DRK Consolidated Feedback Thread

Couple ideas came to mind after my post patch notes rage coma.

1) revert dark passenger. This is a no brainier
2) change dark mind to reduce all damage but keep everything else the same
3) replace living dead with dread spikes.

Dread spikes. Prevents you from falling below 1hp and absorbs between 50-100% of all incoming damage as HP for the duration.

4) reduce the cooldown on shadow wall, or buff it's potency, or add something to make it worth a long cool down.

For example you could intergrate living dead as a passive into it.
Since it's not an ultimate cooldown having it have a chance to spare you from something in which you would otherwise die anyway would justify the long recast. It is still burdensome to the healers but better then your tank kicking the bucket.

5) seriously, give us back scourge...

A few points:

1. They aren't going to give us back Scourge, because like it or not, its potency has been redistributed across our kit through buffs to our other abilities.
2. Living Dead isn't going anywhere, the most we can hope for is a change to its mechanics, not a whole new ability.
3. They don't need to revert DP exactly, but it needs to be a useful button to push. Right now it isn't, and while some people argue otherwise, their arguments are niche AF and just barely tread water.

Basically a lot of DRK's kit is subject unduly to outside influence. TBN to the boss's rotation, LD to the healer's awareness, Sole Survivor to our DPS (though this is easily worked around, just as an example).

Its still the least self-sufficient tank. Its still the neediest tank.

IDK where the patch notes' changes will put our DPS relative to the other two, but assuming its in a respectable place, they simply need to make Dark Passenger a button that isn't dead, and add mitigation to our kit that has something resembling UPTIME. It is ---ridiculous--- literally, ridiculous, as in, if I mained another tank I would be laughing my ass off, that we have to dip into the goddamn cross role system to find a cooldown that lasts longer than TEN SECONDS.

I think it will be counterproductive to suggest outlandish changes like Dread Spikes that in all reality they are extremely unlikely to implement. We should keep our suggestions sane and as simple, but efficient as possible.

->I think Shadow Wall should be 150s, and I think it should last 20s.
->I think Blood Price should add a 5% or 10% damage taken reduction.
->I think Dark Passenger should be a DPS gain.
->I think our self-healing should be buffed to the point of being able to realistically contribute meaningfully to Walking Dead's removal, or if not, Living Dead should be changed in such a way to not be so excessively dependent on healers, or have its duration/recast time reduced.

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Originally Posted by Rbstr

I mean, in terms of actual effectiveness DRK's reprisal themed stuff is stronger than before? Instead of a couple mediocre parry procs we've got TBN giving a bloodspiller worth of gauge. The boss doing damage to you is now fueling the strongest attack DRK has ever had...

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If only this were true. With the soul eater buff I believe TBN to get blood is back to a dps loss out of grit. Based on a lose argument I made in another post it now becomes important to factor in the chances of pushing out natural bloodspillers from our rotation. Before factoring those loses into the equation TBN is at best a 10/3 dps increase 3.333, pushing out a naturally occuring bloodspiller is a fairly large loss balanced by an infrequent occurance but is going to happen every 16 TBN's used in this way.

Compare that to the 250 potency reprisal which was oGCD and gave the boss a 10% down. Mitigation and dps, now what are we getting?

I want to get behind TBN, I really do. But it needs to give the job more.

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Originally Posted by SyzzleSpark

A few points:

1. They aren't going to give us back Scourge, because like it or not, its potency has been redistributed across our kit through buffs to our other abilities.
2. Living Dead isn't going anywhere, the most we can hope for is a change to its mechanics, not a whole new ability.
3. They don't need to revert DP exactly, but it needs to be a useful button to push. Right now it isn't, and while some people argue otherwise, their arguments are niche AF and just barely tread water.

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1) Re-distribution of scourge damage is all well and good, but its done in a clunky. Resource intensive way that goes against one of the core goals of making the jobs simpler. If your going to let us keep the potency why give it a reverse QoL change.

2) Replacing LD may be a lofty goal but I'm not sure how you fix LD. It an ability based almost entirely on the efforts, and resources and timing of another player. And is the only shit button style tank ability that will actually kill you on its own. And I don't see SE giving us any sort of real self healing. We cant even keep our mitigation.

3) I only suggested reverting DP because it wouldn't require much effort and it wouldn't be a completely useless skill.


