Biggest pet peeves when it comes to dungeon runs?

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Originally Posted by Juun

What, I didnt knew this. Im sorry.

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It's not as big of a deal these days, but back during ARR and HW, it could cause quite a bit of problems. At times it was harder to hold aggro back from that Regen in those days (which is why aggro dropping through Shroud of Saints was a big thing for WHM).

Tanks that pull wall to wall and not hit all the mobs. The healer uses heal on them all the mobs charge the and kill them.

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Originally Posted by Minarisweet

People who think prepull regen is bad when getting aggro off these mobs is a no brainer :).

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Sure it's not hard to get the aggro back. But it's time lost. Instead of a fast and proper pull you waste your first GCD because the mobs run to the healer instead of you, so you don't hit all of them. Then you have to run back to the healer, do another AoE, and another one or else the dps will pull aggro off while you run to the next pack.
This does not only slow the run down, you also eat a lot more damage as a tank, so the healer actually has to heal more instead of less (thanks to the regen). Ideally you use sprint to run to the next pack, avoiding auto attacks with our speed. But instead you have to drag the enemys back and forth and get hit a lot.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The only reason why I say this is simple. If the tank isn't holding it, aggro is all over the place and the healer is struggling. Too much gets on the healer, the healer dies, and then the party dies. Like it or not the tank DOES control the flow. Though to be honest the healer does as well, a good healer can basically drag the party over the "Duty Complete" line kicking and screaming. I have a problem with people dragging more than I'm pulling or what the tank is pulling, especially considering if asked in advance, "Small or Big pulls?" If I get an answer of "Small" as a tank or I give that answer as a healer (usually because I'm lagging) and you're doing that, then I will show you no mercy, the answer was already given.

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That's nice and all save for the fact that aggro "management" is the most braindead it's ever been. The days of hoping to God that your casters (and white mage with it's massive enmity generation) hit Lucid Dreaming before they overtake you on the aggro list are gone, you no longer have to worry about melee/ranged DPS not activating diversion before launching their openers and snatching the boss's attention from you, Ninja doesn't have access to it's aggro manipulating abilities Shadewalker and Smokescreen, and tanks no longer have to worry about staying in their offensive stance over their defensive stance to eke out more damage. In fact, tanks generate roughly 10 times as much aggro as they used to the point that a single aoe is enough to grab any trash mob's attention, no thinking involved. Tank stance doesn't even incur a damage penalty anymore.

Quit trying to take this high and mighty approach when your only job is to get punched in the face by monsters you glorified meat shield.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

The only reason why I say this is simple. If the tank isn't holding it, aggro is all over the place and the healer is struggling. Too much gets on the healer, the healer dies, and then the party dies. Like it or not the tank DOES control the flow. Though to be honest the healer does as well, a good healer can basically drag the party over the "Duty Complete" line kicking and screaming. I have a problem with people dragging more than I'm pulling or what the tank is pulling, especially considering if asked in advance, "Small or Big pulls?" If I get an answer of "Small" as a tank or I give that answer as a healer (usually because I'm lagging) and you're doing that, then I will show you no mercy, the answer was already given.

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Two good DPS and a good healer can deal with a tank that is not performing well. A good tank can deal with big pulls if decent dps even if the healer is performing up to snuff. The pace is set by the group, not just a tank or a healer.

The "gogogo" rush mentality, must wall to wall pull where rescuing the tank and dps pulling mobs is perfectly fine annoys me.

What annoys me more though is that it's understandable. Roulettes are just a daily chore, dungeons are mindlessly simple, dps or healers won't die if they pull mobs, so you can understand why people just want in and out as fast as possible. That's what irks me. How the design of dungeons has lead to this.

Dungeons are a massive waste of developer resources. They're visually amazing and must have countless hours of Dev work poured into them, yet they insist on making them 10 minute zergs that people don't even enjoy and just want to be done and over with. In terms of gameplay, dungeons just aren't good in this game and that's by choice. It's a shame.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I mean, I've ran these dungeons just as much as the next guy, but I'm not gonna rush anyone just because I don't feel like doing said dungeon is worth my time. Might as well not even queue at all if it's like that.

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Except dungeons are the most efficient way to level, and the only option for tomes worth doing if I don't feel like spamming hunts. I also don't mind dungeons but pulling only three mobs makes incredibly boring, especially on a tank or healer where I'm basically a gimped DPS. On a healer, I'll actually have to heal big pulls. One pack? I rarely even need Regen, let alone anything else.

