Don't like Blue Mage? Here is how to convince SE to change it...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Because Blue Mage is built on chosing your skills.

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No, Blue Mage is built on Acquiring skills and then using them at the right time.

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Originally Posted by Daniolaut

Wait. People don’t like Blue Mage?

And complaining?

You have 15 other jobs to play as. I sure hope if you’re complianing about BLU you have all 15 others leveled and geared.

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Yes, yes I do. Does that make my opinion worth more than anyone else? No, it doesn't. Terrible reasoning.

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Originally Posted by Daniolaut

Wait. People don’t like Blue Mage?

And complaining?

You have 15 other jobs to play as. I sure hope if you’re complianing about BLU you have all 15 others leveled and geared.

I 100% support this idea of breathing life into the open world. If you don’t like it don’t be play it. That’s your own fault and your own problem. And no one else’s but your own.

I welcome all content for all different types of players. Not everyone plays FFlog.. I mean only does raid.

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So.... Tanks and Healers should be happy that they don't get new jobs to play because they have 3 other jobs to choose from?

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

So.... Tanks and Healers should be happy that they don't get new jobs to play because they have 3 other jobs to choose from?

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Yes. Every single tank and healer that complained during the SB launch was a huge child.

Well... nice to see that there's another job i won't ever touch. Im gonna be honest, SE needs to do more with tanks and heals, i believe rdms and sams werent a bad thing (but a good amount of people who play are crapy players), but a healer at the end of the Expac would of been way better. I could wait on the new tank due "story purposes". Either way, im gonna be more pissed if drk for the new expac doesnt get love cause. I still think blue mage is gonna suck regardless

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

Yes. Every single tank and healer that complained during the SB launch was a huge child.

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Here we see a comical missing of the point.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

No, Blue Mage is built on Acquiring skills and then using them at the right time.

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By that logic, DRG is built on angsty DRG quests and Monk on guiding lost princes and redeeming their students.

Skill acquisition, unless unable pivotal to a fight before which they cannot be acquired, has little to no bearing on combat gameplay. Only the latter part matters. What do we choose to use to fit the situation?

Most people didn't play Quina just to eat things. They played Quina because of the extreme variety in high value skills s/he/it brought. It's the toolkit, not the means of acquisition, that ultimately define BLU.

Does that mean I'd be content with quest-based acquisition? Probably not; I think the acquisition method offers too much valuable excuse to improve upon the open world and old content to forgo the opportunity, and I highly suspect they toolkit size would be reduced if given through job quests (unless they were pseudo-quests that amount to little more than Hunt Marks, but now complete with progress and directions to ensure people know what they're missing). But neither would I be content with an overly limited or redundant set of monster skills acquired through defeating specific enemies, either, because that, too, diminishes the toolkit itself.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

By that logic, DRG is built on angsty DRG quests and Monk on guiding lost princes and redeeming their students.

Skill acquisition, unless unable pivotal to a fight before which they cannot be acquired, has little to no bearing on combat gameplay. Only the latter part matters. What do we choose to use to fit the situation?

Most people didn't play Quina just to eat things. They played Quina because of the extreme variety in high value skills s/he/it brought. It's the toolkit, not the means of acquisition, that ultimately define BLU.
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100% agreed. Blue Mages of the past (in Final Fantasy games) worked with your party in combat which is why I'm not a fan of the No Duty Finder restriction.

Just want to show my support for this topic again.

We are seeing a lot of backlash against other companies in the industry that are taking for granted their existing customers in pursuit of a new market. That's not quite what's going on here with limited jobs but it's awfully close. Your player base is not a monolith and that does go both ways. There probably should have been less focus on endgame content and had content spread out a bit more. That could slow down the patch cycle and/or take longer to get some content out but that would probably be for the best.

Not all of us were complaining about the game you had designed. We enjoyed it a lot. There's nothing wrong for trying to get new people to try out the game and make an often neglected part of your player base happy. There is a lot wrong with pushing aside the other part of your player base that wanted more content in the same style as the rest of the game.

Focus on the middle ground and take the time needed to get there.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Yes, yes I do. Does that make my opinion worth more than anyone else? No, it doesn't. Terrible reasoning.

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No I’m 100% convinced it’s perfectly sound reasoning.

