Summoner 7.0 Wishlist

Make Physick scale with INT as well as MIND.

Make Carbuncle do something other than stare at you all fight, or untie Radiant Aegis and make it an optional cosmetic summon that does nothing might work.

New Summon, my pick would be Odin.

If we keep Carbuncle more glamours would be nice, we have 2 unusable Carbuncles so that's a start but maybe frogs could be neat ... or a mop or even a floating weapon.

A nitpick but could we make Aethercharge make ruin instant cast so its not so jarring going back to lower level.

Any reason Slipstream needs to have a cast time? (I might just be picky)

*Edit*
I have thought about it and this is what I'd change
Remove Carbuncle (it gets in the way)
I want Odin
Split Phoenix and Bahamut, they share cooldowns and you get to chose what you want dps or heal
Remove Physick if Phoenix split happens or let it scale with INT (couldn't care less what they do with Resurrection remove or keep)
Instead of how we summon now how about we (the Summoner) disappear like other Final Fantasy game into another dimension and we get to control our summons
Change Ifrit to be pure melee, we have a gap closer ... lets use it.

That's what I want, what would you pick/change?

Remove Physick and Resurrection from Summoner

Reintroduce casts again.

Add Resources to manage. (eg: Ruin IV stack)

Make rotation less Gemshine spam. Therefore introducing alternative skills or escamotage to avoid its compulsive use.

Make the carbuncle free from demi-summons. (effectively solving the real problem of the carbuncle: ghosting)

Make the carbuncle manageable again from its positioning to its abilities.

Make Bahamut and Phoenix different from each other (As it was in shB. The feeling of the two summons was really different, now they are the same story colored differently).

Make Titan and Garuda different from each other: the cast times, speed and gameplay.

Make the rotation less rigid, especially have a meaningful way to delay the burst phases.

Make the fact that the Aethercharge remains even if the elemental disappears useful. (I believe it has potential, but is currently untapped due to the inherent nature of the extremely rigid rotation that the smn has.)

Add a new elemental summon, perhaps one that justifies ifrit's mini melee combo. Therefore also giving him melee abilities that it can use in combos with ifrit (if the player wants).

Make the progression of the smn less stale, giving it a real sense of progression and not just changing the colors and potency of gemshine. or at least remove it from level 1 classes.

Remove Painflare and Energy siphon and then balance Energy drain and Fester. They are redundant skills (especially for an ogcd with 60s cd).

Add different cds (aka add also 15/30s cds, 60s only its too boring).

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if the smn goes back to being a caster (therefore not be the privileged cousin of the rdm):

Make Physick scaled to INT.

Add an additional serious TP.

Add an aoe shield.

Move EF to an unlockable ogcd after phoenix

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Pls, I don't need more spectacular vfx that turns into Gemshine spam, I need the entire job to be juicier.

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Originally Posted by Nizzi

Remove Physick and Resurrection from Summoner

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There is no way someone puts a better suggestion than this in the thread

+1 on Physick scaling with Intelligence, if they’re going to leave it with Summoner.

Would also like if Carbuncle contributed instead of sitting around waiting for you to use Radiant Aegis lol. Even if it’s just something as simple as using Wind Blade as an auto-attack. I think giving Carbuncle should act as the ‘utility’ Summoner, so giving it one or two more helpful/supportive abilities would help make it feel less like a minion that follows you into combat. They could make them all share charges so there’s some actual decision making. Obvious issue there though is that Carbuncle disappears like 75% of the time lol so you’d be locked in/out of them constantly.

I’m mostly ambivalent on ‘what summon to get next’, in that I’d be happy with anything really. That said, I’d like Shiva and Ramuh to be added first personally, since when I think of Summoner I always think of ‘Ifrit / Shiva / Ramuh’ as like the bread/butter of a Final Fantasy Summoner.

Egi glamours all I’d ask for is Moogle lol; it’d make more sense as a glamour for the fairy, but I’d take one for Summoner too. I mean, it does appear as a summon in various ff games, so it wouldn’t be too out there lol.

For the last part I kind of like Slipstream having a cast time. There’s already a scarce amount of actual casted spells for Summoner so I’d like to keep any we have lol. Plus, deciding whether to Swiftcast to put it under raid buffs or hard cast and keep Swiftcast for Ifrit phase is one of the only things Summoner has to really consider, and I feel like that’d be gone if Slipstream was an instant cast.

