6.1 PvP: Amazing!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Waliel

This is a really old and extremely rare problem that I first encountered back in ARR. All game sounds just randomly die, and the only way to fix it is to restart the game. I've no idea what causes it and it only seems to happen a few times a year at most. One thought I had was the game not liking my discrete sound card, but seeing as I have no way to really test it with it being as rare as it is, I've never bothered.

That said, it did happen to me during one match, yes.

---

an old problem huh. Never happened to me before I think.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ransu

Primal rend absolutely needs to be nerfed. It needs to either be a single target gap closing stun or remove the gap closer and leave it an aoe stun. Ninja LB also needs to be nerfed. Allowing them to be able to do potentially two LB's is stupid. Would also be nice if we got a damn audio queue when someone uses an LB so we can at least have a chance to react to it.

---

I disagree... if you get hit by Primal rend and it stuns everyone, it meant your party was standing too close together. That's a low rank rookie mistake.

Ninja LB is fine as is. It's utterly useless unless it works on the ideal situation, which is what makes it fun and impactful when paired with its toolkit. The huge delay ninja has after utilizing LB is also something you can take advantage of since they'll be immediately animation locked. It has equally as big of a drawback to its usage if you can bait it. This LB is unlike other melee LBs which are impactful no matter the situation (DRG/SAM/MNK).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hagare

I did not pay attention to that xD

---

Yep, keeps happening in CC for me at least a few times in an hour.

Mention it in this thread:
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...Client-Restart

Been having a total blast with CC, it even got me to stop MSQ and unlocking the raid for a few days because I couldn't stop.
Sometimes either side is steamrolled from team composition but it doesn't feel terrible because matches are so fast.
I love that there's soloqueue and hope there's an option to keep soloqueuing even after group matchmaking is added.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

I disagree... if you get hit by Primal rend and it stuns everyone, it meant your party was standing too close together. That's a low rank rookie mistake.

Ninja LB is fine as is. It's utterly useless unless it works on the ideal situation, which is what makes it fun and impactful when paired with its toolkit. The huge delay ninja has after utilizing LB is also something you can take advantage of since they'll be immediately animation locked. It has equally as big of a drawback to its usage if you can bait it. This LB is unlike other melee LBs which are impactful no matter the situation (DRG/SAM/MNK).

---

You can disagree all you want, but you're still wrong. At one point or another you're gonna be clumped together because there's this thing called the objective. Primal rend is broken, especially when they also have a stupid pull chain.

I want to like the mode, but the more I play it the more flawed it is. Roles need to just go away completely. I'm tired of seeing 2 or 3 healers on a team.

Balacing apart adding a literally godmode shield to everyone has to be the most dumbest bandaid fix I've ever witnessed

I won 5-9 matches I tried with CC but my god is it frustrating to play. There's just zero balance, you can't see your impact and too much is reliant on the servers agreeing with what you're doing.

Putting this much time and effort into making such a borked mode only to give the responses to Hroths and Viera reg hair issues is laughable to me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by drtasteyummy

Balacing apart adding a literally godmode shield to everyone has to be the most dumbest bandaid fix I've ever witnessed

---

It is way better than the old combat potions and healing power Healers used to have.

The shield at least (as well as certain Jobs such as DNC or SCH for example), gives the entire PvP mode a good push towards skill oriented gameplay, instead of keeping it purely powerbased.

I've come on the FFXIV forums for the first time wanting to talk about this exact issue. At the first, the PVP is fun and all but when you get hit by the realization of how unbalanced it is, makes one rage in great pain. I for one am trying for 3 days now, 3 days, to at least get to Silver 1 but it's impossible because of how unbalanced the teams are. I'm stuck at Silver 3 for days. I'm winning maxim 2 matches in a row and then losing 6, not even joking. And after every match, if I try to compare how I did VS how my teammates did is depressing. I play healer and I'm 90% of the time the top player in my team or the second. It feels really unfair to be paired with people that are still new to the system and losing because they are still learning, happened like this many times now. Please find a solution so this will be fairer for the people that are actually knowing how to play. I can't even get the mounts yet from the Garo even because I lost so many times.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ransu

You can disagree all you want, but you're still wrong. At one point or another you're gonna be clumped together because there's this thing called the objective. Primal rend is broken, especially when they also have a stupid pull chain.

I want to like the mode, but the more I play it the more flawed it is. Roles need to just go away completely. I'm tired of seeing 2 or 3 healers on a team.

---

... You do realize only ONE person needs to be on the objective point to move it? And in all my games, no one just stays grouped up unless they were willing to purposely tank the attack with guard or bursting the enemy down and requires everyone to engage on the enemy. Even then, it's only for a small brief period. It sounds like you just have a bad case of teammates.

really enjoying pvp, even if some major balancing is required.