Just because you don’t grasp it or agree doesn’t change it’s value. I don’t do Pagos. Cause I don’t like it. It’s like telling them they should make more map content instead of Pagos. My say isn’t and won’t trump another players because they like Pagos and not maps.

So if you’re complaining about BLU, and you don’t even have the other classes leveled, how can you possibly know BLU will be your “main” and SE *must* make it in such a way that it’s raid ready right now or don’t release it? That’s ludicrous.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

So.... Tanks and Healers should be happy that they don't get new jobs to play because they have 3 other jobs to choose from?

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What does this have anything to do with tanks or healer? Absolutely nothing. No idea where you’re even discussing those 2 roles about BLU. It’s a completely separate concept. Raiders got 2 iterations of ultimate content (which I participated in mind you) and that’s content for less than 5% of the player base.

I am 100% convinced BLU will be experienced and enjoyed by more than 5% of the player base


Now... would anyone actually like to talk about BLU and how it’s “bad” for them or the community. Or say something that’s more concrete that I could respond to?

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Originally Posted by Daniolaut

Now... would anyone actually like to talk about BLU and how it’s “bad” for them or the community. Or say something that’s more concrete that I could respond to?

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It's similar to the Diablo Immortal controversy. Both shouldn't have been hyped up in the ways they were but that's not what the blu outrage is really over.

We are fine that there is content like this (diablo immortal) but think that there should have also been something for the people the people that wanted to main blue mage in the full game (diablo 4). It would be fine if they announced that full blue mage (diablo 4) would be coming but was not ready yet and they needed more time while still making content for other types of people (mobile games). Instead of "working on several projects", we got this slide.

https://i.imgur.com/2KkkZeN.png http://

So the feeling is that the only hope is if they change their minds in response to our feedback.
If they were to do the announcement, most of the backlash would go away very quickly.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

It's similar to the Diablo Immortal controversy. Both shouldn't have been hyped up in the ways they were but that's not what the blu outrage is really over.

We are fine that there is content like this (diablo immortal) but think that there should have also been something for the people the people that wanted to main blue mage in the full game (diablo 4). It would be fine if they announced that full blue mage (diablo 4) would be coming but was not ready yet and they needed more time while still making content for other types of people (mobile games). So if they were to do the announcement, most of the backlash would go away very quickly. Instead of "working on several projects", we got this slide.

https://i.imgur.com/2KkkZeN.png http://

So the feeling is that the only hope is if they change their minds in response to our feedback.

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Please don't compare the two, one single job that may or may not have ever been added otherwise being added to a game in a way some are unhappy with, is not the same as a whole PC franchise being told it's next major instalment is on mobile only.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

Please don't compare the two, one single job that may or may not have ever been added otherwise being added to a game in a way some are unhappy with, is not the same as a whole PC franchise being told it's next major instalment is on mobile only.

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It is comparable because both situations have parts (or most) of the player base feeling like they are being left behind in pursuit of a "new market"/appease other players than the people that supported the franchise/game as it was. Obviously the scale is way different but the feeling of "it's fine that they are doing this but don't forget about us" is present in both situations.

We should be pushing for content for BOTH sides and not looking at things as a zero-sum game.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

It is comparable because both situations have parts (or most) of the player base feeling like they are being left behind in pursuit of a "new market"/appease other players than the people that supported the franchise/game as it was. Obviously the scale is way different but the feeling of "it's fine that they are doing this but don't forget about us" is present in both situations.

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Except one is taking a very small part of a whole and changing it while one is taking the entire thing and changing it. Your comparison only holds if like in Diablo's case the majority of the core fan base for 14 were being presented with something that radically changed their whole gaming experience going forwards. One single job is not even close to an entire game.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

Except one is taking a very small part of a whole and changing it while one is taking the entire thing and changing it. Your comparison only holds if like in Diablo's case the majority of the core fan base for 14 were being presented with something that radically changed their whole gaming experience going forwards. One single job is not even close to an entire game.

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I said that the scale is different but that doesn't mean the situations are completely different. Just different in the percent of the player base that feels this way.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...lo-mobile-game


“I’m not against having a mobile game too, but not INSTEAD of a PC game, We’ve been waiting for far too long for another Diablo 3 expansion or better yet, Diablo 4,” signed one petitioner.”


