#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

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Originally Posted by Remyus_Nara

This is such a wild take I had to log in to reply. Why do tanks get a dps rotation if they aren’t a dps and healers don’t? Imagine if tanks were design like healers. 1-2 damage buttons and the rest of their kit revolved around enmity generation and damage mitigation. Sounds boring because it is. There’s zero reasons healers shouldn’t have a legit damage kit that consists of more than 5 buttons. Literally every other job in the game has over 16 buttons dedicated to damage and healers have 5-6. That’s ridiculous.

They could easily cull 4-5 heals from every healers kit and replace them with damage buttons that interact with each other and healers would still be OP in the role. Before telling people to touch grass, maybe understand the topic at hand.

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For real!!! Tanks should tank! They don't need all these damage buttons!

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

Regarding the point about GMs, I don't think it would prove anything but how childish some people can be. It won't do anyone any favors to queue into group content with the intent to bring everyone else down.

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My dude if you think cleaving to the primary purpose of the Role in which our class is ensconced is "bringing everybody else down", then that in and of itself is a condemnation of the situation that healers find ourselves in. If we can't focus on the primary purpose of our role without being accused of "bringing people down", then the situation the role finds itself in is untenable.

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

Tanks sustain isn't really the core issue... It's the whole gameplay of spamming one button.

If they removed all sustain from all tanks and buffed up damage from enemies, even then it would still be just one button spam but instead of spamming Glare it'd be spamming Cure.

Some other kinds of utility, and more attacks is what would fix the problem. Heck, even something as simple as an actual positive way to engage with the Job Gauge would be a huge help... I have said it multiple times but as a WHM, I have to overheal with Lilies in order to use Afflatus Misery, which they had to buff several times in the past in order for it to not be a DPS loss compared to just spamming Glare. If you could actually spend the Lilies to do something other than waste them to get the Afflatus Misery, that'd be nice.

Sage kind of has a similar issue, they need to waste Druochole on a regular basis to regain MP to keep spamming more Dosis.

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Being able to spend the lillies on something other than that one attack would be nice. I remember that white mages used to be able to apply haste to people but it was eventually removed. I'm not sure why though.

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Originally Posted by alfarini

How do you think tanks retain and hold agro? Buy doing damage, tanks can't not have damage abilities.

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Which is why they said you only need 1 or 2? It's not like you need an interesting dps rotation to hold aggro. Just give warrior overpower and fell cleave and they hold aggro just fine.

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Originally Posted by BunnyQueen

It is not reportable for a healer to not attack, go crawl back into your little hole till you know what you are talking about. Go read the TOS.

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You're not doing the movement any favors by attacking people.

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

Which is why they said you only need 1 or 2? It's not like you need an interesting dps rotation to hold aggro. Just give warrior overpower and fell cleave and they hold aggro just fine.

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Heavy Swing, Heavy Swing 2, Heavy Swing 3, Heavy Swing 4, Storm's Path, and Storm's Path 3

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

Being able to spend the lillies on something other than that one attack would be nice. I remember that white mages used to be able to apply haste to people but it was eventually removed. I'm not sure why though.

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That was SCH that had that, back when they had two different fairies with different skills... The current only ones that have were Eos' skills... Selene, the deleted fairy, had a haste buff, AoE Esuna and an interrupt.

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

I said I failed to understand it because if someone is going on strike, why would you then still partake in what the strike is against?

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Most of us will not partake in healing group content though...? Perhaps you confused a few individuals healing their premades with everyone else who are switching roles.

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

That was SCH that had that, back when they had two different fairies with different skills... The current only ones that have were Eos' skills... Selene, the deleted fairy, had a haste buff, AoE Esuna and an interrupt.

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Was it scholar? I honestly couldn't remember, it's been a really long time since then. In the end I do want to see them utilize the gauges more.

One other issue I noticed that I am not sure if it pertains to this thread is when you have double barrier healers in the same party.
It's pretty rough since the shields don't stack so it can be awkward.

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

You're not doing the movement any favors by attacking people.

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You're not doing anyone favors by solo playing bosses. You are in fact wasting everyone's time. Players who fail mechanics don't deserve to lie on the floor and not get a chance to learn the fight. They don't learn their own job by watching you finish the fight either. Moreover killing a boss "near death" is not special. I can do that on a BLM, and I have. Most jobs can under certain conditions or very low time limits. The problem with WAR is it is designed to solo down group content far beyond "near death". If anything I hope you get reported next time you do this (if you're doing it anywhere beyond a few % hp).