Liam essentially addresses it above. The rush mentality is a result of how pathetically weak dungeons are. If mobs had actual teeth, you'd never see DPS pull because they'd actually die. Look no further than Deep Dungeon. Those mobs will nearly one-shot DPS and healers at the higher levels. Additionally, some demand actual thought in the form of crowd control or being a priority target.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Except dungeons are the most efficient way to level, and the only option for tomes worth doing if I don't feel like spamming hunts. I also don't mind dungeons but pulling only three mobs makes incredibly boring, especially on a tank or healer where I'm basically a gimped DPS. On a healer, I'll actually have to heal big pulls. One pack? I rarely even need Regen, let alone anything else.

Liam essentially addresses it above. The rush mentality is a result of how pathetically weak dungeons are. If mobs had actual teeth, you'd never see DPS pull because they'd actually die. Look no further than Deep Dungeon. Those mobs will nearly one-shot DPS and healers at the higher levels. Additionally, some demand actual thought in the form of crowd control or being a priority target.

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I thought they had increased mob damage when Shadowbringers released? Either way it seems like a disservice to the party to enter with an "ugh, let's just get this over with" mentality.

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Originally Posted by Erinellza

When people die to the same mechanic over and over again.

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Classic "dont step in the fire" trope....except in FF...its always fire, and everyone steps in it.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I thought they had increased mob damage when Shadowbringers released? Either way it seems like a disservice to the party to enter with an "ugh, let's just get this over with" mentality.

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Blame SE for making it thr most efficient way to level or grind tomes.

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Originally Posted by Caitsithhh

Or pull wall to wall as the game is intended and keep sprint on cd to do so….actual pro tip

Then you won’t have to deal with ppl thinking you’re doing to slow. Just remove the problem with the kick function if it’s really something you can’t grasp

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Right,again, I'm cool with keeping aggro....surviving however, or having the healer die because he thought he could survive because he had a pre-order item or what have you, isn't fun for me. One could play solo, but the minute you click on "join" you subscribe to the holy trinity, know your role(literally). If the tank doesn't ask for more pulls, don't pull. The rush mentality is never helpful.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Unless it leads to a wipe (due to tank and/or healer genuinely being unable to keep up), I wouldn't see it as griefing.



And this right here is a toxic attitude that can be reported. Tanks DO NOT control the flow of the dungeon. The party overall does. DPS control how long you're in the dungeon (if they're good/fantastic, less time in dungeon. If they're bad/terrible... well, you know), tanks control the mobs around them and healers keep people alive (and DPS to assist in dungeon length). It's silly to say only the tank controls the flow.

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To your logic, neither does the DPS or Healer, COMMUNICATION is the important bit, not running into a mob then pulling them into a group without warning. The tank controls if he wants to aggro after someone is pulling who isn't supposed to. Sure, you can go right on ahead and aggro everything in sight...said tank doesn't have to keep taunt aura on. Lack of communication is the crux of what I'm talking about.

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Originally Posted by Wolven_Essence

I would second this one. It does not bug me to much in FF14 yet because I am still new and don’t know my way around to well yet. So sometimes I rely on those that run ahead a little to let me know the right path. Even though I have hardly had anyone run ahead and pull before I get there.

This sort of thing was so bad in WoW though, people are so fanged impatient there and it used to drive me absolutely nuts when they did it.

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The funny/annoying part was that Rogues were usually the ones saying "dude hurry up"...never gave my tank, food, potions, bandages, etc. Kicked immediately. If you're that squishy, be patient. My thing is the mentality it breeds. That Rogue player now influences others to be just as bad.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

My biggest pet peeve is people thinking tanks can be the only one to pull mobs.

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You got triggered and didn't read my replies, thats cool, next time, take a minute before typing.

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

"You pull it you tank it" has to be about the most smoothbrain take I've ever had the displeasure of hearing and I genuinely despise anyone that subscribes to that mentality.

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To be fair, you subscribe to the holy trinity of MMO's the second you click on the "join" button for duties/raids. Especially raids, where in one bad pull, you can get a healer/team wiped. Its the "I'll just go ahead and pull without telling the tank/party" that breeds bad tactic. You wanna pull mobs to me? Cool, just let everyone know. I don't defend lack of communication and Leroy Jenkins.

