Tales from the Dawn #4: "A Question of Death" (Jullus)

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Originally Posted by Lauront

I've no idea what you think it is you're "putting to bed" but...

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Blue_Gold#Dialogue

Granted, this particular merchant changes his plans as to where he intends to source it from, but it's evident from the quest dialogue he is not alone in this interest in ceruleum and its applications.

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That quest and others all the way back in ARR also mention that Northern Thanalan is the richest deposit of ceruleum in the entire region and it’s much closer to the Eorzean Alliance (being that it’s in Eorzea) than Garlemald is.

The XIVth legion couldn’t transport ceruleum to Eorzea and had to source it themselves here. All the way back in 1.0, Ul’dah was mining and refining ceruleum there and the Garleans came in to take it, which is why Castrum Meridianum is located where it is.

Ultimately the biggest goal of the Ilsabard Contingent is the demilitarization of the ex-Garlean Empire, not necessarily a source of ceruleum at the northern tip of a completely separate continent half a world away.

So let me reword it with clarity: a right to feel resentful. And the Eorzean Alliance is sitting in Garlemald itself protecting the Garleans, citizens and soldiers alike. Whether we go into any of the other freed provinces to aid any Garleans in there instead of the non-Garleans (which is what parts of Stormblood, Werlyt, and Bozja we’re about - and even in SB we had that side quest where we helped the townsfolk in Ala Ganni irrc protect a Garlean ex-soldier. And in the patches the Doman prisoner exchange was returning Garlean soldiers). Right now we don’t know what the situation is in these other places still covered by map clouds. If we use the former British Empire- well, there’s enough former colonies, some still symbolically tied via the Commonwealth while others decidedly not. And Japan’s history and how it colors diplomatic feelings in Korea, Taiwan, China, and the Philippines is the Real Life example that I have a feeling the writers are more leery of. This is well-tread ground, story-wise, for XIV because of ….well, all of Stormblood and even patch content of ShB. Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. It’d fit the story beat in the 6.0 MSQ and be that cheesy but feel-good breaking the cycle of abuse. The Garlean Empire was the Garleans becoming their oppressors writ large on a global scale. I want a restored stable Republic for them, not wiped out but not a new expansionist colonizer a generation later trying to redo Solus. *shrug*

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Originally Posted by Denishia

Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. *shrug*

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At best we'll get a full expansion about it. At worst nothing is done with it. I'm hoping for the middle ground at the least, where we get a long drawn out story segment about it that is side content. Perhaps an entire series of zone stuff with it written by Matsuno (since seriously, that kind of political conflict is what he LOVES to write about).

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

Wasn't there a massive plot point in the Garlemald section of the MSQ about how literally everyone wanted to just kill the Garleans and the Scions had to convince them not to? And I'm pretty sure that even though the Eorzeans in the contingent there got over that (and even then, not entirely), you still have... *checks notes* literally everyone else still wanting to.

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Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

As for the story itself it was good. I'm more interested in the state and affairs of all the former occupied nations and how they will get on but it is nice to know that the Garleans have some hope.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

So let me reword it with clarity: a right to feel resentful. And the Eorzean Alliance is sitting in Garlemald itself protecting the Garleans, citizens and soldiers alike. Whether we go into any of the other freed provinces to aid any Garleans in there instead of the non-Garleans (which is what parts of Stormblood, Werlyt, and Bozja we’re about - and even in SB we had that side quest where we helped the townsfolk in Ala Ganni irrc protect a Garlean ex-soldier. And in the patches the Doman prisoner exchange was returning Garlean soldiers). Right now we don’t know what the situation is in these other places still covered by map clouds. If we use the former British Empire- well, there’s enough former colonies, some still symbolically tied via the Commonwealth while others decidedly not. And Japan’s history and how it colors diplomatic feelings in Korea, Taiwan, China, and the Philippines is the Real Life example that I have a feeling the writers are more leery of. This is well-tread ground, story-wise, for XIV because of ….well, all of Stormblood and even patch content of ShB. Honestly my biggest question is if when they get to exploring the rest of Ilsabard what new story beats will be explored. Maybe the 6.3 patch content will turn out to be ‘protect the Garleans in Garlemald from an Ilsabardic former colony coming for revenge’. It’d fit the story beat in the 6.0 MSQ and be that cheesy but feel-good breaking the cycle of abuse. The Garlean Empire was the Garleans becoming their oppressors writ large on a global scale. I want a restored stable Republic for them, not wiped out but not a new expansionist colonizer a generation later trying to redo Solus. *shrug*

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The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling. You'll notice (or perhaps you will refuse to) that I mentioned Yotsuyu, who is a textbook example of a woman mistreated by pseudo-Imperialist Japan (Doma). Can't blame Garlemald for that one~

For as bad as Stormblood may have been, nuance in its storytelling was most certainly NOT one of its primary flaws.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

As for the story itself it was good. I'm more interested in the state and affairs of all the former occupied nations and how they will get on but it is nice to know that the Garleans have some hope.