Yoshi P really needs to get this tank messiah complex under control. You said, and I quote "I had to solo the boss". You actually don't. You didn't have to do anything.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

You're not doing anyone favors by solo playing bosses. You are in fact wasting everyone's time. Players who fail mechanics don't deserve to lie on the floor and not get a chance to learn the fight. They don't learn their own job by watching you finish the fight either. Moreover killing a boss "near death" is not special. I can do that on a BLM, and I have. Most jobs can under certain conditions or very low time limits. The problem with WAR is it is designed to solo down group content far beyond "near death". If anything I hope you get reported next time you do this (if you're doing it anywhere beyond a few % hp).

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You're making some pretty far reaches to attack me. I never said I solo'd the boss from over half health, in fact I dislike when tanks do that very thing.

I mean a few percentages remaining, where we would have to do the entire fight over.
I've done it as paladin, so I used clemency and cover + hallowed ground on other people alive

I agree warrior should be nerfed, I even mentioned it in my first post that the main issue seems to be about bloodwetting which I would like to see happening

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Originally Posted by CVXIV

You're making some people far reaches to attack me. I never said I solo'd the boss from over half health, in fact I dislike when tanks do that very thing.

I mean a few percentages remaining, where we would have to do the entire fight over.
I've done it as paladin, so I used clemency and cover + hallowed ground on other people alive

I agree warrior should be nerfed, I even mentioned it in my first post that the main issue seems to be about bloodwetting which I would like to see happening

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Fair enough, then it's not a criticism of you. My bad. That's why I added the disclaimer to be fair, because I find it suspicious when people ambiguously reference "near death" when we've had over 300 pages of this same subject and it often leads to people rationalizing pretty crazy health bars.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

Fair enough, then it's not a criticism of you. My bad.

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It's all good. I would've gone into more detail but I didn't want to seem like I was bragging about it because it really isn't special. I only pointed it out because I can see where healers come from when something like that happens because it really shouldn't. One time I was doing grand cosmos and the last boss killed everyone because some of the others burned the furniture so blue fire got us and the warrior refused to die despite the boss being well over half. It was pretty annoying and I'd never like to subject people to that.

Should also state that people asked him to wipe and he refused lmao

If WAR mains are so upset about people asking for nerfs, then I have another idea.

If only one person is left alive in a 4 man dungeon boss room, the boss should stop doing mechanics, gain a 300% damage up, gain haste and have maximum movement speed.

There, no nerfs to WAR, have fun trying to solo. :)

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Originally Posted by Aravell

If WAR mains are so upset about people asking for nerfs, then I have another idea.

If only one person is left alive in a 4 man dungeon boss room, the boss should stop doing mechanics, gain a 300% damage up, gain haste and have maximum movement speed.

There, no nerfs to WAR, have fun trying to solo. :)

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Expert dungeon bosses need that to be remotely threatening anyway, I don't see why a more fun fight should be limited to 3/4 of the party being on the floor

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Originally Posted by Aravell

If WAR mains are so upset about people asking for nerfs, then I have another idea.

If only one person is left alive in a 4 man dungeon boss room, the boss should stop doing mechanics, gain a 300% damage up, gain haste and have maximum movement speed.

There, no nerfs to WAR, have fun trying to solo. :)

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It would be funny if a boss exploded for 999999999999 unavoidable, cannot invuln damage if the last person standing was a tank.

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Originally Posted by Aravell

If WAR mains are so upset about people asking for nerfs, then I have another idea.

If only one person is left alive in a 4 man dungeon boss room, the boss should stop doing mechanics, gain a 300% damage up, gain haste and have maximum movement speed.

There, no nerfs to WAR, have fun trying to solo. :)

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Well let's be honest, there'll be an outrage since they can't smooth brain the boss.

Gotta give credit to Zepla, she's already teaching quite early to sprout healers that they aren't needed if they die :D timestamp for those interested

/s

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Originally Posted by Erzaa

Modern dungeons and trials and raids are much harder than their ARR/HW counterparts. They ask more of the player do keep an eye on and do.

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because i know you weren't here back in ARR & HW (on content), i know you have never experienced a first room farm of Aurum Vale. Or a full run of it. what you are saying is nothing new to us. we, or at least a good handful of us, have been through all of these expansions at content. and, hate to break it to ya. but, no. what you're saying isn't true....at least historically speaking.

ARR & HW Used to be, and to some degree still are depending on the group of players DF decides to jumble together. Some of the harder content in the game. There are mechanics in those dungeons and raids, that have been nerfd countless times (as well as had telegraphs added to them). A lot of those mechanics back in the day, were things you had to die to at least once, to learn about them even being a thing. (this can ideally be related to doom, which; outside of its initial introduction in temple, isn't widely used in the overworld and other dungeons.)

Is the content past SHB more extensive in what it does? yes, i'll agree with you. But by no means is it more challenging.
The difficulty you're speaking of here, isn't "difficulty" in the sense of being mechanically challenging. But difficulty in the sense of fast reaction and damage. both of which, are easily negated.

