4-month patch cycle was a lie. It's almost 4.5 months now.

Am I supposed to be bothered?

It's not as if I'm sat here twiddling my thumbs for those extra 10 days each patch cycle.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deo14

So why are you immediately jumping to hyperboles and claim that we want to make this game another Lost Ark or D4?

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Because that's what it sounds like. Grinds are specific activities that you spam over and over again and that is not fun. I want activities that over variation and are easily achievable. Me having to do a dungeon or a raid multiple times is not my idea of fun

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Because that's what it sounds like. Grinds are specific activities that you spam over and over again and that is not fun. I want activities that over variation and are easily achievable. Me having to do a dungeon or a raid multiple times is not my idea of fun

---

Please, you need to help me out and tell me what comment made you think that. I re-read whole thread, I still cannot find any post where anyone said something that remotely sounds like they want Lost Ark level of grind. Just send a quote of it so that we're on the same page and can potentially discuss something.

And if you want activities which are easily achievable, then for like 4th time, dungeons, trials, V&C, whatever, any EW content that isn't savage falls into this category. Is that not enough for you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deo14

Please, you need to help me out and tell me what comment made you think that. I re-read whole thread, I still cannot find any post where anyone said something that remotely sounds like they want Lost Ark level of grind. Just send a quote of it so that we're on the same page and can potentially discuss something.

And if you want activities which are easily achievable, then for like 4th time, dungeons, trials, V&C, whatever, any EW content that isn't savage falls into this category. Is that not enough for you?

---

Exactly there is already so much content that is casual and doesnt require massive grinds/timesinks there is no reason to deny a grind that last at least the duration of a 4 month patch

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

"How dare people suggest grinds in a genre known for grinds go play others games and stay out of my game." Im so sorry for wanting a mmo to play like a mmo and not want it to play like a single player ff game.

---

Funny that this sentiment is what those other playerbases have been criticizing for. I'm sure if they saw your comment they'd roll their eyes over how shortsighted it is.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Exactly there is already so much content that is casual and doesnt require massive grinds/timesinks there is no reason to deny a grind that last at least the duration of a 4 month patch

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No content in the history of this game has ever lasted for that long.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Why is “I don’t like the direction of the game and want to make a valid complaint” never an option for you people

It’s

1) suck it up

2) leave

Do you understand how customer feedback works, we are the customer here

---

We're the customer, but we're not in charge. Square Enix is. They make the decisions.

Our power as a customer is to pay for products/services we like and feel give us value for our money. It is also to stop paying for products/services that don't meet our standards. It is our money that influences the provider in the end, not our words.

By all means leave feedback when you're unhappy with a product/service. Repeating that same feedback multiple times a week for several weeks isn't more effective than leaving it once them moving on to other things.

It also seems like a strange place to leave feedback when many posters are convinced that SE pays no attention the NA forums at all. There are other avenues for providing feedback and they don't require having an active paid subscription.

I know that WoW is an annoying subject around here but the WoD flying fiasco is an excellent example of the power that players have when they unite and cancel their subscription. That's when developers will take notice of the feedback that has been given all along. That is when change players feel is needed will happen.


You've left your feedback here in the forums. It's time for the next step. Unsub. Get your friends who feel the same way to unsub. Get them to get their other friends who feel the same way to unsub. Reach out to those who connect with other players across the world who feel the same way and get them to unsub. Keep leaving your feedback on social media, on Twitch, on YouTube, on other platforms that won't censor your opinion. You don't need an active subscription to leave feedback in those places.

Unite to create a single loud voice that SE can't avoid hearing if you are serious about your concerns. Together you can make a difference.

Either they announce changes for 7.0 that will satisfy everyone that it will be worth returning to the game.

Or they don't, and all of you will know that this truly is no longer the game for you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

No content in the history of this game has ever lasted for that long.

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I been playing since arr released and back then things did last an entire patch. Some of the relic steps took me an entire patch to finish and i was going pretty hardcore on it back then. You seem very combative towards suggestions of people wanting actual grinds and acusing people of wanting lost ark and diablo levels of grinds.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I been playing since arr released and back then things did last an entire patch. Some of the relic steps took me an entire patch to finish and i was going pretty hardcore on it back then. You seem very combative towards suggestions of people wanting actual grinds and acusing people of wanting lost ark and diablo levels of grinds.

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I don't know. I'm not really sure that the Hildibrand relic weapons are anywhere near as popular as the ones for previous expansions. I certainly wouldn't want to play through a daily grind for months in order to get one.