MNK and NIN are way to tank for the dmg output.

and I think Samurai LB is bugged.


I'm inflicting Kuzushi and doing zantetsuken but no one is taking damage???

It's fun and fast paced which is good, but there are quite overpowered/underperforming jobs.

Its good but the only problem(s) I have is that since the game is so short, barely lasts for 3-4 mins whichever team gets hold of the point first pretty much has a 90% chance of winning, there should be ways to stop.

There should also be no de-ranking until silver or gold, since we are forced to play with randoms who might be there to win or just to increase their level.

Also quite a few jobs need nerfing like DRG and RDM.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ransu

You can disagree all you want, but you're still wrong. At one point or another you're gonna be clumped together because there's this thing called the objective. Primal rend is broken, especially when they also have a stupid pull chain.

I want to like the mode, but the more I play it the more flawed it is. Roles need to just go away completely. I'm tired of seeing 2 or 3 healers on a team.

---

Primal rend is 8000 potency on a 15s cd. That's by no means broken. If you want broken, talk about Dragoons who can put out 55K damage every 30s. Whoever they decide to kill is going to die.

I was looking forward to playing this mode with friends. It was the only thing keeping me subbed, since I don't like the PvE content at all.

Yeah, the biggest issue is the respawn time I think, once one team hits first checkpoint. Since its almost impossible to mount a proper defense at that point.

Maybe make the final goal have to be held for a time before the capture is complete. Gives the defense actual time to do one more team battle, instead of being forced to run piecemeal to there as they spawn.

It's awful. They've thrown away the solid base we had, and replaced it with a short-lived dumbed-down spam fest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fuchsy

I've come on the FFXIV forums for the first time wanting to talk about this exact issue. At the first, the PVP is fun and all but when you get hit by the realization of how unbalanced it is, makes one rage in great pain. I for one am trying for 3 days now, 3 days, to at least get to Silver 1 but it's impossible because of how unbalanced the teams are. I'm stuck at Silver 3 for days. I'm winning maxim 2 matches in a row and then losing 6, not even joking. And after every match, if I try to compare how I did VS how my teammates did is depressing. I play healer and I'm 90% of the time the top player in my team or the second. It feels really unfair to be paired with people that are still new to the system and losing because they are still learning, happened like this many times now. Please find a solution so this will be fairer for the people that are actually knowing how to play. I can't even get the mounts yet from the Garo even because I lost so many times.

---

I know your pain, hang in there. I'm typically a good player but if 4 out of 5 people aren't consistent it's not always your fault. That said losing is demoralizing which can also impact the outcome or quality of your next matches. Make sure you take a break and do something else, it can make a difference.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BigBossCL

Yeah, the biggest issue is the respawn time I think, once one team hits first checkpoint. Since its almost impossible to mount a proper defense at that point.

Maybe make the final goal have to be held for a time before the capture is complete. Gives the defense actual time to do one more team battle, instead of being forced to run piecemeal to there as they spawn.

---

The point of CC is, to have rather short matches to begin with, in case you forgot. Your Team only has arround 3 Wipes at most that can be forgiven, otherwise the match becomes unneccesarily long and stale.



As for the matter of certain Jobs "underperforming": if all you do is zerg rushing face first into the enemy group by any given chance, then you shouldnt expect more technical jobs to fill your lack of awareness or skill. Some Jobs are fundamentally more different than you might think and need to be played in a specific way to be successful.

PvP doesnt need to be "balanced", it needs variety more than anything else.

I always prefer large scale over small scale, never been a fan of arenas in MMOs. I like the rng of crystal conflict as it makes games a bit unpredictable but you have to accept it if you're willing to put in the effort to climb. That being said, the simple fact that it's solo only makes me not play it. I just don't have fun playing this format solo.

It's fun right now because everything is op in it's own way (some more than others of course) but the inevitable obsession with balance will ruin it with time like it has in previous iterations and the entirety of pve.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Anhra

PvP doesnt need to be "balanced", it needs variety more than anything else.

---

/facepalm god I hope the developers don't share your views, this pvp needs some class fixes ASAP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by forsakee

/facepalm god I hope the developers don't share your views, this pvp needs some class fixes ASAP.

---

PvP before patch 6.1 was "balanced" to the point where each Job within its designated role was essentially the same, only the actual numbers and some unsignificant lolgimmick to keep the burst in check was the difference, which made certain Jobs far more powerful than others.

And i dont think i dont need to remind you or anyone how well recieved old PvP was.


Instead of always blaming job design of which you not only seem to know little of, but also not provide any constructive feedback about, how about you try instead getting used to things first, if you do care so much about PvP since it made you post on these very Forums?

Yes, to make it worse Bards main source of damage goes down when they get close. Worse it has a RP walk and a cast time which makes you a sitting duck. What is the point of playing a rng physical job if you have cast times on your attacks?