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Originally Posted by Nizzi

Remove Physick and Resurrection from Summoner

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This. Maybe SMN could have kept it with its old kit, but they should have been tossed with the rework. It's too strong now for how approachable it is to play at an effective level; it's making RDM and BLM be chosen shockingly less often as a result.

If it doesn't go away and the new DT caster also cannot rez, hoo boy.

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Originally Posted by Connor

Would also like if Carbuncle contributed instead of sitting around waiting for you to use Radiant Aegis lol.

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Carby has their world first clear of an Ultimate. They've done enough. Let them chill. :P

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Originally Posted by Post

This. Maybe SMN could have kept it with its old kit, but they should have been tossed with the rework. It's too strong now for how approachable it is to play at an effective level; it's making RDM and BLM be chosen shockingly less often as a result.

If it doesn't go away and the new DT caster also cannot rez, hoo boy.

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If they really want casters to have a rez, they could try making it a role action with a long cooldown. This would make it less spammable on SMN/RDM, give THM/BLM more appeal, and help out in BLU parties since nobody ever equips Angel Whisper. Then Resurrection could be purely a SCH action.

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Originally Posted by VictorSpoils

If they really want casters to have a rez, they could try making it a role action with a long cooldown. This would make it less spammable on SMN/RDM, give THM/BLM more appeal, and help out in BLU parties since nobody ever equips Angel Whisper. Then Resurrection could be purely a SCH action.

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Even if remains just to RDM and SMN, giving it a cooldown would be enough reason to not 'rez tax' them anymore, since it's not spammable.

As for SMN moving on I'd want:

- Physick scaling with INT. Idk why some people are so adamant against a situational button that is actually useful in solo content, especially deep dungeons. There's a reason why RDM is a good job in PotD runs.

- Everlasting Flight Ready: After you summon Phoenix, Physick turns into EF ogcd for 40s. There, now you can actually make the best of an often wasted aoe regen.

- Since they only attack once and leave, Gemstone Summons are no longer an 'entity' and are just animations now not replacing the Carbuncle anymore.

- Carbuncle auto-attacks again, from range.

- New egi glamours: moogle and poroggos.

- Last but not least:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbcBGxOX...name=4096x4096

Those gemstones are more cast-time focused than the previous ones.

Optional:a level 100 trait that rearranges the 6 gemstones according to their polarity. Now Bahamut activates the umbral elements Water, Earth, and Ice and Phoenix activates the astral elements Fire, Wind and Lightning. There's also a bonus action that cycles your demi phase outside of combat, so now it's possible to decide if you want to start a fight with Bahamut or Phoenix.

What would adding 3 new Legos to SMN actually achieve though

Right now the only thing that separates the 3 current legos is capacity for movement (and this is really only in the post Phoenix phase because if you are optimising for damage during the Bahamut window you always should be going titan->Garuda->ifrit

If the new primals are more mobile then the current ones you end up with the post Bahamut phase being restrictive on movement, if they are less mobile then the post Phoenix phase is immobile, since you can’t swap around when you summon Bahamut vs Phoenix there is still no choice, you just get 3 new shades of ruin 3

I love 6.0 Summoner a lot. I loathed DoT Summoner. I wouldn't want to lose Resurrection (or Verraise on RDM). They've saved me restarting too many boss fights by being able to raise my healer. I don't play with any intention of ever using it. If the healer dies they'll have to wait however long is necessary for my next Swiftcast, but it's there if we need it.

All I want for 7.0 is for Ifrit/Titan/Garuda to be replaced by Leviathan/Ramuh/Shiva after summoning Phoenix. They don't have Egis so they can go straight to full-sized at 93 and get their Astral Flows at 96.

I'm not sure what I'd add at 100. Demi-Diabolos would be pretty cool but I don't think a third phase is actually all that elegant. I think an ability to skip or repeat a phase might be useful. Double up on Bahamut for extra burst damage or double up on Phoenix for better dps, assuming Levi/Ramuh/Shiva offer higher damage than the base 3, or get an extra Enkindle if you're hurting.

Regarding Carbuncle, I actually don't want him doing anything independent. I don't trust an AI pet to be targeting the right mob at any given point. This is the inherent problem with pet classes. Take for instance the last boss in The Burn. If Carbuncle attacks the Mist Dragon in the mist phase before you're able to swap to the dragon heads, you're boned. And that's absolutely going to happen every time. You cannot trust AI. I expect this was the same conclusion the devs came to.