People who seem to believe that they can dictate the run for everyone else after intentionally selecting to do often randomly selected casual content with a group of 3 other completely random people.

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Originally Posted by StriderShinryu

People who seem to believe that they can dictate the run for everyone else after intentionally selecting to do often randomly selected casual content with a group of 3 other completely random people.

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Fair enough, but we all signed that invisible MMO-Holy trinity contract when we decide to do dungeons. DPS, falls in line, Healers follow the Tank, and said Tank, leads the way. If you find a way to tank with a dps or healer vs level appropriate minions, by all means, rock on, till then, we all understandthe totem pole. And thats coming from someone who has DPSed, Tanked and Healed in over 4 major MMO's...I learned to drop the ego quickly, someone always has to lead, and we always have to follow (in context).

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Originally Posted by StriderShinryu

People who seem to believe that they can dictate the run for everyone else after intentionally selecting to do often randomly selected casual content with a group of 3 other completely random people.

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Absolutely. The only way anyone can dictate the run is collectively with a vote kick.

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Originally Posted by SavageCipher

Right,again, I'm cool with keeping aggro....surviving however, or having the healer die because he thought he could survive because he had a pre-order item or what have you, isn't fun for me. One could play solo, but the minute you click on "join" you subscribe to the holy trinity, know your role(literally). If the tank doesn't ask for more pulls, don't pull. The rush mentality is never helpful.

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The dungeons were designed to be pulled wall to wall. Especially when synced. This isn’t Everquest or some 25 year old mmo.

Imagine not even being maxed level/ilvl and thinking your opinion matters lol.

There’s not a single rule in ffxiv that says who pulls. Being an easy chore means there’s plenty of room to run it however anyone in the party sees fit.

If you’re a tank in a dungeon you just click a single aoe and the mob is your’s. If your ego makes you feel like you don’t want to then that’s a therapy issue not a gaming issue.

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Originally Posted by SavageCipher

Fair enough, but we all signed that invisible MMO-Holy trinity contract when we decide to do dungeons. DPS, falls in line, Healers follow the Tank, and said Tank, leads the way. If you find a way to tank with a dps or healer vs level appropriate minions, by all means, rock on, till then, we all understandthe totem pole. And thats coming from someone who has DPSed, Tanked and Healed in over 4 major MMO's...I learned to drop the ego quickly, someone always has to lead, and we always have to follow (in context).

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Yep just read more you’re def dated in mmo’s and how they are ingested here.

My biggest pet peeve? The inability of people to adequately communicate with other members of a group in an MMO.

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

Blame SE for making it thr most efficient way to level or grind tomes.

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SE isn't forcing that mentaility on people. It's their own decision to act like their time is more valuable to everyone else's. When I hit the Join button I'm there to do the content that comes up. Doesn't matter if it's my first time or my 500th time.

"Did you Dia the mobs before I could pull? I'm turning off stance you can tank them."

WHM proceeds to heal the DPS and tank the trash and bosses.

"Are you coming tank?"

Tank with severely bruised ego quietly drops pt

There are no leaders in dungeon, tank holds aggro no matter what, DPS do DPS, and healers DPS and heal if needed. Always wall to wall and always sprint before the pull starts. The only exception to these rule are if sprouts are present, then adapt as needed.

If you want to have a casual stroll through a dungeon then use explorer mode or PF. These people with egos that find any excuse to try to teach people a lesson are often unskilled players with multiple 80s. Get over yourselves and stop wasting peoples time, their subs are just as valuable as yours.

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Originally Posted by Annihilism

"Did you Dia the mobs before I could pull? I'm turning off stance you can tank them."

WHM proceeds to heal the DPS and tank the trash and bosses.

"Are you coming tank?"

Tank with severely bruised ego quietly drops pt

There are no leaders in dungeon, tank holds aggro no matter what, DPS do DPS, and healers DPS and heal if needed. Always wall to wall and always sprint before the pull starts. The only exception to these rule are if sprouts are present, then adapt as needed.

If you want to have a casual stroll through a dungeon then use explorer mode or PF. These people with egos that find any excuse to try to teach people a lesson are often unskilled players with multiple 80s. Get over yourselves and stop wasting peoples time, their subs are just as valuable as yours.