"Just play other games if you don't like it."

*players pull their subscriptions and quit enmasse, game's marketboard grinds to a halt taking incentive to craft with it, queues die, vicious cycle of friends quitting because their friends quit, causing their friends to also quit, once active community based free companies dry up, towns and cities are emptier and less enticing to free trial players who also can't do anything on their own (make a party, send /tells, etc.) except queue up and cry when it takes so long that they have to use Trusts in a multiplayer game, and the cbu3 boys are forced to sit down with the shareholders and explain why their cash money cow lost 30% of their player base in a month and a half*

"W-Wait no, not like that haha"

The grind until Summer 2024 is gonna be rough if we're not getting regular events to tide us over, that's all I'm saying. I'm already mentally prepping to lose my house 'cause once I do the new alliance raid in 6.5 there won't be any reason to justify 15 a month for 9ish months of no content. That's 135 dollars I could've spent on 2 nice games, or a really sick keyboard, or a new pair of headphones or something.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Koros

Remember when people were saying "what's another 2 weeks"? Now it's another 2.5 weeks. And like a frog in slowly heated water, the players don't realize this gradual change.

Who else is excited for 5-month patch cycles in 7.x!!!

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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F23hYgaX...jpg&name=small

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I would agree with this if only for the fact that you're forgetting that Shb only real content was Bozja and even then that was just watered down but digestible version of Eureka with 2 zones compared to the 4.

They all suck anyway but Shb had less variety in its content than EW. What standards are we comparing with Shadowbringers?

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If we're counting quality of content then Endwalker hasn't had a patch since it came out.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deo14

Mind telling me your calculations? Did you count .55 as major patch?
2.0 was released in 27/8/2013, 6.4 in 23/5/2023, that's 3556 days.

Major patches are :
2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 2.4, 2.5,
3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.3, 3.4, 3.5,
4.0, 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, 4.4, 4.5,
5.0, 5.1, 5.2, 5.3, 5.4, 5.5,
6.0, 6.1, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4 = 28 patches

Average between each patch, including X.5 to Y.0, is 127 days. In-expansion patches have average of 118. This is of course, assuming that ChatGPT gave me right release dates and I didn't do mistakes:

https://i.imgur.com/1uIW7SK.png

Before someone gets the misconception that I'm demanding that devs hurry up or whatever, I'm just pointing out the fact that patches do take longer, even longer than they said they will, while quality is noticeably worse. Right now EW is at worse pace than even ShB's Covid pace for some reason, and content doesn't reflect the added time to it. The "they take more time to check everything is working" doesn't even apply, EW patches do lack QA, as we can see from numerous bugs EW had. I'm not trying to bring the game down, I just want to have back the better standards, instead of settling on mediocrity.

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Your missing the biggest time space I said to 7.0. Which adds 395+ more days to 29 patches. Which just has a seasonal release date. Your number is at almost 4.2 months already. We are literally in the same month your roughly second week and I am end week or start of next.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

Your missing the biggest time space I said to 7.0. Which adds 395+ more days to 29 patches. Which just has a seasonal release date. Your number is at almost 4.2 months already. We are literally in the same month your roughly second week and I am end week or start of next.

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I don't include release dates that we don't know. And 7.0 would be 30th patch, you didn't account for 6.5. I know that it feels like we should be halfway through 6.5 by this time, but we're still just in 6.4.

But if you want to use uncertain release dates, then if 6.5 is scheduled for early october and 7.0 for early summer, then let's use 10.10.2023 for 6.5 and 14.7.2024 (1/4 into the summer) for 7.0, then we would still get to average of ~4.352 months per patch, which is still far from the 5 months as you suggest. This average would climb to your suggested 5 months only if 7.0 released in spring of 2026.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

serious case of Stockholms Syndrome that I'm legit worried that you need to go sick a psychiatrist for help.

---

Please remember to report these comments for being insulting and harassing.

I definitely wouldn't mind some more midcore grinds, with some worthwhile rewards. More mounts, glam, hairs, etc.. I'd like to be able to play at endgame a bit more. Stuff like that would help with patch lulls. There is a balance to be made when it comes to a grind.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheNight

Please remember to report these comments for being insulting and harassing.

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They been combative and insulting toward people who dare to suggest the game have a single piece of content that has even a little bit of a grind for people that enjoy having a grind in a mmo.

It's the way of the English forums. Being insulting, and combatitive is the norm around here.

