I miss the sense of adventure and danger in MMOs.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

I can definitely agree with this. Odin spawned on top of me and some friends once while we were spiritbonding in Urth's Gift. The remainder of our lives was very short and very memorable, that's for sure. xD

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The last time I saw Odin he had spawned right next to a class duty exit point. Those of us standing around waiting to get a group big enough to take him on kept falling over in laughter at the newbie lancers who would pop in, stare at Odin, then run away in terror as he chased them down. XD

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Originally Posted by Leigaon

That I didn't know..did they? I loved it, I was doing a quest and my friend walks by "You're going to die" "no I'm not." ..I died "yeah they hit hard now..you're not a super god here."

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Only for FATE enemies, depending how the FATE ended the last time.

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Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

You learned how mobs aggroed and took the appropriate steps to avoid them or you made liberal use of sneak/invisible. The only hard part was trying to find a safe spot to reapply sneak/invis or the rare True Sight mob you had to avoid. Zones weren't dangerous, they were a tedious exercise in patience.

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Gotta agree with the Sneak/Invis stuff. It was overdone, because people weren't really exploring in the way the devs designed it. FFXI was almost entirely party-based, and most areas couldn't be safely explored alone without the aid of Sneak/Invis, which could also get expensive. Most of the maps were flat out misleading, making it look like you could get to certain areas via certain paths, only for there to be a rock, tree trunk, or slightly raised piece of land that prohibited you from getting there.

And while I think you can make the case that XIV could use some more overworld party-based things, XI took it to an extreme.

Yup, FFXIV world has no sense of exploration or group content stuff like sky/sea/etc. My whole FC and I finally unsubbed. It's just too boring and I don't think it will ever be like 1.23/FFXI again. No sense of accomplishment, adventure or group work.

MMO, at least for now are not like how they used to be at all sadly...

I do miss the sense of danger... Once you get to max level, with decent gear, there is no threat anywhere outside of raid content. Doing my various hunts, I have no issue agro'ing 4 other mobs to get to the one I want. I kill it while completely ignoring the rest entirely.

I was hoping for some truly dangerous zones in HW, but it's sad to see the same 2.0 cycle over again.

Are we ever going to get dangerous zones that stay dangerous at max level?

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Originally Posted by Iromi

Yup, FFXIV world has no sense of exploration or group content stuff like sky/sea/etc. My whole FC and I finally unsubbed. It's just too boring and I don't think it will ever be like 1.23/FFXI again. No sense of accomplishment, adventure or group work.

MMO, at least for now are not like how they used to be at all sadly...

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If you want FFXI, go play FFXI; it's still running, and there's a yearlong expansion planned. Of course MMOs are not like they were in the past, the genre evolves as the market evolves as games bring in different ideas. This like whining that you no longer have to turn a crank in a car to start it.

This would require people to group up in the open world content and actually play with other people on the same server and free company's could actually do stuff together. >.> oh noes!

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Originally Posted by odintius

This would require people to group up in the open world content and actually play with other people on the same server and free company's could actually do stuff together. >.> oh noes!

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Party Finder and FC alliances?

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Originally Posted by odintius

This would require people to group up in the open world content and actually play with other people on the same server and free company's could actually do stuff together. >.> oh noes!

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What open world content?

Anyone remember running to Chimera in the ToAU expansion of FFXI? Remember how fun it was using potions to hide from mobs and work around true sight mobs because no one cared to fight them and time wasters while weaving around two areas just to get there and another party claimed it? Yep, we need that back.

All relevant content for the party finder isn't for open world content which we don't have ironically, you still have to register in duty finder to enter still in a none open world instance btw.

Ja as many have said old school mmo's do not sell well anymore, the new school (like FF14 now) do sell well as the numbers show. Until the "new" (which will not be that major and you will see FF14 and WoW stick around even with the next gen of mmo's) comes out this type of gameplay is what you will find in newer mmo's. Open world content is a mean to an end and beyond some named hunts and fates are no longer appealing to play for the majority, you should aim for some new ideas and not give us X feature from FF11. This includes open dungeon/"hard" world content, sideways progression, and rng stats on gear (major flaw that WoW hit and was part of the reason people left WoD). What we could use is better PvP and a PvP endgame, more side content like Golden Saucer, and for them to keep up the current schedule of content. To not scarp this what could we add that would be new or interesting?