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Nice work being a pretentious one, little Sylph. Your information is still yet inaccurate, however. I do believe it would be in your best interest to go back and watch those cutscenes, since you'd realize that Lyse mentions that the formation of the Ilsabard contingent was initially hamstrung by the necessity of the onerous process of weeding out those who merely wanted to go take bloody revenge on what they saw as their oppressors and those who genuinely wanted to help those who would be ultimately revealed as ailing, freezing, close-to-death victims of Zenos' and Fandaniel's monstrous villainy.

For as bad as Endwalker was with nuance, ironically the criminally short Garlemald segment was one of the few points in the storyline that lacked that absent nuance.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Might wanna read those quest again. I know you have trouble with that and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to read it again. Nobody in game said what you said. They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

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Did we not read the same quest text? Because there were definitely several points where individuals in positions of power indicated a desire to deal rather..... harshly, we'll say, with the Garlean survivors.

I want it, because I want the map filled out, I desperately want to see that homeland of skilled Hellsguard mages, I want to know if the neighbor nations the longest conquered by Garlemald are the ones who thanks to that full generation and a half under Garlean rule are most assimilated and maybe will have an amicable tie to New Garlemald or if they’re especially eager to throw off the colonial rule and assert their independence. It’s been especially relevant in the news with Ukraine and the British Commonwealth/former members like Ireland. But as it is something that has been covered so much in the game already, and with the mixed reception that Bozja had…..I’m curious if my questions will ever be answered. And what they could do to make it feel fresh gameplay-wise.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling. You'll notice (or perhaps you will refuse to) that I mentioned Yotsuyu, who is a textbook example of a woman mistreated by pseudo-Imperialist Japan (Doma). Can't blame Garlemald for that one~

For as bad as Stormblood may have been, nuance in its storytelling was most certainly NOT one of its main flaws.

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Nobody was blaming the Garleans for what happened to her. If you paid any attention to that section that had more to do with doman culture being the issue that created her. That section is a rather scathing critique on a few real world cultures.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

They did say the opposite though, considering the contingent's primary purpose was providing aid to the Garleans.

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Who said that? The scions and their close friends? The people who had to convince literally everyone else in the contingent to not kill the Garleans? Oh wow, I didn't know that, thank you Great Oatmeal. What great information. The people not looking to kill the Garleans and thus went and convinced everyone else to not kill them... weren't the ones trying to kill the Garleans. I was wrong when I read the story that said the Eorzean leaders sent the contingent to Garlemald to help the Garleans but most of the contingent just wanted to kill said Garleans. My apologies, I will be sure to refer to your version of events next time. I gotta say, this is some next level intelligence coming from Oatmeal guys, I think we should try eating some of the oats too, they seem to give lots of intelligence. /s

Gee golly, it's almost like the people IN the contingent didn't share the same opinion as its leaders.

(Might wanna fix the 'Gridinia' spelling. I know you have trouble with spelling it and I see you still haven't managed it but I shall implore you to try it again.)

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Did we not read the same quest text? Because there were definitely several points where individuals in positions of power indicated a desire to deal rather..... harshly, we'll say, with the Garlean survivors.

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Uh, you see, Oatmeal has this special power that when he eats his oats, he can see parts of the story that we mere mortals cannot. His oat vision allows him to see extra lines of dialogue that are beyond our comprehension.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

The devs aren't leery of real-world parallels, they just see things through rather black-and-white lenses lately which is ultimately a detriment to their storytelling.

