Forbidden Materia

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Originally Posted by Wynn

Good luck getting there though. Plus, I have a feeling the "soft cap" on stats is not gone, just has different numbers now.

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that and having 4 str in that item isnt gonna stop something from pounding him into the ground
i checked, 32 str in my gloves, gave me all of 5 more attack power! thats 5 added on to the few hundred i had, not much of a damage difference
im curious if attack power materia are a better idea at that point(unless of course str gives crit attack too which is another story altogether)


but the point is, people want to do everything easy, this isnt about fail or success rates, its about the fact things arent being handed to them on a silver platter and they may have to work at it
people wanna be lazy and they HATE being told that somthing may be difficult to obtain(especialy this difficult)

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

that and having 4 str in that item isnt gonna stop something from pounding him into the ground
i checked, 32 str in my gloves, gave me all of 5 more attack power! thats 5 added on to the few hundred i had, not much of a damage difference
im curious if attack power materia are a better idea at that point(unless of course str gives crit attack too which is another story altogether)


but the point is, people want to do everything easy, this isnt about fail or success rates, its about the fact things arent being handed to them on a silver platter and they may have to work at it
people wanna be lazy and they HATE being told that somthing may be difficult to obtain(especialy this difficult)

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Yep, pretty much on the bolded part.

I don't see what all the fuss is. A single high grade materia slotted into each piece makes a person quite strong indeed.

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Originally Posted by Wynn

Yep, pretty much on the bolded part.

I don't see what all the fuss is. A single high grade materia slotted into each piece makes a person quite strong indeed.

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the big deal is simple
people want to be able to easily put 5 materia into everything, because if they cant easily do something it shouldnt be in a game at all
they dont want people with more time to be rewarded over them

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

the big deal is simple
people want to be able to easily put 5 materia into everything, because if they cant easily do something it shouldnt be in a game at all
they dont want people with more time to be rewarded over them

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^ This i can't even believe this thread is still going on God. You guys need to suck it up and face it you just wont have the time to get 3 materia on a weapon or the money.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

the big deal is simple
people want to be able to easily put 5 materia into everything, because if they cant easily do something it shouldnt be in a game at all
they dont want people with more time to be rewarded over them

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if ppl complain hard enough. and whine loud enough. square will give them what they want 5 materia on one item made easy, but a word of warning be careful what you wish for, coz they will nerf the hell out of materia to give you this system. attack power materia +5 will be a tier V matearia, but hey you can now meld 5 easy :P

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Originally Posted by grandm

if ppl complain hard enough. and whine loud enough. square will give them what they want 5 materia on one item made easy, but a word of warning be careful what you wish for, coz they will nerf the hell out of materia to give you this system. attack power materia +5 will be a tier V matearia, but hey you can now meld 5 easy :P

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LOL yeah, exactly ^This. I'd rather not go back to stats meaning jack diddly.

I totally feel you guys about the difficulty, but I think what the complaints are about is luck being so integral. Why not just require a huge time sink or money sink instead? The issue is the very real possibility never getting past 2 materia ever no matter how much time you spend, where as some lucky guy can feebly 5 slot his first try. Where was that guys commitment and skill or time or challenge?

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The issue is the very real possibility never getting past 2 materia ever no matter how much time you spend

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That's as unlikely as winning in the reverse lottery. It's not going to happen.

Spend enough time, you will be rewarded for it. Don't spend any time and QQ about luck instead, you will be left to eat dust.

Has anyone noticed any success rate differences when trying to attach a second materia to an HQ/+3 item?

(Not that HQ Cobalt and Felt are gallavanting around).

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

Has anyone noticed any success rate differences when trying to attach a second materia to an HQ/+3 item?

(Not that HQ Cobalt and Felt are gallavanting around).

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the differene between 17% and 20% to succeed between nq and hq really isnt that great to see the difference

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

the differene between 17% and 20% to succeed between nq and hq really isnt that great to see the difference

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Wasn't sure if there was one. Thought I read a dev post saying HQ would be slightly better, but then I haven't seen anyone bring it up in this thread and thought maybe the mechanic didn't exist. Thanks!

I'll have to confirm it with my ls mate, but I seem to recall him saying the chances were even worse on his HQ gear. Anyone have extended first hand experience? It may just have been the materia combo/gear type he was trying out.

I think the OP has a valid point; not that the system is too hard - I think most would agree slotting materia should not be a simple task - but rather that the system in its current capacity is not viable.

