Sorry Yoshi, but if you award the best weapon in the game by winning the lottery...

Might I suggest another reason why the i280 weapon was introduced to Diadem? Perhaps, because of the ARR relic weapon and nerfing of the encrypted tomestone from coil allowing easily obtainable i130 weapons backlash, they added i280 weapons to give raiders another option for a higher ilevel weapon to keep them interested through the end of the HW cycle?

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Another option that would be ignored because the requirements are way too tedious for the reward.

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I thought most people keep saying more options is better though? It's still another way to get i275 so isn't that good?

Also if it was only i275 maybe SE wouldn't have made it so rare, just a possibility.

Which would actually, in my opinion, benefit more players. I actually would have gone to farm them for alt jobs and people who didn't have relic or savage would have a way to get an i275 and it wouldn't be so rare like the i280 is and barely benefit no one...but hey that's just an idea :/

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Where were your complains when Creator was "the only option" ?

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You are making the wrong assumption that I actually care about getting the i280 weapon. I'm not going to bother; it's not worth my time.

So if you read my post properly you will see I am not complaining it is the only option since I don't actually care. It was an objective reply about their argument with some of my opinions about relic that I feel should have been top weapon for at least a month for the players who put time into it.

I was pointing out a flaw in their argument about options; NOT complaining about there being only one option.

All you have to do is notice what I wrote:

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Originally Posted by Miste

Heck if they had just released it a month after relic completion even if it was still i280 I wouldn't care.

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So if they added i280 at end of March I would have zero issue with it...so why do you think I am actually complaining about it being the only option even though I would have accepted it if it would have been added a bit later? Read carefully.

My only personal issue with the i280 weapon was how soon it was released after the final relic step (9 days). No other personal issues with it, but that doesn't mean I cannot make neutral objective replies about other player's grievances or say that people are allowed to voice their criticism.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Another option that would be ignored because the requirements are way too tedious for the reward.

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The requirement can be adjusted. Nobody said that with a 275 weapon from Diadem they should stick to their 0,01% chance to obtain one.

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Where were your complains when Creator was "the only option" ?

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There were always complaints that there are not enough "options" and with that implied "equal" options.

People didn't demand a new set of 280 or 290 items within a gear tier (people already complain that gear replacement is too fast). They are complaining that there are only 2 choices per slot.

As said... Diadem with a new designed 270 gearset + a 275 weapon and it would have been a success, incentive wise. People still do 24-man, although it gives only one upgrade per week and 260 stuff. It's far away from dead.


Nevertheless.. it's a fact that there were never any complaints like "we want faster gear replacement and faster ilvl rise, so please give us not only higher ilvl at a new gear tier, but 1-3 months before that."

Most people are either ok with the current pacing, but there are also a lot who find it's too fast. But where are the people who demanded something like this?
That alone is enough to estimate the backlash.

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Originally Posted by Llus

Might I suggest another reason why the i280 weapon was introduced to Diadem? Perhaps, because of the ARR relic weapon and nerfing of the encrypted tomestone from coil allowing easily obtainable i130 weapons backlash, they added i280 weapons to give raiders another option for a higher ilevel weapon to keep them interested through the end of the HW cycle?

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https://j.gifs.com/X6lkJo.gif

That's what raiders think of this garbage.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

That's what raiders think of this garbage.

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Why did they make a video about it though? :thinking:

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Of course it is perceived, because thats how progression in this game works. Let ask you, why do people play this game? Why do people play beyond the story, grinding relics, doing raids? There is no fixed endgame, but there is progression. An i275 for 6 months has represented endgame, a fixed goalpost that says "i have reached the end of progression, i have beaten the gear cycle", stormblood comes out in 3 months yes, but out of the blue Yoshi and the team decided to move the goalpost, right when people were about to reach it, and for some reason that's ok. It doesn't allow for more choice, it doesn't allow for Catchup, it simply "forces" the goalpost to involve diadem in a big way

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I don't get this whole "it forces it into Diadem", no it doesn't? You can beat all content without Diadem weapons... you want to know the end of progression? When you can beat the endgame raid. You can do that with i270/275 weapons, hell, Angered beat it with i250/i255 weapons, and to be honest, it's a load of wallop that people think i280 is a necessity at this point. Everyone is pushing this "You have to get the i280 weapon to even compete", well, I think your signature puts it very well. "You were just going to spend those 5 minutes bullshitting in Idyllshire anyway". :)

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Originally Posted by Miste

So just curious....to the people who are okay with SE's decision to put i280 weapons nine days after relic completion step..