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This never gets old. The best part is the tank is an easy kick if they try to start any drama, since they’re already proven they’re unnecessary.

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Originally Posted by Caitsithhh

Yep just read more you’re def dated in mmo’s and how they are ingested here.

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Unless raids have changed in Shadowbringers.....I just checked nope, all the same, especially in raids; Tanks go in and draw aggro, nobody else. But please, if you can show me a DPS or Healer tanking lvl appropriate mobs, by all means.Till then it hasn't changed, nice attempt, but my point still stands communication > Leroy Jenkins. Never pull the "its different now" card, when I can literally youtube and or log into the game smh.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I thought they had increased mob damage when Shadowbringers released? Either way it seems like a disservice to the party to enter with an "ugh, let's just get this over with" mentality.

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They supposedly did. However, they didn't consider tanks having passive mitigation now or how bloated both theirs and healer kits are in terms of mitigation, healing and etc. Like I said earlier, Warrior can literally solo every single 80 dungeon. It's utterly insane how powerful Nascent Flash is.

And how is it a disservice? Most players want Experts to go by quickly. Hence why tanks usually pull entire rooms without a word. It's expected nowadays to big pull, and has been for several years.

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Originally Posted by Annihilism

"Did you Dia the mobs before I could pull? I'm turning off stance you can tank them."

WHM proceeds to heal the DPS and tank the trash and bosses.

"Are you coming tank?"

Tank with severely bruised ego quietly drops pt

There are no leaders in dungeon, tank holds aggro no matter what, DPS do DPS, and healers DPS and heal if needed. Always wall to wall and always sprint before the pull starts. The only exception to these rule are if sprouts are present, then adapt as needed.

If you want to have a casual stroll through a dungeon then use explorer mode or PF. These people with egos that find any excuse to try to teach people a lesson are often unskilled players with multiple 80s. Get over yourselves and stop wasting peoples time, their subs are just as valuable as yours.

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Again, with higher level gear/trinkets, I don't doubt it, but if you're new to the game, this isn't going to be you as a DPS, nor is it the norm in Dungeons and Raids, so we need to stop with that ridiculous mentality. Ultimately you're defending lack of communication and bad gameplay...which is fine for you, but I rather teach the fundamentals to sprouts anyone lurking/thinking of going into tanking. Are you automatically the leader as a tank? No. But certain tactic is still vital in ANY mmo; like going in first, communicating with your team, etc.

Are there leaders in dungeons and raids in general? Of course there are, to deny that would be feigning ignorance on a cosmic level.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

They supposedly did. However, they didn't consider tanks having passive mitigation now or how bloated both theirs and healer kits are in terms of mitigation, healing and etc. Like I said earlier, Warrior can literally solo every single 80 dungeon. It's utterly insane how powerful Nascent Flash is.

And how is it a disservice? Most players want Experts to go by quickly. Hence why tanks usually pull entire rooms without a word. It's expected nowadays to big pull, and has been for several years.

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It's a disservice because it assumes that everyone is on board with that mentality.

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Originally Posted by Joven

It's a disservice because it assumes that everyone is on board with that mentality.

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Very rarely is that not the majority opinion in higher level dungeons. If one person in the party wants to explore and three want to get it over with, well... majority rule. In a scenario like that, you're better off running Trusts. They're literally designed for people who prefer taking their time and going at a slow pace.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

They supposedly did. However, they didn't consider tanks having passive mitigation now or how bloated both theirs and healer kits are in terms of mitigation, healing and etc. Like I said earlier, Warrior can literally solo every single 80 dungeon. It's utterly insane how powerful Nascent Flash is.

And how is it a disservice? Most players want Experts to go by quickly. Hence why tanks usually pull entire rooms without a word. It's expected nowadays to big pull, and has been for several years.

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Yeah and that usually gets patched/Nerfed, it isn't the first time in an MMO that a class is OP, WoW had that problem with Paladins, and Death Knights, but again, it isn't the norm. Nor is it teaching any newcomers anything good. You go into a raid with that mentality, and you're getting kicked. Have I made huge pulls? Of course, but my point throughout this whole "peeve" has been the lack of communication, dps attempting and getting themselves or the healer killed.