Hmm, this sounds awfully similar to what people on my side are saying about blu. It's almost like you could replace "mobile game" with solo content and "diablo 3 expac/diablo 4" with a blue mage that can be used in the full game.

Sounds like that Diablo player doesn't care about there being the mobile game IF there was also a diablo 3 expac or diablo 4 reveal. That's sounds almost identical to what my side has been saying about blue mage.

It's similar to EA and the Command and Conquer mobile presentation. Then they announced HD remasters of old games in that franchise and the backlash died down.

Other gaming companies understood that they can announce a product that targets a new market IF they also announce something for the people that liked the previous products.

None of these situations are 100% identical to the blue mage situation but they line up quite a bit.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

It is comparable because both situations have parts (or most) of the player base feeling like they are being left behind in pursuit of a "new market"/appease other players than the people that supported the franchise/game as it was. Obviously the scale is way different but the feeling of "it's fine that they are doing this but don't forget about us" is present in both situations.

We should be pushing for content for BOTH sides and not looking at things as a zero-sum game.

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Breaking news everyone: apparently, solo-oriented content in FFXIV is a "new market" and doesn't appeal the players who "supported the game"... even if it's what FFXIV has been doing since its release as a theme park MMORPG, providing content to a lot of different players.
And also, we are not getting "content for BOTH sides"... even if we actually do with new "real" jobs, raids, dungeons, and all the usual stuff.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Breaking news everyone: apparently, solo-oriented content in FFXIV is a "new market" and doesn't appeal the players who "supported the game"... even if it's what FFXIV has been doing since its release as a theme park MMORPG, providing content to a lot of different players.
And also, we are not getting "content for BOTH sides"... even if we actually do with new "real" jobs, raids, dungeons, and all the usual stuff.

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I said "supported the game as it was" as in the people that weren't complaining about the content of the game. They are trying to appeal to a different part of their player base, some of the people who have quit, and some that have yet to try the game by putting in a different form of content. There's nothing wrong with that but it's repeating the same mistake of ignoring part of the player base when they should be trying to please both. The new jobs don't matter to those of us that wanted to main blu and have that job be the tool for how we interact with the full game. So despite all that new stuff coming, it's still a disappointment.

Worst part is. If Blue Mage is a target for new players it's false advertising. People that have never played before that see "oh hey, I can play blue mage now" will get a shock when they buy the game and log in to see they can't pick it as a starting class. They'll fill jipped or wronged and will either quit right there or maybe they'll go look up how to play BLU only to find you have to complete ALL of ARR's main story to be able to play it. And why shouldn't they be able to pick BLU mage from the start? It's level 1, can only be played in ARR areas. And caps at 50... oh right... it can't use duty finder or the dungeons to help with the MS quests unless it uses party finder. Which I'm not even sure when party finder unlocks.

Blue Mage is nothing but side content to be done when you are at level cap and have nothing else to do. Plain and simple. It shouldn't even be called a job. But that's just my opinion.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

I said "supported the game as it was" as in the people that weren't complaining about the content of the game. They are trying to appeal to a different part of their player base, some of the people who have quit, and some that have yet to try the game by putting in a different form of content. There's nothing wrong with that but it's repeating the same mistake of ignoring part of the player base when they should be trying to please both. The new jobs don't matter to those of us that wanted to main blu and have that job be the tool for how we interact with the full game. So despite all that new stuff coming, it's still a disappointment.

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Here's the thing though, they can't please everyone. No matter how many wannabe smart people are saying that SE is lazy, or "they could have done X, Y, Z!". You will ALWAYS have people complaining.
And if you think that they are not trying to please as much people as possible, then you are delusional, because they obviously do.

It's a theme park MMORPG. Different content is made to appeal to a different type of players all the time. And this time, BLU wasn't made to please your type. That's it. Just deal with it. You're free to ask for more, but don't become entitled, because nobody is. "BLU mains" are no exception.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

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To be fair, I'm pretty sure no job in the game is advertised as being available at level 1 or the beginning of the game anyway. Yes classes start at lvl 1 but not jobs, so no new or old player should expect it to be different with BLU.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Here's the thing though, they can't please everyone. No matter how many wannabe smart people are saying that SE is lazy, or "they could have done X, Y, Z!". You will ALWAYS have people complaining.
And if you think that they are not trying to please as much people as possible, then you are delusional, because they obviously do.