What if at 4.0 the devs decide to do this....

Omega raid first 4 turns is released and the last boss fight in turn 4 drops i315 weapons.
BUT...9 days after this ^ is released they add an i315 RNG weapon to Diadem or PotD or Aquapolis or make the i315 relic step available to complete right then if you do the work.

Is this okay?

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Is it okay? No, because let's see: i275 step became available 27 Feb, i280 weapons became available 9 Mar, i275 Raid weapons were added September 26th.

Weaving a situation like that and then attempting to compare is a cheap shot at the people who don't have an issue. As far as I'm concerned, I don't have an issue because it's the end of an expansion/patch cycle. If this happened in the middle of a cycle, it'd be infuriating to me. It's not hypocrisy, it's just a simple matter of not mucking it up because it would mean i280 weapon holders would have an advantage at beating the next set of raids purely because raids operate in "Who can damage the most?", unless of course the next tier of gear began at i290 gear and weapons anyways...

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

Then why couldn't it have come IN 4.0? Or at least after 3.56 to help all the people crying about getting murdered by Vishap 2.0

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This is a fair point to make, at that point it'd be a leveling weapon, but I'm pretty sure Diadem being boring as is, is the reason why the i280 weapons are in, but to be honest, the people complaining don't get that they don't need the i280 weapons... and I'm honestly baffled why people expect they need them and are making such a commotion about what is nothing more than a medal for being extremely lucky.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Also if it was only i275 maybe SE wouldn't have made it so rare, just a possibility.

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Raiders and Anima owners wouldn't have done Diadem if the weapon was only i275. With an i280, everyone has a change of improving their gear. Weher they have to motivation to do it another matter, which can be discussed for just every other content.

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Originally Posted by Miste

You are making the wrong assumption that I actually care about getting the i280 weapon.

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Not you particularly. People complain about Diadem giving the best weapon for the next three months, yet they were totally fine for Creator giving the best weapon for the past 6 months.

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Originally Posted by Miste

My only personal issue with the i280 weapon was how soon it was released after the final relic step (9 days).

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Your personal issue should be that the Anima weapon was not released sooner. Zodiac weapons (i125) were released at the same time as Final Coil where i260 Anima was released 2 months after Creator Savage.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Zodiac weapons (i125) were released at the same time as Final Coil where i260 Anima was released 2 months after Creator Savage.

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We can thank their decision of making the Anima i210 at launch instead of i200 or some such item level, it massively threw off the Anima's progression as opposed to 2.0 where they increased the Allagan weapons to be +5 item levels, I'm not quite sure why they decided to do that, but yes, I believe that's the reason why.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

That's what raiders think of this garbage.

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Then what's the complaint if you don't want it? I didn't suggest you had to like the weapon or want it; I offered a hypothesis as to another reason they included the 280 weapon, to keep raiders interested. If you're not interested then they failed if that was their intent - however, given that you traded in that 280 weapon to the spoils collector it actually looks like they succeeded in their intent. For a lot of other people, they also appear to have succeeded in their intent and that is to keep them subscribed and interested through the end of the HW content and into SB by giving them a carrot; which because of the drop rates - it really is a carrot on a stick. I still fail to see how that invalidates - as so many have said - any work done in obtaining a creator weapon or anima weapon. I personally won't even try for the 280 weapon because I just despise the content itself. I hated Diadem 1 and, even though I haven't tried D2, that content just doesn't appeal to me.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Not you particularly. People complain about Diadem giving the best weapon for the next three months, yet they were totally fine for Creator giving the best weapon for the past 6 months.

.

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That's because Creator is the "hardest" content in the game so it SHOULD give the best gear. It was also expected that Anima was an alternative route to end game stats based on time vs skill, and most were ok with that. Even raiders worked on Anima on the side as Creator had bad stat rolls for a lot of jobs (Det/SS for DRG? Really?)