SE doesn't seem to know what to do with DRK quite frankly. or Doesn't actually care to be bothered with DRK. We've been asking for Shadow Wall and LD changes since 3.0 and up to this point have gotten largely questionable descisions.

DRK isn't even fun to play until 68.. and far more incomplete then the other tanks until 70.

But you know we Quietus... so there is that -_-

I think can get behind the two changes they made.

Warning: I have not done this math yet and likely will not be able to for a few days due to time constraints.

In a groupable add phase (the most common) the quietus change is fairly nice. It's the equivalent of blood weapon paired with aoe damage that can be paired with blood weapon and as main tank "should" have a nice interaction with TBN. In other words it could very well be mana city for fights with large groupable add phases and dungeon runs.

The core issue I have with the changes is that they aren't enough. This kind of skill interaction needs to be present in more of our kit to tie it together proper. I support the changes SE made but believe we need more of this in 4.1. We do seem to have gotten the short end of the stick here.

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Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising

I think can get behind the two changes they made.

Warning: I have not done this math yet and likely will not be able to for a few days due to time constraints.

In a groupable add phase (the most common) the quietus change is fairly nice. It's the equivalent of blood weapon paired with aoe damage that can be paired with blood weapon. In other words it could very well be mana city.

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Grain of salt and all that, but in regards to Quietus's potential this came up in another thread.

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Originally Posted by Daniel_Fury

That pull in temple of fist with roughly 10 mobs was ridiclous. Full DA AD spam and ended at 6.5k dps in grit o.o

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If Quietus's buff brought back DAAD spam, then our focus on mitigation changes should probably be directed toward bosses at this point.

Also I agree, we did not need to be buffed for aoe damage. This is a bit silly to me. Single target we are in as weird a place as ever.

More than anything they feel like token buffs they had to provide to match with Storm's Eye pumped to 270 and the Bloodbath element baked into Steel Cyclone.

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Originally Posted by SyzzleSpark

A few points:
1. They aren't going to give us back Scourge, because like it or not, its potency has been redistributed across our kit through buffs to our other abilities.
2. Living Dead isn't going anywhere, the most we can hope for is a change to its mechanics, not a whole new ability.
3. They don't need to revert DP exactly, but it needs to be a useful button to push. Right now it isn't, and while some people argue otherwise, their arguments are niche AF and just barely tread water.

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Originally Posted by Ryutamashiisan

1) Re-distribution of scourge damage is all well and good, but its done in a clunky. Resource intensive way that goes against one of the core goals of making the jobs simpler. If your going to let us keep the potency why give it a reverse QoL change.

2) Replacing LD may be a lofty goal but I'm not sure how you fix LD. It an ability based almost entirely on the efforts, and resources and timing of another player. And is the only shit button style tank ability that will actually kill you on its own. And I don't see SE giving us any sort of real self healing. We cant even keep our mitigation.

3) I only suggested reverting DP because it wouldn't require much effort and it wouldn't be a completely useless skill.

DRK isn't even fun to play until 68.. and far more incomplete then the other tanks until 70.

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1. Agree with Ryutamashiisan on this one, tho I can see the point of SyzzleSpark as well. The idea of distributing Scourge damage to the rest of our kit is good and all, but the execution is way too weak at the moment to justify the Scourge removal.

2. An idea I had about LD, was making it so while we're in Walking Dead ALL our damage is partially converted to HP (Bloodbath-esque). It's not a perfect solution, but I believe it's a good direction at least to take it. Don't know if it would need some more extra effects, a downside, longer or shorter CD, but that's the direction I'd like to see LD going. We would still need healer aid, but we would be contributing a lot more as well, specially with the BS potency right now.

3. As for DP, I think lowering the mana cost to what it used to be, keeping the potency as it is now, but adding a better defensive effect (Old Reprisal damage reduction, that only affects the DRK, or something) when DA'ed would be good enough.

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Originally Posted by Ryutamashiisan

3) replace living dead with dread spikes.

Dread spikes. Prevents you from falling below 1hp and absorbs between 50-100% of all incoming damage as HP for the duration.

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If they were going to replace Living Dead, I'd rather they keep it in line with our abilities getting tied into our story.
Call up a copy of our character at full health as a noncontrolled pet with it projecting a Cover effect on us for the duration.

Effectively doubles our HP before we can be killed as our ultimate survival technique while keeping in line with the story's tendency to have us project someone to help us cope with a trauma.