A dungeon can be cleared without a tank. Tanks are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

A dungeon can be cleared without DSP. DPS are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

A dungeon can be cleared without a healer. Healers are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4O4JGCC0g4

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Originally Posted by CerusSerenade

A dungeon can be cleared without a tank. Tanks are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

A dungeon can be cleared without DSP. DPS are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

A dungeon can be cleared without a healer. Healers are useless and content needs to be made to make them more necessary.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4O4JGCC0g4

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1T 3D might clear a dungeon in 15 minutes.
1T 2D 1H might clear a dungeon in 20 minutes.
3D 1H might clear a dungeon in 30 minutes.

It's not that it isn't impossible to clear it with out a certain role, it is that it is more efficient to clear it with 1T 3D.

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Originally Posted by DynnDiablos

Also, this is futile. SE ain't gonna do anything.

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Said Xerxes to leonidas.

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Originally Posted by Aravell

If WAR mains are so upset about people asking for nerfs, then I have another idea.

If only one person is left alive in a 4 man dungeon boss room, the boss should stop doing mechanics, gain a 300% damage up, gain haste and have maximum movement speed.

There, no nerfs to WAR, have fun trying to solo. :)

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Every tank can perpetually sustain on a dungeon boss, that one is hardly a WAR specific issue.

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Originally Posted by MisterNublet

1T 3D might clear a dungeon in 15 minutes.
1T 2D 1H might clear a dungeon in 20 minutes.
3D 1H might clear a dungeon in 30 minutes.

It's not that it isn't impossible to clear it with out a certain role, it is that it is more efficient to clear it with 1T 3D.

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Given the time of the video that's clearly not the case, as 1 healer 2 DPS cleared 1/3 of the dungeon in 7 minutes. A third dps would have clearly cut that down to the 15 minute mark you were talking about.

That healers have a very simplified kit for dealing damage is a valid complaint, but that dungeons can be completed without a healer is overblown, as dungeons can also be completed without a tank.

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Originally Posted by Rehayem

Gotta give credit to Zepla, she's already teaching quite early to sprout healers that they aren't needed if they die :D timestamp for those interested

/s

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XIV tubers outside of the bald warrior almost never have strong stances on the game and are always neutral, it honestly pretty annoying. I'd prefer is Zepla and Mr Happy weren't wishywashy with their opinion and either said they think the strike idea is stupid and that healers are fine or support it. But then again the toxic faux nice casual fanbase would probably rip them apart like they did with Zepla after her opinion on Endwalker because for some reason you can't like a game and admit that it has problems.

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Originally Posted by CerusSerenade

Given the time of the video that's clearly not the case, as 1 healer 2 DPS cleared 1/3 of the dungeon in 7 minutes. A third dps would have clearly cut that down to the 15 minute mark you were talking about.

That healers have a very simplified kit for dealing damage is a valid complaint, but that dungeons can be completed without a healer is overblown, as dungeons can also be completed without a tank.

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They had already defeated the first boss and were clearing trash packs towards the second boss. It took them two and a half minutes to clear the second pack of mobs even with the Dark Knight dpsing the first group before dying to the lack of heals. At the 6 minute mark they only pulled one group, and at the 7 minute mark they ended up single target pulling making it easy to heal through both. That is slow.

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as dungeons can also be completed without a tank.

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Right, I said that. It just wont be very fast. I would know, I've done it multiple times.

I support making encounters across all grouped content just somewhat interesting for the healer role. Add some DoTs to dungeon enemies, tbh I wish they had something akin to M+ from WoW.


Just a version of 4 player dungeons that makes each role sweat a little.

Then at your floor level, an average healer would be someone who keeps the group alive and you complete content, but a great healer could have a ceiling of optimizing dps + healing since you'd be doing a blend of both instead of like 99% mashing Glare or Holy and falling asleep.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Every tank can perpetually sustain on a dungeon boss, that one is hardly a WAR specific issue.

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Just did an MSQ bit with a Gunblade in the party and I might as well not have been there with Aurora+Mitigation making my healing almost entirely superfluous except for the final boss. I couldve taken a nap through the entire dungeon except the final boss and they'd have been fine without me.

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

XIV tubers outside of the bald warrior almost never have strong stances on the game and are always neutral, it honestly pretty annoying.

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Look at Warrior now, lol. I wish Healers had a streamer with a spine.

With the addition of Duty support, I think the putting pressure on healers argument is dumb now.
Just rename duty support to "story mode" keep them easy and make regular online dungeons hard enough that all roles are needed and you can't brainlessly go through them. Then everyone can play the story but the normal players can not have an incredible jump from normal mode to extreme/savage, where you actually have to use the kit you neglect as all roles in this game throughout the story.