Besides, if the 280 is ultimately useless til Stormblood, why not add something more exciting and less offensive? Like a spellsword or a katana? Right now, I'm refusing to do diadem out of principle. However, if they were offering katanas, even of existing sets like Ironworks and Dreadwyrm, you better believe that I'd drop my A12S progression (which is at around 8% on 2nd puddles) in a heartbeat and thrown everything I had into chasing a katana. Can I just buy one at SB launch? Yes, but I'd want one NOW and I'd want to get my glamour started.

They could also just hand out a million gil, or a million MGP, or 100 Mhachi Matter, or 99 random primal tokens, or instacap all of your tomes, scrips, and seals, or cap your wolf marks, etc etc

You see that, that's a whole bunch of possible incentives that would have enticed raiders and anima grinders alike and doesn't disturb the balance of the end game. The 280 weapon is a copout, and a poorly thought out one at that

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Originally Posted by Llus

Then what's the complaint if you don't want it? I didn't suggest you had to like the weapon or want it; I offered a hypothesis as to another reason they included the 280 weapon, to keep raiders interested. If you're not interested then they failed if that was their intent - however, given that you traded in that 280 weapon to the spoils collector it actually looks like they succeeded in their intent.

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Well, the 280 was just a byproduct of obtaining the mount I think. It's not like we're farming the weapon to trade the in, lol.

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For a lot of other people, they also appear to have succeeded in their intent and that is to keep them subscribed and interested through the end of the HW content and into SB by giving them a carrot; which because of the drop rates - it really is a carrot on a stick. I still fail to see how that invalidates - as so many have said - any work done in obtaining a creator weapon or anima weapon. I personally won't even try for the 280 weapon because I just despise the content itself. I hated Diadem 1 and, even though I haven't tried D2, that content just doesn't appeal to me.

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I'm subscribed and stay subscribed, but to use a unexpected and absolutly unbalanced weapon as an incentive is just the most lame attemp to get people into a content.
Yes, savage had his "unique" weapon, too. But that one was in balance, only having a slight higher value than a good 270 one (+1 WD, 10ish more substats, 2 substats) and therefore competing on almost even ground with other ways to obtain high weapons.

It will be annoying that my farm groups (as soon as the lockout is removed) is competing for players with the lame diadem, just because they slapped a 280 weapon onto it.

Instead of making such a content, they could have made a supplementary content, like the scripture/savage gear, which are both used to complete a desired gear set. Some imagined their desired gear with a relic, some with an upgraded weapon, some with a 275 savage weapon, some gear from there, some gear from here, update from hunts, some materia slapped on it, etc...
Diadem is not supplementary, it's replacing. The proto ultima gear was well recieved, why do you think people were pleased with those (not talking about the Encounter, just about the rewards)?
Do you think a 280 right side would have recieved even better feedback and people would've been even more satisfied compared to the new 270 stuff we got? Maybe if only on out of the 24 man get a random one (not for their class) with 0,001% chance? Would that be cool?
No. It would've killed A9S in an instant and everyone would run Dun Scath and bail after Ultima. Wow, great.

And people complain because they feel the current decision is euqally bad.

Imagine PotD was not just only the fastest way of leveling, but with PotD you could also reach Level 61 (with additional stat boosts). Would this be bad and an unfair incentive towards the other level opportunites (not only difference in speed, but also value of the reward much higher)? Why? In Stormblood (only 3 months!!!) the Level cap is raised anyway. /shrug

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

There were always complaints that there are not enough "options" and with that implied "equal" options.

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Raiders frequently complained that Savage was not the only option. The real problem with options is not really to have one or several, but to have one content cover every need.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

As said... Diadem with a new designed 270 gearset + a 275 weapon and it would have been a success, incentive wise.

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No, it wouldn't. Raiders wouldn't group with "casuals" to gain a kind of weapon they already have, and Anima owners wouldn't do it either since their alt job would easily obtain a wapon powerful enough for any content, and their main already has the BiS weapon.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

People still do 24-man, although it gives only one upgrade per week and 260 stuff. It's far away from dead.