Reality is that no matter what we say, or suggest, that nothing short of a mass exodus will cause anything to change in regards to the longer patch cycles, and patches containing less content overall.

The problem is, that a mass exodus is not coming for FFXIV. Trying to convince the playerbase to stage a mass exodus I need not say is a futile endeavor. This game, even through its biggest content drought can limp by on casuals who stick around for player generated content, essentially acting as a VR chat alternative. These types of players don't care about content droughts as long as they periodically get new furnishings or event glamours, and with Dawntrail announced, you can expect them to stick around for even longer. It takes a perfect storm to brew up a mass exodus of players from an MMO. Disasterous game-breaking changes, Controversies with key figures involved with the company, or years worth of poorly recieved expansions. Pick two, and have a public figure announce their departure from the game, and you've got the makings of a serious player bleed off.

Yes, FFXIV will bleed players - But never in a capacity to raise any eyebrows. Remember, its not only sub money that keeps this MMO alive, but money also generated through the ingame store and no matter how upset we are on the forums, the casuals who keep this game alive will continue playing, and paying in blissfull ignorance of any real issues around them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Archeron

It's the way of the English forums. Being insulting, and combatitive is the norm around here.

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bro you really shouldn't talk when you invited your fc member to pile in to join arguments

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Koros

bro you really shouldn't talk when you invited your fc member to pile in to join arguments

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they made a good point and thats all you can come back with? considering how many alt characters you have that you actually yourself post under, I would have thought it wouldnt have bothered you. thin skin I suppose...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

person with hateboner for SHB rants and raves about how terrible optional grinds are

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You know, if you don't like grinds you can just... not do them? Things like the relic grind are not required in any way. If you don't like grinds, then just don't do them, that's not a complex concept to grasp. But that's not what this is about, is it? You just want the rewards for free with none of the content 'baggage' attached. We get it, you people hate MMOs. Your ilk already ruined this expansion's relic 'grind', stop trying to change an MMO into a single player game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Why does everyone treat it as a personal attack when someone says they want grinds and not want an mmo to play like a single player game.

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The answer:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

Most gamers now want instant rewards and gratification and handed things then sit in limsa rather then actually do content and grind.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Archeron

The problem is, that a mass exodus is not coming for FFXIV.

---

A mass exodus occurs every 4 months, about a day or two after the new patch drops and people have finished their MSQ.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kes13a

they made a good point and thats all you can come back with?

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They didn't make a good point, so they didn't get a good response. Everything they said was either very obvious or dangerously close to making me take another shot for the drinking game.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

You know, if you don't like grinds you can just... not do them? Things like the relic grind are not required in any way. If you don't like grinds, then just don't do them, that's not a complex concept to grasp. But that's not what this is about, is it? You just want the rewards for free with none of the content 'baggage' attached. We get it, you people hate MMOs. Your ilk already ruined this expansion's relic 'grind', stop trying to change an MMO into a single player game.



The answer:





A mass exodus occurs every 4 months, about a day or two after the new patch drops and people have finished their MSQ.



They didn't make a good point, so they didn't get a good response. Everything they said was either very obvious or dangerously close to making me take another shot for the drinking game.

---

Its not about liking grinds is just that GRINDS in of itself are an outdated rpg concept. There is no fun to have having to do the same activity repeatedly because its an obvious padding mechanic to prolong a part of the game or a piece of content. This is a fact; actually you and others saying that grinds are good are pretty much indoctrinated with terrible gaming design.

Actually honestly just having to do a little bit isnt that bad. Like maybe having to run the same instance 2 or 3 times at most. But having to do like 7 or 10 or so for them is just awful. Im sure nobody ever said "GEE WILIKER I SURE DO LOVE RUNNING ANTITOWER AND DELIBRUM REGINAE MULTIPLE TIMES FOR THE SAME GOSH DARN ITEM". Good Content my ass...

^ill run DRN for no reason on the regular because it’s better designed content than anything EW gave us thank you very much

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

A mass exodus occurs every 4 months, about a day or two after the new patch drops and people have finished their MSQ.

---

It's an expected loss of players, there is always an ebb, and flow of people coming into and out of the game for fresh patches.

The ingame shop whales will more then make up for the loss of those players whenever they add another $34 mount that some intern made in a week. FFXIV needs to see a noticeable dip in revenue, that will make Yoshi P panic, and make Square Enix executives raise an eyebrow. Right now, they're very happy with how the game is going. They're spending less, delivering less, and making a killing off of this game, and the people we need to help us think we're insane and they will blindly love FFXIV, regardless of its flaws.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kes13a

they made a good point and thats all you can come back with? considering how many alt characters you have that you actually yourself post under, I would have thought it wouldnt have bothered you. thin skin I suppose...