I do think that before level 70, when you actually summon Bahamut, Carbuncle should be the source of the additional damage provided to both Ruin and Outburst while Aethercharge or Dreadwyrm Trance is active. I also think he should get more than just Radiant Aegis. He should cast Ruin IV, which should probably be called something else anyway. Maybe he could be the solution to the Physick problem by changing Physick into some kind of Carbuncle Cure. However I think SMN with any kind of functional cure might be a bit too OP.

-Delete Physick.
-Delete energy drain/siphon
-Normal rez restricted.

Split bahamut and pheonix summon like the pvp system.
(bahamut 1.5s cast/2.5s gcd, add megaflare to it)
(Phéonix instant cast/1.5s, medium damage,
give 1 stack of free instant rez + 10% hp shield for the whole team).

-"Separate carbuncles from the summoning system and let them accumulate ether for a new resource management approach.
Create a 2 long-range spell 2.5s gcd (similar to the old egi assault) with two charges, first generating one Ruin IV stack per use. second generate 1 stack per use for painflare/fester.
Additionally, introduce a spell that absorbs ether from elemental summons to convert it into Carbuncle Trance after 3 elemental ether,
allowing the use of a 20s duration reflect damage effect and 15s personnal 5% damage boost. After two trance carbuncle, unlock ''OGCD summon demi-carbuncle and deal instant damage''

-Reduce the Global Cooldown for summoning Garuda, Titan, and Ifrit from 2.5 seconds to 1.5 seconds.
-add 1.5s cast time to titan 2.5s recast for allow the use of the ogcd.
-Garuda: Slipstream instant cast.
-Ifrit Ruby rite 2.8s cast-> 2.5s
Crimson cyclone no changement
Crimson strike 5 yalms-> 25 yalms.

Add Shiva, Ramuh, Leviathan.

"Implement an elemental combo system among the different summons and allow the choice of 3 summons, with each Demi-Phoenix and Demi-Bahamut summon resetting the previously used summons."
and add effect for these combo.
Exemple Use ifrit after garuda:
Using Ifrit after Garuda or the opposite applies a damage-over-time effect to the target for 10 seconds.

example of possible effect, personal damage increased by 5%, next spell instant cast, gives 1 stack of ether,
reduces casting speed by 25%,etc,etc,...

For this to be possible, it would be necessary to add 3 spell emplacement for the shiva,leviathan,ifrit.
We could replace Physick, which serves no purpose, with a demi-ogcd and instant summon after 120s, such as Carbuncle/Odin/Alexander, etc.
In total, it would likely require adding 5 spell emplacement.

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Originally Posted by Korbei

I love 6.0 Summoner a lot. I loathed DoT Summoner. I wouldn't want to lose Resurrection (or Verraise on RDM). They've saved me restarting too many boss fights by being able to raise my healer. I don't play with any intention of ever using it. If the healer dies they'll have to wait however long is necessary for my next Swiftcast, but it's there if we need it.

All I want for 7.0 is for Ifrit/Titan/Garuda to be replaced by Leviathan/Ramuh/Shiva after summoning Phoenix. They don't have Egis so they can go straight to full-sized at 93 and get their Astral Flows at 96.

I'm not sure what I'd add at 100. Demi-Diabolos would be pretty cool but I don't think a third phase is actually all that elegant.

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Unfortunately, Demi-Diablos seems impossible because in FF14, it's a demon and not a primal.

Summoner has always been flashy. Summoner is about summoning. My opinion is more summons please.

I know people saying it’s silly to give us ramuh, leviathan and shiva because it adds nothing to the job and it will only be recolours of what we currently have. It adds flashiness. Summoner in previous games always had these 6. They are the OG original and need to be added to make final fantasy XIV summoner feel complete. It just doesn’t feel complete without ramuh, shiva and Levi.

Also if people want carbuncle to attack then resurrection and physic needs to go. The job can’t have it all. I also think energy drain/siphon needs to go too. It just brings nothing to the job. Keep fester and painflare and put them on the charge system.

I do believe for level 100 we need a flat OGCD summon. Not another demi. Just a primal that will come out and attack for a bit then leave. Think, mch queen robot. Can also summon other primals too while that one is out. I think it should be either Alexander or Odin.