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"Once a week" is not particularly "alive". Especially if you intend it to still be alive for the next three months.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

it's a fact that there were never any complaints like "we want faster gear replacement and faster ilvl rise, so please give us not only higher ilvl at a new gear tier, but 1-3 months before that."

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It's a fact that lots of people of having nothing to do at all between 2.5 and 3.0.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

But where are the people who demanded something like this?

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All the people that asked for new relevant content do so beside Savage and are upset that their character only improves every 6 months.

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

That's because Creator is the "hardest" content in the game so it SHOULD give the best gear.

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It really depends on people, in fact. You have some skilled players totally unable to have the patience to farm for the Anima of the Diadem. For them, Anima is "harder". Savage has the highest skill requiement, but, first, skill is not the only thing that should be rewarded, and second, skill doesn't have to cover every reward.

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

Besides, if the 280 is ultimately useless til Stormblood, why not add something more exciting and less offensive? Like a spellsword or a katana?

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What's the point ? It's even more useless than an i280 weapon.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Imagine PotD was not just only the fastest way of leveling, but with PotD you could also reach Level 61 (with additional stat boosts). Would this be bad and an unfair incentive towards the other level opportunites (not only difference in speed, but also value of the reward much higher)? Why? In Stormblood (only 3 months!!!) the Level cap is raised anyway.

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It sure would be a great way to push people doing PotD again, yes. Or, even more, you make PotD a requirement to unlock a unique Necromancer job.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Raiders and Anima owners wouldn't have done Diadem if the weapon was only i275.

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Erm...I am a raider and I have my anima and I edited it in after so you might not have seen it but I said I would have done Diadem to get weapons for alt jobs if they were a bit easier to obtain and if SE made them i275 they might have been not so rare.

So uh...that statement is false.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Your personal issue should be that the Anima weapon was not released sooner.

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Erm...you can't just tell someone else what their personal issues should be. Like...this whole statement you made is pointless.

Had I known i280 diadem weapons were coming so close to the final relic step then I could have voiced my issue with it, but as I didn't know (and no one else knew either) then I can't have an issue with it can I?

So in the end the turning point where it became an issue was i280 weapons coming out without warning 9 days after final relic step so unless I can go back in time and know the future then my personal issue with it still exists and you can't just dictate to me what personal issues I should have or not have.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

Weaving a situation like that and then attempting to compare is a cheap shot

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You're making assumptions about me. I wasn't being hostile I was asking a question because I didn't understand some player's points of view. I wanted to know if, since they are fine with this system, if they are fine with the scenario I mentioned also. I was trying to understand, not to "cheap shot" anyone so that is incorrect.

Well since my issue was the relic only lasting 9 days then I can propose a solution then.

Most people like more options so I suggest adding another relic step that increases it to i280 and also adding something raiders can get to upgrade the savage weapon to i280. They can make it around the same difficulty for all 3 options just as long as they add the options then.

That should fix any problems people have. People who like the i280 diadem can still do it and still get it and relic and savage owners also have a way to get i280 versions of their weapons. Should be no problem there then and it adds more ways to get i280 weapons. This also solves the people having nothing to do because people have 3 options to make/get an i280.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Erm...you can't just tell someone else what their personal issues should be. Like...this whole statement you made is pointless.

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Considering people expected the game would follow the footsteps on ARR for its formula, the release for Anima steps is actually the biggest difference.

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Originally Posted by Miste

Most people like more options so I suggest adding another relic step that increases it to i280 and also adding something raiders can get to upgrade the savage weapon to i280. They can make it around the same difficulty for all 3 options just as long as they add the options then.

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What's the difference ? Since Diadem is the content that need to be promoted, would it be different if Emergency Missions randomly drops an item that could upgrade your Raid/Anima weapon while randomizing its stats ?

I'd like to come back to one of your earlier post, and more, importantly the answer you received from that. Yes, I would totally be okay to have Eureka give an i315 weapon at the same time as Omega1 is released. Because it's another option. And, since you did have an Anima weapon, you know that doing an Anima is not being lazy nor fightin against RNG for hours and hours.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

What's the point ? It's even more useless than an i280 weapon.
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Seeing is believing. The point is to directly hype for Stormblood by giving you something immediately useful when it hits and possibly for the long term if you like how it looks. People are already farming caster and monk gear now. Why not give them a taste of the main hands? Perhaps previewing the stances and trying glamours on their own characters will provide the push to sway them over if they were on the fence.