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Case in point, Venat. Venat is a morally gray character that can be compared to real world figures that commit horrible crimes against humanity for the 'greater good', yet the writers cannot see things past a very black and white perspective. Ignore the screeching of SannaR as they get mad that someone said the V word.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

I want it, because I want the map filled out, I desperately want to see that homeland of skilled Hellsguard mages, I want to know if the neighbor nations the longest conquered by Garlemald are the ones who thanks to that full generation and a half under Garlean rule are most assimilated and maybe will have an amicable tie to New Garlemald or if they’re especially eager to throw off the colonial rule and assert their independence. It’s been especially relevant in the news with Ukraine and the British Commonwealth/former members like Ireland. But as it is something that has been covered so much in the game already, and with the mixed reception that Bozja had…..I’m curious if my questions will ever be answered. And what they could do to make it feel fresh gameplay-wise.

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Knew this one would come up sooner or later. What an utter bore.

You DO realize that a writer is not obligated to fetishize and glorify tyrannical regimes to reveal that the people native to that regime's locale are also suffering, right? The two are as far from mutually exclusive as the core of the Earth and the planet Pluto.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Nobody was blaming the Garleans for what happened to her. If you paid any attention to that section that had more to do with doman culture being the issue that created her. That section is a rather scathing critique on a few real world cultures.

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Missing the point, my dude.

I just want an interesting game world that isn't afraid to have a balanced approach to world building, grit and consequences. I don't want the game's storytelling to be at the mercy of real world events since there's always something dodgy or bleak going on somewhere on any given day.

I don't think the game has really even begun to scratch the surface of what could be done in regards to political intrigue and the lack of any major looming threats/rivals in the background combined with the player character being able to teleport to the edge of the universe at will has served to make the game world feel quite irrelevant and one note on many fronts.

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Did we not read the same quest text? Because there were definitely several points where individuals in positions of power indicated a desire to deal rather..... harshly, we'll say, with the Garlean survivors.

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There is one quest where a forced worker was rather shocked when we told him that we weren't here to kill all the Garleans. Seems you just didn't read the text at all. You might wanna go read it again.

If we go for headcanons and wild predictions with no lore backing: a place/political situation that they haven’t written or shown yet is a former Garlean colony that wants to fully embrace the Garlean culture instead of what was before. Not just Bozja reforming their government with inspiration from the Garleans. Have a place full of provincials that are more ‘True Garlean’ than the Garleans themselves, an idealized mini-Garlemald city. And that the inhabitants do this as to distinguish themselves from their neighbor-nation that chooses the opposite route. If anything, it’d be a former colony completely distinct than all the other locations we have visited. And while not the real Garlemald, it would be a way for people to RP and gpose in a pre-destroyed Garlemald without using time travel.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

If we go for headcanons and wild predictions with no lore backing: a place/political situation that they haven’t written or shown yet is a former Garlean colony that wants to fully embrace the Garlean culture instead of what was before. Not just Bozja reforming their government with inspiration from the Garleans. Have a place full of provincials that are more ‘True Garlean’ than the Garleans themselves, an idealized mini-Garlemald city. And that the inhabitants do this as to distinguish themselves from their neighbor-nation that chooses the opposite route. If anything, it’d be a former colony completely distinct than all the other locations we have visited. And while not the real Garlemald, it would be a way for people to RP and gpose in a pre-destroyed Garlemald without using time travel.

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I wouldn't call Bozja taking Garlean ideals. Those are Gabranth's ideal, who revolted against the Garleans and him and his father were most likely planning that from the beginning.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

That quest and others all the way back in ARR also mention that Northern Thanalan is the richest deposit of ceruleum in the entire region and it’s much closer to the Eorzean Alliance (being that it’s in Eorzea) than Garlemald is.

The XIVth legion couldn’t transport ceruleum to Eorzea and had to source it themselves here. All the way back in 1.0, Ul’dah was mining and refining ceruleum there and the Garleans came in to take it, which is why Castrum Meridianum is located where it is.

Ultimately the biggest goal of the Ilsabard Contingent is the demilitarization of the ex-Garlean Empire, not necessarily a source of ceruleum at the northern tip of a completely separate continent half a world away.

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Let's review the comment I was responding to:

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Nobody but the Garlean's care about ceruleum

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Then let's review the quest text:

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Surely you have seen the power the Garleans wield. Their technology continues to advance, while we Eorzeans cling to our ancient ways. For now, we are able to keep the Empire at bay, but for how much longer?

I am not the only one who feels this way. There are those who seek to develop airships and engines of war to combat the imperial threat. It will not be long before the Grand Companies deploy magitek units of their own on the front lines.

Even so, the most advanced weaponry will be worth little more than scrap metal without a steady supply of ceruleum. As we speak, the Garleans and the Immortal Flames are fighting to claim the supply in northern Thanalan.

