Dev blog: New Feast rewards

Please stop asking to make a PvP exclusive item non-exclusive.
It is not going to happen under S/E that is operating under Asian culture and philosophy.
They don't hand out reward for being last place like North American did to their youth.
It is either you have the strength and determination to claim the reward or you don't.

S/E always have track record of offering PvP exclusive item that is never available for PvE:

http://ffxiclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Stars_Cap

What are you are asking will never happens, you are just arguing for the purpose of arguing right now.
Compares to the available and requirement for this item, Top 100 is really nothing.
Max 10 cap each server. (some server only have 6)

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Originally Posted by Divinemights

Please stop asking to make a PvP exclusive item non-exclusive.
It is not going to happen under S/E that is operating under Asian culture and philosophy.
They don't hand out reward for being last place like North American did to their youth.
It is either you have the strength and determination to claim the reward or you don't.

S/E always have track record of offering PvP exclusive item that is never available for PvE:

http://ffxiclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Stars_Cap

What are you are asking will never happens, you are just arguing for the purpose of arguing right now.
Compares to the available and requirement for this item, Top 100 is really nothing.
Max 10 cap each server. (some server only have 6)

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If they want to make these rewards time sensitive, that's totally fine. But, they should also try and improve PvP in order to make people say "hey, that looks cool, I want to try and get that mount/glamour". They've gotten people to try PvP (look at the Garo event for example) but ultimately, it resulted in very few people actually doing so in the long run. It's just not that compelling or engaging. Couple that with the fact that we have bots running rampant and SE is doing nothing about it and...PvP is simply a mess. I think they need to fix everything wrong with PvP before they continue giving out these rewards. I have no issue with them, but SE needs to give MORE people a reason to try for them. And right now, a good many people simply don't think it's worth it.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

*snip*

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I misread where said peraon was ranked for that thread, my apologies. That does not remove the slew of evidence of ranked Feast botting. I will happily bet you money there is at least one botter in top 100 Feast. Too many people complain about it and post evidence of it for it not to be correct.

Second the closest I came to saying 'hellhounds for all' was pointing out that non-pvpers requested them so there was bound to be a stink and that nobody was asking for them free. I never said 'sure do it' I even pointed out how foolish it was to ask for them with wolf marks.

If they were to put a hellhound behind a grind achievement it needs to be different from the ranked ones somehow. Add a collar or a rug on the back or a particle effect but don't make it the same. You automagically assumed I was someone else out to devalue your achievement and got angry. That is why I responded.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

I have no issue with them, but SE needs to give MORE people a reason to try for them. And right now, a good many people simply don't think it's worth it.

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You will be surprised to find that result after this exclusive item is exactly opposite to what you have described. The Ballista player population received a spike until 2009 Salvage wiped out. As most of Ballista players are also active in end game PvE content.

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Originally Posted by Divinemights

You will be surprised to find that result after this exclusive item is exactly opposite to what you have described. The Ballista player population received a spike until 2009 Salvage wiped out. As most of Ballista players are also active in end game PvE content.

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2 completely different games, so...yeah.

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Originally Posted by Keridwyn

I misread where said peraon was ranked for that thread, my apologies. That does not remove the slew of evidence of ranked Feast botting. I will happily bet you money there is at least one botter in top 100 Feast. Too many people complain about it and post evidence of it for it not to be correct.

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Bots don't play well enough to be in the top 100. Fact. I await for you to point out the bot with proof thanks.

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Originally Posted by Keridwyn

Second the closest I came to saying 'hellhounds for all' was pointing out that non-pvpers requested them so there was bound to be a stink and that nobody was asking for them free. I never said 'sure do it' I even pointed out how foolish it was to ask for them with wolf marks.

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Originally Posted by Keridwyn

If they were to put a hellhound behind a grind achievement it needs to be different from the ranked ones somehow. Add a collar or a rug on the back or a particle effect but don't make it the same. You automagically assumed I was someone else out to devalue your achievement and got angry. That is why I responded.

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Let me be frank, I already know why people are upset with the exclusive mount. You repeatedly tell me that Casuals requested the mount, that PVP is full of cheaters, and that PVE players are not asking for them to be free. What are you trying to convince me of? Your entire "argument" is trying to rationalize the other sides feelings to me and yet at the same time you don't agree with them somehow. Interesting

It seems like people are just arguing with me for the sake of arguing. Just a waste of time

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Not wasting another post on this response but—

I see that I forgot to include that twisting words is also not a statement of fact.

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You said PVE doesn't have exclusives like PVP does. You are in fact, complaining/whining about it. It isn't twisting your words, you just don't want to admit it.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I didn’t say that “the majority” weren’t whining in this thread; actually, I never said anything about denying that whining was going on. I said that you weren’t pointing out “whining” with your condescending remarks and baseless attacks against people that happen to disagree with you—all you’re doing at that point is arguing for the sake of arguing; you can’t point out “whining” for someone who isn’t actually whining. The remarks you have made don’t point out anything, really; they’re just plain old rudeness.

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You say you never said people weren't whining, and in the same breathe say people I am debating with aren't whining. No words. You are really grasping here. Just give it up.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I also said that people can make suggestions without reflecting their wants, needs, or desires. I never said that everyone making suggestions was doing that.

I’d ask for a direct quote quoting where I said that no one was whining/the majority in this thread aren’t whining, but I’ll never get it. Just some condescending remark about how you’re going to tell me what I really said, or how I really feel.

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Here you go

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

you can’t point out “whining” for someone who isn’t actually whining.

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TIL nobody I was talking to was complaining about how SE was giving PVP Exclusives lol. But you actually know this isn't true.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

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As someone that has many unique items in other games, even sold one account to another player due to the items it had. I understand the value exclusive items have especially PvP related ones. I also understand the commitment one has to devote to ascertain the skill level and game sense to climb the ranks and reach the point of being a top tier player. In the end having something exclusive it is nice and knowing you have an item that no longer possible to get is cool. Nevertheless, let us be real though outside of those reasons please point out how providing others the same reward detracts from your own accomplishments obtaining said reward. Only person that can devalue a personal accomplishment is if the one that earned it, since said people has to let an outside factors detract from the value. Baring that in mind I will to consed that having an exclusive reward does provide motivation for some to take part in an actively.