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Originally Posted by remiff

Unfortunately, Demi-Diablos seems impossible because in FF14, it's a demon and not a primal.

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Anything can be a primal. It's just an image made manifest through aether and conviction. With everything going on in the Void right now, it's easy to imagine someone summoning a primal version of Diabolos. But if not Diabolos, Alexander would be interesting too. Actually come to think of it, they're kind of two sides of the same coin, Light/Dark. I could see both being added together.

Maybe instead of going through the lesser primal cycle, you could forgo all three for one big boom like in old school FF game, sacrificing damage over time for burst damage if you're running out of time. Diabolos in the Bahamut phase and Alexander in the Phoenix phase. That seems like more of an 8.0 idea, though.

Phoenix having a 1-2 combo in ShB felt great and distinguished it from Bahamut. They dumbed down everything else, dunno why they needed to go the extra mile to homogenize Bahamut and Phoenix. They put so little care into that decision that hitting 80 and unlocking Phoenix was a DPS downgrade until an early EW patch because they forgot that Deathflare meant Bahamut dealt more damage overall.

My very casual friend that loved ShB SMN resorted to swapping jobs away and back to SMN every fight as we MSQuested in the world so that he wouldn't be forced into Firebird every other minute, even though that meant he had to resummon Carbuncle between every fight. Eventually he just picked up RPR when he got bored with how SMN plays in EW.

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Originally Posted by SweetPete

Summoner has always been flashy. Summoner is about summoning. My opinion is more summons please.

I know people saying it’s silly to give us ramuh, leviathan and shiva because it adds nothing to the job and it will only be recolours of what we currently have. It adds flashiness. Summoner in previous games always had these 6. They are the OG original and need to be added to make final fantasy XIV summoner feel complete. It just doesn’t feel complete without ramuh, shiva and Levi.

Also if people want carbuncle to attack then resurrection and physic needs to go. The job can’t have it all. I also think energy drain/siphon needs to go too. It just brings nothing to the job. Keep fester and painflare and put them on the charge system.

I do believe for level 100 we need a flat OGCD summon. Not another demi. Just a primal that will come out and attack for a bit then leave. Think, mch queen robot. Can also summon other primals too while that one is out. I think it should be either Alexander or Odin.

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It's not that the majority of people think it's dumb to have them, it's just that they think it's dumb with the current etineration and the fact that the Primals don't really have unique mechanics apart from Ifrit, which has a combo gap closer.

Garuda and Titan seem quite similar overall, and they believe that many of the spell feel like reskinned Ruin spells.

They had marketed 6.0 Summoner as a job with a real strategic aspect in the choice of summons, but in the end, that's clearly not the case,
The only aspect that can sometimes be strategic is the gap closer, but it's limited to just that one part of the rotation.

Seems people are more split on the Summoner than I thought, some people seem to want DPS classes to not be able to rez/heal, others seem to want the old Summoner back while others seem to want another re-haul. Interesting to see, I see Summoners used quite a bit so I thought people were fairly happy with the direction it was going in... can't keep everyone happy I guess.

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Originally Posted by LoadedVirus

Seems people are more split on the Summoner than I thought, some people seem to want DPS classes to not be able to rez/heal, others seem to want the old Summoner back while others seem to want another re-haul. Interesting to see, I see Summoners used quite a bit so I thought people were fairly happy with the direction it was going in... can't keep everyone happy I guess.

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The job's visual design is interesting, but the issue is that the gameplay has been very poorly developed and suffers from numerous problems.

-The job falls into the caster category but is more of a ranged physical DPS, making it quite challenging to balance the caster role, especially when there's a summoner with 99.9% mobility in the game.

-They completely obliterated the previous iteration without planning for a replacement job that drew inspiration from the old summoner's gameplay,
there was still a sizable player community who enjoyed the old job. I'm not against a complete rework, but the majority of this community despises the new summoner precisely because it retains none of the concrete elements from the old one, especially not the best aspects.
Moreover, it has transitioned from a job that required careful management and thoughtful play to one that epitomizes extreme simplicity.

-Yoshi-P marketed the summoner rework as a mobile caster with genuine strategic choices depending on the situation. In reality, this isn't particularly the case, except for Ifrit's gap closer.

-The system for pet management has been completely abolished in favor of a carbuncle that does nothing more than occasionally put up shields.
Additionally, this carbuncle is unavailable during the summoning.