Being stunlocked into oblivion even after you used your purify isn't fun at all.

It needs to give 5s of immunity on use.

That or Guard needs to break CC on use.

How do I get my team to understand "fall back and regroup" doesn't mean "run solo head first into a full healthy resource ready 5 man team on crystal". It's the only part of the new pvp that I don't like. I don't mind the broken jobs, I just can't stand the fact that I'm losing because of my team's unwillingness to make plays together. I love PLD but I also feel like it's completely useless guarding people most of the time because they either don't recognize it or do anything with it. Edit: My team just AFK'd because they thought they were going to lose, so we lost. What even is rank???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

Being stunlocked into oblivion even after you used your purify isn't fun at all.

It needs to give 5s of immunity on use.

That or Guard needs to break CC on use.

---

Guard breaking CC would definitely be nice.

While I'm glad the PvP scene got revived and tons of people are having fun with it, me included with Crystalline Conflict. But the balance is a mess right now due the current "unga bunga mass cc burst" meta.

While it was expected being this chaotic since it's the first season with the mass overhaul ever, the good old Frontlines are reaching a point where they are just not fun.

Like, isn't fun see the whole alliance raid being wiped out so easily by spam of ranged ccs from WHM and SMN LBs before you had any chance to do anything. And I'm noticing that this extreme wide area burst meta + Battle High system, is almost impossible to have any chance of comeback compared to before. And, unlike Crystalline Conflict, the matches aren't being faster, if anything feels they are dragging out more lately.

Not only they need to improve DR being shared to all types of cc to avoid players being stunlocked till dead, but several jobs needs extra tweaks ASAP.

While I love the job changes, playing so much pvp the past few days has only re-established how much I actually hate pvp.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bergfinn

Like, isn't fun see the whole alliance raid being wiped out so easily by spam of ranged ccs from WHM and SMN LBs before you had any chance to do anything. And I'm noticing that this extreme wide area burst meta + Battle High system, is almost impossible to have any chance of comeback compared to before. And, unlike Crystalline Conflict, the matches aren't being faster, if anything feels they are dragging out more lately.

---

I think Overtime needs to be re-thought.

If one team has a checkpoint, and the other doesn't at the end of regulation that should be the match.

Obtaining a checkpoint isn't easy at all. It's 10-20 extra seconds of standing there vulnerable in enemy territory.

I had a game where we had 77% progress to 0% progress, went into overtime for 3 min or so and they still didn't make any progress (I think they got it back to mid?), they could just respawn and get there one at a time and barely survive enough for the next person.

Final standing? 77% progress to 0% progress.

That game should NOT have went to overtime.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

Primal rend is 8000 potency on a 15s cd. That's by no means broken. If you want broken, talk about Dragoons who can put out 55K damage every 30s. Whoever they decide to kill is going to die.

---

Nah, DRG is strong but it doesn't mean people can't outheal it still. Not to mention any Guards that go up. You can win most 1v1s but that's rarely the case as people tend to be in groups so you're dealing with other things happening to you. DRGs are bulky af however.

And yes Primal rend is broken. An AoE Stun for 2s that can do up to 16k potency, every 15 seconds? It's a decisive game changer of a skill on point especially if your party is ready to attack. Not to mention the stun ailment having NO diminishing returns. WAR right now is the strongest tank and no other comes close.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

I think Overtime needs to be re-thought.

If one team has a checkpoint, and the other doesn't at the end of regulation that should be the match.

Obtaining a checkpoint isn't easy at all. It's 10-20 extra seconds of standing there vulnerable.

I had a game where we had 77% progress to 0% progress, went into overtime for 3 min or so and they still didn't make any progress (I think they got it back to mid?), they could just respawn and get there one at a time and barely survive enough for the next person.

Final standing? 77% progress to 0% progress.

That game should NOT have went to overtime.

---

In terms of Overtime, it's functioning with the same concept as Paladins which does work. The only thing I believe that fails here is that you have to push the crystal all the way to the winners side and take more ground if you are behind, even if you wiped out the enemy team. In Paladins when a game goes into overtime, if the team who caught the point first, fails to push it to the end, the surviving team gets a point for defending..

They could incorporate something similar with the crystal for this game where, if the team that has more progress holds the crystal for longer than 3s without anyone coming in, -> its a win
The team that had less progress, but wiped out the team with more and held the crystal with no interferences for 3s -> Draw

You are way more at a disadvantage when you are below in overtime, because even if you step out of the crystal for a few seconds, if the the ahead party is in there, that's game immediately.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Havenchild

And yes Primal rend is broken. An AoE Stun for 2s that can do up to 16k potency, every 15 seconds? It's a decisive game changer of a skill on point especially if your party is ready to attack. Not to mention the stun ailment having NO diminishing returns. WAR right now is the strongest tank and no other comes close.