What is the point of having 7 materia slots if it takes a 1-in-300,000 chance to successfully slot lvl 1 materia? Who in their right mind would undertake the effort to maximize this system, let alone on more than one piece of equipment? Nevermind the cost involved; the time to gather the resources needed is simply incalculable.

On top of that, the equipment modified will become obsolete once the inevitable content expansion is released and level caps are raised. All of that work, even if possible, wiped out. The system is broken because it is not reasonable (nor possible) for people to use it to its maximum potential.

If the odds are this high, then a piece of equipment should never have more than three or four materia slots available for modification. The maximum is still difficult, yet eventually attainable by the most dedicated players.

The current system is "eventually attainable by the most dedicated players." If you don't think you will ever see it then that just means you are not among them.

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Originally Posted by ZDamned

I totally feel you guys about the difficulty, but I think what the complaints are about is luck being so integral. Why not just require a huge time sink or money sink instead?

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Luck is part of almost any game, if there was no luck involved it would be a boring system. Sure it hurts when my 3 slotted axe explodes in my face trying to hit that 4th slot but I knew the risk when I took it.

If I win I'm ahead, if I lost I'm back at square one.

Over time I will have more chances, and therefore better odds at obtaining well slotted gear than players with little time. Thos without time, need money to skip the time part. That or those who don't want to spiritbond the gear may farm for the gil and just buy the materia themselves.

Cutting luck out of everything just makes things stagnant far quicker than they should. I also doubt your going to see many people get 5 slots on the first item, and even if so it's not going to make him magically more skilled than the player with more time vested in the game. You can give a baby a shotgun, doesn't mean he knows how to use it.

Seriously... Newbie want to take off the only challeging in the game?! PLEASE DO NOT HEAR THESE Newbies. Go for it Square Enix... Materia make sense at all... Mainly after HQ become 100% people can't see what SE plan for future.

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Originally Posted by Kymusashi

I'll have to confirm it with my ls mate, but I seem to recall him saying the chances were even worse on his HQ gear. Anyone have extended first hand experience? It may just have been the materia combo/gear type he was trying out.

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I was getting lower % as well on my HQ gear.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

the big deal is simple
people want to be able to easily put 5 materia into everything, because if they cant easily do something it shouldnt be in a game at all
they dont want people with more time to be rewarded over them

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Most of us in the high end don't want this game to turn into Final Craftasy, not because we're complaining that it's too difficult. We want the focus and the rewards to be centered around battle content. Like I said earlier, double materia's took all of a week to get. Triple we're mainly waiting for 1.20 with the HQ revamp so we've stocked up tons of materia for it. Beyond that who cares it's not worth the effort.

The point is the materia system is hard to balance around battle content because in order to entice people the rewards need to be good enough to give them incentive to do it. When you have 40-50 str gaunts, 200 hp boots, 40 vit bp's already the only thing this leads to is inflation of stats and/or the rewards not worth the trouble of raiding when you can just sit in town grinding away to get the best gear. Only way around this if they really want to keep this system is for raid gear to have special effects materia gear can't provide. We'll see how it goes...

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Originally Posted by Madruk

Most of us in the high end don't want this game to turn into Final Craftasy, not because we're complaining that it's too difficult. We want the focus and the rewards to be centered around battle content. Like I said earlier, double materia's took all of a week to get. Triple we're mainly waiting for 1.20 with the HQ revamp so we've stocked up tons of materia for it. Beyond that who cares it's not worth the effort.

The point is the materia system is hard to balance around battle content because in order to entice people the rewards need to be good enough to give them incentive to do it. When you have 40-50 str gaunts, 200 hp boots, 40 vit bp's already the only thing this leads to is inflation of stats and/or the rewards not worth the trouble of raiding when you can just sit in town grinding away to get the best gear. Only way around this if they really want to keep this system is for raid gear to have special effects materia gear can't provide. We'll see how it goes...

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some raid gear already is better then crafted gear no matter what you do with materia(jackboots from darkhold for instance, unless you are a tank who wants to put evasion into it)
but yeah they need to put more incentive into some of the gear for sure
and my understanding is youll be able to slot them eventualy to once they code a way to do it in

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Originally Posted by northernsky

Would anyone be complaining if they only allowed 2 materias , 1st 100% and 2nd 25% success?

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Probably not. People just expect the very best for the smallest effort. When they first announced materia crafting they were going to just have two maximum but I guess they decided to add more layers for the mega rich. It's a good way of distributing the gil which rich players have been collecting since launch.