So if I may ask do you object to timed exclusives, now I know they will never do this I am just wondering if you could point how this inherttly detracts from your value of your reward / accomplishment. For example the reward from the previous is made obtaining through some form of currency only obtained through ranked play after the next seasons rewards have already been sent to the top 100 players. This means that the top 100 players to who the reward would have two seasons of having that exclusive mount and as long as they keep reaching top 100 for every season they will have access to the exclusive rewards. Could even take it one step further and make a new currency that is tied to the rank system for that season. In this case when the rewards are granted to the top 100 for the next season said players can start to earn currency only granted only during that season by participating in the feast which can be spent to get the previous season rewards at the end of the season. Which means that the previous season rewards would only be available to earn during the following season since the currency is tied that that season.

Kindly could you please explain to me how the system above detracts from directly from your accomplishment, you still have your timed exclusive and as long as you keep getting top 100 you will always be ahead of the curb from those causal players. Either way I have no dog in this fight since I personally do not take part in an activity unless I enjoy what I am doing despite the rewards outside of extreme cases. Still interested to see how such system devalues your rewards in the grand scheme of things, since if that aspect of notoriety is important to you all you would have to do is keep getting top 100 each season.

This thread is 25 pages and counting. If the dev team ever needed to see precisely how the players feel about pvp ranked rewards, this is it.

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Originally Posted by Awha

As someone that has many unique items in other games, even sold one account to another player due to the items it had. I understand the value exclusive items have especially PvP related ones. I also understand the commitment one has to devote to ascertain the skill level and game sense to climb the ranks and reach the point of being a top tier player.In the end having something exclusive it is nice and knowing you have an item that no longer possible to get is cool. Nevertheless, let us be real though outside of those reasons please point out how providing others the same reward detracts from your own accomplishments obtaining said reward. Only person that can devalue a personal accomplishment is if the one that earned it, since said people has to let an outside factors detract from the value. Baring that in mind I will to consed that having an exclusive reward does provide motivation for some to take part in an actively.

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You really only say the same thing over and over again. Basically amounts to if you earn 1 million dollars through hard work, only you let the fact that some else got 1 million dollars for free detract from the satisfaction that you worked hard for your own 1 million dollars. You literally say this in every post. There really is nothing more to say about it, you repeating it over and over again isn't suddenly going to change minds.

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Originally Posted by Awha

So if I may ask do you object to timed exclusives, now I know they will never do this I am just wondering if you could point how this inherttly detracts from your value of your reward / accomplishment. For example the reward from the previous is made obtaining through some form of currency only obtained through ranked play after the next seasons rewards have already been sent to the top 100 players. This means that the top 100 players to who the reward would have two seasons of having that exclusive mount and as long as they keep reaching top 100 for every season they will have access to the exclusive rewards. Could even take it one step further and make a new currency that is tied to the rank system for that season. In this case when the rewards are granted to the top 100 for the next season said players can start to earn currency only granted only during that season by participating in the feast which can be spent to get the previous season rewards at the end of the season. Which means that the previous season rewards would only be available to earn during the following season since the currency is tied that that season.

Kindly could you please explain to me how the system above detracts from directly from your accomplishment, you still have your timed exclusive and as long as you keep getting top 100 you will always be ahead of the curb from those causal players. Either way I have no dog in this fight since I personally do not take part in an activity unless I enjoy what I am doing despite the rewards outside of extreme cases. Still interested to see how such system devalues your rewards in the grand scheme of things, since if that aspect of notoriety is important to you all you would have to do is keep getting top 100 each season.

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You can look above. There should be no reason that casual players that don't provide the same effort or skill should have access to the same rewards people put hard work into.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

This thread is 25 pages and counting. If the dev team ever needed to see precisely how the players feel about pvp ranked rewards, this is it.

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The community wants low effort avenues to gain access to rewards that were exclusive to top 100 players. Basically everything should be accessible for no effort, you have made this quite clear for a while now.

Looks like they’ve taken a cue from WoW with having exclusive pvp mounts for ranked play. I’m fine with that, really, but there’s one difference between here and WoW; in the latter, you could get different skins of the same mount. Generally the pvp ones had some form of armor on them vs. their more casually acquired alternatives (and I don’t mean that as a slight). There should be some sort of recolor or reskin version available for those not into pvp.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Snip . . .

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You still have your million though so why does it bother you so much? You still have your own satisfaction, that is what I do not understand. Why is your satisfaction for your accomplishment based around how few people were able to receive the goal. In the context of money I can see how giving everyone one million dollars would detract from the value, but for an item in a video game? I do not see it. Since the value of the item is derived by the value you put in it, the reward has no objective value like money. So you value your accomplishment and the rewards that come with it the effort another player put be it less or more for the same reward should not detract from the persevered value of your own reward, unless you let it.

Just because a causal can earn the item through a different means does not detract from what you personally went through to get said item, unless the sole reason you took part in the activity was for notoriety tied to said item then yes it would detract from the value of your accomplishment. It simply does not make sense to me why nothing can ever belittle the fact you were able to get top 100, and most certainly seeing causal pvpers with the same reward you earned in seasons past does not detract from the fact you made it to top 100 and earned the reward when it was relevant. I say it a lot because it does not make sense to me because it seems like your satisfaction is derived around how few people were able to reach the goalline, so help me understand your position.

To me it seems like you base the value of your accomplishments around how few people were able to reach the goal line instead of valuing the fact you were able to accomplish your goal which in this case was reaching top 100, you proved you were able to best many other competitors, and showed that you were clearly one of the best. Nothing can ever change that, so please help me understand how seeing a causal player with your reward makes your top 100 any less of a feat to your personally.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

The community wants low effort avenues to gain access to rewards that were exclusive to top 100 players. Basically everything should be accessible for no effort, you have made this quite clear for a while now.

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Your effort will always remain, you made it your goal to hit top 100 for the rewards you put in the work to reach said goal that effort is not going away, unless you are telling me that the fact you were able to best other players and place top 100 becomes meaningless because a random player was able to earn the same reward as you through a different means? Once again how does that make your feat of getting top 100 any less impressive. To other players in the future yes the reward will look less impressive since random players will generally assume that you got the reward through the grind instead of earning it. May I ask why does matter though since you will always know the truth, and those active within the community at the time of you obtaining said reward will also know the truth.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Snip . . .

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Mass influx of money has a proven negative impact on the economy, so that is why RMT or giving everyone one million dollars on a whim is objectively bad. I do not have the data so I cannot say for certain if your reward for PvP if it were handed to every player simply for logging in could have a negative impact to the mode itself. Though that has very little to do with the fact that the reward was given out more so that people took part in the activity simply for the reward and not the activity itself. Which comes down to a issue that SE should figure out, you know make the mode interesting and engaging so they do not have to bait people int playing said mode.