It's a theme park MMORPG. Different content is made to appeal to a different type of players all the time. And this time, BLU wasn't made to please your type. That's it. Just deal with it. You're free to ask for more, but don't become entitled, because nobody is. "BLU mains" are no exception.

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BLU is a JOB. A Battle Class Job. No battle class job should be relegated to side content when the 80-90% of the game is about battle related content. If BLU was some form of crafter or gatherer no one would blink an eye at this being side content. What about summoner? It's NOTHING like what a summoner use to be. Should it be reworked and made into a limited job? Look at how they did RDM. It was great they way they worked it in. I never would have thought RDM would have a balancing act between White and Black Mana to empower melee attacks. They could have found some way to incorporate learning skills from mobs, and giving it a mechanic to keep the job interesting, while making it a real job.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

BLU is a JOB. A Battle Class Job.

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No. BLU is a Limited Job. There's a reason they didn't simply call it a "Job". Words have meanings.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

No battle class job should be relegated to side content when the 80-90% of the game is about battle related content.

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A Job and a Limited Job don't do the same things. And there's no rule saying that SE cannot create Limited Jobs. Besides, you have absolutly no authority in saying what a playable class can or cannot do.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

If BLU was some form of crafter or gatherer no one would blink an eye at this being side content.

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Wrong. Some people would complain. There are ALWAYS some people complaining.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

What about summoner? It's NOTHING like what a summoner use to be. Should it be reworked and made into a limited job?

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Nobody is talking about a rework. BLU isn't a rework. But yes, some people do think that SMN may have been a good contenter to be a Limited Job, if it wasn't already in the game as it is.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

Look at how they did RDM. It was great they way they worked it in. I never would have thought RDM would have a balancing act between White and Black Mana to empower melee attacks.

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Yes, RDM does plays well. But it has objectively lost a lot of its iconic identity and toolkit in order to fit the mold. FFXIV's Red Mage is it's own thing. Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't mean that BLU -or any other FF Class/Job- has to follow the same pattern.

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Originally Posted by Burningskull

They could have found some way to incorporate learning skills from mobs, and giving it a mechanic to keep the job interesting, while making it a real job.

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Could they? Probably. Did they want to? Obviously not. Possible doesn't mean desirable. And if you don't respect their creative freedom and their right to do whatever the heck they want to do with their game and their franchise, then you might as well quit right now. You are not entitled to anything, you do not work for them, and you have no authority to tell them what they can do or not.

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Edit: I didn't want to start a quote war, mind you, but almost everything you said in your post was either false or inaccurate. I had little choice but to pick every argument individually.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Here's the thing though, they can't please everyone. No matter how many wannabe smart people are saying that SE is lazy, or "they could have done X, Y, Z!". You will ALWAYS have people complaining.
And if you think that they are not trying to please as much people as possible, then you are delusional, because they obviously do.

It's a theme park MMORPG. Different content is made to appeal to a different type of players all the time. And this time, BLU wasn't made to please your type. That's it. Just deal with it. You're free to ask for more, but don't become entitled, because nobody is. "BLU mains" are no exception.

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Never said they could please everyone. This feels like instead of taking the time to please A LOT more people overall, that they decided that they would boost the chance of the "open world and side content meant to boost sub retention before 5.0" working by shoehorning blue mage into it. FFXIV since ARR has been designed a certain way with a few tweaks for better or worse here and there but retained the same base idea. This iteration of blue mage is totally different compared to the past jobs in good and in bad ways. My side just wishes they would compromise so that the bad parts were removed or reduced greatly and we are willing to wait for this. That we hope SE realizes that altering a big part of their traditional content is not a good thing BUT that they do see that people are excited for the open world and Carnival side content so that a better game can be made. Sacrificing how jobs have worked in the game for five years is not the way to get there. Adding content to let us do MORE, not less, is the right way.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

Never said they could please everyone. This feels like instead of taking the time to please A LOT more people overall, that they decided that they would boost the chance of the "open world and side content meant to boost sub retention before 5.0" working by shoehorning blue mage into it. FFXIV since ARR has been designed a certain way as has the Diablo franchise with a few tweaks for better or worse here and there but retained the same base idea. This iteration of blue mage is totally different compared to the past jobs in good and in bad ways same as diablo mobile. My side just wishes they would compromise so that the bad parts were removed or reduced greatly and we are willing to wait for this.

