here, this information hasn't been confirmed).

I want to play as a Dragoon, not a Lancer. :/

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I think the solo aspect of the classes is meant to be dropped.

On the limited cross class ability side, I imagine there would be the added layer of tactics and roles to try out. The recovery options of a cross class, versus being restricted to job-specific abilities that may have more emergency responses built into them.

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

Not being able to use abilities from other classes. I understand that on the job you excel at that role. However almost all content in this game requires second wind, sentinel, and cure. This will make soloing much more inefficient for almost every class (EXP, and farming). I hope they at least allow 5 abilities to be used from other classes (Speculation post here, this information hasn't been confirmed).

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Jobs are designed for parties, not solo play.

given the info so far i find jobs to be a bit underwhelming. I would have initially guessed that jobs would work like a job tree and branch out. Since you keep you class skills branching out into certain jobs would be tough to pull off. Also the number of job skills is a bit disappointing(esp since one of the 5 we are getting will be 15 min cool down i think). Over all it seems jobs will add a nice little bonus to the class but they dont seem like they will be as unique as i thought they would have been.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

given the info so far i find jobs to be a bit underwhelming. I would have initially guessed that jobs would work like a job tree and branch out. Since you keep you class skills branching out into certain jobs would be tough to pull off. Also the number of job skills is a bit disappointing(esp since one of the 5 we are getting will be 15 min cool down i think). Over all it seems jobs will add a nice little bonus to the class but they dont seem like they will be as unique as i thought they would have been.

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Quite a lot we don't know about them just yet. A lot of people are excited in anticipation of jobs and have placed a lot of faith into them being an amazing, much needed addition. Many expect it to be the greatest step in the direction of balancing out the game and it's content.

On the flipside there are also quite a number of people who are taking every bit of info with a grain of salt, with a very understandable fear of being disappointed yet again.

That's one reason I feel that addressing the questions in the OP can greatly help us both manage our expectations as well as preparation.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

given the info so far i find jobs to be a bit underwhelming. I would have initially guessed that jobs would work like a job tree and branch out. Since you keep you class skills branching out into certain jobs would be tough to pull off. Also the number of job skills is a bit disappointing(esp since one of the 5 we are getting will be 15 min cool down i think). Over all it seems jobs will add a nice little bonus to the class but they dont seem like they will be as unique as i thought they would have been.

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Who knows what the future holds... especially with the small tidbits of information we have now, it's really all speculation at this point. Everything SE has said came with a disclaimer that "this may change". Take it for what you will, but in my mind nothing is finalized until they say so and release it.

We all have an idea brewing in our minds as to how the job system will be, the main thing to also keep on your brains is to not be disappointed if it doesn't work exactly as you envisioned it.


Also, just wanted to add from a pure speculation point of view. Even if the jobs are restricted to the base 'class' skills, they could evolve the system so that Job-A and Job-B unlock a new Job-C which could have completely new skills. Then again the possibility of additional classes being added, combinations of classes making new jobs, etc... are all viable at this point.

Wait and see will always be the best answer when it comes to anything in this mmo. *fingers crossed for job success*

there will be a 1.20b patch? anyone knows some details?

I get the feeling jobs will be very worth it....
for example

PLD Abl. 3 O Grants imperviousness to melee attacks. Effect fades upon moving.
PLD Mag. 1 O Restores target's HP. When cast on another player, restores 50% of their HP in addition to a portion of your own.

WAR Abl. 2 O Grants an additional attack to the next weaponskill used.
WAR Abl. 4 OSelf AoE Increases the maximum HP and attack power of all party members within range, and removes any Sleep effects. Stuns all enemies within range.

MNK Abl. 1 O Temporarily increases attack speed.
MNK Abl. 2 O Adds kicks to auto-attacks. Effect fades upon reuse. MP is continually consumed while effect is active.

DRG Abl. 1 O Performs a jumping attack on the target.
DRG Abl. 2 O Performs a jumping evasion and attack that triggers when you are attacked.
DRG Abl. 3 OTarget AoE Deals fire damage to all enemies within range of the target.

Do I even need to list Bard?

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Originally Posted by Rydin

I get the feeling jobs will be very worth it....
for example

PLD Abl. 3 O Grants imperviousness to melee attacks. Effect fades upon moving.
PLD Mag. 1 O Restores target's HP. When cast on another player, restores 50% of their HP in addition to a portion of your own.