-Since the majority of spells lack any real depth, many people believe that 80% of the spells are nothing more than visually glorified Ruin spells.
The summoner seems to be a level 60 job, and apart from the level 86 trait, the gameplay hardly evolves, even before reaching level 60.

In essence, some want a return to a (DoT) job like the old summoner, while others like the current summoner because it's too easy.

Many believe that the job has potential but needs significant changes without a complete overhaul, including adding depth to gameplay, reducing mobility slightly, and introducing a genuine resource management system.

And a bit more spells that aren't limited to just 4 buttons, especially ones that are more interesting. They could draw inspiration from old summoner mechanics that worked well, such as the egi-assaults, the 4-stack Ruin 4 for when mouvement was crucial,
the Phoenix 1-2 combo, the mechanics of the old Dreadwyrm Trance. from Stormblood to unlock a new burst phase (use a ressource for unlock the transe) etc,...

Sorry for the wall of text, it's not usually my style of message.

That's fair, I don't think they will do another dot class since they seem to have removed most of the dots from the game excluding Blue Mage, I can understand why some people would feel slighted. Summoner currently is definitely different flavours of Ruin spam for sure. I like it however so I can't exactly argue against it.

Remove Physick and Resurrection. Leave the healing to Scholar; turn Summoner into pure Magic DPS. Arcanist can do both (but not as good as either) since it's the pre-requisite Class for the two Jobs, but we need to specialize once the Jobs are in play.

Since we don't have DOTs anymore, give our Carbuncle the ability to attack again; if our Fairy can heal on it's own, Carbuncle should be able to deal damage on it's own.

Since our “summons” aren't actually summons in the previous sense of the word (from previous expansions) anymore, and are more temporary techniques akin to the Demi-Summons of Bahamut and Phoenix, let us have the other three Primals as “summons”. Having Ramuh, Leviathan, and Shiva would let this job feel complete and more like the old-school Summoners of previous games. Preferably, have them aligned with each elemental polarity; wind, lightning, and fire for Phoenix, and water, ice, and earth for Bahamut.

Add some more complexity to the rotation other than just Ruin/Tri-Disaster spam until summons are available → Gemshine/Precious Brilliance spam once summons are usable → Ruin/Tri-Disaster spam until summons are available again. Make Bahamut and Phoenix feel like different summons again. Maybe add some kind of resource management to spice things up.

Add some more glamour for our egis; personally, I like to keep my summons in Carbuncle form, so corresponding colors to any possible new summons would be great.

If they're going to remove Resurrection and leave the healing to Scholar, then I demand a better weapon.

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Originally Posted by remiff

They had marketed 6.0 Summoner as a job with a real strategic aspect in the choice of summons, but in the end, that's clearly not the case,
The only aspect that can sometimes be strategic is the gap closer, but it's limited to just that one part of the rotation.

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I keep seeing people say this and I don’t think that’s actually what he meant. When he said that he meant for the primals themselves if my memory serves me right. He said you will have to be strategic in which primals to use for mechanics like for example. If you have to move allot then Titan and Garuda will be the ones to use and if the boss is standing still for a bit then Ifrit will be the one to use.

I means obviously you can’t use Ifrit if there is allot of movement going on. Right? So technically he was correct. Well you can use him but the ruby abilities you cannot since they have a cast time attached. I think his words are being twisted here a bit.

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Originally Posted by SweetPete

I keep seeing people say this and I don’t think that’s actually what he meant. When he said that he meant for the primals themselves if my memory serves me right. He said you will have to be strategic in which primals to use for mechanics like for example. If you have to move allot then Titan and Garuda will be the ones to use and if the boss is standing still for a bit then Ifrit will be the one to use.

I means obviously you can’t use Ifrit if there is allot of movement going on. Right? So technically he was correct. Well you can use him but the ruby abilities you cannot since they have a cast time attached. I think his words are being twisted here a bit.

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5,6second of cast and the rest gemshine instant cast spam is anything but strategic.

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Originally Posted by SweetPete

Summoner has always been flashy. Summoner is about summoning. My opinion is more summons please.

I know people saying it’s silly to give us ramuh, leviathan and shiva because it adds nothing to the job and it will only be recolours of what we currently have. It adds flashiness. Summoner in previous games always had these 6. They are the OG original and need to be added to make final fantasy XIV summoner feel complete. It just doesn’t feel complete without ramuh, shiva and Levi.