---

Some trolls deserve to starve under a bridge. Feed him no attention.

I like having variety of Lost Actions to mess around with and play in one from multiple different ways on any jobs I pick, whether it's to be that silly overpowered Glare Machine Gun, that goblin fast WAR, or tanking drunkard DNC.

If you tell me to run DRN---or any same content 255 times on a vanilla Glare Mage, I'd be bored too. Oh wait, isn't that what EW relic feels like if you spam 90s dungeons and/or hunt trains? lmao.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Archeron

Some trolls deserve to starve under a bridge. Feed him no attention.

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I agree, but I also find you too funny to try and starve you and your puppet account of a friend of attention.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

You know, if you don't like grinds you can just... not do them?

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They do like grinds, they literally did the MSQ like five times, that really tells you how much they should be ignored

I mean the literal producer of the MMO was pulled to make FF16 which was an extremely strange choice. It led to a very poorly thought out itemization system as he was pulled between 2 major projects.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CStrife912

You can actively look at a spreadsheet of what stormblood offered release to post patch, shadowbringers to post and Endwalker to post and EW has way more stuff packed in and released variety-wise (Stormblood got more towards Eureka that was a bigger point) the issue is reasons to run it...if they nailed it I have a feeling people would be far more optimistic about it all. Relic sure could still use an area or something but if it went more HW than tome farming then even that would be better received. However resources are finite, they're doing a visual update, and they are making an Xbox port (which isn't straightforward forward especially with the Series S being a necessity when it comes to releasing anything on Xbox)

If they gave an in depth resource allocation document of what they have to play with showing where they choose to apply it, in EW case it was applied more in PvP reworks, Island Sanctuary, QoL more so then ever before, duty support (including trial, dungeon, castrum, prae, westwind, steps of faith reworks, flying in ARR etc etc) Sure people will view Duty support making it more a single player game and I disagree really. The further we get away from ARR the harder it is for people especially DPS on say non packed servers to queue for stuff. Duty Support will at least let them get through a good majority of the game and then they can DF the trials when they pop.

But yeah people say 'it seems its too hard for them to put out content' its not, their approach seems to be providing for multiple player types and tidying up the foundations to try and entice more players to try the game. Other MMOs don't really cover all bases or clean up their beginnings they keep focusing on the end which yeah its great for someone like me, but I would rather take the loss for a year or so if it meant new players got a better experience it 'should' pay dividends down the line.

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I find it hard to believe EW has way more content than SB. SB had hard mode dungeons, 2 Ultimates, 4 relic zones, a relic dungeon, 2 extra trials(yojimbo and rathalos), a new housing district, relic armor, primal weapons for the new jobs(Both ShB and EW didn’t even give the new jobs previous primal weapons), diving, spear fishing, the list goes on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

I agree, but I also find you too funny to try and starve you and your puppet account of a friend of attention.

---

I don't blame them for being envious of my friend. Default is a lovely person, when you're not busy insulting her for existing, or sending people to message my FC members ingame. I welcome having an entourage bump topics I'm interested in straight to the top, and then keep them there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Archeron

I don't blame them for being envious of my friend. Default is a lovely person, when you're not busy insulting her for existing, or sending people to message my FC members ingame. I welcome having an entourage bump topics I'm interested in straight to the top, and then keep them there.

---

remember to report brigading

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Archeron

I don't blame them for being envious of my friend. Default is a lovely person, when you're not busy insulting her for existing, or sending people to message my FC members ingame. I welcome having an entourage bump topics I'm interested in straight to the top, and then keep them there.

---

So you're admitting to brigading then. I don't think anyone is envious of you having a friend. I have plenty of friends myself, but even when I show them threads on the forums, I don't get them to come in to back me up and parrot my points. Why? Because that's cringe.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Koros

remember to report brigading

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It has been done.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It does seem longer. SE did say that they were also taking breaks for holidays, but they aren't very clear about which holidays and when.

---

With patch cycles this long, every patch will have some sort of holiday in there somewhere. Hence, they always have an excuse!

The reason given for the widening of the patch cycle is there being more jobs and races than when the game started; they have more equipment to tailor for different body types.
I feel like why should gameplay content be held up for fashion? Just reuse old gear designs with slight alterations more often to keep things moving. The fashion choices are huge at this point anyway.