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

Seeing is believing. The point is to directly hype for Stormblood by giving you something immediately useful when it hits and possibly for the long term if you like how it looks.

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You will have tons of new weapons available for RDM and SAM when SB launches, even before having access to the Diadem if you're a new player. One of the first weapon I sought as a DRK what the 2.1 EX Primal weapon even though I could buy a stronger one form vendors...

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Originally Posted by Miste

You're making assumptions about me. I wasn't being hostile I was asking a question because I didn't understand some player's points of view. I wanted to know if, since they are fine with this system, if they are fine with the scenario I mentioned also. I was trying to understand, not to "cheap shot" anyone so that is incorrect.

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Fair enough, I apologize for any malicious intent in my post.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Raiders frequently complained that Savage was not the only option. The real problem with options is not really to have one or several, but to have one content cover every need.

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Why care about this really small minorty? There was only one real issue, that was withthe 210 relic and the Gordian weapon and Yoshi-P admitted himself that this was a bad decision, just alone because of the Ultra high difiicult of Gordias and the timeframes back then.

Never again this was a huge issue and since then there was almost no complaint thread regarding relic becoming raid level.

Please link a thread which complains about availability of 275 weapons with many supporting raiders in there. You won't find one.

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No, it wouldn't. Raiders wouldn't group with "casuals" to gain a kind of weapon they already have, and Anima owners wouldn't do it either since their alt job would easily obtain a wapon powerful enough for any content, and their main already has the BiS weapon.

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You don't seem to know very much about gearing in this game.
"They already have their BiS"? Wat? BiS changes as soon as more options on the same ilvl are added, rendering your current BiS not BiS anymore.

They would. They already join together with them in every relic related quest, they join together with them in every primal ex group, they join them in roulettes, which you need to get the normal 270 gear. They join them in 24-man, to get the upgrade and the proto-ultima drop and 260 gear for their 7th/8th/xxth Job.

And yes, of course I would join Diadem to get the 2-3 pieces everyone of my jobs need for the then-new BiS, if the acquisition rate is similar to savage/scripture/Protoultima.

And glamour is a thing, too, at least that was said about relic and savage weapon. So, at least for this reason, we would join you filthy casuals. :3

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"Once a week" is not particularly "alive". Especially if you intend it to still be alive for the next three months.

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I complete Dun Scath usually 3-4 times a week. 1-2 times to get a neat item, 2-3 times to help some fc mates. Yes, only MNK and NIN [that one is not even levelled] are below 240, but that's still 8 interesting items for me and glamour is a thing, too.

"Once a week" only applies if you don't want to have a specific gear piece.
And a Diadem with the same "popularity" as Dun Scath would still be considered a success. Why overdo it?

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It's a fact that lots of people of having nothing to do at all between 2.5 and 3.0.

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Well, they can do Diadem, all I'm saying is that a 280 weapon should not be needed as an incentive.

"Having nothing to do" = "Having no higher ilvl to obtain"? That's your opinion?

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All the people that asked for new relevant content do so beside Savage and are upset that their character only improves every 6 months.

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Please, link a thread. I think I saw something like this once, too, but well.. that wasn't well recieved as far as I remember. :D

People complaining about fast gear recycling are way in the majority if you look at the forums. Many complain that they can't gear all their jobs within a gear tier.
Additional high level sets help with that issue.

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It really depends on people, in fact. You have some skilled players totally unable to have the patience to farm for the Anima of the Diadem. For them, Anima is "harder". Savage has the highest skill requiement, but, first, skill is not the only thing that should be rewarded, and second, skill doesn't have to cover every reward.

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And still.. then make the rewards equal in value at least. Or comparable at least. And not a hidden ilvl 290 weapon with a 280 tag and destryoing absolutly every other weapon.
Savage weapons, although they were (for some jobs) BiS, never were that out of scale.