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Of course everyone would wish for the best of two worlds. But the issue is that some people don't understand that's not always possible. For a bazillion of different reasons.

... And please stop comparing Blue Mage to Diablo Immortal. That's ridiculous. SE is not trying to get to a brand new market by pissing off their entire established community. They are simply filling their theme park MMORPG with yet again another different kind of content. The fact that a good part of the community welcomes BLU as it is completly contradict this comparison. Lots of people already like solo content in FFXIV.

I said the only real difference between comparing the two is in the scale of how many hate the idea.

They are similar in that they are not making the "product" for those that have liked the previous offerings for the most part and instead for people that haven't. That's not necessarily a bad thing but it is when it's done this way and with something as requested as blue mage.

There are many reasons but they weren't the ones they gave during the live letter for why blue mage has to be restricted like this.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

I said the only real difference between comparing the two is in the scale of how many hate the idea.


They are similar in that they are not making the "product" for those that have liked the previous offerings for the most part and instead for people that haven't. That's not necessarily a bad thing but it is when it's done this way and with something as requested as blue mage.

There are many reasons but they weren't the ones they gave during the live letter for why blue mage has to be restricted like this.

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BLU was pretty much requested only because it's a weirdo. Nobody would say that they like BLU because "it's like any other job". It's the very specific gameplay and identity that people like the most. And SE specifically said that weirdos like this wouldn't fit the mold. It's easy to understand why (well, I guess not for some people).

And no, "the scale of how many hate the idea" is definitly not the only difference between Diablo Immortal and Blue Mage. But I already said why and what was different, so I won't repeat myself yet again. Continue thinking that if you want, but I strongly disagree with this argument and opinion. It has no value to me aside from trying to bank on a recent meme.

Edit: And since I don't see this conversation going anywhere -like pretty much everything said in every recent BLU thread-, I'll stop there.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

BLU was pretty much only requested because it's a weirdo. And SE specifically said that weirdos like this wouldn't fit the mold. It's easy to understand why.

And no, "the scale of how many hate the idea" is definitly not the only difference between the two. But I already said why and what was different, so I won't repeat myself yet again. Continue thinking that if you want, but I strongly disagree with this argument and opinion. It has no value to me aside from trying to bank on a recent meme.

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Barely saw people requesting blue mage because of it being "a weirdo" and wanting it to be in the game as one. You do what you said as well then "continue thinking that if you want". Most requests were for a XIV job that uses enemy abilities and I didn't see any that were asking for this AND it have restrictions on what it was allowed to do in game.

I said that to us on my side, it is pretty dam similar. Have I used any of the DI memes when debating this?

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Originally Posted by jon041065

Barely saw people requesting blue mage because of it being "a weirdo" and wanting it to be in the game as one. Most requests were for a XIV job that uses enemy abilities and I didn't see any that were asking for this AND it have restrictions on what it was allowed to do in game.

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Just check any thread speaking about Blue Mage after the 2014 Q&A. People definitly do care about BLU's identity.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Just check any thread speaking about Blue Mage after the 2014 Q&A.

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I have since I've been wanting blue mage since 2013. Most posts in response to Yoshi saying blue mage had to be that way were in disagreement with that notion.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

I have since I've been wanting blue mage since 2013. Most posts in response to Yoshi saying blue mage had to be that way were in disagreement with that notion.

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Then if you think that most people were in favor of the job being shoehorned to fit the mold, you've not been looking hard enough, because I can see countless counter-examples. People actually understood and recognized that it was a weird job to make fit in FFXIV, and some of them even gave a lot of suggestions to try and break the current system because it was too restrictive.
While people ovbiously didn't want it to be "limited" (no one is arguing against that), they also didn't want its identity to be butchered. And sometimes, you can't have everything.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Then if you think that most people were in favor of the job being shoehorned to fit the mold, you've not been looking hard enough, because I can see countless counter-examples. People actually understood and recognized that it was a weird job to make fit in FFXIV, and some of them even gave a lot of suggestions to try and break the current system because it was too restrictive. While people ovbiously didn't want it to be "limited" (no one is arguing that), they also didn't want its identity to be butchered.