WAR Abl. 2 O Grants an additional attack to the next weaponskill used.
WAR Abl. 4 OSelf AoE Increases the maximum HP and attack power of all party members within range, and removes any Sleep effects. Stuns all enemies within range.

MNK Abl. 1 O Temporarily increases attack speed.
MNK Abl. 2 O Adds kicks to auto-attacks. Effect fades upon reuse. MP is continually consumed while effect is active.

DRG Abl. 1 O Performs a jumping attack on the target.
DRG Abl. 2 O Performs a jumping evasion and attack that triggers when you are attacked.
DRG Abl. 3 OTarget AoE Deals fire damage to all enemies within range of the target.

Do I even need to list Bard?

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jobs do add some nice new skills. I personally don't think they add enough to constitute it being separate from the class. I would have liked jobs to have dropped 5 class skills and gotten 10 job skills. By dropping some skills and adding more with the job the jobs could have more easily been designed to branch out into different jobs. With only having the addition of a few skills I think they should nix the classes and have only jobs. Im fine with whatever they do but like i said before, the whole job system so far seems a bit underwhelming.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

jobs do add some nice new skills. I personally don't think they add enough to constitute it being separate from the class. I would have liked jobs to have dropped 5 class skills and gotten 10 job skills. By dropping some skills and adding more with the job the jobs could have more easily been designed to branch out into different jobs. With only having the addition of a few skills I think they should nix the classes and have only jobs. Im fine with whatever they do but like i said before, the whole job system so far seems a bit underwhelming.

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You know what else is underwhelming? Freezer waffles.

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Originally Posted by AngryNixon

You know what else is underwhelming? Freezer waffles.

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i disagree, when prepared properly they can be tasty. do you microwave or toast. you have to toast them. also make sure you put butter on them, lastly microwave the syrup so it helps to melt the butter.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

i disagree, when prepared properly they can be tasty. do you microwave or toast. you have to toast them. also make sure you put butter on them, lastly microwave the syrup so it helps to melt the butter.

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I disagree. Microwave slightly at first to soften, then toast until desired crispiness is achieved, add butter and microwave for 10 - 15 seconds for melting. Syrup must be kept just above freezing point so allow for maximum deliciousness.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

jobs do add some nice new skills. I personally don't think they add enough to constitute it being separate from the class. I would have liked jobs to have dropped 5 class skills and gotten 10 job skills. By dropping some skills and adding more with the job the jobs could have more easily been designed to branch out into different jobs. With only having the addition of a few skills I think they should nix the classes and have only jobs. Im fine with whatever they do but like i said before, the whole job system so far seems a bit underwhelming.

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The change between class and job has much more to it than just 5 skills and new gear. Setting aside the fact that we still know little about the potency and exact effects of these skills and that we know next to nothing about the gear, it is expected that the switch to a job alone will have a profound effect on one's stats. We also don't know if there are any traits that will come with the switch.

I will agree that with how little we know, expecting an underwhelming implementation is understandable, however one can also appreciate that the true value of jobs may lie in the large amount of info we don't have.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

The change between class and job has much more to it than just 5 skills and new gear. Setting aside the fact that we still know little about the potency and exact effects of these skills and that we know next to nothing about the gear, it is expected that the switch to a job alone will have a profound effect on one's stats. We also don't know if there are any traits that will come with the switch.

I will agree that with how little we know, expecting an underwhelming implementation is understandable, however one can also appreciate that the true value of jobs may lie in the large amount of info we don't have.

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yea, im not hating on jobs or anything. thats why i wrote given the info i have now. If nothing else, hopefully getting the job gear will be fun.

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Originally Posted by Keftenk

Yes please! I also would like to know if AF is just dropped or we get the great quest lines we got in XI for them. I'm assuming Yoshi ditched the whole story based gear direction :(

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As i understand it, and this may just be my thinkerbox not fully understanding the relevant info. Some of the gear will come from the quests, other pieces will be obtained via other methods. Dollars to doughnuts it will have to do with one of the new incoming "Raids".

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Originally Posted by Griss

As i understand it, and this may just be my thinkerbox not fully understanding the relevant info. Some of the gear will come from the quests, other pieces will be obtained via other methods. Dollars to doughnuts it will have to do with one of the new incoming "Raids".