What I am trying to tell you is that people like Martyn waste their time on worthless relics of the past and fail to see the bigger picture. The future lies in ceruleum. If you ever decide you want to make a real difference in this world, I could use someone like you.

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The quest is dealing with someone already involved with Amajina & Sons. Notably:

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Don't let the magitek fool you─I've no connection to the Empire. Well, not a direct one, at least. My company carries out work at a ceruleum processing plant run by Amajina & Sons Mineral Concern. Perhaps some of it ends up in imperial hands, perhaps not.

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Even so, he plans to tap into further ventures, as below, no less on an entirely separate continent:

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Whastrach
Ha! I tricked you for a moment there, didn't I? I must admit, I had grown rather accustomed to playing the villain, but enough is enough.
The fact is, I lost our wager, so it's time I put an end to my plans for Lapis Canyon. I'm a businessman, not a monster, and I have you, Ceadda, and Martyn to thank for reminding me of that.

The New World is a vast, untamed land, and there are bound to be ways to acquire ceruleum without mining on sacred ground. Royse has even agreed to fund my next expedition.

I will be leaving by ship within the next few days. Ceadda, would you care to join me? With you as my guide, perhaps I can avoid repeating the mistakes I made with the Whalaqee.

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Whatever the Ilsabard Contingent's plans are, two things are clear: 1) there is an appetite for ceruleum outside of Garlemald, which will only grow as knowledge of its uses expands, thus fuelling demand over and above existing, readily available reserves and 2) not everyone belongs to it or will be bound by its commitments. It really doesn't take much imagination to think of a scenario where a former hostile neighbour of it tries to seize a weakened Garlemald for its ceruleum reserves, to marshal the sort of military force it had (to say nothing of potential non-military applications), even if none of the nations participating in the Ilsabard Contingent would - at present. And that's the sole point being made.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Let's review the comment I was responding to:



Then let's review the quest text:



The quest is dealing with someone already involved with Amajina & Sons. Notably:



Even so, he plans to tap into further ventures, as below, no less on an entirely separate continent:



Whatever the Ilsabard Contingent's plans are, two things are clear: 1) there is an appetite for ceruleum outside of Garlemald, which will only grow as knowledge of its uses expands and 2) not everyone belongs to it or will be bound by its commitments.

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Pretty sure he's talking about reserve in the New World. Why would this guy worry about reserves an continent away with an ocean between them. Getting way ahead of yourself and reaching really hard.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Pretty sure he's talking about reserve in the New World. Why would this guy worry about reserves an continent away with an ocean between them. Getting way ahead of yourself and reaching really hard.

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Of course he's talking about the New World. The point is he is flatly contradicting your comment that I quoted, i.e. that none but the Garleans have an interest in ceruleum. If anyone is reaching here, it is none other than you.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Of course he's talking about the New World. The point is he is flatly contradicting your comment that I quoted. If anyone is reaching here, it is none other than you.

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Considering we were talking about the Garlean stores of the resource I'd thought it plain the context. I had forgotten how literal you try to be when you make massive leaps to argue. So I will specify. Nobody cares about taking the Garlean stores. How do we know this. 800 years of them being there and nobody being interested in it. With the advent of magitek? Still no interest to go invading to take it. Magitek is the Garlean answer to magic.

You're libel to pull something at this rate.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Considering we were talking about the Garlean stores of the resource I'd thought it plain the context. I had forgotten how literal you try to be when you make massive leaps to argue. So I will specify. Nobody cares about taking the Garlean stores. How do we know this. 800 years of them being there and nobody being interested in it. With the advent of magitek? Still no interest to go invading to take it. Magitek is the Garlean answer to magic.

You're libel to pull something at this rate.

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... you do realise that all that changed with the advent of magitek, right? Try reading the text I quoted. Feel free to die on the hill you're already languishing upon. I've little interested in expending further posts on correcting your persistent misapprehensions.

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Originally Posted by Denishia

The Garleans trying to rebuild at Broken Glass have the cerulean to rebuild -and worry about the profits going to them and not Ul’dah. Which is the same issues brought up in the Stormblood patches when Nanamo conferred with Lolorito and Godbert, only swapping out Ala Mhigo and salt.

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In case it's not clear what the context is for all this:

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Originally Posted by KariTheFox

I feel like in order to be appealing targets for invasion, the Garleans need to not only be weak, but also have a resource that is worth going to war for.