You still have not answered me as to why making an item obtainable through alternate inherently detracts effort and skill you displayed to earn said reward. It is not like we are talking about something that already has an objective value like money or any form of currency. You mentioned by would I team up for coil if I can buy the weapon. simple because I want to experience the content, I would like to take part in said activity. I do understand that progression is am important part of an RPG, but no one is asking for the removal of progression if a game provided an easier way to obtain an item that comes down to player choice if they will walk down that path let the player choose how they progress.

I think the reason we see this differently is due mindset. Way I see if someone finds something fun and enjoyable they will take part and do what needs to be done for as long as they find it enjoyable. If they do not they find short cuts, but those players take take the short cut have not lessen my enjoyment in what I am doing. More or less you keep asking if something can be obtained easily why bother working for it, in the sense of a video game. One real reason because they enjoy it. Rewards are nice, but I do not understand doing something simply for the reward. My issue is when you tie value of something to the effort that went into you I feel things get murky. Effort to a degree subjective, for some getting top 100 may have been easy, for others doing 1000 matches to farm some currency for an item might be extremely hard. Effort is funny like that, you personally feel effort amounts to more then the person that farmed 1000 matches but is it really? Who is to say since the value you place on your effort is based off what you personally value you it as.

Hope that sort of makes sense, lol English and I do not get along if you have not noticed.

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Originally Posted by Awha

You still have your million though so why does it bother you so much? You still have your own satisfaction, that is what I do not understand. Why is your satisfaction for your accomplishment based around how few people were able to receive the goal. In the context of money I can see how giving everyone one million dollars would detract from the value, but for an item in a video game? I do not see it.

Just because a causal can earn the item through a different means does not detract from what you personally went through to get said item, unless the sole reason you took part in the activity was for notoriety tied to said item then yes it would detract from the value of your accomplishment. It simply does not make sense to me why nothing can ever belittle the fact you were able to get top 100, and most certainly seeing causal pvpers with the same reward you earned in seasons past does not detract from the fact you made it to top 100 and earned the reward when it was relevant. Help me understand your position.

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You are really just repeating yourself. Do you actually have something else to say?

I will restate it one last time because, as stands you really don't provide any new argument for me to debate you with.

Why should players that don't provide the same effort/skill/hard work receive the same reward? Why should people get something other people had to work hard for? If an item is made widely available for nothing where is the incentive to actually do it the hard way? You don't seem to understand that a rpg such as FFXIV is about doing tasks that improve your character along the way in some form. If you literally make everything for free you literally just destroyed any sense of progression and in a way you just destroyed the game. Why team up for Ultimate Coil if you could just buy the achievement and weapon with gil? Why do anything if everything is mindlessly provided to you?

A good example is if everyone is just given 1 million dollars for free, whenever they want, where is the incentive to actually work?

I personally wouldn't be surprised if you supported the following:

Why should you be upset if someone used RMT to buy 100million gil while you worked hard for your 100million through crafting or other means? You still worked hard for your 100 million it doesn't matter! Meanwhile the games economy collapse because you somehow don't care people are using RMT.

There isn't much more to say, you may not like to admit it, but there is only value in rewards, money or whatever based on how hard it is to get it. You don't seem to appreciate that at all.

Why do people think that the alternatives are always easier and mindless? Use the current PvP system, place the old Feast rewards in a store. Make it so you can only buy them with collars. Be able to buy the collars with Wolf Marks (say 20k each), then you have to grind the hell out of PvP to get them. The store should have all the previous season's rewards but not the trophies, they should remain exclusive. Give the top 100 a title, like SCOB savage back in the day and a shit ton of collars. There, you have your bragging rights.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

You said PVE doesn't have exclusives like PVP does. You are in fact, complaining/whining about it. It isn't twisting your words, you just don't want to admit it.

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Or I am just stating a fact? Much like I did with the developers probably removing the level/item level sync for Ultimates introduced in Stormblood once 5.0 hits, since that has been the precendent set for every piece of content they ever released—all ARR content had level sync removed when HW came out; all HW content had its sync removed when SB came out; all SB content will more than likely have its sync removed once 5.0 comes out, and that will probably include Ultimate since that’s just the way developers do things. Personally, they could leave it synced forever. I don’t really care either way.

What you are doing is very much twisting words to suit your own rhetoric—just like you did with my mentioning them possibly removing the sync from Ultimate meaning that I want it removed so that I can steamroll through it for the rewards. I have no need to steamroll since I’m more than capable of clearing it as it currently stands, and I’m definitely not doing it for the rewards since the weapons are not that appealing and I much prefer my current title I use, even if “The Legend” is nice. But that’s all irrelevant to the conversation.

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You say you never said people weren't whining, and in the same breathe say people I am debating with aren't whining. No words. You are really grasping here. Just give it up.

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I said that I never said people weren’t whining, but that your remarks don’t point out “whining” so much as they are just condescending personal attacks. You’re debating with myself, Istaru, and Awha right now, and none of us are “whining” over wanting your shiny puppies or Hojo-chair.

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Here you go

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I’m guessing the quote you provided here is supposed to be some “proof” that I am contradicting myself? It’s not, but nice try.

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TIL nobody I was talking to was complaining about how SE was giving PVP Exclusives lol. But you actually know this isn't true.

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Discussing and complaining are two separate things. I’ll use my very first post to you as an example: I was just entering the discussion after pointing out a strawman in your argument about Legacy items (i.e., I consider them different since they’re from an entirely different game, so to use them as an example of exclusivity is a strawman and irrelevant to discussing FFXIV 2.0 exclusives). I gave some thoughts/opinions about the PvP mounts, and how I just disagreed with the idea of exclusivity in general when it comes to things—because they just serve as vanity items for people to use as bragging rights, but at the end of the day, they’re virtual pixels, and owning them doesn’t make you more special than the next guy (this is my opinion on them).

I also mentioned something about the consistency between PvP and PvE, and asked why couldn’t it just be the same; but it’s just asking a question. Said thoughts and opinions aren’t really complaints from my end, since I don’t care about the Feast or its mounts. Why would I complain about something I don’t care about? Maybe I am just trying to discuss something civilly on a discussion forum?

Alas, that is hard to do with your attitude from the very first response you had to me. After that, I’ll admit it wasn’t so much debating PvP as much as it was me getting fed up with your apparent need to attack my character because I dared bring up the idea that maybe your shiny Hellhounds be brought back much later on via achievements for people that would like a shot at them.

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Originally Posted by Awha

I am just wondering if you could point how this inherttly detracts from your value of your reward / accomplishment.

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Awha keeps asking you this question (i.e., “repeating himself” as you like to say) because you refuse to provide a straightforward answer without resorting to more snark and needless comments (example: your “I wouldn’t be surprised if you supported the following” remark). And he brings up a good point when he says that the only one who can devalue an item is the owner. If other people/more people having something detracts from its value to you (using the general “you” here, mind you), maybe it wasn’t that valuable to you in the first place as a mark/measure of your accomplishments, but only as something to hold over others so that you could brag.