I'll use PSO2:NGS again as an example of different design philosophies. They just dropped a new content type with no fanfare on a minor patch, made completely out of old assets with old enemies, but it's a totally new kind of endgame activity that's good enough to be our new daily routine.

You spawn into an area divided into many different rooms, each one assigned a different buff reward. You need to decide which buffs you want to prioritize and clear those rooms before the time runs out. Some rooms have waves of enemies, some have puzzles, some have bosses. Once the timer is over, you carry over any buffs you managed to bank into the next phase where you fight a challenging boss under certain conditions, again with a strict time limit.

Each day the boss cycles to a different one and different restrictions on players like -75% max HP. You earn a new kind of gear upgrade item, and a rare chance of a powerful weapon drop. It's interesting and put together with low resource cost, a new gameplay type made of old assets.

It's the polar opposite of FF XIV dungeons that have a high resource cost with beautiful new art, new enemies, new music, but completely cookie-cutter gameplay that adds nothing new, basically a high effort reskin of the last 50 dungeons we got.

^the funny thing is 14 does have one raid that does this exact thing, T2, and T2 before we learned we could cheese it was a damn well designed fight (most of coils besides 3, 4 and 5 were fight me)

The thing that really makes me sad about this game is basically every time someone suggests something another MMO has or something they wish 14 had 99 times out of 100 it’s something 14 used to have and removed (or made completely redundant a la T2 because even MINE that fight is a joke now)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rufalus

The reason given for the widening of the patch cycle is there being more jobs and races than when the game started; they have more equipment to tailor for different body types.

---

I highly doubt, that more jobs and races is so time consuming, that it slows down the patch cycles significantly. Because the development tools are also getting better und many things can be done automaticly.



Cheers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Larirawiel

I highly doubt, that more jobs and races is so time consuming, that it slows down the patch cycles significantly. Because the development tools are also getting better und many things can be done automaticly.



Cheers

---

Not to mention like i stated previously, new jobs don’t seem to have nearly as much effort put into them as in the last. Samurai and Red mage released in SB with all level 50/60/70 primal weapons and unique ultimate weapon models. Dancer and Gunbreaker got 0 primal weapons on release and still don’t have the 50/60/70 ones AND their ultimate models were just either reused shire weapon for dancer and reused dungeon weapon for gunbreaker. Sage and Reaper also have no primal weapons outside of the knights of the round one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I find it hard to believe EW has way more content than SB. SB had hard mode dungeons, 2 Ultimates, 4 relic zones, a relic dungeon, 2 extra trials(yojimbo and rathalos), a new housing district, relic armor, primal weapons for the new jobs(Both ShB and EW didn’t even give the new jobs previous primal weapons), diving, spear fishing, the list goes on.

---

Don't forget that they introduced Bluemage and the Glamour Dresser in Stormblood as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rufalus

The reason given for the widening of the patch cycle is there being more jobs and races than when the game started; they have more equipment to tailor for different body types.
I feel like why should gameplay content be held up for fashion? Just reuse old gear designs with slight alterations more often to keep things moving. The fashion choices are huge at this point anyway.

---

This is also complete nonsense that needs correction every time I see it.

We know that all gear is designed for roughly 5 different body types (in extremely rare cases for more), those being Lalafell, male Midlander, male Highlander, female Midlander and male Roegadyn, the rest is done through bone scaling.
Every female character, except Lalafell, uses the female midlander body.
Lalafell use the...well, Lalafell body. Sometimes it's split into male and female but those two are pretty much identical.
Male Roegadyn and Hrothgar use the male Roegadyn body.
Every other male uses either the Midlander or Highlander body.


Outside of very few exceptions they are not making any hats or helmets for Hrothgar or Viera, so I ask you, where is this extra work on equipment coming from when everything is made for the exact same races we've had since Heavensward?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Larirawiel

I highly doubt, that more jobs and races is so time consuming, that it slows down the patch cycles significantly. Because the development tools are also getting better und many things can be done automaticly.



Cheers

---

Refer to my spoilered post.

The whole "due to covid we gotta do one dungeon per patch" - excuse also lost alot of its charm didn't it? ~

Quote:

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Originally Posted by IckeDerTyp

The whole "due to covid we gotta do one dungeon per patch" - excuse also lost alot of its charm didn't it? ~

---

I'm not defending, but I don't think that Covid and 1 dungeon per patch are even related. I'm fairly sure that 1 dungeon per patch was announced long before Covid. If memory serves me correctly it was actually announced before the launch of 5.0.