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Originally Posted by odintius

This would require people to group up in the open world content and actually play with other people on the same server and free company's could actually do stuff together. >.> oh noes!

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This is a fast food MMO. Everything from combat to dungeons have been dumbed down to the lowest possible denominator. Even if they did create open world content like what you are suggesting, it wouldn't add anything to the game because there is no depth of strategy to the roles. If it wasn't for how low development for this game costs, it would already be F2P.

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Originally Posted by Fendred

This is a fast food MMO. Everything from combat to dungeons have been dumbed down to the lowest possible denominator. Even if they did create open world content like what you are suggesting, it wouldn't add anything to the game because there is no depth of strategy to the roles. If it wasn't for how low development for this game costs, it would already be F2P.

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you mean video games for the most part are fast food entertainment, mobile being the shortest, and grand strategy games being the longest (and some of the least played). Even games that are considered some of the better games of today like dark souls, .AAA's, and MMO's are now (and for the most part since conception) have been designed for short bursts of play. You can get on and play for 30's to an hour and get enjoyment and a sense or progression. The grind for months to max level is not very appealing to the most audiences, it is almost like with time the video game industry grew up with it's consumers. (the once high schooler with loads of time is now married and has kids and less time) Is it bad? It matters who you are, it works great for a college student like me I can get some major grind during the summer and play less frequent when I have more work and more social ops. and not feel left behind for not playing more than 30-an hour of gameplay. This game is not a job it is in the end all an entertainment experience

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Originally Posted by Iromi

Yup, FFXIV world has no sense of exploration

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So I guess you don't like the sightseeing log? Also, you can explore in FFXIV fine. In fact, you can find some awesome things if you just look around a bit. Unless you need a tangible reward for everything you do?

"I have to get to Point B from Point A but there are dozens of dangerous enemies I have to meander/fight through to get there safely or risk starting over again."

Holy shit guys, no thanks.

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Originally Posted by justinjarjar

What we could use is better PvP and a PvP endgame

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Good lord no, there's dozens of things I could go play PvP in that aren't FFXIV and plenty that aren't MMO's.

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Originally Posted by Fendred

This is a fast food MMO. Everything from combat to dungeons have been dumbed down to the lowest possible denominator. Even if they did create open world content like what you are suggesting, it wouldn't add anything to the game because there is no depth of strategy to the roles. If it wasn't for how low development for this game costs, it would already be F2P.

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This is very telling on todays gamers then, player's expect a dumbed down content to the lowest denominator and if dev dare add any kind of depth it's a instant F2P game, how sad how far the genre has fallen, so Yoshi does have a point on it dying off slowly but surely for mmo's in general. /shrug

I never got lost before, but the only things that came close to causing it, were;
(1) Lack of view distance
(2) Repeating simple terrain layouts (such as FFXI)
(3) Teleportation that causes the camera to change which direction you were facing. (even more so if its different every time)

As for a sense of "exploration" things that actually make me feel that are;
(1) No maps, so you dont actually see the edges, and always "assume" there's more. (I never bothered getting map[s in FFXI, just to help the immersion the areas had more to them. Once I saw a map, it no longer felt vast and open.)
(2) Lower number of aggressive enemy populations, except certain key points. (encountering an enemy every 5 feet is just annoying, and never lets u just stop and enjoy the scenery.)
(3) Having something to actually find that is either a rare find (NM or chest) or simply out of the ordinary (NPC or beautiful vistas)
(4) and lastly, the environment is large, with enough intractable terrain, to make it feel like a playground, and not just a means to hold something inside itself. (This being the most hard to do, yet sadly, the most important.)

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Originally Posted by Delily

Do you plan on rewarding them for exploration? Because not everyone enjoys the same thing. Achievers have ALWAYS been the dominant faction of the 4 archetypes.

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What you discover though exploration is its own reward. Obviously it would have to make game designers design actual meaningful content. You don't play zelda ocarina of time because there is a reward at the end. You didn't play super mario because there were rewards (you get my point, playing a game should please you, and not be a work for which you should be paid for).

Back in 2006 to 2009, a lot of players who were raiding in world of warcraft didn't so much raid because they wanted gear, or fame for completing the content, but they wanted to discover new bosses and interesting areas in raids/dungeons.