People try to have reasonable discussions with you, but you won’t allow for that with the way you speak to them.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

There isn't much more to say, you may not like to admit it, but there is only value in rewards, money or whatever based on how hard it is to get it. You don't seem to appreciate that at all.

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That is your opinion. That is not a fact.

The reward for graduating college is a diploma. College can be challenging, yes, but it can also be very easy.
The reward you get for working is money. Work can be tiring, yes, but it can also be very simple.

The value in an item is not only determined by how hard it is to get. Maybe that is how you determine value, but your definitions of value do not apply to everyone else. Some of the most valuable things I own I put zero effort into receiving; actually, most are gifts given to me by people I love. Those are more valuable to me than my college degree (not to say it isn’t valuable, mind you, but that I find more value in the other things compared to it).

What you are defining is materialistic value.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Or I am just stating a fact? Much like I did with the developers probably removing the level/item level sync for Ultimates introduced in Stormblood once 5.0 hits, since that has been the precendent set for every piece of content they ever released—all ARR content had level sync removed when HW came out; all HW content had its sync removed when SB came out; all SB content will more than likely have its sync removed once 5.0 comes out, and that will probably include Ultimate since that’s just the way developers do things. Personally, they could leave it synced forever. I don’t really care either way.

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You personally believe PVP shouldn't have exclusives since PVE doesn't. That isn't a fact, it is your opinion, and you are in fact complaining about it. There is no word twisting, you have long echoed the sentiment.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

What you are doing is very much twisting words to suit your own rhetoric—just like you did with my mentioning them possibly removing the sync from Ultimate meaning that I want it removed so that I can steamroll through it for the rewards. I have no need to steamroll since I’m more than capable of clearing it as it currently stands, and I’m definitely not doing it for the rewards since the weapons are not that appealing and I much prefer my current title I use, even if “The Legend” is nice. But that’s all irrelevant to the conversation.

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You like to say I'm twisting your words, but i have repeatedly shown you the opposite. you just like repeating the phrase because you can't really defend your own thoughts and beliefs when you continue to deny them. It's ok.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I said that I never said people weren’t whining, but that your remarks don’t point out “whining” so much as they are just condescending personal attacks. You’re debating with myself, Istaru, and Awha right now, and none of us are “whining” over wanting your shiny puppies or Hojo-chair.

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If saying that people are whining is condescending, there is nothing I can do about it. If a fact is that upsetting to you maybe you should self reflect.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I’m guessing the quote you provided here is supposed to be some “proof” that I am contradicting myself? It’s not, but nice try.

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"I-it isn't BELIEVE ME"

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Discussing and complaining are two separate things. I’ll use my very first post to you as an example: I was just entering the discussion after pointing out a strawman in your argument about Legacy items (i.e., I consider them different since they’re from an entirely different game, so to use them as an example of exclusivity is a strawman and irrelevant to discussing FFXIV 2.0 exclusives). I gave some thoughts/opinions about the PvP mounts, and how I just disagreed with the idea of exclusivity in general when it comes to things—because they just serve as vanity items for people to use as bragging rights, but at the end of the day, they’re virtual pixels, and owning them doesn’t make you more special than the next guy (this is my opinion on them).

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Well this is FFXIV 3.0 and beyond. SE is perfectly within their right to innovate the game as they please. If you are trying to argue that SE shouldn't be trying different things then you are already on the losing end of the battle lol. And you may want to say having a achievement pretty much no one else has doesn't make people unique and special in relation to others, but that just isn't true. Someone got top 100 and someone else didn't, there is a clear difference. You seem to have a problem with people being unique and not all the "same" or "equal"

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I also mentioned something about the consistency between PvP and PvE, and asked why couldn’t it just be the same; but it’s just asking a question. Said thoughts and opinions aren’t really complaints from my end, since I don’t care about the Feast or its mounts. Why would I complain about something I don’t care about? Maybe I am just trying to discuss something civilly on a discussion forum?

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Why would you even talk about it if you didn't care about it. You literally say you don't like the idea of exclusives. It's obvious you do care to a extent otherwise you wouldn't even be a part of this conversation. Just contradictions everywhere on your part.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Alas, that is hard to do with your attitude from the very first response you had to me. After that, I’ll admit it wasn’t so much debating PvP as much as it was me getting fed up with your apparent need to attack my character because I dared bring up the idea that maybe your shiny Hellhounds be brought back much later on via achievements for people that would like a shot at them.

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Again, not my fault that whining and complain about how SE does certain things offends you. It's already quite clear you have a problem with the current system and you claiming you don't care or w.e is going to change that.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

That is your opinion. That is not a fact.

The reward for graduating college is a diploma. College can be challenging, yes, but it can also be very easy.
The reward you get for working is money. Work can be tiring, yes, but it can also be very simple.

The value in an item is not only determined by how hard it is to get. Maybe that is how you determine value, but your definitions of value do not apply to everyone else. Some of the most valuable things I own I put zero effort into receiving; actually, most are gifts given to me by people I love. Those are more valuable to me than my college degree (not to say it isn’t valuable, mind you, but that I find more value in the other things compared to it).

What you are defining is materialistic value.

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You pretty much ignored the entire point of the post. If you hold value in something that is relatively useless to society that's on you. We are talking about things that everyone can agree holds value either through extreme hard work/achievement or something similar.

You are suggesting that items that you have to work hard for should be made available to everyone in some easier fashion. That is just logically wrong and even immoral.

And you know what, a lot of what your are describing is personal value. That doesn't actually matter in this discussion.

Anyways I've reached my post limit again. It is quite funny you are still posting despite declaring you weren't going to anymore pages ago and that you don't care lol. contradicting yourself to the end

Edit: I've reached the post limit. If you guys are still complaining over what you can't achieve, I'll be back tomorrow ;]

Alright, so let's say they did change it up slightly, kept the same one shot only approach (as in if you miss the season, tough bananas), and only one person per season got a mount (as in top 1 in the entire game, not just datacentre), how would you feel about that Aviars? It'd make each reward even more unique. Let's also make it so once the new Ultimate drops, the old one becomes sealed off forevermore. And thus the fight can never be experienced again, nor can the rewards ever be obtained.

I think things need to be equal between both game modes.

If PvE rewards become easier to get over the time then so should PvP rewards.

If PvE rewards are not limited by time then neither should be PvP rewards.

The problem is that some people feel threatened that other people might want the opportunity to also earn their precious pixels.