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It sure would be a great way to push people doing PotD again, yes. Or, even more, you make PotD a requirement to unlock a unique Necromancer job.

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But they already do it, because the current incentive (fast leveling) is enough.
Incentives are only working when total overkill? I don't think so.

Some of you are missing the point of it all, like really.
Anima was made 275 and like what a week later a 280 Weapon was introduced...
It is NOT the first time SE pulled off something similar but hey if you do not want to call them out on it by all means they will just continue this pattern.

oh boy maintenance on the 14th. you think they will change the ilvl of the weapon... Kappa

Cya in June

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Well, the 280 was just a byproduct of obtaining the mount I think. It's not like we're farming the weapon to trade the in, lol.

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Mount, minion, gear or weapon it's still content that attracts players even if the 280 is thrown in the trash.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

I'm subscribed and stay subscribed, but to use a unexpected and absolutly unbalanced weapon as an incentive is just the most lame attemp to get people into a content.
Yes, savage had his "unique" weapon, too. But that one was in balance, only having a slight higher value than a good 270 one (+1 WD, 10ish more substats, 2 substats) and therefore competing on almost even ground with other ways to obtain high weapons.

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From a strictly business perspective though, it's a great move. People that have never touched savage raids or don't have the patience for the anima weapon can try to farm for a BiS weapon just by zerging fates over and over. Gimmicky? absolutely; unbalanced? yea, I'd have to agree with that 100% - but so is giving an ever increasing echo (and even auto-echo). This just happens to be unique to the individual vs applied to the entire group. Unless you're trying to hit top parse numbers on fflogs though; it really doesn't do a whole lot for or against you individually (assuming you have an i270/i275 weapon already)

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

It will be annoying that my farm groups (as soon as the lockout is removed) is competing for players with the lame diadem, just because they slapped a 280 weapon onto it.

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Now, this is probably the best argument against the weapon I've seen. Because it prematurely ends A12S for mid-core raiders still farming for the creator weapon.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Instead of making such a content, they could have made a supplementary content, like the scripture/savage gear, which are both used to complete a desired gear set. Some imagined their desired gear with a relic, some with an upgraded weapon, some with a 275 savage weapon, some gear from there, some gear from here, update from hunts, some materia slapped on it, etc...
Diadem is not supplementary, it's replacing. The proto ultima gear was well recieved, why do you think people were pleased with those (not talking about the Encounter, just about the rewards)?
Do you think a 280 right side would have recieved even better feedback and people would've been even more satisfied compared to the new 270 stuff we got? Maybe if only on out of the 24 man get a random one (not for their class) with 0,001% chance? Would that be cool?
No. It would've killed A9S in an instant and everyone would run Dun Scath and bail after Ultima. Wow, great.

And people complain because they feel the current decision is euqally bad.

Imagine PotD was not just only the fastest way of leveling, but with PotD you could also reach Level 61 (with additional stat boosts). Would this be bad and an unfair incentive towards the other level opportunites (not only difference in speed, but also value of the reward much higher)? Why? In Stormblood (only 3 months!!!) the Level cap is raised anyway. /shrug

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I think the PotD argument is stretching a bit, but I understand where you're coming from.

As far as the i270 gear from the weekly DS raid, you're right it was much better received and if they'd given a 280 ultra-rare drop there would have been as much if not more complaints; but DS would be popping non-stop if they had and A9S would be completely dead (still, pretty much dead now except for late comers - I rarely see A9S parties other than learn in PF anymore).

The best argument against the 280 weapon is that it may prematurely shorten the lifespan of A12S for those that haven't gotten their first clear yet (for those that are doing it for gear only) and I agree a 275 weapon would have been better (or better yet, whatever the drop is that's needed to upgrade the shire weapon). But how long would that content run? You see how quickly other casual content dies - look at any casual PvP content, 24-man raids when there's no incentive to run it and you'd have the same drop-off on diadem - a month or two and then it'd be dead and people would beg for new content. We'll have to see, but I'm guessing that Diadem will hold attention through the end of HW for a LOT of people. I just hope the 280 weapon drop rate doesn't get nerfed (it likely will though - either that or it'll get tokenized).

In a couple months all the weapons and armor will be crap when stormblood releases :P

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Why care about this really small minorty?