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Being OP and does not function in large parts of the game are not parts of blu identity. They have had some OP spells in the past but those had some limits on them. Blu identity has always been learning and using enemy abilities. XI made the job worth within that game without being OP in most cases and still kept the key identity intact. Yes different games but it proves that blue mage can work in a mmo setting with those two key elements.

I said that most that were requesting the job wanted a XIV job. Yes, that would typically mean that it would need some concessions to fit within the trinity. Or they could have used blu to start pushing the limits or go beyond the trinity system as you said. It's what they should have done with rdm but that job ended up being pretty fun regardless and we expected similar treatment for blu.

There were plenty of examples of how/why blu wouldn't work but those were barely from people that were ASKING for the job. Mostly two different groups. So putting the job in this way doesn't do a lot for the majority that were asking for the job.

Let's pretend that there was a new subscription option that would be like 1/3rd of the normal price. This sub option would let you play blue mage with the restrictions of no matchmaking, no pvp, no palace of the dead, and can't be used in anything that requires you to be higher than level 50. You would also be unable to change class/jobs. How many do you think would go with that sub option? How many do you think would still be using that sub in April? They already said the update patches for blu are coming after 5.0 so the number that would subscribe in this way would gets us close to telling us how effective this is as retention content. If the majority of the player base is tired of the game being stale and getting the same kind of content each patch then those that would subscribe in this way would be a pretty large number right? Or do you think it would be on the low side? If so, do you think it would be enough for SE to think of their first limited job as a success?

A solo job in an MMO is for a lack of a better word dumb imo. If I wanted to play a solo experience I wouldn't be playing FFXIV. There are much better single player experiences to be had elsewhere.

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Originally Posted by ElazulHP

A solo job in an MMO is for a lack of a better word dumb imo. If I wanted to play a solo experience I wouldn't be playing FFXIV. There are much better single player experiences to be had elsewhere.

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Which is fine, but some people do and there's nothing wrong with providing content for them too.
As stated FFXIV is a theme-park MMO and you don't need to like every ride at a theme-park to enjoy your time there.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

Which is fine, but some people do and there's nothing wrong with providing content for them too.
As stated FFXIV is a theme-park MMO and you don't need to like every ride at a theme-park to enjoy your time there.

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Can still make content for those people without any ride having such restrictions.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

There is no need for any rides to have such restrictions though. Can still make content for those people.

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Except in this case the content or "ride" has been made, you're asking them to take a mostly finished ride and either totally redesign it or bolt on a second fully formed ride to it, both are not easy feats.
Regardless of people asking for them to "just change BLU" or "Make a second BLU that works in all content." That's not something easily done, they can't just rework the current BLU into anything else or build a whole functioning job out of it's pieces on the spot
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If it were so simple Dark Knight wouldn't have had to wait until 5.0 for a rework the Dev's went on record saying it needed as early as 4.1-.2. Like BLU, Dark knight exists now, the rework will likely take a lot of what Dark is and they can reuse animations, spells and skills, they still can't just churn out its rework on demand.

If they decide to make BLU able to do more, it'll either come way down the line as a large rework, 6.0'ish or part of a slow evolution as they feel out this limited job system and see how far they can push it.

At the end of the day, we don't even know what their endgame (endgame as in their final goal not in the sense of endgame content) is for limited jobs, yes there limited, with what they can do and their level but they've said the level will be raised we don't know what else they'll do with it.
Solo focused doesn't mean solo only, I could very well see a day where limited jobs are only kept one major patch behind just as to not break current content, that could be something they'd consider.
But asking them to either redesigned the whole thing, or make a whole second extra job, on top of the current blue and the two other jobs coming with 5.0 is unrealistic.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

Except in this case the content or "ride" has been made, you're asking them to take a mostly finished ride and either totally redesign it or bolt on a second fully formed ride to it, both are not easy feats.
Regardless of people asking for them to "just change BLU" or "Make a second BLU that works in all content." That's not something easily done, they can't just rework the current BLU into anything else or build a whole functioning job out of it's pieces on the spot
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If it were so simple Dark Knight wouldn't have had to wait until 5.0 for a rework the Dev's went on record saying it needed as early as 4.1-.2. Like BLU, Dark knight exists now, the rework will likely take a lot of what Dark is and they can reuse animations, spells and skills, they still can't just churn out its rework on demand.