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From what I understand you get the initial set they displayed via simply finishing the last job quest which is at 50 if I'm not mistaken. However, if they do in fact put in some extras that are JS in the new dungeons that would be absolutely exciting! Perhaps another JS weapon? Finally some looted accessories with unique effects perhaps? Another curious thing is the shield being missing from the PLD in the Job pose thumbnail they posted a while back...

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

From what I understand you get the initial set they displayed via simply finishing the last job quest which is at 50 if I'm not mistaken. However, if they do in fact put in some extras that are JS in the new dungeons that would be absolutely exciting! Perhaps another JS weapon? Finally some looted accessories with unique effects perhaps? Another curious thing is the shield being missing from the PLD in the Job pose thumbnail they posted a while back...

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they said they plan to make getting all the gear rather difficult, thats all i can recall on it.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

jobs do add some nice new skills. I personally don't think they add enough to constitute it being separate from the class. I would have liked jobs to have dropped 5 class skills and gotten 10 job skills. By dropping some skills and adding more with the job the jobs could have more easily been designed to branch out into different jobs. With only having the addition of a few skills I think they should nix the classes and have only jobs. Im fine with whatever they do but like i said before, the whole job system so far seems a bit underwhelming.

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This could just be the beginning.... Jobs could very well blossom into something big and incredible... I do agree that 5 abilities is slightly underwhelming

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Originally Posted by Rydin

This could just be the beginning.... Jobs could very well blossom into something big and incredible... I do agree that 5 abilities is slightly underwhelming

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i really hope they do. theres a ton of potential there. Another thing they could do is add traits to grant existing skills more bonuses which would be nice.

Out of all the jobs the bard and mages seem to have gotten the least amount of attention. I don't plan on playing bard as of now but i do think bard should have equaled more then some random party buffs attached to our current archer
class.

The jobs were supposed to be focused on party play but when i read through the skill list there are alot of skills that fit in more with the class design and not so much focused on job skill(party play).

example:blizz3, why is the 3rd tier of a class magic spell a blm spell. to me it seems like cop out way to add skills to jobs.

there are other sills i would list but i dont really care too. also there are some really nice skills that will really benefit party play coming so no need to get raged over my comment. its just an honest opinion of how i feel right now.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

i really hope they do. theres a ton of potential there. Another thing they could do is add traits to grant existing skills more bonuses which would be nice.

Out of all the jobs the bard and mages seem to have gotten the least amount of attention. I don't plan on playing bard as of now but i do think bard should have equaled more then some random party buffs attached to our current archer
class.

The jobs were supposed to be focused on party play but when i read through the skill list there are alot of skills that fit in more with the class design and not so much focused on job skill(party play).

example:blizz3, why is the 3rd tier of a class magic spell a blm spell. to me it seems like cop out way to add skills to jobs.

there are other sills i would list but i dont really care too. also there are some really nice skills that will really benefit party play coming so no need to get raged over my comment. its just an honest opinion of how i feel right now.

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Actually BLM gets Freeze, not Blizzaga.

Some new juicy info. I'm sure we'll get an official translation soon enough.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post514832

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Actually BLM gets Freeze, not Blizzaga.

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im not concerned with the name so much. my point is the description of the skill doesn't really say party play to me. convert is another one. i have to be in a party to to make turning my hp into mp worth it. that would be just as good solo imo.

the point of jobs is to focus on party play and excel at a role, i just dont see that being the case. Are they gonna nerf glads attack for more def. they may as well just take away the sword all together and give him a bigger shield since glad damage sucks enough now. Glad attack should be much stronger for the solo aspect ad then nerfed for pld.

I don't need anyone to recite all the good party skills coming i know what they are. It just seems to me that some of the jobs got a allot of filler instead of job skills and are party oriented.

people have to remember this is alpha stage of this game and if you dont give your honest opinions and white knight everything then thats really not helpful.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

im not concerned with the name so much. my point is the description of the skill doesn't really say party play to me. convert is another one. i have to be in a party to to make turning my hp into mp worth it. that would be just as good solo imo.

the point of jobs is to focus on party play and excel at a role, i just dont see that being the case. Are they gonna nerf glads attack for more def. they may as well just take away the sword all together and give him a bigger shield since glad damage sucks enough now. Glad attack should be much stronger for the solo aspect ad then nerfed for pld.