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Originally Posted by Madruk

Only way around this if they really want to keep this system is for raid gear to have special effects materia gear can't provide. We'll see how it goes...

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It seems they're taking small steps in this direction as is. A good example of this is the Sipahi Gloves. Although they don't have the most overwhelming stats, they are the only piece of equipment/materia currently in-game that provides Crit Rating. I'd like to see more of this kind of situation, where dungeon gear can provide bonuses/stats/set bonuses that cannot be found on crafted gear or materia.

It would be lovely if the AF gear slated to be introduced provided a set bonus to boost a skill/set of skills for the job class in question. That way the armor still serves some sort of benefit.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

some raid gear already is better then crafted gear no matter what you do with materia(jackboots from darkhold for instance, unless you are a tank who wants to put evasion into it)
but yeah they need to put more incentive into some of the gear for sure
and my understanding is youll be able to slot them eventualy to once they code a way to do it in

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Eh, it's a little class dependent for Jackboots. For ARC/PGL yes they are decent, but for LNC/MRD I'd take the +3 STR from Cobalt Sollerets (Red). Especially since Accuracy is sorta a non-issue at the moment for the content available.

Your statement is so wrong you just have to be mis guided enough not realize the concept of random. I played aion for a couple years, and never got my character to hq a craft to make a specific bow that was required for a quest. I spent over a trillion kinah trying for that for over a year, and never got it, yet others have gotten it first try countless times. You can't tell me I didn't try hard enough, our that I was rewarded for my time and effort. A failed craft in aion means you list everything, because sub quality weapons are useless. A luck based system is always stupid with no safety net after a certain number of failures.

Ignore my last post, I forgot to quote.....

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Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah

That's as unlikely as winning in the reverse lottery. It's not going to happen.

Spend enough time, you will be rewarded for it. Don't spend any time and QQ about luck instead, you will be left to eat dust.

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Your statement is so wrong you just have to be mis guided enough not realize the concept of random. I played aion for a couple years, and never got my character to hq a craft to make a specific bow that was required for a quest. I spent over a trillion kinah trying for that for over a year, and never got it, yet others have gotten it first try countless times. You can't tell me I didn't try hard enough, our that I was rewarded for my time and effort. A failed craft in aion means you list everything, because sub quality weapons are useless. A luck based system is always stupid with no safety net after a certain number of failures.

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A luck based system is always stupid with no safety net after a certain number of failures.

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It will always come down to statistics in the long run. In short term, when it comes to one item? Somebody might get lucky while someone else might get unlucky. The more you do stuff the more it balances out itself.

No dedicated person is going to come out with less than the time he has put into the game. He might have few streaks of bad luck, but it inevitably always comes with a streak of good luck as well.

And that said, you should never try to go beyond your capabilities as a player. If you don't have the dedication to go all the way, set your sights on obtaining gear with 2 materias socketed to it. With 30% chance, sometimes you will go 1/10 on successful synths, other times you succeed the first time. And you do this enough times (relatively few) and end up with pretty much 30% success rate total.

Similarly, if you can dedicate yourself to socketing 5 materias the same applies, only in a larger and more time-consuming scale. Needless to say at the end of the day you will get the same results as the first guy, with larger variables in-between individual synths. That's why it's important to not bite more than you can chew. If you just want to get lucky with 5 materias socketed to a piece when you don't really have the dedication it takes to pull through in the long-term, you'll end up only hurting yourself.

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Ignore my last post, I forgot to quote.....

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You can edit your posts and insert quotes using [quote] [ /quote] tags.

This page shows a profound misunderstanding of basic statistics by what seems to be a majority of the people supporting the system.

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Originally Posted by Hachiko

This page shows a profound misunderstanding of basic statistics by what seems to be a majority of the people supporting the system.

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Could you please provide statistics to support your claim?

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Originally Posted by Zomb

I think this is the beauty of the system. Everyone can get SOME materia, but only the truly committed will have the best of the best gear. This is the way it should be, everyone will be able to get good enough gear, but the people that really work at it get the greatest rewards. I myself will be one of the people with "some" materia, and I won't have any complaints when I see the guy with multiple in each slot.