No one here is saying we want to give pvp rewards out to all the unwashed masses for nothing. We're saying we would like the opportunity to earn them through similar means.

If you think that option devalues your precious pixels so much, then I would like to invite you to see alllllllllll the other items in game that have similarly been "devalued"

"Limited time" lightning gear
"Limited time" dragon quest gear
"Exclusive" mog cap
"Exclusive" items from china
"Exclusive" items from Amazon promotions
Need i continue?

Some PvE rewards are actually exclusive though?

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Originally Posted by zuzu-bq

Some PvE rewards are actually exclusive though?

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Only a small portion, most of which is old 1.x stuff. Even the minions they add to merchandise stopped having timed exclusives due to the number of complaints. PvP remains the lone holdout on exclusivity.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

Thank you, you were able to explain my point a lot better hopefully that will make it easier for them to answer my question.



Awha keeps asking you this question (i.e., “repeating himself” as you like to say) because you refuse to provide a straightforward answer without resorting to more snark and needless comments (example: your “I wouldn’t be surprised if you supported the following” remark). And he brings up a good point when he says that the only one who can devalue an item is the owner. If other people/more people having something detracts from its value to you (using the general “you” here, mind you), maybe it wasn’t that valuable to you in the first place as a mark/measure of your accomplishments, but only as something to hold over others so that you could brag.

People try to have reasonable discussions with you, but you won’t allow for that with the way you speak to them.



That is your opinion. That is not a fact.

The reward for graduating college is a diploma. College can be challenging, yes, but it can also be very easy.
The reward you get for working is money. Work can be tiring, yes, but it can also be very simple.

The value in an item is not only determined by how hard it is to get. Maybe that is how you determine value, but your definitions of value do not apply to everyone else. Some of the most valuable things I own I put zero effort into receiving; actually, most are gifts given to me by people I love. Those are more valuable to me than my college degree (not to say it isn’t valuable, mind you, but that I find more value in the other things compared to it).

What you are defining is materialistic value.

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Thank you, you were able to explain my point a lot better hopefully that will make it easier for them to answer the question.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Only a small portion, most of which is old 1.x stuff. Even the minions they add to merchandise stopped having timed exclusives due to the number of complaints. PvP remains the lone holdout on exclusivity.

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that's not even pve exclusive though. The only stuff that is exclusive but not pvp is stuff from parts of 1.0 that don't even exist anymore which is more like "whole other game exclusive" and merchandise bonuses which aren't any kind of gameplay exclusive.
Everything else is either always available and made easier as time goes on or added to mogstation six months later if it was event based

Maybe they should remove the arbitrary number of people who receive it, add ranked decay, and give the rewards to everyone Gold and above just like League does with Victorious skins. Give the players who reach Diamond the same mount but with sparklies.

It is still timed, it is still competitive, but it gives newbies and those with significantly less time a chance to give it a go.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

You personally believe PVP shouldn't have exclusives since PVE doesn't. That isn't a fact, it is your opinion, and you are in fact complaining about it. There is no word twisting, you have long echoed the sentiment.

You like to say I'm twisting your words, but i have repeatedly shown you the opposite. you just like repeating the phrase because you can't really defend your own thoughts and beliefs when you continue to deny them. It's ok.

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I’ll admit that I like consistency, and I don’t think that there should be any timed exclusives in this game really, because of the attitudes like what I’ve seen here feed off of them. But stating my opinion doesn’t equate to complaining or whining. Hard to believe, but people can state something without actually complaining about it.

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to state—verb
-to declare definitely or specifically: She stated her position on the case.
-to set forth formally in speech or writing: to state a hypothesis.
-to set forth in proper or definite form: to state a problem.
-to say.
-to fix or settle, as by authority.

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to complain—verb
-to express dissatisfaction, pain, uneasiness, censure, resentment, or grief; find fault: He complained constantly about the noise in the corridor.
-to tell of one's pains, ailments, etc.: to complain of a backache.
-to make a formal accusation: If you think you've been swindled, complain to the police.

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to whine—verb
-to utter a low, usually nasal, complaining cry or sound, as from uneasiness, discontent, peevishness, etc.: The puppies were whining from hunger.
-to snivel or complain in a peevish, self-pitying way: He is always whining about his problems.
—verb (used with object)
-to utter with or as if with a whine: I whined my litany of complaints.

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As for my thoughts, I can defend them very well, thank you. The examples of someone being unable to defend their arguments lie with remarks that debate the character of the opposing party versus the actual argument, or who deflect with needless snark. My posts may have had some light snark in them, but at least I don’t resort to trying to debunk your character.

As for the twisting words, let’s not forget:

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

I’m only saying I doubt they’ll consider leaving older Ultimates locked behind level and ilvl syncs when new expansions come out because there will be new Ultimates at that point, since they have claimed that UCoB is not the first and only of its kind. With a new expansion, they will probably figure that there’s no need to maintain the syncs anymore.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

What you think they will do is irrelevant. If that was true they wouldn't have added ilvl sync in the first place.

Nah the biggest point is the time exclusivity, and I have already said that if top 100 players from future seasons want to forfeit the current seasons reward for a past one, that would be fine. You seem to have a problem with people not having the talent or skill to be capable of obtaining such items or mounts. However Ultimate is already non-reachable for about 99.9% of the playerbase.

"Wow it's so hard SE please nerf and give me everything"

That is such a sad mentality

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Also Hyomin made the claim that they would probably nerf Ultimate to make it easy for people. This falls in line with her achievement solution which really is a want.

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The insinuation that I want Ultimate nerfed because I mentioned the item level sync possibly being removed in 5.0 because that is the precedent the developers have set since Heavensward. Nowhere in there did I claim I wanted it nerfed, or that it should be nerfed. Not what I said at all. Part twisting words, part putting new words in my mouth.

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If saying that people are whining is condescending, there is nothing I can do about it. If a fact is that upsetting to you maybe you should self reflect.

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I said that your remarks towards people are condescending.

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condescending—adjective
-showing or implying a usually patronizing descent from dignity or superiority: They resented the older neighbors' condescending cordiality.

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I suppose I should quote your condescending remarks that have nothing to do with you saying people are whining and everything to do with the fact that you feel like your exclusivity is threatened? Because I believe I have already quoted some throughout this thread.

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"I-it isn't BELIEVE ME"

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There you go again, putting words in my mouth. Please quote where I said that.

You can’t prove your own arguments so you resort to immature comments like that. Are we in 2nd grade? Prove your arguments with logic, not with this nonsense.