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There's no reason, other than devs not setting aside the proper time to develop the job feel, that the skills which were kept weren't reworked to be summons.

The Radiant Aegis shield shouldn't need Carbuncle to be deployed as an idle pet, it should summon Carbuncle to bestow a shield.

Fester has no connection to biological magic anymore because that no longer exists for SMN and should upgrade to 'Ramuh Trance' which manifests a ghostly Ramuh beside you to blast lightning the same way Deathflare manifests Bahamut's head.

Searing Light should create a vision of Sri Lakshmi or Susano or Ravana to buff everyone instead of being a nothingbeam from the summoner's body.

Even Physick could receive a flavor upgrade to 'Summon Mog' and flash King Mog into existence to cast Pom Cure for a trifling amount.

And they should rewrite and retcon whatever lore is necessary to have more summons at this point, because flinging magic missiles and book beams for 80% of your GCDs isn't summoning.

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Also if people want carbuncle to attack then resurrection and physic needs to go. The job can’t have it all.

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I don't want the pet to attack, I want the pet to not exist. Trying to preserve and expand the crappy demi-summon system instead of just making the summons into visual effects is what's hamstringing the job. I'll keep the utility rez and the meme heal, thanks.

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Originally Posted by vetch

I don't want the pet to attack, I want the pet to not exist. Trying to preserve and expand the crappy demi-summon system instead of just making the summons into visual effects is what's hamstringing the job. I'll keep the utility rez and the meme heal, thanks.

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well, it's not like it's the carbuncle's fault that they decided to ruin it with demi-summons. The demi summons could easily be visual effects and nothing more, the carbuncle worked so well before SB and before ghosting.

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Originally Posted by Ggwppino

5,6second of cast and the rest gemshine instant cast spam is anything but strategic.

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Hey I feel you lol. I’m just saying what he said about the whole strategic thing with summoner.

In my opinion, however, they sold something that isn't. Quite dishonest, Yoshi-P first and foremost, just so as not to immediately create discontent with EW's imminent release. They made fun of those who liked smn, or even were their favorite class. From those words we expected a heavy rework, but with the right tactics and optimization like the old one had, but instead it is nothing more than a spam broil without cast.

I do wish with you that Carbuncle should do something (although I'd rather it not exist as a useable pet if it's not possible) and Aethercharge making Ruin instant at lower levels sounds okay though since it IS pre-Astral Flare/Scarlet Flame. Do the same with the AoE actions as well and it's golden because why not.

I, too, would like to post wishes that will likely never come into fruition for funsies ...

- Remove Carbuncle; it becomes a visual effect similar Reaper on Carbuncle-based actions.
- Remove Physick from Arcanist.
- Give Radiant Aegis an effect that removes and/or protects from Esuna-able detrimental effects, allow it to be used on allies; allow Radiant Aegis to have different effect based on elemental attunement on use ... Long removed Radiant Shield but deals damage surrounding when absorbed/expired for Ifrit, Macrocosmos-based party shielding when absorbed/expired for Titan, not-really-Hallowed Ground for Garuda?? (it is a massive stretch, really)
- Add another Carbuncle-based ability that restores HP to self only based on INT at a cost to Aetherflow.
- Energy Drain upgrades to Energy Siphon; restores HP and MP based on targets hit.
- Remove Fester, replace with Painflare; remove Aetherflow cost for Painflare, give an effect that increases potency based on aetherflow charges.

- If you want "strategy", limit to only 2 summons per minute. Allow summons to fight alongside you for a short time, then go away.

- Swap attunement costs from elemental Ruin and Rite to Astral Flow-based actions instead (unlimited elemental Ruin and Rite until you summon something else).
- Allow Ruin III instant cast while under any elemental attunement.
- Ruin IV ... still exists as a free cleave from Energy Drain/Energy Siphon (leave the coolest Ruin effect alone please).
- Give cast times to Topaz Rite and Emerald Rite.
- Give Slipsteam reactive action to 'denonate' its pet windstorm.
- Give Mountain Buster an effect that makes the next Topaz Rite instant cast.
- Allow Crimson Cyclone and Crimson Strike to auto-crit and/or direct hit.
- Add another ability to recharge elemental attunement to maximum at an Aetherflow cost.

- Change Bahamut to have its PVP-variant's Megaflare cast on summon.
- Allow Rekindle to be applied on downed player characters for resurrection.