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You know why I think, virtually, everything you said is moot? Because it has nothing to do with hard work half the time. I've seen 100s of ppl try to get the same item for years, putting the same time, effort, hard work, and gil into it as the next guy. Wanna know the difference? There's always that poor soul who gets completely shafted. And, clearly, those who align themselves w/ your biased logic have never been on the s@!# end of the stick when pushing for items like this. Well, here's a thought: do away with the BULL S!#@ luck aspect (a.k.a horribly calculated algorithms), and embrace some sort of system that *truly rewards hard work. Why not make materia EXTREMELY difficult to obtain, or leave hand/land ppl out of the mix, and make it where players have to complete some insanely difficult "Divine Might-like" fight in XI to gain access to an npc that will meld items for you. There are numerous ways to bring about the same results without this ridiculous system that rewards the "charmed" and punishes the "unlucky."

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

You know why I think, virtually, everything you said is moot?

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I like presumptious posts like this, they think that people supporting the system are always the people who went 5/5 for a materia. Hell I played XI for years, I still love the NM hunting in the game I had my good streaks and my bad streaks.

What was my worst?

In my total XI career until they changed the drop of the Theifs knife NM I went 0/89 for that knife that is only counting the times I claimed that bastard. Yet still despite being that guy who got the poo end of the stick I didn't complain because everyone had the exact same chance as me to get the item.

Everyone has the exact same chance to get a 5/5 slotted item as I do, I can increase my odds by investing more time. It gives me something to do in a game where long lasting content is non-existent outside this system.

Love it or Hate it, you can't deny it provides a massive time-sink that this game desperatly needed.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

I like presumptious posts like this, they think that people supporting the system are always the people who went 5/5 for a materia. Hell I played XI for years, I still love the NM hunting in the game I had my good streaks and my bad streaks.

What was my worst?

In my total XI career until they changed the drop of the Theifs knife NM I went 0/89 for that knife that is only counting the times I claimed that bastard. Yet still despite being that guy who got the poo end of the stick I didn't complain because everyone had the exact same chance as me to get the item.

Everyone has the exact same chance to get a 5/5 slotted item as I do, I can increase my odds by investing more time. It gives me something to do in a game where long lasting content is non-existent outside this system.

Love it or Hate it, you can't deny it provides a massive time-sink that this game desperatly needed.

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lol...0/89 for that queer tonberry, and you think you know what it's like to be on the "poo" end of the stick?? I don't even remember what his pop time was, but try going 0/40ish on Argus -ya, the NM that you could know the pop time for and still end up waiting 12 hours for him to pop. That was one of my friends. I was lucky enough to go like....2/7 or so. And you know the funny thing about it? I actually enjoyed it. And the reason, why, is simple...camping NMs is "a completely different animal" as some hicks like to say. At least w/ NMs you can't "lose" everything you worked for after already putting in a tremendous amount of effort. I don't mind making ppl sink time into something as long as it's always "productive." What's absurd, is that SE has made it where you could spend days, even months, farming enough materia or stuff to make gil, get all the mats you need to make your godly gear, BUST on every single one, and then start from scratch. You lose TIME (like w/ nms); you lose GIL (not like w/ nms): and you lose something you already WORKED your A#$ off for (not like w/ nms). SE needs to find a more innovative way to "take up our time" than simply hitting the "repeat button" for everything.

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

lol...0/89 for that queer tonberry, and you think you know what it's like to be on the "poo" end of the stick?? I don't even remember what his pop time was, but try going 0/40ish on Argus -ya, the NM that you could know the pop time for and still end up waiting 12 hours for him to pop. That was one of my friends. I was lucky enough to go like....2/7 or so. And you know the funny thing about it? I actually enjoyed it. And the reason, why, is simple...camping NMs is "a completely different animal" as some hicks like to say. At least w/ NMs you can't "lose" everything you worked for after already putting in a tremendous amount of effort. I don't mind making ppl sink time into something as long as it's always "productive." What's absurd, is that SE has made it where you could spend days, even months, farming enough materia or stuff to make gil, get all the mats you need to make your godly gear, BUST on every single one, and then start from scratch. You lose TIME (like w/ nms); you lose GIL (not like w/ nms): and you lose something you already WORKED your A#$ off for (not like w/ nms). SE needs to find a more innovative way to "take up our time" than simply hitting the "repeat button" for everything.

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id like to chime in and say its actualy quite similar to NMs in a way you are not looking at

yes, you only lose time at first glance with NMs compared to materia

BUT when camping those NMs, you are doing literaly nothing, so not only are you losing time, your losing productivity, time you could be spending doing something else

with materia, you are making money to make materia, you are spending your time actualy doing something instead of just sitting there waiting for a pop


so in the end, you can technicaly say you lost a ton of money camping NMs too since you coulda been farming during all that time instead of sitting there twiddling your thumbs


either way, farming NMs or materia, is all pure choice
and with materia, you dont have to do forbidden, you can settle for a nice full set of single slotted materia and be more then ok with it, but those who want to better themselves have chosen to take the bad with the good and that again is their choice

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

you lose GIL (not like w/ nms): and you lose something you already WORKED your A#$ off for (not like w/ nms).