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Which was followed up by:

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Ceruleum is currently employed by all major nations for everything from lighting to cooking, and the gradual adoption of magitek as a whole is very likely to expand that demand even further. Heck, Ishgard is about to start rocking magitek heaters. Cid's been working in Eorzea for a while, and now the Garleans themselves are pretty likely to share technology as a means of remaining useful.

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To which mal responded with the quote I included in my post.

The point is Garlemald has a resource that could theoretically make it a target for future hostiles, thus meeting the criterion laid out in Kari's post.

But yes, what you mention could plausibly be taken as a concern for the Garleans too.

The Garleans trying to rebuild at Broken Glass have the cerulean to rebuild -and worry about the profits going to them and not Ul’dah. Which is the same issues brought up in the Stormblood patches when Nanamo conferred with Lolorito and Godbert, only swapping out Ala Mhigo and salt.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

... you do realise that all that changed with the advent of magitek, right? Try reading the text I quoted. Feel free to die on the hill you're already languishing upon. I've little interested in expending further posts on correcting your persistent misapprehensions.

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The hill he's on is where his oat stash is buried. Of course he's gonna die on it.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

... you do realise that all that changed with the advent of magitek, right? Try reading the text I quoted. Feel free to die on the hill you're already languishing upon. I've little interested in expending further posts on correcting your persistent misapprehensions.

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The Garleans changed their use of it and through Cid and the ironworks other people have used a bit of it but there is no indication that anybody is making drastic changes.
Maybe just stop trying to reach so hard. You do it with nearly every topic and its getting rather tiring. Please come up with something new.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

The Garleans changed their use of it and through Cid and the ironworks other people have used a bit of it but there is no indication that anybody is making drastic changes.
Maybe just stop trying to reach so hard. You do it with nearly every topic and its getting rather tiring. Please come up with something new.

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He's one of the posters who actually compiles and posts sources - so no, he isn't 'reaching'. He's offering clarification and outlining what is actually the case as per the game's established narrative.

Though this is little more than the usual thing that certain posters like to do in regards to making a claim that is then countered by actual sources and then rather than admit to being mistaken the poster(s) providing the clarification are then attacked and insulted in an effort to deflect.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

He's one of the posters who actually compiles and posts sources - so no, he isn't 'reaching'. He's offering clarification and outlining what is actually the case as per the game's established narrative.

Though this is little more than the usual thing that certain posters like to do in regards to making a claim that is then countered by actual sources and then rather than admit to being mistaken the poster(s) providing the clarification are then attacked and insulted in an effort to deflect.

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Usually from the french translation for some reason. Given the link he did post, he is reaching, quite a bit based on the narrative being told. One guy from a across the sea liking the the potential of the resource, does not imply a willingness to take said resource from other people when said resource is readily available in his homeland and from his current employer.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Usually from the french translation for some reason. Given the link he did post, he is reaching, quite a bit based on the narrative being told. One guy from a across the sea liking the the potential of the resource, does not imply a willingness to take said resource from other people when said resource is readily available in his homeland and from his current employer.

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Many of us posting here are European and are multilingual. We either play the game in French, English or both. Plus we talk about the game's story with players who play the game in French, English or both.

I don't recall seeing you or anyone else criticise or question the likes of the Anonymoose whenever he took the time to share translations from other language versions of the game as part of a discussion or debate.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Many of us posting here are European and are multilingual. We either play the game in French, English or both. Plus we talk about the game's story with players who play the game in French, English or both.

I don't recall seeing you or anyone else criticise or question the likes of the Anonymoose whenever he took the time to share translations from other language versions of the game as part of a discussion or debate.

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I never said looking at the other translations was a bad thing. It's when you use one translation to make a pretty big reach about something that the other translation, including the original Japanese don't even hint at. That's the core of the issue.

Back to the topic at hand. His current example is reaching. He used the English version of the game for this particular reach. Either find something else, something that doesn't require you to take creative leaps to try and make the point.

That being said:

https://mirkemenagerie.tumblr.com/po...nagerie-update

I highly recommend you reading the Garlean section

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

I never said looking at the other translations was a bad thing. It's when you use one translation to make a pretty big reach about something that the other translation, including the original Japanese don't even hint at. That's the core of the issue.

Back to the topic at hand. His current example is reaching. He used the English version of the game for this particular reach. Either find something else, something that doesn't require you to take creative leaps to try and make the point.