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Originally Posted by Niroken

Look at Warrior now, lol. I wish Healers had a streamer with a spine.

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Because healing in this game is boring and atrocious. It doesn't make for very exciting streaming content, so hardly any of them play it (full time).

Hey it's me, the bogeyman of the forums again. Just wanted to say again that if you haven't been happy for years and years, you should probably unsub. Maybe the game just isn't for you anymore. When the game is no longer for me, I'm going to unsub too like a normal person instead of whatever all this is. Thanks, have a great day!

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Originally Posted by Bibine_Bine

You said healers do matter, and I counter with this:
A group cleared The Omega Protocol. With no healers. No healers. One of the hardest pieces of content in the game, and they didn't need a healer. Healers do not matter anymore.

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Seriously? That was a highly coordinated group that took a long time to get finished, and just because of that you think healers don't matter? Comparing that TOP team with random people you find in PF or in roulette it's insane. Of course you can complete content without a role type if you have an actual gameplan, day one of the 3rd Ally EW raid I joined an all tank party and cleared it. You going to tell me we don't need dps and healers after being able to do that? It's definitely not hard content but it's the same argument.

Your TOP clear with no healers point is ridiculous, the smallest of the small minority of players doing something cool does not make an impact on the game as a whole. You see it and think "oh man healers are useless" when in reality it's healers are not needed in a group that has every second of a fight memorized, making absolutely zero mistakes. This is an insane thing to do, and thinking it's how the rest of the community plays really tells me how narrow minded alot of these "protesters" are. Healers matter in every form of content, because not everyone is playing to there absolute peak. People die or get hit by a mechanic and need some heals, even the best players in the world make mistakes. We need healers. If you don't like how healers are right now, play a different job, we have it cushy in 14 we can play any Job on one character. Unlike in wow for example where you have to remake a Chara, boost it and then gear it just to play another class. Oh and don't forget that in wow if you do any damage at all your yelled at for not only healing, ff14 healers have it better than wows healers so be grateful for that. Here come the healer tears after this.

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Originally Posted by Kazmarek

Hey it's me, the bogeyman of the forums again. Just wanted to say again that if you haven't been happy for years and years, you should probably unsub. Maybe the game just isn't for you anymore. When the game is no longer for me, I'm going to unsub too like a normal person instead of whatever all this is. Thanks, have a great day!

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Nah, I'm gonna main paladin and picto in DawnTrail so I can increase your queue time instead.

I'll have no need to unsub when I'm having fun playing a job that isn't an empty husk.

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Originally Posted by Kazmarek

Hey it's me, the bogeyman of the forums again. Just wanted to say again that if you haven't been happy for years and years, you should probably unsub. Maybe the game just isn't for you anymore. When the game is no longer for me, I'm going to unsub too like a normal person instead of whatever all this is. Thanks, have a great day!

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That's the same tired argument people use to counter criticism of ANY systemic issue be it in real life or in a videogame. "If you dont like it, just leave."
It's an empty argument that ends up fixing nothing. A deflection.

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Originally Posted by MisterNublet

Nah, I'm gonna main paladin and picto in DawnTrail so I can increase your queue time instead.

I'll have no need to unsub when I'm having fun playing a job that isn't an empty husk.

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Oh no! Not the queue times! /s
You know there's more than just you playing the game right? The world is not centered around you. You know what I do and what millions of others do to help queues? Switch to a tank or healer.

Xenosys posted a video about the thread.

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

XIV tubers outside of the bald warrior almost never have strong stances on the game and are always neutral, it honestly pretty annoying. I'd prefer is Zepla and Mr Happy weren't wishywashy with their opinion and either said they think the strike idea is stupid and that healers are fine or support it. But then again the toxic faux nice casual fanbase would probably rip them apart like they did with Zepla after her opinion on Endwalker because for some reason you can't like a game and admit that it has problems.

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Well good news, Mr. Happy called the healer strike is the dumbest thing he's ever seen. https://youtu.be/v1pheogEplw?t=379

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Originally Posted by CerusSerenade

That healers have a very simplified kit for dealing damage is a valid complaint, but that dungeons can be completed without a healer is overblown, as dungeons can also be completed without a tank.

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okay but hear me out,

a tankless clear shouldn't be possible either, "the bullet in my shoulder is overblown, there's a bullet in my foot too"

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

With the addition of Duty support, I think the putting pressure on healers argument is dumb now.
Just rename duty support to "story mode" keep them easy and make regular online dungeons hard enough that all roles are needed and you can't brainlessly go through them. Then everyone can play the story but the normal players can not have an incredible jump from normal mode to extreme/savage, where you actually have to use the kit you neglect as all roles in this game throughout the story.

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Having “Expert” roulette dungeons in duty finder be at minimum item level would be a step in the right direction.