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So your saying that your time is worthless right? Otherwise you wouldn't just say you are only at a time loss.

Farming NM's costs you time that you could be doing other things "Farming more consistent drops that you could use to just purchase the item" Farming NM's costs you time, money, and effort.

Materia system costs you Time, Money, and effort. Both have the exact same principles in this manner. You take a risk for the reward offered, your willing to invest in the chance to strengthen your weapons beyond their natural limits.

Everything is a risk, it's a matter of balancing the risk to the reward. Personally I like a punishing system, obviously I don't speak for anyone else but myself but I have no qualms with the materia system as it stands. Even with 1 slot in all of your gear you get a very potent boost versus 0 slots (The first slot is still 100% remember) Now you start adding a risk on-top of your characters progression, you are risking your current items to make them even stronger I see no issue with this.

With great rewards come great risk. Of course developers will probably eventually cave and just nerf materia and let people slot for no risk at all making fully slotted materia the norm and thus ruining the entire point of the system.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

...yes, you only lose time at first glance with NMs compared to materia

BUT when camping those NMs, you are doing literaly nothing, so not only are you losing time, your losing productivity, time you could be spending doing something else

with materia, you are making money to make materia, you are spending your time actualy doing something instead of just sitting there waiting for a pop


so in the end, you can technicaly say you lost a ton of money camping NMs too since you coulda been farming during all that time instead of sitting there twiddling your thumbs

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The best thing about NM camping is that, once you know the pop time, you're pretty much set. Argus was one of the worst NMs in XI, b/c even w/ a pop time, you might still be there for 12 hours. However, it was hardly unproductive, because once you DID get your item, it was instant gratification. You get the drop, you're done. Yes, you could have made a lot of gil while farming instead, but the same is true for materia. All the money and time you HAVE to blow to get the additional materia on an item could have been spent doing something much more productive -like twiddling your thumbs, waiting for a pop. What's worse to you:

Farming for days, buying a bunch of gear and materia, "throwing away all the mats you just bought," and then doing it all again? or...


"Twiddling your thumbs," waiting for an NM to pop, having him not drop the item, running off and doing something else, then coming back later to try again?


I don't mind doing something "unproductive." What i DO mind though...is doing something "productive" and then having all of that hard work and effort rendered useless in a matter of minutes. That's what the materia system offers.


Let me break it down, so it makes more sense:

NM Camping: Time, Money, and Effort = "GODLY ITEM"

Materia Acquisition: Time, Money, and Effort = ****ATTEMPT**** at a "GODLY ITEM"

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

NM Camping: Time, Money, and Effort = ****ATTEMPT**** at a "GODLY ITEM"

Materia Acquisition: Time, Money, and Effort = ****ATTEMPT**** at a "GODLY ITEM"

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Fixed that for you.

standing around for hours for nm and crafting almost equal the same thing to me, they both boring. but i'd say it like in ffxi i would take the boat places even though i knew the choco would get me there a little quikcer, why? i got to go afk instead of pay attention to get there. i don't want to camp nm's all day and be afk or waiting for hours for a pop like ffxi, but i surely don't want to craft 24/7 for my best gears. while i'm sure the dungeon drops will be better balanced (or failed game) materia can't be the best made stuff no matter how hard it is, it needs to involve drops from killing. both wait for nm and crafting/dol for materia is both kinda weak for me, i want to be killing stuff all day long, like the strongholds, i can happily farm gear like that all day if the gear was worth it. no more of this afk business.

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Originally Posted by HoolieWho

Fixed that for you.

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lol yeah, you didnt get 100% drops thats for damn sure

and lets not forget the gimped version of the items that came around when they rare/exd everything the NMs dropped

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Originally Posted by HoolieWho

Fixed that for you.

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Well, if you want to be a smart a#@ about it, I'll explain it further...

When you camp an NM for hours, you *always get a pop, and you *always get a chance to claim/kill it. You don't have to go farm something for hours, to make gil, to buy items, to get the nm to pop or anything absurd like that....you just CAMP.

When you try to meld additional materia, you HAVE to either farm to make gil, so you can buy materia, or go and spiritbond gear for hours, pray you get the type you want, then you finally manage to get to a point where you can take all that time you've ALREADY wasted, and gamble it on the item.