That being said:

https://mirkemenagerie.tumblr.com/po...nagerie-update

I highly recommend you reading the Garlean section

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Did you just accuse someone else of reaching, then link them a Tumblr post?

Did you click on the post before leaving a snide remark?

You probably didn't. You should. Please refrain from replying to this until you do so.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Did you click on the post before leaving a snide remark?

You probably didn't. You should. Please refrain from replying to this until you do so.

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I've clicked on the post. It's a Tumblr post. Senti's reply is accurate.

Did you think about what you were going to say before saying it?

You probably didn't. You should. Please refrain from replying to anyone here until you do so.

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

I've clicked on the post. It's a Tumblr post. Senti's reply is accurate.

Did you think about what you were going to say before saying it?

You probably didn't. You should. Please refrain from replying to anyone here until you do so.

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Ah, my mistake. I must be very specific with you folk, you lot have a hard time following. Read it.

Do not reply until you've read the tumblr post. Also what is wrong with a tumblr link? I'm sure you have your little baseless assumption. Which would be quell if you read my comment to your other buddy about reading it. Do that before replying.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Did you click on the post before leaving a snide remark?

You probably didn't. You should. Please refrain from replying to this until you do so.

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Bruh. Bruh.

It's TUMBLR.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Ah, my mistake. I must be very specific with you folk, you lot have a hard time following. Read it.

Do not reply until you've read the tumblr post. Also what is wrong with a tumblr link? I'm sure you have your little baseless assumption. Which would be quell if you read my comment to your other buddy about reading it. Do that before replying.

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O.
M.
G.
s

This is about as helpful as linking a post from an alt-right white supremacist subReddit, then insisting that you MUST read it before responding once more. Surely, surely that totally non-bigoted post will improve your life by drastic leaps and bounds, you will experience profound wisdom unlike you've ever heard before and ascend to a heightened state of humanity upon your return from Enlightened Sage-land.

You can say anything on Tumblr, and proselytize without fear of being countermanded. It's as liable to be helpful and accurate as bloody Wikipedia. So no, I won't click that link because I have evidence and experience that doing so would prove to offer nothing but massive and numerous detriments.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Also what is wrong with a tumblr link?

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The fact that it's from tumblr. TUMBLR. Do you honestly expect anyone to take anything seriously when it's on tumblr? Do you have a MySpace edition too?

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

Bruh. Bruh.

It's TUMBLR.

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https://c.tenor.com/GRgN0EK59FsAAAAC...anner-bruh.gif

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

The fact that it's from tumblr. TUMBLR. Do you honestly expect anyone to take anything seriously when it's on tumblr? Do you have a MySpace edition too?



https://c.tenor.com/GRgN0EK59FsAAAAC...anner-bruh.gif

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Neat, neither of you did what I asked.

Do what I asked you please. You'll find it full of game lore. Mainly just quotes from the game about. Read it. Don't reply until you do. Third time is the charm.

Ok I'll bite. The site is an entire repository of source materials. What specifically are you asking us to look at, and why? Copy and paste it here.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

That's still a lot of "what if?" and conjecture. To my knowledge, no one in-game from Eorzea has made mention of plundering Garlemald's ceruleum and piping it to Eorzea.

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But we're not just talking about Eorzea. And yes, of course it's conjecture - it's pertaining to hypothetical events in the future, extrapolating on what could happen to a nation in its weakened state. But the premise I am correcting relates to a point that is not hypothetical.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Whatever the Ilsabard Contingent's plans are, two things are clear: 1) there is an appetite for ceruleum outside of Garlemald, which will only grow as knowledge of its uses expands, thus fuelling demand over and above existing, readily available reserves and 2) not everyone belongs to it or will be bound by its commitments. It really doesn't take much imagination to think of a scenario where a former hostile neighbour of it tries to seize a weakened Garlemald for its ceruleum reserves, to marshal the sort of military force it had (to say nothing of potential non-military applications), even if none of the nations participating in the Ilsabard Contingent would - at present. And that's the sole point being made.

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That's still a lot of "what if?" and conjecture. To my knowledge, no one in-game from Eorzea has made mention of plundering Garlemald's ceruleum and piping it to Eorzea.

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

The fact that it's from tumblr. TUMBLR. Do you honestly expect anyone to take anything seriously when it's on tumblr? Do you have a MySpace edition too?