That is something a player in FFXIV wouldn't understand, because most of FFXIV content is so underwhelming SE has to implement rewards in the game to make people play content.

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So I guess you don't like the sightseeing log? Also, you can explore in FFXIV fine. In fact, you can find some awesome things if you just look around a bit. Unless you need a tangible reward for everything you do?

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Sightseeing log isn't exploration, as it makes you go to areas you've already visited.

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Originally Posted by Lisotte

Good lord no, there's dozens of things I could go play PvP in that aren't FFXIV and plenty that aren't MMO's.

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Which is you, and I like PvP which is lacking in this game (even in a casual sense zergs are in no way fun to me or should ever be). Does not mean that they can not improve on it (which many people want just QoL changes like no GC restriction which could be implemented as a small patch and would not change anything major).

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Originally Posted by odintius

This is very telling on todays gamers then, player's expect a dumbed down content to the lowest denominator and if dev dare add any kind of depth it's a instant F2P game, how sad how far the genre has fallen, so Yoshi does have a point on it dying off slowly but surely for mmo's in general. /shrug

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Time sink/waste and dumbed down are completely two different things. Just to point out to you, hard was arcade games which where made to take your money faster (harder game more deaths, more deaths more coins for resets). There is a reason they did not last with home gaming. Time waste is a 2 year grind to max level where you hit the same mobs for a months to level to get to the next zone and hit a slightly different mob for a month.

Exploration in FFXI? How many of you went to Ifrit's Cauldron for just sightseeing? I won't take sides, but if you are holding some higher standard to FFXI's exploration then you do not have much to work off of. FFXI had it's own share of issues that gated people and influenced them to not do it. Sense of danger is fine, but FFXI was so miserable to get through certain places that you never left Jeuno/Aht Urghan Whitegate unless you had a reason to. Not to mention traversing was such a pain that people were willing to spend gil on WHM's to teleport them to areas.

Even in FFXIV 1.xx, people rather stay in town than take time to run to a certain area because they ran out of anima. People take ground/flying mounts for granted. I guarantee you people in FFXI in it's prime would of killed to get the type of accessibility that FFXIV has today. I sure as hell wish I had better accessibility when I played FFXI from 2003-2010. Its another case of rose-tinted glasses. Its fun to explore a first time, but after a while it only becomes tedious.

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Exploration in FFXI? How many of you went to Ifrit's Cauldron for just sightseeing?

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I actually did X)

But exploration was tedious in FFXI due to the XP penalty in case of death and the fact that you could easily be gibbed while exploring. Aside of that, FFXI level design was cool. The sens of danger is one thing, and the sens of adventure is one other.

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Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

FFXI never had a dangerous world. You either learned quickly how the more dangerous mobs aggroed and just avoided them or you stocked up on Silent Oil and Invisible Dust, completely trivializing any threat besides the occasional True Sight creature. I didn't play EQ very much so I can't comment on that. This is also the kind of thing that starts out fun, but it quickly becomes a tedious chore if you have to pass through the "dangerous" areas a lot.

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No danger huh? Let's see you go in 2007 to solo a T - IT mob, without a RDM. Let's see how long you last, oh and get agro from another 1 or 2 monsters, without being RDM to sleep , nuke, sleep nuke. BUT FFXI had no danger..LOL.

Adventure and Danger is dead in MMOs. MMOs are now solo Themepark Moneymaking games, sorry.

The reason for this is simple: Everquest was designed to NOT be a game, but a Virtual World. It was not made to coddle you and hold your hand.

Every encounter in the game was made to be beaten fairly, every class in the game is balanced. Every encounter has meaning and a story.

Everquest however, made encounters that were NOT balanced, classes that had advantages over other classes and designed dungeons and bosses that were seemingly impossible for players to beat. Made gear that was powerful and meant to be abused.

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Originally Posted by Asierid

This. Finally, someone with a realistic outlook on how things used to be compared to today without all this extra crap in an attempt to fluff up what was now (In the grand scheme of things) a terrible idea.

This is like people talking about how a Gremlin was a bad ass car and deserves a ton of praise compared to the typical Toyota Corolla of today.

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That is not realistic, that is selfish. You think just because one persons life changed that doesn't mean millions of others peoples lives change in the same way.