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Because the "one content fits all reward" is a design issue. Whenever you have a new content in a odd patch, people talk about what rewards it should give and how it could not be higher than raid. To te point that any additionnal "catch-up" content is dead on arrival. PotD did well enough because you could do it solo.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Please link a thread which complains about availability of 275 weapons with many supporting raiders in there. You won't find one.

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That horse was beaten to death months ago. But don't worry, the release of Stormblood will revive it again, like the one where the Anima weapon is meaningless at the new level cap.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

And glamour is a thing, too, at least that was said about relic and savage weapon. So, at least for this reason, we would join you filthy casuals. :3

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Glamour is more overused as reward than FATES are as content.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

"Once a week" only applies if you don't want to have a specific gear piece.

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No, "once a week" applies if you drop your item.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

And a Diadem with the same "popularity" as Dun Scaith would still be considered a success. Why overdo it?

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Because Diadem is a grand scale content. People already act like jerks in dungeons, what do you think would happen in a 72 picked-up alliance ?

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

Well, they can do Diadem, all I'm saying is that a 280 weapon should not be needed as an incentive.

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For what ? Gold Saucer was the great additionnal content back in 2.5 and it failed horribly because it offered nothing but mounts and glamour.

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Originally Posted by Neophyte

But they already do it, because the current incentive (fast leveling) is enough.

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You don't need to go beyond floor 50 to reach max level.

The EM spawned yesterday and a tank pulled the legatus to the middle. Worse than coordinating children throwing food at eachother. How did this get past testing, honestly? Diadem is just a troll mode....

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

You will have tons of new weapons available for RDM and SAM when SB launches, even before having access to the Diadem if you're a new player. One of the first weapon I sought as a DRK what the 2.1 EX Primal weapon even though I could buy a stronger one form vendors...

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Vendor gear will ultimately outclass a 280 weapon on SB launch as well. Difference the Coven weapons will go in the trash while the Spellswords and Katanas will be kept by many as glam pieces. They'd also have the draw of being 100% new toys to pine after right now, even if they released existing sets such as Ironworks, Primals, or even Alexander. There would have been nothing to lose by making these the lottery prizes, and everything to gain

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

Vendor gear will ultimately outclass a 280 weapon on SB launch as well. Difference the Coven weapons will go in the trash while the Spellswords and Katanas will be kept by many as glam pieces. They'd also have the draw of being 100% new toys to pine after right now, even if they released existing sets such as Ironworks, Primals, or even Alexander. There would have been nothing to lose by making these the lottery prizes, and everything to gain

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That's an inaccurate statement, unless the designs come from elsewhere, the coven weapons actually have some pretty nifty designs to them and would be worthy as a glamour piece.

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Originally Posted by Aquaslash

Difference the Coven weapons will go in the trash while the Spellswords and Katanas will be kept by many as glam pieces.

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That's a pretty bold assumption considering we have absolutely no idea how the various Katanas and Spellswords wll look like. Keep in mind that RDM and SAM will start at 50 so we'll have unique weapon design from i90 to i275 already.

And again, grand scale content...71 people besides you who can screw the mission...insults, etc...glamour not worth it.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

The EM spawned yesterday and a tank pulled the legatus to the middle. Worse than coordinating children throwing food at eachother. How did this get past testing, honestly? Diadem is just a troll mode....

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I've seen people specifically state in chat they intentionally sabotage the EM fight so nobody gets i280 weapons. There's unfortunately no way to control this.

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Originally Posted by seraf

I've seen people specifically state in chat they intentionally sabotage the EM fight so nobody gets i280 weapons. There's unfortunately no way to control this.

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I hope people are reporting them, because that is pretty disgusting behavior.

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Originally Posted by seraf

I've seen people specifically state in chat they intentionally sabotage the EM fight so nobody gets i280 weapons. There's unfortunately no way to control this.

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So, in a way, I hope every reward in Stormblood requires than kind of coordination.
When people get bored of not progressing at all because they act like dicks toward each other, maybe we can build something out of this community...

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Originally Posted by Airget

That's an inaccurate statement, unless the designs come from elsewhere, the coven weapons actually have some pretty nifty designs to them and would be worthy as a glamour piece.