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Originally Posted by SavageCipher

Yeah and that usually gets patched/Nerfed, it isn't the first time in an MMO that a class is OP, WoW had that problem with Paladins, and Death Knights, but again, it isn't the norm. Nor is it teaching any newcomers anything good. You go into a raid with that mentality, and you're getting kicked. Have I made huge pulls? Of course, but my point throughout this whole "peeve" has been the lack of communication, dps attempting and getting themselves or the healer killed.

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Two years and Nascent Flash has yet to be changed. Paladin can also solo dungeons with Clemency and that's been around since Heavensward. While Dark Knight can't survive solo, it's single target mitigation is so absurd, three mobs simply won't break TBN in the seven second duration. You literally aren't healing tanks pulling small. You'll spam Holy/AoW/Gravity and nothing else. In fact, Astro's strongest heal, Essential Dignity is rendered completely worthless in this scenario because it's healing potency is increased the lower its target's HP. Likewise, Benediction and Excog are equally pointless since tanks won't take enough damage. Regardless, I'm not talking about straight new players. Which is why I've specifically said higher level dungeons and Expert. Granted, you should be learning to big pull on your way to 50 because that is the standard.

Raids are irrelevant to this discussion because those bosses can actually kill you. There's also no benefit to DPS pulling them, and in fact, most DPS prefer a proper content to do their openers. At least at 70+. Nonetheless, this "mentality" doesn't apply to raids because they function differently.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Very rarely is that not the majority opinion in higher level dungeons. If one person in the party wants to explore and three want to get it over with, well... majority rule. In a scenario like that, you're better off running Trusts. They're literally designed for people who prefer taking their time and going at a slow pace.

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Nobody is arguing for slower runs. Just to be mindful of your teammates and communicate before running off on your own to pull because you feel things aren't going as fast as you want.

When I'm tanking I don't always pop sprint and run immediately when the dungeon starts; sometimes I'm preoccupied and need a few seconds. Same thing for in between pulls. If a DPS runs ahead to pull and decides he's going to get the group moving for me, then I'll generally just stand there and see what the Healer does. If the Healer heals the DPS and takes aggro I'll pick the mobs up to protect him, but otherwise I'll let the DPS die.

Still, the discussion about DPS pulling isn't limited to 80 content. In low level dungeons I've had DPS pulling the mobs in optional rooms and running down dead end paths to pull. Also, in dungeons like Stone Vigil I generally won't pull absolutely everything because the wall to walls are ridiculous, and most of the healer classes have garbage kits. I choose when to stop the pull based on things like what CDs are up, how good the DPS is, how much the healer is struggling. In lower level dungeons there's actually a bit of a science to it, and DPS running ahead because they've decided I'm not done pulling yet is obnoxious, to say the least.

Slow, unaggressive tanks. It takes a certain kind of mindset to tank properly: a combination of audacity and awareness regarding group limitations. A tentative tank is someone who should be playing another job.

You want to be the WoL and pull everything with your healer or DPS? Fine. But act like a good WoL and bring the mobs to your tank or die alone.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Very rarely is that not the majority opinion in higher level dungeons. If one person in the party wants to explore and three want to get it over with, well... majority rule. In a scenario like that, you're better off running Trusts. They're literally designed for people who prefer taking their time and going at a slow pace.

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Exactly and I always do this when a new dungeon drops. I go in with Trusts and take in the sights and go "ooooh aaaah" at all the shiny things I can't go to because the grass is too long or something, and then once I do Roulettes I just do my usual wall to wall pulls because... that's the standard and I'll be damned if I become an egotistical tank.

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Originally Posted by SavageCipher

To your logic, neither does the DPS or Healer, COMMUNICATION is the important bit, not running into a mob then pulling them into a group without warning. The tank controls if he wants to aggro after someone is pulling who isn't supposed to. Sure, you can go right on ahead and aggro everything in sight...said tank doesn't have to keep taunt aura on. Lack of communication is the crux of what I'm talking about.

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I literally said party overall controls the flow, mate.
But hey, keep that toxic attitude of "you pull, you tank." Easiest way to leave a dungeon without getting a penalty (though the risk of being reported for potentially MPKing might not be worth it).

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Originally Posted by Nestama

And this right here is a toxic attitude that can be reported. Tanks DO NOT control the flow of the dungeon. The party overall does. DPS control how long you're in the dungeon (if they're good/fantastic, less time in dungeon. If they're bad/terrible... well, you know), tanks control the mobs around them and healers keep people alive (and DPS to assist in dungeon length). It's silly to say only the tank controls the flow.