Jesus people. You pull the I don't have time for that card, I have family, work, stuff all the damn time. Games, MMOs, they have always been a TIME commitment. Do you remember yourself when you didn't have all these responsibilities and would spend hours beating that optional boss in the game? That's because the game required hours of gameplay! You complain you don't have the time to commit to a game, then why the flying chocobo are you playing? You want everything accommodated to you, why not play a game specifically made for your type of market? There is PLENTY of them. The market is saturated with all those crappy games. Just like you tell people to go play other games why don't you take your own advice then?


MMOs are not like in the past because players got used to the eased gameplay, there is no one to blame but devs who started doing so and players who started getting spoiled. That's what happens when people get spoiled, they will whine about being too hard or tedious to do because they are used to the nowdays market that started *devolving* thanks to them. It's like if you were forced to stop using your smart phone and had to revert to a normal cellphone. People would complain about not being able to type on the screen, not being able to use whatsapp, not being able to play 3D games. People would complain about the lack of color variety, the resolution, etc. Whatever it is, people would complain about something, because they got used to the ease. Did people complain before when phones didn't have these things? No, because they didn't know it was possible. They worked with what they had, The market itself has made people believe that they NEED all these new shinies.

Except that's a tool. Tools are made for convenience, to make life easier (and lazier) for people. A game is not a damn tool, it's entertainment. You don't like exploring a ROLE PLAYING GAME, a genre that's been all about developing your character AND exploring the world your character lives in. Then why are you playing this?! Why not go watch a movie instead, you just have to sit down without having to move a finger?

Well great, games have reached a mainstream audience and they are probably doing much more money than before. Good for the Devs, bad for actual gaming. Then people complain that all MMOs are the same now and there's nothing creative or innovative in the market, well to whom do they owe that to? MMOs are in decline and they don't have a very brilliant future(and no, Oculus Rift isn't exactly a brilliant future, specially when people don't want to have to move even ingame) exactly because of this.

You find everything tedious, you just want to sit down there and not have to move your fingers much. Why can't a MMORPG have exploration?! Some people actually like that! Just like you like not having to walk anywhere, there's people that like that and it has nothing to do with "staying in the past" the hell people? Is it the age? You've grown old physically and therefore you have to grow old mentally, too? Games are supposed to be fun! The games you played before were about the fun, exploration, danger. That's what made them fun. And don't tell me it isn't because then why would people have complained about FF13 being too linear with no open world to explore? Why is FFXV now completely the opposite and open world? Maybe because of the FF13 complaints? Would you have found games fun back then if they were easy pie? Could you imagine the same fun with a super easy Mario? Honestly, would you have? This game is so watered down already that it's bland. Do people telling others to "go play FFXI" even care about the game or the game industry at all? That's the worst possible way to grow a community.

There's people with a lot of responsibilities (yes, work, family, etc) who still make time to play and don't whine about things being tedious because god forbids you actually have to PLAY the game. If you can't manage your time that is your problem, but don't make it a game's problem.

You have your very convenient teleports so you can have your own "fun", let people who want the game to be more interesting by letting them have exploration too, as long as you don't have to do it, it doesn't affect you in ANY way. They are customers just like you.

The more I read the OF, the more I want to bang my head against the table. I love the game and want to see it become better, but this community leaves a lot to be desired. I am not a rude nor aggressive person but I've just had enough of people bringing gamers down because they'd like something implemented, telling them to take off their tinted rose glasses, telling them to go play other games, telling them to stop being in the past, belittling them for wanting something different to spice up the game. What you do is very offending, so don't feel offended if you get posts like mine. How you treat others is the way you will be treated. Have some damn respect towards others if you want respect back.

I already know what kind of excuses people are going to post towards the subjective "fun" because they sound like a broken record "fun does not equal tedious, therefore it is no funnnn (funny enough the current dungeon grinding is tedious as well but these same people don't complain about that, eh? Why not?)", so I'll just save myself a headache and leave it as it is.

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Originally Posted by justinjarjar

Time sink/waste and dumbed down are completely two different things. Just to point out to you, hard was arcade games which where made to take your money faster (harder game more deaths, more deaths more coins for resets). There is a reason they did not last with home gaming. Time waste is a 2 year grind to max level where you hit the same mobs for a months to level to get to the next zone and hit a slightly different mob for a month.

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Time sinks is in every game to extent the content of particular game and that helps developer for a mmo aspect to create other content not just the $$$ aspect while we go threw said time sink, you can create depth without dumbing it down its called having creative talent.

