Shocked at the reduction in mage damage, quadruple mp cost, and lowered resources

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Originally Posted by Jin_

let me sum up the community

um "lol @ THM and ARC" "shut up CON lern to cure onry" "quit then, go play wow" "dont let the door hit you" "let the door hit you" "yer wrong im right now cure me and go passive" "servers werk fine"

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you have a way with words :)

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Originally Posted by Jin_

let me sum up the community

um "lol @ THM and ARC" "shut up CON lern to cure onry" "quit then, go play wow" "dont let the door hit you" "let the door hit you" "yer wrong im right now cure me and go passive" "servers werk fine"

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that's how it has been since day one on these forums. if anyone has a complaint or suggestion the certain group doesn't want to see they go after personal attacks.

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Originally Posted by MerkinValefor

overall point is that now conj can fill every role needed while thm cannot. Conj is gonna be required for dungeons while thm is just optional. Hell even if they had just given the raises to thm, it would give some reason to have them in the pt. But conj can dd, heal, buff/debuff at will while thm can debuff/dd. Im totally cool with the changes if they will make both mages needed and not just make one required and one optional.

edit: but w/e the patch is done gonna stop derailing this thred because its about mp cost

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CON CAN'T DD!! OMG dude, go level CON. You have no idea what you're talking about. THM got a dmg boost, con still has terrible dmg. CON is nothing more than a gimp whm at this point while THM is everything else. Think, please.

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Originally Posted by Dubont

CON CAN'T DD!! OMG dude, go level CON. You have no idea what you're talking about. THM got a dmg boost, con still has terrible dmg. CON is nothing more than a gimp whm at this point while THM is everything else. Think, please.

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wow you must have never used proper battle regimens. ive watched conj nuke for 1k+ and rape with dots on uraeus very easily.

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Originally Posted by MerkinValefor

wow you must have never used proper battle regimens. ive watched conj nuke for 1k+ and rape with dots on uraeus very easily.

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using battle regiments yes, the nukes are "semi-useful," and the DoTs are meh, but now, you won't have mp to do any of that so CON isn't OP. Again, thm got a dmg buff and isn't gimped into being a gimp little whm.

At any rate, I can see both being used in parties...1 thm, 2 con, 5 DDs? sounds about right to me

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Originally Posted by Dubont

I CAN'T DD ON CON!

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Fixed for proper statement.

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Originally Posted by Dubont

using battle regiments yes, the nukes are "semi-useful," and the DoTs are meh, but now, you won't have mp to do any of that so CON isn't OP. Again, thm got a dmg buff and isn't gimped into being a gimp little whm.

At any rate, I can see both being used in parties...1 thm, 2 con, 5 DDs? sounds about right to me

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Na, feels more like 2 thm 1 con, 3 DDs 2 tanks, give or take the content.

you got 1 full time 1whm 1 rdm 1 blk.

2 mages jobs is 2 mage jobs.

Who knew players have to think now ....

It's appalling to see how many complaints there are flying around since the 1.18 update....which was hours ago.

This is what we call balancing, people. Welcome to challenge. Because that's what FFXI was all about, and they aren't about to make FFXIV something easy either.

Yes, you work a little harder, but the rewards and the feeling of accomplishment are multiplied in proportion to that work. What has held true for every Final Fantasy game in existence? Parties. Jobs. Classes. You name it, that ultimately all compliment one another. Don't expect to come into this game and be able to do everything solo because you were babied through pre 1.18.

Or perhaps a lot of complainers doesn't understand simply because they are branching off from WoW to play this?

First day of 1.18, give it a chance.

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Originally Posted by zaviermhigo

Fixed for proper statement.

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170 int...Harlequin gear, Jade Crook+2 and 170 Lightning Element..Thunder 2, outside of BRs, on big NMs, might do 200 dmg...if you're lucky. Purge 2 + Shock + Thunder II leads to around 300dmg, then about 5 seconds of shock dmg...so you're looking at 400 dmg (maybe) by mixing an ability and 2 spells as well as quite a bit of mp. But none of this matters now because THM's dmg is much higher now and CON is fulltime healer. Problem?

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Originally Posted by Speeral

Who knew players have to think now ....

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I know...but in today's world, thinking is a hindrance, apparently.