---

Read.the.dang.tooltip.

You're only getting 16K when you use your Limit Break. It's NOT 16K every 15s.

Warrior is strong when they're lots of people around you, they're weak when they're isolated.

I think it needs some tone down in CC. CCs feel really bad in fast paced games…
Other than that it‘s quite fun! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

Warrior is strong when they're lots of people around you, they're weak when they're isolated.

---

Na man, Warrior is kind of broken, or it feels like it for me atleast. I hate having a Warrior on my butt, completely obnoxious! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jennah

If anyone else has repeatedly given up on even casual PvP in disgust, and is wondering if it's worth learning an entire new random set of abilities almost unrelated to your job AGAIN: No, not it is not.

---

it's literally 6 skill are you illiterate or what?

WAR literally needs to be nerfed into the ground along with WHM lol.

I don't think PVP is very good at all.
Classes are NOT even close to balanced.
Tank classes aren't tanking, Healers can't heal, etc. Not every job is effected to the same degree, but almost every GUN and WHM agrees, can't tank (gun) and can't heal (whm) worth squat to be considered that class roll.
For WHM - imagine your healing doing 10% HP, taking 1.5 seconds to cast, and only 2 charges (takes 15 seconds to get a charge) that is your main healing.
Secondary healing requies you to "jump" into the attack - hitting an opponent, to trigger Cure3 - which is a slight bit more healing, but usually not able to get enough players to matter (as you have to target an enemy, charge at them with an attack - making no sense to healer class - and then find the group that is damaged in X seconds to trigger cure 3 or you lose it)

That is the extend of the 'healing' on WHM. They are stuck with glare (recast 2.4s - way too long to be actually useful in PVP) - which also does a weak amount of damage (see PVP skills below)
The "change into an creature for 2 second" isn't crowd control, it is a single target denial for 2 seconds, which has no effect on guarded and similar opponents (which defeats half the use, to pull/cancel guard and allow a kill instead of recovery)

PVP Skills
So you have Guard, the ultimate "ok i don't want any part of this" 90% reduction shield, ok.... useful and I am ok with.
Then you have Purify - to get out of all those freakin snares/slows (or.. by contrast.. you could just... make LESS stuns/snares since they are just annoying anyway)
Lastely Recuperate - this one skill nullifies the usefulness of a WHM - the healing it does, is near 2x as powerful, instant cast (mana cost) and can be spammed by yourself. You don't need a healer to target you or stay in range (something rather hard to do, without being targeted themself)

Lastly - remove mounts, or make a PVP specific mount to reduce screen clutter. It just is annoying to have so many things blocking targeting like summons and mounts. Your in PVP - you need to be more PVP focused.

You can't slow, sleep, remove-debuffs or anything else the WHM can do NORMALLY in PVE - the only thing you have is a secondary stun and a 2second "dont use skills" that has a 25s recast timer.

WHM damage, is so pathetic, or the Recuperate ability is so OP - that a WHM can attack 4x (over 10 seconds of casting) and 1 recuperate negates all the damage taken, and that isn't even counting Tanks and other damage mitigation that could and most likely is on an enemy. That is just impossibly low.

Also you took away Areo/Dia for DoT damage to help counter these problems.... which means 90% of damage dealt is from LB a mass of enemy zergrush, and running away without any kills typically. We can't sit around and help heal - because of our restrictions and weak heal ability.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ransu

WAR literally needs to be nerfed into the ground along with WHM lol.

---

play a whm and tell me you feel as powerful as literally any other class. I dare you.

dissapointed i can queue into with friends.

either casual or ranked im unsure which would be better, but it'd be nice to go in with my friends, we did a few where we all queued at the same time and it was kinda fun getting randomly put on opposite teams.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kissker

play a whm and tell me you feel as powerful as literally any other class. I dare you.

---

Unfortunately, WHM is putting out some of the biggest numbers in PVP right now, especially in CC. They more than double any other healer for healing done, and they typically outdamage the other healers more often than not, too. Sometimes they'll even outdamage DPS. It's about how you use your spells and abilities, in this PVP.

And we're no longer just DPS/Tank/Healers. Now we're WHM, AST, etc. We're jobs, not roles, now. Which is a fantastic step in the best direction that the game has gone in, so far, for job design.
That said, yes, numbers and effects need to be tweaked and adjusted. We still have a long road to trek down. Or a surprisingly short one, if they keep releasing dumpsterfire patches like this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kissker

play a whm and tell me you feel as powerful as literally any other class. I dare you.

---

When I play WHM and I use the LB, I feel like a gamechanging god, its also pretty easy to score some kills and keep people up with some neat healing in a pinch. WHM is an absolute powerhouse in CC and its pretty damn strong in Frontlines too.