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Afaik, the coven weapons are recolored PVP gear. Specifically the set that has the Rising Dragon, Behemoth Queen, etc

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

That's a pretty bold assumption considering we have absolutely no idea how the various Katanas and Spellswords wll look like. Keep in mind that RDM and SAM will start at 50 so we'll have unique weapon design from i90 to i275 already.

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I see people with white/green weapons glamoured all the time, even pro raiders. Some people just prefer the simpler looks.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

glamour not worth it.

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Bruh. Did you forget what game this is? Glamour is the true endgame. Do you really think, in a game where 90% of the populace has a weeaboo name, that people wouldn't jump at the chance to LITERALLY:

*unsheate katana*
*teleports behind u*
*runs u through*
*nothing personel...kid*

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

The EM spawned yesterday and a tank pulled the legatus to the middle. Worse than coordinating children throwing food at eachother. How did this get past testing, honestly? Diadem is just a troll mode....

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Yeah feels like a raid boss with no coordination. Everyone has all be in sync with each other to clear. Otherwise you have to be lucky. And you only get one shot. Mess up once and you are done. Utter chaos.

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Originally Posted by seraf

I've seen people specifically state in chat they intentionally sabotage the EM fight so nobody gets i280 weapons. There's unfortunately no way to control this.

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Wow.... the saltiness of some of these people is real. Ruining other people's fun because they don't like that everyone has a chance to get a i280 weapon? I really hope they get a good 3 month ban for doing this!

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Originally Posted by Rainsworth

Wow.... the saltiness of some of these people is real. Ruining other people's fun because they don't like that everyone has a chance to get a i280 weapon? I really hope they get a good 3 month ban for doing this!

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Agreed. I hate the i280s, but I unsubbed and spoke my mind here, I didn't and would never do anything to ruin others' fun.

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Originally Posted by Rainsworth

Wow.... the saltiness of some of these people is real. Ruining other people's fun because they don't like that everyone has a chance to get a i280 weapon? I really hope they get a good 3 month ban for doing this!

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I wouldn't justify this kind of behaviour but SE brought it on themselves.

Can we really blame the faults of the community on the developers?

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Originally Posted by Remedi

Can we really blame the faults of the community on the developers?

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If it was the developers' actions that brought this response from the community then yes, they deserve part of the blame.

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Originally Posted by Remedi

Can we really blame the faults of the community on the developers?

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You're hard pressed to find an online game that isn't pushed to find exploitation, zergs or griefing. You're even harder pressed to find an online game that is void of those things. It's not all the developers fault, game communities are like water in a cracked vase- something's gonna leak sooner or later. All they can do is try to mend it until someone finds a new crack.

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Originally Posted by Xerek

If it was the developers' actions that brought this response from the community then yes, they deserve part of the blame.

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That's far too subjective of a statement to be valid though. Where do you draw the line? Is it at "fun"? I'd argue those griefers are having fun doing what they do, at the expense of others. It's pretty terrible to defend the actions of **** people, just because you don't agree with something the devs do to the game.

You can't logically blame the devs for the bad actions of others in this type of context. They created content, regardless if the individual liked it or not, and people are supposed to do it as intended (which doesn't involve messing with other peoples objectives). That'd be like blaming the victim(s) of a crime IRL for having existed at all, or to a lesser extent, blaming anyone frustrated by the griefers actions for taking part in something said griefer has problems with. No one is that high and mighty.

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Originally Posted by Rainsworth

Wow.... the saltiness of some of these people is real. Ruining other people's fun because they don't like that everyone has a chance to get a i280 weapon? I really hope they get a good 3 month ban for doing this!

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I argue maybe 4 months. Very few things sting more to such people than being refused access to something new, especially if it's not a very long removal of access. Anticipation and "unfair" treatment goes a very long way to making them suffer.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

My statement has truth otherwise people wouldn't be wiping the EM on purpose. AFK content.... of course people are going to be bored. Diadem 2.0 isn't even a revamp.

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People kick, harass and wipe for fun. If they don't like the content, they can simply not do it.
No opinion could justify acting like dicks to the rest of the community.