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Originally Posted by Jin_

let me sum up the community

um "lol @ THM and ARC" "shut up CON lern to cure onry" "quit then, go play wow" "dont let the door hit you" "let the door hit you" "yer wrong im right now cure me and go passive" "servers werk fine"

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Exactly man. To those of you reading that post that kind of stuff, please work towards finding a better perspective.

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Originally Posted by Teknoman

Neptune, if you havent had the chance to attempt a solo battle against a moderate enemy/guildleve since the patch was implemented, i'd give it a shot at least once. It might not be as bad as you think, especially since enemies have been tweaked due to the new system as well.

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I haven't because I can't log in. As soon as I can, I most certainly will. I'm thinking to my last Conjurer solo, a 50sish NM in the Black Shroud. It hit for 500-600 damage, and I had about 1100 HP. The fight took about ten minutes if I remember right, and I was rank 50. Cure 3 is about 600 hp. If nothing else has changed but the MP cost of Cure 3 I would last about 70 seconds on that NM before I got wiped from running out of MP. Meanwhile, classes with better defense can keep on truckin' as their abilities are simply on recast timers.

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Originally Posted by Speeral

Who knew players have to think now ....

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yea too bad you magitek legends people cant seem to do it. If you cant understand how a job that can play a dd, buff, debuff, and main healer will be much favored over a job that can only play dd/debuff then idk how to help you.

It will end up with the group of 2 tank 2 conj 1 thm (started the party) and the rest dd. And a lot of times that thm will be interchangeable. there is no debuff/buff spell other than shadowseer from thm that a conj with proper thm gm abilities cannot use.

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Originally Posted by Dacen

It's appalling to see how many complaints there are flying around since the 1.18 update....which was hours ago.

This is what we call balancing, people. Welcome to challenge.

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I'm not sure if you read my OP but I'm upset because now Conjurer is NO challenge. What is the challenge in casting 4 buffs, then 7 Curaga 2's? Previously I was engaged in difficult solo fights, dots/buffs/enfeebles/curing/nuking/ magic bursting.. and now my class is reduced to.. cure whore. Conjurers will need to save all their MP for healing.. completely negating all of their other abilities.. and for what? Balance? Challenge? I don't think so.. it's so that a dev team lacking solutions can grasp at one, poorly.

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Originally Posted by Dubont

170 int...Harlequin gear, Jade Crook+2 and 170 Lightning Element..Thunder 2, outside of BRs, on big NMs, might do 200 dmg...if you're lucky. Purge 2 + Shock + Thunder II leads to around 300dmg, then about 5 seconds of shock dmg...so you're looking at 400 dmg (maybe) by mixing an ability and 2 spells as well as quite a bit of mp. But none of this matters now because THM's dmg is much higher now and CON is fulltime healer. Problem?

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Now we're speaking the same language!

Yeah seriously my archer can use thm abilities with awesome potency with transcendence, my conjurer with transcendence can use all my THM spells with almost no reduction in potency. Like int matters, or pie at this point till they fix stats lol. They're only really noticeable at higher levels, and really its magic pot and magic acc that people need to stack once they get to the level to feel it anyway. Its all bs and malarky. Can anyone find the stat cap for pie and int anyway, i know vit and mnd are 174, I was assuming they'd be similar.

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Originally Posted by Neptune

Let's get this man a PROMOTION! Hey, let's team up. What kind of strategies can we come up with while we're sitting in passive mode because we cast all of our MP out in cures in 30 seconds?

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Thanks. I am so glad I am not the only one who thinks this non logic is garbage

sitting around watching mp refresh = challenge
casting cure non-stop and never being able to use another spell = challenge

How about some real challenges instead of cheap shots that just make mages suck to play?

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Originally Posted by Dubont

I know...but in today's world, thinking is a hindrance, apparently.

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Yes, I will have lots of time to think while watching my mp refresh. But, you know what, I don't play videogames to stare at a bar slowly refilling - I play them, to you know, play.

Luxlex is also one my new heroes, challenge=/= mp sink, mp management is a challenge, but not an all around mp sink.

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Originally Posted by LuxLex

Yes, I will have lots of time to think while watching my mp refresh. But, you know what, I don't play videogames to stare at a bar slowly refilling - I play them, to you know, play.

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Which is why next month I will be playing 10x more Xenoblade than FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by zaviermhigo

Luxlex is also one my new heroes, challenge=/= mp sink, mp management is a challenge, but not an all around mp sink.