With an NM, I already meet the requirements to "obtain my godly item" -i have space in my inventory. I don't need a s!#$load of gil; I don't need to exp, so I can get some stupid item that allows me an "attempt" at the claim; I just sit there, and wait for a pop. So, you're essentially asking someone to farm for hours in order to make their "NM pop." I don't know how to be any clearer. Do you understand the difference?

NM= time sitting, effort claiming, and a loss of gil incurred by wasting the time camping instead* of farming.

Materia Melding= time farming, effort succeeding w/ a meld, and a loss of gil incurred by wasting time getting the materia and/or farming to make gil and then the loss of all that gil by **attempting** to get your item

Imagine that the NM is the Materia Melding attempt: the NM has a poor drop rate; the Meld has a poor success rate. I didn't have to do a thing to get a chance at my drop. You had to farm for hours; and w/o gil you will NEVER get your item. Without a party to help you and other ppl spritbond their gear to make materia, you will NEVER get your material for your item. Without crafters making the gear you keep blowing up, you will NEVER even have a all the pieces of gear you want to meld materia to, and so on...

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

You know why I think, virtually, everything you said is moot? Because it has nothing to do with hard work half the time. I've seen 100s of ppl try to get the same item for years, putting the same time, effort, hard work, and gil into it as the next guy. Wanna know the difference? There's always that poor soul who gets completely shafted. And, clearly, those who align themselves w/ your biased logic have never been on the s@!# end of the stick when pushing for items like this. Well, here's a thought: do away with the BULL S!#@ luck aspect (a.k.a horribly calculated algorithms), and embrace some sort of system that *truly rewards hard work. Why not make materia EXTREMELY difficult to obtain, or leave hand/land ppl out of the mix, and make it where players have to complete some insanely difficult "Divine Might-like" fight in XI to gain access to an npc that will meld items for you. There are numerous ways to bring about the same results without this ridiculous system that rewards the "charmed" and punishes the "unlucky."

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is it not the same when you fight ifrit? you have lets say : lancer a) and lancer b) they both spend as much on there gear and both fight ifrit together all the time, after 10 battles lancer a) has won a lancer and sword. but lancer b) has won nothing. both have put in the same effort, but luck can be a bitch, stop crying, get over it, this is the way games work

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Everything is a risk, it's a matter of balancing the risk to the reward. Personally I like a punishing system, obviously I don't speak for anyone else but myself but I have no qualms with the materia system as it stands. Even with 1 slot in all of your gear you get a very potent boost versus 0 slots (The first slot is still 100% remember) Now you start adding a risk on-top of your characters progression, you are risking your current items to make them even stronger I see no issue with this.

With great rewards come great risk. Of course developers will probably eventually cave and just nerf materia and let people slot for no risk at all making fully slotted materia the norm and thus ruining the entire point of the system.

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Hi Jynx,

I usually agree with your sentiments on most topics. :) Here's a question for you and everyone:

* What about the long-term goals that always allows a positive increment for player progress? Specifically, like Relic Weapons in FF XI?

I agree with Khal in that the Materia System feels like far too much is left to a Random Number Generator and Chance (just rolling the dice).

What about long-term goals like Relic Weapons from FF XI, where at least *every step of the way* it's rewarding Player Effort, Time and Skill (battling in Dynamis every chance you get, to earn more Currency to work towards the long term goal of getting different Stages of your Relic Weapon).

As insane as the requirements were for Relic Weapons (at least the early days of FF XI, I'm not sure how much easier it got later), at least every minute you put towards it as a player (fighting through Dynamis for Currency, fighting to beat NMs for the Attestation of Might, Attestation of Bravery, Glory, etc.), the game was rewarding your effort.

I understand the Risk vs. Reward scenario as well, but I'd love to see a system that rewarded Player Effort and Skill (e.g., overcome a series of challenging Quests around Eorzea and defeat a brutal NM to gain a "blessing" by one of the Twelve that increases your chances to Meld a 2nd or 3rd Materia, etc.).

Thanks~

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Originally Posted by Kiara

I understand the Risk vs. Reward scenario as well, but I'd love to see a system that rewarded Player Effort and Skill (e.g., overcome a series of challenging Quests around Eorzea and defeat a brutal NM to gain a "blessing" by one of the Twelve that increases your chances to Meld a 2nd or 3rd Materia, etc.).

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Amazing idea. That would actually make sense. If they make it too easy, then multiple materia will be the norm and content will be tuned around it. Gotta keep that in mind.