I would be all for getting rid of Carbuncle, it adds nothing and creates problems. We already summon Carbuncle at low levels and then move on to better summons. I was only thinking of the people that might have grown attached to little guy. Adding other ways of healing ourselves seems roundabout though ... why not just fix the one we do have? Other people want to remove it and rez entirely, don't entirely understand why but fair enough.

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Originally Posted by LoadedVirus

I would be all for getting rid of Carbuncle, it adds nothing and creates problems. We already summon Carbuncle at low levels and then move on to better summons. I was only thinking of the people that might have grown attached to little guy. Adding other ways of healing ourselves seems roundabout though ... why not just fix the one we do have? Other people want to remove it and rez entirely, don't entirely understand why but fair enough.

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It is fair to think of people who want to keep the pet as-is and I would not mind if Carbuncle was cosmetic and moved a dedicated system like Bard's performance, where it's only allowed out of combat and not in battle instances. Wishful thinking would have it only be an effect in combat where it could, perhaps, "flip" out of your grimoire above you and disappear on casting "Summon Carbuncle" or fan its tails in front of the player on using "Radiant Aegis".

It would be great to make Physick INT based, but given how long it's been as it has remained MND based for Arcanist, I have a feeling it could finally be on the chopping block and just solely given to SCH. Giving recovery through abilities would allow them to be used between casted actions, so you don't lose out on damage as a damage dealer. I can agree that giving the job more utility for conditional situations like taking unintended (and sometimes turning lethal) damage and in solo-ish content FATEs/Eureka/Bozja/PotD/HoH/Orthos would always be more beneficial, but I do not believe in keeping Physick as an Arcanist spell is the ideal way when we can make use of abilities that are "flavored" towards a summon like Carbuncle and still be able to maintain damage in combat as needed. Personally, I think getting both worlds of "hey, Summoner needs more summon-y stuff like in other FF games" visual and "I really want to support the party sometimes like in other FF games" utility would be ideal.

The whole Resurrection removal ... I'm just going to guess the idea that Resurrection should be removed from the job only comes from the standpoint that the job loses out on potential damage and suffers in balancing in comparison to other jobs because of it. However, the idea also doesn't take in consideration that the ability to revive player characters in non-high end duties being removed would be detrimental to the rest of the playerbase. Looking at how the playerbase in casual content during this event time really nails on how much it is still required.

make their resurrect a phoenix based mitigation spell that they can use on self or a party member that is in risk of dying. Like excog but the raise would trigger on the player taking lethal damage and come back with 1hp.

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Originally Posted by unjourneyed

The whole Resurrection removal ... I'm just going to guess the idea that Resurrection should be removed from the job only comes from the standpoint that the job loses out on potential damage and suffers in balancing in comparison to other jobs because of it. However, the idea also doesn't take in consideration that the ability to revive player characters in non-high end duties being removed would be detrimental to the rest of the playerbase. Looking at how the playerbase in casual content during this event time really nails on how much it is still required.

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I buy that logic with Red Mage but not with Summoner. Because Red Mage can basically spam verraise, I accept the logic behind the argument that the devs are holding RDM back because it fills more of a support role. I don't agree with it but I accept the logic. Summoner, I do not. Summoner is doing just fine. Its ability to raise is very restricted in combat and is basically dependent on Swiftcast which is never available.

And yes, losing it would absolutely be detrimental to everybody. There is so much more going on in this game than 8/24 person content. Not every ability that exists needs to be geared toward that content. People raise their healers in dungeons and prevent resets. They raise their party members in hunt trains to save time. It can be super helpful to have extra raises in Deep Dungeons. It's a major help to everybody in Eureka. It's a QoL ability. That's why everybody can set raise in Variant Dungeons and in Bozja and why it's one of the most coveted Blue Mage spells. It's incredibly useful!

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Originally Posted by Korbei

I buy that logic with Red Mage but not with Summoner. Because Red Mage can basically spam verraise, I accept the logic behind the argument that the devs are holding RDM back because it fills more of a support role. I don't agree with it but I accept the logic. Summoner, I do not. Summoner is doing just fine. Its ability to raise is very restricted in combat and is basically dependent on Swiftcast which is never available.