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And Cure 3 / Curaga 2 costing 100+ MP out of 700 or 800 MP isn't MP management.. it's MP rape!

..where's my MP rape-horn?

wtf do u mean 800 MP put some damn points into mind and have 2000+ mp is it that hard think people its not hard.....

yeah, and then have 500 hp and get 1 or 2 shot... and be so weak you can barely lift your wand so the only thing you are good for is being a curebot. Oh that sounds fun.

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Originally Posted by Neptune

Which is why next month I will be playing 10x more Xenoblade than FFXIV.




And Cure 3 / Curaga 2 costing 100+ MP out of 700 or 800 MP isn't MP management.. it's MP rape!

..where's my MP rape-horn?

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Will you quit posting next month too? I sure hope so!

I don't care if it's a fix, a nerf, rebalancing or anything

if it make gameplay less fun then it's a fail

I think that is what is missing from the folks who seem to be delighted that mages will be useless for anything but being their cure slaves.

Games are meant to be fun, not tedious. Making jobs boring doesn't increase the challenge - unless you find waiting for hours to find a healer for your group "challenging" - because, mark my words - within a very short time, we'll be seeing the "I want to party but after waiting 2 hours no healer will join my group" threads.

Why? Cause if playing a mage sucks, a lot of people simply won't do it.

I think it's tons of fun LOL-ing at people. But I was never like a super redmage who can do anything.

Sure they need to fix the seek party system, but no one needed to party and now realized they have to find someone to cover their rears.

best thing to happen to this game in a long time. everything in the op is why this is a good update, not a bad one. i hope that they make partying even more of a viable option than it is now in later updates. keep making solo content, thats great, but the main focus of any mmo should be player interaction.

i havnt read every post, but from the ones i did read theyre saying that they dont like the way that mages are now, well i know that its what ive been waiting for (at least from what ive read, i havnt had much time to actually play). tomorrow ill be playing my conjurer again, and ill be trying to keep everyones hp up ... :) maybe thaumaturge ... :) maybe both ... :)

I may not be that high a conjurer, but I don't mind the difficulty, it'll make me have to use more stratedgy and conservation when casting. Instead of spamming Cure II or Cure III, i'll spam alot of Cure 1s, and use cure III in emergency. It is just like in ffxi where whms before abyssea spammed cure III, and only used cure V in emergencies. I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this because I only read up to page 4 or 5, but what about spiritbind? We all are complaining about mp costs, but doesn't that cut mp costs in half? Like I said my conjurer is not that high, so my suggestions may be off, if so please correct them, thank you o/.

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Originally Posted by Pebe

I may not be that high a conjurer, but I don't mind the difficulty, it'll make me have to use more stratedgy and conservation when casting. Instead of spamming Cure II or Cure III, i'll spam alot of Cure 1s, and use cure III in emergency. It is just like in ffxi where whms before abyssea spammed cure III, and only used cure V in emergencies. I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this because I only read up to page 4 or 5, but what about spiritbind? We all are complaining about mp costs, but doesn't that cut mp costs in half? Like I said my conjurer is not that high, so my suggestions may be off, if so please correct them, thank you o/.

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no spiritbind no longer cuts the cost in half. it cost me 176mp to cast shadowseer without spitirbind......used it with and it dropped me to 127. even using spiritbind on a once every 3 minute ability was still a nice chunk of the mp. quite frankly, if you were only spamming cure as a mage before this patch you should have already given up as being a decent mage because you were horrible at that job.

the ability to fill multiple roles in the party is what people liked about the mage classes. if you needed a debuffer either could do it. if you needed a nuker either could do it. if you needed a buffer healer either could do it. now no matter what role you need filled a con with the thm affinity trait and thm decently leveled is by far the better choice. why? because if you get stuck in the battle and the other mage needs to recover mp they can fall into that role for a short time frame.

I don't see why they implemented the Auto-attack change so soon. It's so unbalanced and buggy right now it makes even curing a pain in the ass. Ooo yes, mp management, that's a great argument fair enough but for me it's not even about mp.

I don't know if it's lag or poor coding but I've been unable to properly attack anything as either a con or a lnc. I'll be standing in front of a mob getting my arse kicked, and no matter how many times I spam enter while targeting it the name won't change from yellow to red, I won't attack it, I'll just end up staring at the wall.
Basic attack damage has been slightly nerfed, fair enough, but there isn't enough room on my bar for both cure sets and attack sets. Nor do I have enough MP to do both as I wish.