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Well this is FFXIV 3.0 and beyond. SE is perfectly within their right to innovate the game as they please. If you are trying to argue that SE shouldn't be trying different things then you are already on the losing end of the battle lol. And you may want to say having a achievement pretty much no one else has doesn't make people unique and special in relation to others, but that just isn't true. Someone got top 100 and someone else didn't, there is a clear difference. You seem to have a problem with people being unique and not all the "same" or "equal"

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You seem to have a problem with people being “equal”. You seem to want to feel special. Why is that?

And where did I argue that SE shouldn’t try new things? Nowhere. I don’t even know where you pulled that one from.

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Why would you even talk about it if you didn't care about it. You literally say you don't like the idea of exclusives. It's obvious you do care to a extent otherwise you wouldn't even be a part of this conversation. Just contradictions everywhere on your part.

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Because I’m trying to have a discussion? Sometimes when I have nothing to do, I go to a discussion forum and try to discuss things with people; considering when I first came into this thread I was waiting on a DPS queue, it was something to do.

People can discuss things that don’t interest them if they just want to have a discussion with other players, or understand why they feel the way they do. Which is pretty much what Awha is trying to do, but you keep brushing him off with your snark instead of providing a straight-forward polite answer. They will of course be far more passionate about things that hold their interest, but they can still attempt a discussion at something that does not.

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Again, not my fault that whining and complain about how SE does certain things offends you. It's already quite clear you have a problem with the current system and you claiming you don't care or w.e is going to change that.

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If giving feedback or thoughts/opinions on something is “being offended”... I have to say, that is news to me.

I don’t have a problem so much with the system right now as I do with your attitude. That being said, I think (and I am not alone in this) that SE needs to really look at making PvP itself more attractive to the general playerbase (this includes the Feast) without throwing in exclusive mounts to try and entice players into doing it. Considering the current state of even more “casual” PvP... This would call for a system revamp, which I think they should look in to. Maybe it would entice more players like me (those “casuals”) to actually give something like Ranked Feast a try. The mounts don’t do it because I don’t like the system, and I feel fairly confident when I say I’m not alone in that.

Adding in timed rewards is just a thinly veiled attempt to draw players into the mode. It’s not trying to fix the mode itself to make it more appealing, but giving the mode shinies in hopes people will fight to partitipate. While I don’t have hard numerical proof of this, I don’t think it’s working out for them, so they should probably consider actually looking at PvP in general instead of just throwing in mounts into it.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

You pretty much ignored the entire point of the post. If you hold value in something that is relatively useless to society that's on you. We are talking about things that everyone can agree holds value either through extreme hard work/achievement or something similar.

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Your definition of value is your own personal definition, regardless of what it’s referring to; it’s not the same for everyone. That’s why Awha is asking you what he is asking you: Why would it matter if others were eventually able to obtain a Hellhound or the Hojo-chair? Is it because your Hellhound or Hojo-chair will be devalued? The closest thing you gave to an answer is that definition, but if someone had to win 1,000 Feast matches 2 years after the Hellhounds were a thing, how is that somehow less effort than what you put in to it? Can you determine the value of effort?

I’m sorry, but that definition doesn’t apply to everyone. It obviously doesn’t apply to Awha, or he wouldn’t be asking you what he’s asking.

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You are suggesting that items that you have to work hard for should be made available to everyone in some easier fashion. That is just logically wrong and even immoral.

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Where did I say that? Quote, please.

Here’s what I actually think on these sort of things, before you start telling me what I actually think about them again:

I will use the Ultimate title as an example, since it’s using something that is hard to obtain and takes effort to get. Let’s say that I clear Ultimate at the end of Patch 4.2. Yay! Now, let’s say that they removed the sync in 5.0, and a bunch of people go in, in their i400 gear, and steamroll it. Okay, now they have the title. Well, I’m not miffed. Because I cleared it when it was relevant; I know I cleared it, I had the title for a year or more, and I enjoyed my synced experience. It doesn’t devalue the title for me if others can unsync it later. But I don’t place that much stock in virtual achievements.

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And you know what, a lot of what your are describing is personal value. That doesn't actually matter in this discussion.

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Except it does, because value is a subjective measure.

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Anyways I've reached my post limit again. It is quite funny you are still posting despite declaring you weren't going to anymore pages ago and that you don't care lol. contradicting yourself to the end

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Yeah, I did say I would stop because I didn’t want to waste my post count, but there is nothing else that I would probably use them on anyways, so why not. Feel free to say I’m contradicting myself there if you want. It may shock you, though, if I were to say that I am actually interested in this thread, though.

as someone mentioned earlier, WoW's gladiator mounts (top 1%) are recolored with armor. another good compromise is doing the same, like for instance the hellhounds for season 3 and 4 should've been armored in a way and recolored to not be red, but having a very unique and neat looking color, and there is an alternative hellhound mount obtained by some dungeon lets say, its the standard unarmored plain red model. would that ideology make everyone happy? i do understand how you all think its unfair for unique models to be limited and exclusive but i personally ENJOY that type of notion, the prestige in itself is rewarding.

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Originally Posted by Crit

as someone mentioned earlier, WoW's gladiator mounts (top 1%) are recolored with armor. another good compromise is doing the same, like for instance the hellhounds for season 3 and 4 should've been armored in a way and recolored to not be red, but having a very unique and neat looking color, and there is an alternative hellhound mount obtained by some dungeon lets say, its the standard unarmored plain red model. would that ideology make everyone happy? i do understand how you all think its unfair for unique models to be limited and exclusive but i personally ENJOY that type of notion, the prestige in itself is rewarding.

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This would be an excellent compromise, coming from someone who plays WoW.

for a more clear example of what i'm talking about, this is the WoW storm drake obtained from pve
http://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/screen...rake-mount.jpg


and this is one of the time limited exclusive pvp storm drakes for the top 1%
https://media.mmo-champion.com/image...mDragon203.jpg

See, Crit, this is why I like you. This would be a compromise that would be fair to everyone. Although I still think they should fix the glaring issues in pvp, rewards notwithstanding. You can't put a glittery bandaid over a wound and hope people will cut themselves for it.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

You pretty much ignored the entire point of the post. If you hold value in something that is relatively useless to society that's on you.

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In the grand scheme of things the pixels you earn in this game are relatively useless. End of the day society does not care about the value one attributives to "relatively useless" things only those that have an interest in said item care about the value and even if they made it easier to get the item said community has no reason to not value the items importance so to speak since it is not the item itself that holds the value but what the item represents, aka in this case your effort and skill. This will still remain within your local community in this case PvP.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

We are talking about things that everyone can agree holds value either through extreme hard work/achievement or something similar.