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Tumblr is still Tumblr, but Mirke's Menagerie is the greatest single source of properly compiled and sorted FFXIV lore I've seen on the internet and Sounsyy has done a really good job of putting it together. It's easier to flip through the topics to find bits of lore than opening up the encyclopedias, or searching through dialogue on other sites. Discounting it just because of the website it's on, not even clicking it, and posting an MCU reaction gif is what I'd expect a stereotypical Tumblr user to do so I guess you're already halfway there.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Neat, neither of you did what I asked.

Do what I asked you please. You'll find it full of game lore. Mainly just quotes from the game about. Read it. Don't reply until you do. Third time is the charm.

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What are they meant to even be looking up there, you just seem to be pointing at a load of plagiarised lore without and reason and saying if they don't do was you demand they can't post

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

That's still a lot of "what if?" and conjecture. To my knowledge, no one in-game from Eorzea has made mention of plundering Garlemald's ceruleum and piping it to Eorzea.




Tumblr is still Tumblr, but Mirke's Menagerie is the greatest single source of properly compiled and sorted FFXIV lore I've seen on the internet and Sounsyy has done a really good job of putting it together. It's easier to flip through the topics to find bits of lore than opening up the encyclopedias, or searching through dialogue on other sites. Discounting it just because of the website it's on, not even clicking it, and posting an MCU reaction gif is what I'd expect a stereotypical Tumblr user to do so I guess you're already halfway there.

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Perhaps, but the author possesses a known bias. The Encylopaedia Eorzea lacks such things. Almanacs are expected to remain impartial, when they do not they lose the respect and trust they require to survive. It's indicative of the perils of the modern internet, that such repositories tend to be less reliable than that which is hand-written due to the considerable vetting and fact-checking processes that such knowledge gets put through before publishing. Tumblr lacks these rigorous safeguards, hence my comparison to Reddit and Wikipedia. Any such information found firmly on the internet and the internet alone is subject to butchering based upon bias rather than the factual and the court of public opinion can influence what is thus written.

In shorthand, I suppose then: Despite it's disjointed nature, I personally would yet sooner pick up a copy of one of the Encylopaedia Eorzeas' Volumes than trust what is written on an unverified, unvetted public domain blog. I cannot trust such a compromised source.

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

What are they meant to even be looking up there, you just seem to be pointing at a load of plagiarised lore without and reason and saying if they don't do was you demand they can't post

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I had asked the person I was originally talking to to read the section on the Empire, since there have been quite a few leaps about how other people view the Garleans in the setting and what we went up there to do.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

Perhaps, but the author possesses a known bias. The Encylopaedia Eorzea lacks such things. Almanacs are expected to remain impartial, when they do not they lose the respect and trust they require to survive.

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It's been around for years so if they have a bias it hasn't affected their longevity and they're still posting and updating.

They mostly just compile a bunch of dialogue and passages from the encyclopedias and in-game items into something easily parseable so I'm not sure how a bias, if it exists, would matter.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

It's indicative of the perils of the modern internet, that such repositories tend to be less reliable than that which is hand-written due to the considerable vetting and fact-checking processes that such knowledge gets put through before publishing. Tumblr lacks these rigorous safeguards, hence my comparison to Reddit and Wikipedia. Any such information found firmly on the internet and the internet alone is subject to butchering based upon bias rather than the factual and the court of public opinion can influence what is thus written.

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People here link gamer escape all the time, is that any different? If you see something you don't agree with or don't think is true, you can always fire up the game and compare the text there to the text in the game. They're not free-handing whole passages of lore, they're copy-pasting it from the source. Jeez.

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Originally Posted by SentioftheHoukai

Perhaps, but the author possesses a known bias. The Encylopaedia Eorzea lacks such things. Almanacs are expected to remain impartial, when they do not they lose the respect and trust they require to survive. It's indicative of the perils of the modern internet, that such repositories tend to be less reliable than that which is hand-written due to the considerable vetting and fact-checking processes that such knowledge gets put through before publishing. Tumblr lacks these rigorous safeguards, hence my comparison to Reddit and Wikipedia. Any such information found firmly on the internet and the internet alone is subject to butchering based upon bias rather than the factual and the court of public opinion can influence what is thus written.

In shorthand, I suppose then: Despite it's disjointed nature, I personally would yet sooner pick up a copy of the Encylopaedia Eorzeas than trust what is written on an unverified, unvetted public domain blog. I cannot trust such a compromised source.

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How would you know it has a bias, you refused to click on it.