I don't need anyone to recite all the good party skills coming i know what they are. It just seems to me that some of the jobs got a allot of filler instead of job skills and are party oriented.

people have to remember this is alpha stage of this game and if you dont give your honest opinions and white knight everything then thats really not helpful.

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So... reducing enmity does not say party play to you?

I get the whole Work in Progress argument. I make it quite often myself. The skills that jobs gain are meant to improve their ability in the line of their purpose. What makes jobs party-oriented is mainly going to be their lack of ability to cross-class, effectively making them dependent on others.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

So... reducing enmity does not say party play to you?

I get the whole Work in Progress argument. I make it quite often myself. The skills that jobs gain are meant to improve their ability in the line of their purpose. What makes jobs party-oriented is mainly going to be their lack of ability to cross-class, effectively making them dependent on others.

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if we were to argue that emnity reducing skills were more party focused(which they are, but the blm skill is also DD+enmity reduce) then my point would only be proven further since cnj has shroud of saints which would have been better suited for whm.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

if we were to argue that emnity reducing skills were more party focused(which they are) then my point would only be proven further since cnj has shroud of saints which would have been better suited for whm.

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Don't forget it also recovers MP over time quite quickly, so it still has use for soloing. In fact I use it more for that function rather than the enmity thing.

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Originally Posted by Estellios

Don't forget it also recovers MP over time quite quickly, so it still has use for soloing. In fact I use it more for that function rather than the enmity thing.

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yea i know. meanwhile thm has no means to recover mp except to wait for blm convert. because recovering your mp is more for being in a party and all /sarcasm.

i really don't feel like arguing any of this, if everyone else thinks that it seems perfectly planned out and everything makes total sense then im obviously wrong.

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

if we were to argue that emnity reducing skills were more party focused(which they are, but the blm skill is also DD+enmity reduce) then my point would only be proven further since cnj has shroud of saints which would have been better suited for whm.

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There clearly exist skills among classes that promote party play. You don't even have to go as far as Shroud of Saints. Remember, classes will be the dominant choice for the most part not only for solo but Light Party events as well.

Another point, as I made in my previous post, is that the job skills aren't primarily meant to provide exclusively party oriented bonuses. A lot of them are simply stronger or more unique weaponskills and personal buffs even. The idea is they are very desirable skills that boost your ability to do what you are meant to do on that job as opposed to staying as the class counterpart; WHM being more proficient at healing than CNJ, BLM better damage ability than THM, PLD better tanking ability than GLA, etc. What directly encourages jobs to be used in Full Party events is the lack of ability to cross-class effectively as a cost for obtaining those skills.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

There clearly exist skills among classes that promote party play. You don't even have to go as far as Shroud of Saints. Remember, classes will be the dominant choice for the most part not only for solo but Light Party events as well.

Another point, as I made in my previous post, is that the job skills aren't primarily meant to provide exclusively party oriented bonuses. A lot of them are simply stronger or more unique weaponskills and personal buffs even. The idea is they are very desirable skills that boost your ability to do what you are meant to do on that job as opposed to staying as the class counterpart; WHM being more proficient at healing than CNJ, BLM better damage ability than THM, PLD better tanking ability than GLA, etc. What directly encourages jobs to be used in Full Party events is the lack of ability to cross-class effectively as a cost for obtaining those skills.

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i will wait for them to go live to form a final opinion. my 2 cents has turned into a quarter now so talk to yea later, bye.

Jobs: just like classes but with four more abilities you'll never use.

/crystalball

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

Jobs: just like classes but with four more abilities you'll never use.

/crystalball

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I honestly hope that does not end up being the case lol

Hey guys! I made sure to let the dev. team know the types of questions that you have been asking about with the upcoming job system. Just a heads up that we'll be posting frequent information and topics on Lodestone in the coming weeks leading up to patch 1.21! Once that is all released, we'll see what questions remain and we'll work to get further specific details then. Don't wanna spoil it all just yet!

Thanks for the heads up, Rukkirii.

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

Hey guys! I made sure to let the dev. team know the types of questions that you have been asking about with the upcoming job system. Just a heads up that we'll be posting frequent information and topics on Lodestone in the coming weeks leading up to patch 1.21! Once that is all released, we'll see what questions remain and we'll work to get further specific details then. Don't wanna spoil it all just yet!

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Rukkirii posted in my thread. I can now die in peace~