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Clearly not everyone can agree that top 100 items inherently hold any value. This is where our disagreement I think stems from. You feel that hard work/achievement in itself are reason enough as to why someone should value the rewards you obtained through your accomplishments.

Do not get me wrong I do agree that you personally should hold value for your accomplishments but I do not think that means due to the effort you put into something inherently gives your accomplishments collective value. Hope that makes sense. Guess what I am trying to say just because your value something does not mean I have to attribute the same value. More or less why do you get to make the choice how the collective should attribute the value of something?

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Originally Posted by Aviars

And you know what, a lot of what your are describing is personal value. That doesn't actually matter in this discussion.

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Value is subjective, like it our not the collective does not to agree with what you hold as valuable, and if you let that effect the value of something you earned then I am sorry. Do not let other dictate the value of something you earned, undermine the effort and time that went into reaching your goal no matter how long it takes. You are the only person that can rob the value an accomplishment, no one else.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

You are suggesting that items that you have to work hard for should be made available to everyone in some easier fashion. That is just logically wrong and even immoral.

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I will use Shadowmourne, my guild in WoW during WoLK came together and I happened to be the second person on the server to complete the weapon. As the years passed Shadowmourne became more common, and even if one it rains Shadowmourne's from sky it would not detract from the collective effort that went into earning that weapon. I will always hold it dear as silly as that sounds. Not because of the item itself but went into getting said item the experience of earning it is where I personally attribute the value.

Though if you do not mind how is it logically wrong and immoral to obtain something through easier means. With progression don't things inherently become easier as time goes on, does that detract from past accomplishments.

Things through out life have become easier as time goes on. Take old school sports records they get broken but that does not detract from accomplishments of the past record holders. Maybe not the best example but hope you get what I am trying to get at.

Also let us be civil about this we are just trying to have a conversation.

Because people seem to just repeat themselves over and over again I will just gather up every reason people think PVP shouldn't have exclusive rewards from what I observed and debunk them one by one.

1. SE should be consistent. PVP is the only game mode that offers a exclusive item that is only obtainable by 100 people per datacenter. It is unfair that PVP has this privilege.

First off, Square Enix is by no means obligated to stay within their trademarked and predicable ExtremePrimal + Savage Raid into 24man Raid/repeat and nothing else. Square Enix is allowed and ALSO ENCOURAGED to think outside of the box and provide the community with new ways to compete and play the game. Just because it upsets you that Square Enix is doing something new and different does not mean they are in the wrong.

If people are so insistent on Square Enix not changing why not complain about Ultimate Coil? It offers unprecedented difficulty, it offers a best in slot weapon outside of savage raids and title for that difficulty, it lies outside of the cookie cutter patch cycles that you've come to know/expect and it also features ilvl syncs even after it's gear relevancy. It is quite clearly a contradiction in their entire argument. Why don't people complain about that? I have my own thoughts about why that is, but I'll let you guys stew that one over.

2. Feast is full of cheaters, it shouldn't have exclusive rewards because of it.

I for one know through playing Feast since season 1 that cheating is not as widespread as you tend to think. However that isn't really relevant to what I am about to say. There are MANY things in this game that people cheat in, people cheat in savage raids, ultimate coil and pretty much anything else you can think of in this game. Does that somehow make it necessary for SE to provide alternative and easier ways for people to obtain said items in those game modes? Absolutely not.

To go further RMT is a huge problem in this game, people can buy 100million gil with a swipe of a credit card. Does that mean Square Enix is supposed to hand people gil due to the fact that people RMT? 100% no.

You can argue that Square Enix needs to step up their game in regards to cheating, but that doesn't mean you advocate for changes to the game itself to make it as easy as cheating.

3. PVE players wanted this mount/gear, pve players deserve it more than PVP players.

Probably one of the more transparent reasons out there, the community in general demands and wants everything. Why should PVE have a monopoly on all unique mounts? Just because it exists? Just to remind you PVP is in fact a part of FFXIV, it's pretty much impossible for content to be created for PVP that isn't somehow related to PVE in some vague and obscure way. The gorilla robot mount in rival wings is a good example, it is eerily similar to Garlean magitek and subsequently the Magna Roader boss in Castrum Abania. Is it somehow now taboo that PVP has this mount? You tell me.

I do wonder why people didn't complain about that? I will answer this with the next point.

4. Top 100 is WAY to hard for the normal player, it isn't fair for people that are incapable of being in the top 100.

This is a doozy, but people do COMPLAIN that they have to be better than other people in order to receive certain mounts or items. THAT IS THE NATURE OF PVP. It is the main reason why you don't see people whining over mounts like the Gorilla mount that Rival Wings provides. It is because it is TOO HARD. Which I now say this, why shouldn't hard work, talent, skill, practice, time and so on be rewarded with a unique item? Why are people allergic to the prospect of people being better than them? I think for the most part it is because the top 100 is getting rewarded with something they want. You never saw people complain about the hellhound earrings provided, despite the that, oh wow, they are related to something you find in void ark....... It is purely because people see something that they want that they start to complain.

There should be no reason past or current items provided for top 100 should be available for current users through relatively easier means. Especially since Square Enix PROMISED that these items would not be available after the fact, that they would be exclusive forever. I tend to think Square Enix should keep their word.

And to the people that say that Savage raids or Ultimate coil don't provide exclusive mounts, go back to my explanation of Point #1, it is enlightening.



There are also other reasons people complain, but many of them can be debunked with the point I made in Number 1.

To conclude my big wall of text. I just want to say Square Enix is trying to innovate their game by fostering the sense of competition in PVP through the use of unique rewards. There is nothing wrong with Square Enix rewarding people for extraordinary effort and skill. Sometimes you have to accept that NOT EVERYTHING IS MEANT FOR YOU. Real life is the same way, you just got to deal with it.

Hopefully the entitled attitude for access to absolutely everything goes away. Thanks for reading.

Edit: This will probably be my last post on the matter. There is no more reason for me to stay in here longer than I have explaining the same points over and over again for the last couple days. See you guys in the next thread complaining about a reward they can't obtain. Cheers

Edit2: some typos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qb-h0sXkH4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybOvddwpJAg


Also please be excited for when all your shit inevitably gets ganked for the Mog Station/throwaway model reuse to save some pennies on art assets. Nothing in this game is sacred. I'll try to remember to laugh if the vaunted "more expensive than Fenrir" MGP stuff winds up being some of the earlier Feast season glamours/mounts. They put Garo's stuff there, after all.