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Originally Posted by TeraRamis

Slow, unaggressive tanks. It takes a certain kind of mindset to tank properly: a combination of audacity and awareness regarding group limitations. A tentative tank is someone who should be playing another job.

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This is really what it comes down to. Not everyone is suited to be a tank or a healer or a dps. Push the roles that work with your personality and don't try to force yourself into being something you're not.

If your personality doesn't permit you to tank, dps, OR heal, then I heartily recommend becoming a gold saucer main. That's where we all end up eventually, anyway.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

This is really what it comes down to. Not everyone is suited to be a tank or a healer or a dps. Push the roles that work with your personality and don't try to force yourself into being something you're not.

If your personality doesn't permit you to tank, dps, OR heal, then I heartily recommend becoming a gold saucer main. That's where we all end up eventually, anyway.

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It's hilarious that people on here call tanks who'd like to pull at their own discretion egotistical, yet can feel they can tell people a role isn't for them. Imagine the ego needed for that. To tell someone they're no good simply because they don't perform to your standards. "Oh no, the run took 0.2 more minutes to complete because the tank didn't pick up that last mob pack in time. They suck and need to go play in the Gold Saucer."

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Originally Posted by Joven

It's hilarious that people on here call tanks who'd like to pull at their own discretion egotistical, yet can feel they can tell people a role isn't for them. Imagine the ego needed for that. To tell someone they're no good simply because they don't perform to your standards. "Oh no, the run took 0.2 more minutes to complete because the tank didn't pick up that last mob pack in time. They suck and need to go play in the Gold Saucer."

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You're missing the point. Nobody gets to play at their own discretion because anyone can be voted away.

If the party doesn't want a slow pulling tank in Stormblood or Shadowbringers, I'm not going to leap to the tank's defense when the removal vote comes up. I'm not going to try to remove the healer that's trying to rescue them into the next pack, and I'm not going to try to remove the DPS that's helping the tank get more mobs.

Sure, back in Heavensward or ARR I'll be a bit more forgiving-- but that vote is what matters here, not one's own personal standards or inner sense of sanctimonious faux justice.

My own standards are pretty much rock bottom aside from what the party wants. If the party is terrible across the board and they all agree to slow pull everything always, then I just weigh the 30 minute penalty against the penalty of suffering in the party's presence. I don't care how much time I waste or gain, it's entirely a matter of if I'd rather enjoy 30 minutes without "these people" or 20 minutes with "these people." A slow pulling party that cracks jokes every pull is preferable to a drama-filled speedrun for me, at least. Heck, I'm even happy to attempt to solo bosses when I'm tanking just for giggles if the party is that bad, just to see if I can do it.

If we'd all be happier without an individual, of course, then they need to get the boot so everyone can have a better time. Including the person clearly upset that the party wants to do things differently than they do.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

You're missing the point. Nobody gets to play at their own discretion because anyone can be voted away.

If the party doesn't want a slow pulling tank in Stormblood or Shadowbringers, I'm not going to leap to the tank's defense when the removal vote comes up. I'm not going to try to remove the healer that's trying to rescue them into the next pack, and I'm not going to try to remove the DPS that's helping the tank get more mobs.

Sure, back in Heavensward or ARR I'll be a bit more forgiving-- but that vote is what matters here, not one's on personal standards or inner sense of sanctimonious white knighting.

My own standards are pretty much rock bottom aside from what the party wants. If the party is terrible across the board and they all agree to slow pull everything always, then I just weigh the 30 minute penalty against the penalty of suffering in the party's presence. I don't care how much time I waste or gain, it's entirely a matter of if I'd rather enjoy 30 minutes without "these people" or 20 minutes with "these people." A slow pulling party that cracks jokes every pull is preferable to a drama-filled speedrun for me, at least. Heck, I'm even happy to attempt to solo bosses when I'm tanking just for giggles if the party is that bad, just to see if I can do it.

If we'd all be happier without an individual, of course, then they need to get the boot so everyone can have a better time. Including the person clearly upset that the party wants to do things differently than they do.

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And you also miss the point. Pulling slow isn't playing the job wrong and doesn't mean the person sucks at playing it. Vote kicking someone just because they take a few more minutes of your time is petty. Use a few of those precious seconds to say "hey, you can pull more" and generally most people will pick up the pace.