And yes, losing it would absolutely be detrimental to everybody. There is so much more going on in this game than 8/24 person content. Not every ability that exists needs to be geared toward that content. People raise their healers in dungeons and prevent resets. They raise their party members in hunt trains to save time. It can be super helpful to have extra raises in Deep Dungeons. It's a major help to everybody in Eureka. It's a QoL ability. That's why everybody can set raise in Variant Dungeons and in Bozja and why it's one of the most coveted Blue Mage spells. It's incredibly useful!

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Sorry but it’s probably going bye-bye in 7.0. It survived by the skin of its teeth for 6.0. That was basically Yoshi and the devs telling us don’t expect it in 7.0. If by some miracle it does survive then good but I highly doubt it. Maybe they will give the next caster one or just make RDM as the only caster who can res.

Let me be clear, it's not ruining the job for me either way. It's ruining it for everybody else.

I just don't understand why people want to get rid of it so badly.

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Originally Posted by Korbei

Let me be clear, it's not ruining the job for me either way. It's ruining it for everybody else.

I just don't understand why people want to get rid of it so badly.

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It's Yoshi-P who wants to remove it.
He had said before the release of Endwalker that Summoner's resurrection ability would likely be removed for 7.0,
but they decided to keep it for 6.0 because the job was reworked, and they weren't sure how it would turn out.

This led people to believe that its complete removal would be a good thing,
but in the end, Summoner would probably end up in the same category as Machinist, and I'm not sure that would be a good choice.

I'd rather they turn it into a Phoenix ability than remove it completely.

That's hilarious. Rez is half the reason I take Summoner into content. It's not like its gameplay loop is so compelling it'll make up for a lack of utility.

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Originally Posted by remiff

Summoner would probably end up in the same category as Machinist, and I'm not sure that would be a good choice.

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However, even if I don't agree with removing the ress, if it were removed, due to the so much mobility it has compared to the role it should play and compete with, it still wouldn't be mistreated like the mch has been for 3/4 of the tier.
Bringing a smn to a raid means bringing 2 physranged but with party bonuses.

And unless it's highly debilitating to the clear for low dps, it won't be like the mch.

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Originally Posted by vetch

That's hilarious. Rez is half the reason I take Summoner into content. It's not like its gameplay loop is so compelling it'll make up for a lack of utility.

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Currently the ress is the only thing that makes me pay that little bit of attention to the things I do. It's the only thing I have to adapt to and that can make me vary the rotation, making the rotation a little fresher. That sense of uncertainty, that sense of having to understand if I can or cannot ress, what or not what to sacrifice, when to do it.

Actually, in its current state, losing it would be a great shame. It's one of the very few things that requires a bit of critical thinking while playing.

As a compromise between having Resurrection and not having Resurrection, how about Resurrection being available only during Phoenix phase? But it's free, instant, and restores to full HP.

That way it's not giving summoner so much utility tax on its DPS from having constant access (or as constant as Swiftcast's cooldown, realistically), but it is really circumstantial, but when it IS that circumstance it is actually appreciated. Appreciated in a unique and job appropriate way like red mage's chainable insta-rezes. And it's just so Phoenix, yo.

Or just a really long cooldown if they end up making Phoenix phase manually choosable instead of alternating between Bahamut and Phoenix like clockwork. If so, they could lean into its heal properties even more, and give Everlasting Flight potency worth a damn.

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Originally Posted by DustyBlue

As a compromise between having Resurrection and not having Resurrection, how about Resurrection being available only during Phoenix phase? But it's free, instant, and restores to full HP.

That way it's not giving summoner so much utility tax on its DPS from having constant access (or as constant as Swiftcast's cooldown, realistically), but it is really circumstantial, but when it IS that circumstance it is actually appreciated. Appreciated in a unique and job appropriate way like red mage's chainable insta-rezes. And it's just so Phoenix, yo.

Or just a really long cooldown if they end up making Phoenix phase manually choosable instead of alternating between Bahamut and Phoenix like clockwork. If so, they could lean into its heal properties even more, and give Everlasting Flight potency worth a damn.

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That this ress would be in a burst phase and would have the same design problem as EF has from shB where it is a highly situational heal usability due to the very limited time window and rotation rigidity that forces this window to be at 2 minute intervals.

At this point it would be better to just remove it, rather than worry about having a ress every 2 minutes and within 15 seconds people have to die


Different if phoenix became a lego summon. However, this would take away from the player's thoughts whether or not it is better to use the ress, wasting a gcd in burst. It would make an already very simple job even easier