Dungeons are the same grind just to point that out, you also are hitting the same mob for experience get to next dungeon to hit a slightly different mob same results but in an instance. These are the options we have currently people are asking for more of a variety of those options beside just hitting same mobs in open world >.> <FATES> <.< with there own reward sets in the end were going to be hitting some type of mob.

There are reasonable time sinks, and then there are dumb time sinks. Taking an unreasonable amount of time reaching your destination due to meandering/fighting enemies follows the latter. It doesn't encourage exploration, it encourages pissing and moaning.

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Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

FFXI never had a dangerous world. You either learned quickly how the more dangerous mobs aggroed and just avoided them or you stocked up on Silent Oil and Invisible Dust, completely trivializing any threat besides the occasional True Sight creature. I didn't play EQ very much so I can't comment on that. This is also the kind of thing that starts out fun, but it quickly becomes a tedious chore if you have to pass through the "dangerous" areas a lot.

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true sight were a joke *run behind* /poke /slap /laugh *mob turns around* <death> <you can have this> ! T_T


1 thing is dangerous world and another is annoying as hell world , the 1 is nearly impossible to create w/o the 2nd

All the dangerous mmos are based around the idea that DEATH hurts (be it exp loss , exp debt , or just having to travel for 15 min to go back where u were )

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

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Yes the game has evolved with society. No one wants the grind that turned many off of FF11 there is a reason I did not play mmo's till WoW, I wanted fun 30-2 hour fun not sit and grind to feel like I did nothing. The whole spoiled argument is a tired and true argument that is used to repress youth (which has shown that people are not dumber or more entitled just different). I simply put that in this current market old school mmo's would not sell, and probably will not come back in a major way (thank you indie developers for bringing back some old school games). What you are asking for is not a change of player base, but a change of the industry, which I wish you good luck, that is a long up hill battle. No one should be saying that some people like the old school and that it should no longer exist, just that a game set in the current market has no reason to move in that direction. I can get a lost done with one dungeon a day with he current system. That is perfect for me and many others who consume this product. The point of people saying go back to FF11 is that game is of the old era (when game developers still thought that only male teens played video games) that people want to move on from. (since so many counterarguments are FF11 had it which is a game that does not appeal to many of the FF14 gamers). You also act like even a less dedicated gamer is not a "true gamer" which is not true. They just have different time commitments. Welcome to the age where a 39 year old woman can get a positive experience with the same game as a 15 year old boy. I do not get what you mean by devolution, what are we reverting to? You have a right to care and you seem to, so figure out what you can do to help. Maybe start coming up with new ideas that the current market could use, or get a degree in computer programming and spend hours of your day making the game that you want. Welcome to business or what adults have been calling the real world for decades, not everything is right, it just needs to make money.

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Originally Posted by odintius

Time sinks is in every game to extent the content of particular game and that helps developer for a mmo aspect to create other content not just the $$$ aspect while we go threw said time sink, you can create depth without dumbing it down its called having creative talent.

Dungeons are the same grind just to point that out, you also are hitting the same mob for experience get to next dungeon to hit a slightly different mob same results but in an instance. These are the options we have currently people are asking for more of a variety of those options beside just hitting same mobs in open world >.> <FATES> <.< with there own reward sets in the end were going to be hitting some type of mob.

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However it takes less time out of my day (I can do one dungeon a day and some alex normal on weekends) and I can see the change (the pay off of hard work can be seen ask someone out of cancer research about not seeing progress it can lead to depression). I agree fates are not my idea of fun and I only do dungeon runs I like grouping with friends and meeting new people. (I'll do fates in a zone once in a while to see some fates I have not done yet I will admit). However at the end of the day FF11 was a niche market since many people did not enjoy the huge grind to level even (why do you think wow did so well?).

By the way "creative talent"...... have you made art on commission? After a while you hit these holes where your creative well is dry, it happens to even great artists. You start to sound like Mozart who died in an unmark grave poor for a reason (he did not understand that not everyone can be god sometimes people need breaks try studying that music period and see what real commissioned art was :P)

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Originally Posted by justinjarjar

However it takes less time out of my day (I can do one dungeon a day and some alex normal on weekends) and I can see the change (the pay off of hard work can be seen ask someone out of cancer research about not seeing progress it can lead to depression). I agree fates are not my idea of fun and I only do dungeon runs I like grouping with friends and meeting new people. (I'll do fates in a zone once in a while to see some fates I have not done yet I will admit). However at the end of the day FF11 was a niche market since many people did not enjoy the huge grind to level even (why do you think wow did so well?