If they decide to make BLU able to do more, it'll either come way down the line as a large rework, 6.0'ish or part of a slow evolution as they feel out this limited job system and see how far they can push it.

At the end of the day, we don't even know what their endgame (endgame as in their final goal not in the sense of endgame content) is for limited jobs, yes there limited, with what they can do and their level but they've said the level will be raised we don't know what else they'll do with it.
Solo focused doesn't mean solo only, I could very well see a day where limited jobs are only kept one major patch behind just as to not break current content, that could be something they'd consider.
But asking them to either redesigned the whole thing, or make a whole second extra job, on top of the current blue and the two other jobs coming with 5.0 is unrealistic.

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I think most of us have accepted that real change for BLU will take time. The first things I said after it was announced as limited and what that entails is 'so we'll have to wait for 6.0 for a rework'.

And that's fine with me because that's how long it takes other jobs to be reworked, but we gotta get out here and have our voices heard so it happens that early. The sooner they hear the displeasure the better.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

Except in this case the content or "ride" has been made, you're asking them to take a mostly finished ride and either totally redesign it or bolt on a second fully formed ride to it, both are not easy feats.

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It's not easy but they've done it before, here's looking at you Bard.

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Originally Posted by BlitzAceRush

But asking them to either redesigned the whole thing, or make a whole second extra job, on top of the current blue and the two other jobs coming with 5.0 is unrealistic.

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for 5.0 is unrealistic, but if they are not working towards it in 6.0, they really really messed up.

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Originally Posted by ElazulHP

A solo job in an MMO is for a lack of a better word dumb imo. If I wanted to play a solo experience I wouldn't be playing FFXIV. There are much better single player experiences to be had elsewhere.

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FFXIV already had solo jobs before this deciple's of hand and land so try again.

I don't get the If I wanted to solo thing I would play offline games?
You do a ton of soloing in most modern mmos these days. And FFXIV is the more solo friendly job of the Square mmos.

• Solo 90% of the MSQ.
• Solo sidequest
• Solo craft
• Solo in gold saucer
• Solo job quest
• Solo job rotation

Even in intense group combat scenarios you are basically soloing minus the occasional buff or heal you give out to a party member. The majority of group coordination involves stacking or splitting and running to safe zones.

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Originally Posted by Sandpark

I don't get the If I wanted to solo thing I would play offline games?
You do a ton of soloing in most modern mmos these days. And FFXIV is the more solo friendly job of the Square mmos.

• Solo 90% of the MSQ.
• Solo sidequest
• Solo craft
• Solo in gold saucer
• Solo job quest
• Solo job rotation

Even in intense group combat scenarios you are basically soloing minus the occasional buff or heal you give out to a party member. The majority of group coordination involves stacking or splitting and running to safe zones.

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I agree with all of this. I've always considered this game to be a single player RPG that has mmo features since most content is indeed done solo.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sandpark

I don't get the If I wanted to solo thing I would play offline games?
You do a ton of soloing in most modern mmos these days. And FFXIV is the more solo friendly job of the Square mmos.

• Solo 90% of the MSQ.
• Solo sidequest
• Solo craft
• Solo in gold saucer
• Solo job quest
• Solo job rotation

Even in intense group combat scenarios you are basically soloing minus the occasional buff or heal you give out to a party member. The majority of group coordination involves stacking or splitting and running to safe zones.

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Yes many mmorpgs are like single player games because they evolved from single player games obviously. Just because there are single player qualities in an MMORPG doesn't mean a majority of people want more single player content. People play mmorpgs for the for the Massive Multiplayer Online aspect I reckon, as there are much better single player western and jrpgs out there. If we are going to compare aspects of FFXIV to other MMOs id like to ask, "How many other MMOs reduce a class or a job into a minigame? How many other MMORPG player populations want future classes/jobs to be "Limited" like blue mage?" I am willing to place money down and say not many.