As far as I can tell with no balancing, this isn't "Play how you want" it's "Suffer, suffer, and herp derp." I can't understand how my friends as melee really enjoy this change. I didn't like spamming 1 key over and over, but this is...even more ridiculous and difficult to handle. At least with the stamina bar I had a visual telling me what I was doing was right, now I have to just trust the server is processing my input.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

the ability to fill multiple roles in the party is what people liked about the mage classes. if you needed a debuffer either could do it. if you needed a nuker either could do it. if you needed a buffer healer either could do it. now no matter what role you need filled a con with the thm affinity trait and thm decently leveled is by far the better choice. why? because if you get stuck in the battle and the other mage needs to recover mp they can fall into that role for a short time frame.

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Thank you. For all of your posts, really. I've been in full rage mode over these changes. It is insane to see people saying

Con= healer, buffer, nuker
Thm= debuffer (maybe nuker?)

is balanced. Like, on what planet?

You guys have fun praising this patch for making cures cost quadruple the MP and taking up twice as many action points. It adds nothing but more time spent in passive mode and less time playing the game. It's a very, very questionable call and raises serious questions about the battle team leadership. A lot of mages are not going to tolerate this.. and I don't know if I want to play a game that is constantly making me explain my role to other players, and making me defend my choice to not use the most powerful abilities on the class I leveled to cap. Everyone is going to associate Conjurers with Curaga 2 and that's not why I chose to play this game. If I had known that when the game came out I would not have even played. What's the use if it isn't any fun?

It's cool, and it's just the beginning.
If you can't take a few rough edges,
you shouldn't have voted for change.

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Originally Posted by LuxLex

Thank you. For all of your posts, really. I've been in full rage mode over these changes. It is insane to see people saying

Con= healer, buffer, nuker
Thm= debuffer (maybe nuker?)

is balanced. Like, on what planet?

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the bad thing is you can't even say that thm is the nuker since those abilities can be cross classed easily to a con and be just as effective using the thm affinity trait. why would anyone want a thm that is only effective on dot's when a con can do it just as well and still perform other jobs inside of the party if needed.

my job before the update was to debuff and nuke when i did play thm. there were times i would have to step over to heal due to a con dying for any reason. since the thm can no longer be used in that aspect people will replace that thm that was in the party with another con since they can fill that role and take the thm abilities.

@Rinsui: ): Assuming we did vote for them? I personally did not. I was fine with the stamina system pending UI adjustments to fix the lag. Even an auto attack on top of that, to work slightly slower in the background while Stamina was used solely for TP moves, that would have been ideal.

This? An unfinished product that shouldn't have been introduced this early. They should have kept it in the shop until at least 1.19 or 20 when they had enough time to properly work on it and the weapon delays.
To drop this adjustment now ontop of brand-new content to fiddle around with, honestly Toto-rak was a nightmare with this new unfinished auto-attack.

the first MMORPG that didn't separate Healer and Magic Nuker from each other~!

believe me, if they don't do something about this Red Mage issues, more problems are waiting in near future

Funny, I don't remember voting for mages to suck...

Hi guys,

I have a very interesting and quick question.

Aside from the enhanced magic effects ,Are the magic animations (or vissual effex) still the same? or did SE make some changes?

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Originally Posted by Oscillate_Wildly

@Rinsui: ): Assuming we did vote for them? I personally did not. I was fine with the stamina system pending UI adjustments to fix the lag. Even an auto attack on top of that, to work slightly slower in the background while Stamina was used solely for TP moves, that would have been ideal.

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this system is not even as close to a finished product as we had when the game was first released much less the one we had just a few hours ago. replacing broken with utterly shattered is not going to win many people back.

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Originally Posted by Vivoco88

Hi guys,

I have a very interesting and quick question.

Aside from the enhanced magic effects ,Are the magic animations (or vissual effex) still the same? or did SE make some changes?

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it's all same lame

they reduce the AMs cast time but they're still useless

even a normal attack (spirit/phantom dart) got nerfed too

what a joke? 10 seconds cooldown for normal attack, while DoW got Auto-Attack

DoM getting worse everytime they update the game

Darkstar quit being a baby - this is all about adding "challenge"

;)