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That why I said options meaning it a choice to do them not a requirement if implemented correctly you still can do your normal things you like and other people can do alternative god forbid adding variety to a game which leads to the same conclusion #endgame. You have a diverse group of people your not going to please everyone so that should stop them form implementing anything creative or different, because X person doesn't like what Y person likes or Z person and so and so forth nope fates/dungeon that it everyone else gtfo.

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Originally Posted by odintius

That why I said options meaning it a choice to do them not a requirement if implemented correctly you still can do your normal things you like and other people can do alternative god forbid adding variety to a game which leads to the same conclusion #endgame. You have a diverse group of people your not going to please everyone so that should stop them form implementing anything creative or different, because X person doesn't like what Y person likes or Z person and so and so forth nope fates/dungeon that it everyone else gtfo.

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Time spent on X could be used on Y and more people use Y so Y makes more money.... Welcome to business. In current climate MMO's, overworld will probably not see anything like FF11 ever. More people are into either A. Raiding and progression, or B. having a nice 30-hour a day (if that) game. I agree their are other types of players that would love their type of content to get more focused on (heck if they came up with new cool zones that added story every patch I would be all for it more casual exploration fer me since I do not raid) if it is not the direction that the devs think it should go (right now they want a consent stream more casual dungs and story raids and hard raider raids for everyone to focus on.) So in a way yes if more people like X and Y, Z gets booted. Devs got to focus on something or no one will get anything.

No ones wants are wrong, just the communities wants go above peoples wants. Sounds like you liked FF11 and maybe someone will make an updated version of it. The old school lose exp and hard to even walk through zones are find more of a turn off than on for most people at this time. The scene is allows evolving on what people want and even then it will not move quickly (only move at the speed of bureaucracy huehuehue).

People tend to be very passionate about these subjects (which is why the large backlash by people) but you need to look at the bigger picture why would SE do it? (and no because I like it is not a reason, looking at you pvp)

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

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You make a game that requires a time commitment each night out of you, you lose an incredible amount of numbers. This is a game that aims at both hardcore and casual and it owes nothing to the people who like to spend 6-7 hours a night on their game.

Sounds like y'all need to contact From Software and get them to make a Souls MMO. but i'm sure even that would be "too easy" for most of you...

It isn't just about op type of content but other types I it think people are assuming if they implement X feature it somehow will require them to to do it, like hunts I personnel hate them I still play this game though because it doesn't effective me in the least in progression if I don't do them and that was my choice. If they only focus on one thing like we currently getting it will get old and stale fast the game for 2.0 is still young and already people asking to change things up a bit nothing drastic the bigger picture is give it awhile of the same old over and over like mention ppl will move on to something else, that when you'll see an actual money business module in effect and start to see changes not because they can't focus on more then just couple features that people are asking for but bc of $$$.

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Originally Posted by odintius

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It is time and money, we have ahd some of the best content per month rate of any mmo I have ever seen (and many have pointed this out). They also have at least airship zoned stuff and who knows what else (more GS stuff prob and they talked about more PvP stuff) coming. Just give it time the changes are slow and as long as content comes up (even if you feel like it is just the same and not worth doing which I think you don't) then the game is going in the right direction, as has been said a good chunk of open world has a major problems in the current climate and system currently set up.

Also the expansion has just started no one should look at launch as the idea of what the expansion is look at what they add and how fast it is added. (how most people review games)

Time will tell on that front, but as i see it if more the same old same old nothing new and are we going to fly on those airship or is it just your Free company leader sending it out on click board and reap the rewards when it returns or are we actually going to said location as a free company to do X?

As for pvp it just sad not even interested in it anymore and i've seen some f2p module have some the best content of any mmo as many have said in other forums as well and offers more. Don't get me wrong I like the game and certain content and story, but I would like more not same thing over and over and over.

If you want it to be dangerous running around open world, just equip some lvl1 gear and run around heavensward areas for a bit. Or change to a class that is like lvl 15 or something. Challenge accepted? Stuff would be a challenge is you weren't prancing around in ilvl 180+ gear.