They've had this "exclusive feast only season rewards" for going on two years ago. It doesn't draw people to the mode or foster any real spirit of competition. You can't work for it, because pvp players have discovered that if you rush the season early and just stop playing, no one will be able to get any queues to challenge you. It's actually a perverse incentive, since the more people who play the less percentage of people who can get the mount in the first place.

people should just be honest and say "i deserve this for suffering through enough feast and all its brokenness to place." then its ok imo.

TBH this is annoying, but at this point, we're hoping to God eureka doesn't suck. Bigger worries.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

Because peopleseem to just repeat themselves over and over again I will just gather up every reason people think PVP shouldn't have exclusive rewards from what I observed and debunk them one by one.

1. SE should be consistent. PVP is the only game mode that offers a exclusive item that is only obtainable by 100 people per datacenter. It is unfair that PVP has this privilege.

First off, Square Enix is by no means obligated to stay within their trademarked and predicable ExtremePrimal + Savage Raid into 24man Raid/repeat and nothing else. Square Enix is allowed and ALSO ENCOURAGED to think outside of the box and provide the community with new ways to compete and play the game. Just because it upsets you that Square Enix is doing something new and different does not mean they are in the wrong.

If people are so insistent on Square Enix not changing why not complain about Ultimate Coil? It offers unprecedented difficulty, it offers a best in slot weapon outside of savage raids and title for that difficulty, it lies outside of the cookie cutter patch cycles that you've come to know/expect and it also features ilvl syncs even after it's gear relevancy. It is quite clearly a contradiction in their entire argument. Why don't people complain about that? I have my own thoughts about why that is, but I'll let you guys stew that one over.

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You're not debunking anything there, you're just stating that you want it to stay exclusive "just because", that's not a reason. I'd rather they keep things fair than keep unfairness "just because".

Ultimate coil is not time exclusive and the weapon has the same ilvl as savage weapons, it also comes after savage weapons, and you are even expected to have max ilvl before tackling it.

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Originally Posted by alimdia

You're not debunking anything there, you're just stating that you want it to stay exclusive "just because", that's not a reason. I'd rather they keep things fair than keep unfairness "just because".

Ultimate coil is not time exclusive and the weapon has the same ilvl as savage weapons, it also comes after savage weapons, and you are even expected to have max ilvl before tackling it.

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he just said the reason why they should stay exclusive is because its the natural spirit of competition LOL, i'm starting to see what he means by people completely ignoring his statements. it doesn't have to fair when the whole premise of the rewards existing is through skill. by your logic i can say "those who cleared o8s and got their weapon is unfair just because they're better than me"

Limited to 100 people probably won't get a lot of fresh blood. You can queue with a friend for Feast right? But why bring a friend who might bump you down to 101.

You know what caused a PVP surge for months and months? Garo. You know what wasn't limited to 100 people? Garo. You know what wasn't a horrible, soulless grind to get every achievement...

It's like they just don't learn. Those who forget the past are doomed to piss off their playerbase every other patch.

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Originally Posted by NolLacnala

Limited to 100 people probably won't get a lot of fresh blood. You can queue with a friend for Feast right? But why bring a friend who might bump you down to 101.

You know what caused a PVP surge for months and months? Garo. You know what wasn't limited to 100 people? Garo. You know what wasn't a horrible, soulless grind to get every achievement...

It's like they just don't learn. Those who forget the past are doomed to piss off their playerbase every other patch.

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I didn't mind PvP prior to Garo, but...man, I grinded the crap out of that until I had all 3 mounts and the gear I wanted. It really revitalized the PvP scene for a few weeks. There's just other issues that need fixing now which have already been mentioned in this thread. Limited time rewards won't get more people to play PvP. They can stay for all I care, but if the goal is to get more people into it...it's not working. They just need to make it more worthwhile. Also actually fun. I probably would have queued for FL roulette when I came back about 3 weeks ago, but I already had the marks for the new set for SAM, so...yeah. Would have been done after I finished that grind anyway until the next rewards are introduced.

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Originally Posted by Mutemutt

And I'm not sure why you think limiting the amount of ranked games one can play would be a good idea. I can't think of any game with a pvp season that has a limit like that, and for good reason; it's always time based from what I can see.

In case you're wondering, I think the best way for SE to get more people to participate in ranked feast would be to offer better rewards through the wolf collar system they only barely just made. I don't think the mount for the top 100 absolutely has to be one of the things offer by the wolf collars though.

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Because that would make it more competitive. For example they could say that you have to do like 200 matches in the season (which is still a lot for the non-pvpers) and if someone only wins half of them they might be at the top at the start of the season but might also not get it at the end because someone with more skill came and won like 80% of it. This way more competitive than someone just having lots of time at the start and then sit on it. I even pointed out that we might not need such a limit if they would introduce a rank decay. This way people cant simply sit on their wins because they would lose their rank over time and thus the season would be alive till the very end. Anything like that is better than what we have now.

Seeing how SE puts more glamour and mounts behind PVP they seem to believe that those are the carrots that people need to go there. Thus having the mount still out of reach might not increase the participation. I mean you dont see threads about the exclusive gear and stuff, its mostly just the mounts and thus they should be part of that too.

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Originally Posted by Aviars

This may be a foreign concept to many people in FF14 but not everything is made specifically for you. SE made it top 100 for a reason. They want The Feast to be a competition and the rewards that only the top 100 receive reflect that. Just because you are decently skilled at the game doesn't mean you are also a top 100 player and deserve it, that is the nature of competition. Not everyone gets a medal.

I find it quite strange so many people think they should have a significantly easier option to obtain the same rewards as people who got to the top 100. You basically invalidated the competition. If I could get 1 million dollars in a extremely easy way like a guaranteed lottery compared to creating a successful business, which would you do? Why work your butt off when you can get it for free? This is basically the mentality of the majority of people complaining in this thread and it is sad.

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Then they should introduce the system for savage too! Because lets be honest..savage is still harder than PVP..especially Ultimate. And yet there is no restriction there.

I already posted that the Feast cant be a true competition as long as cheaters and alt characters still exist and as long as no rank decay is there..because that will just lose every point of it being a competition.

Also why are you always saying that it should be the easy way? We even said that it should use the collar system and should be expensive there so that people need to do a lot of seasons and be at least decent at that to get the chance. Also if its a competition, how about just putting a title and a trophy there? Or would that suddenly not be enough?

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Originally Posted by Crit

for a more clear example of what i'm talking about, this is the WoW storm drake obtained from pve

and this is one of the time limited exclusive pvp storm drakes for the top 1%

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I really don't want them to go the same way like WoW, they sometimes have 100 reskins for 1 ugly mount, it gets very excessive.

What you don't see, another difference is the mountspeed. Arena mounts were usually faster than all other mounts in the wow game. This might be more interesting to me.