Pretty sure he called you ableist for equating disability with poor play, and in my opinion it is kind of weird to single it out as a valid excuse. I remember my first run through the Great Gubal Library, the first boss made my computer lag, I got stressed, almost had an autistic meltdown, and eventually did have a minor seizure. The second time I fought the boss, I zoomed the camera in so that I wouldn't have any of those problems and did just fine. I was dead weight because I was new, not because of my disabilities; they just mean I have to learn how to combat whatever triggers might show up. Refusing to learn how to handle your disability isn't any more valid an excuse than any other excuse that's been mentioned imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adire
What is it with some tanks, healers, and dps?
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03-20-2017, 03:50 PMTitaniumVulpes
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03-20-2017, 04:01 PMAnaviAnael
OP, welcome to post-POTD FFXIV. I'd recommend doing what I do and stick with premades. Playing is a lot more fun now.
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03-20-2017, 04:05 PMseekified
The game doesn't teach people how to play their jobs properly, and offering advice as a stranger is more often than not met with hostility. You'd think people would be able to read their skill tooltips and do basic maths to figure out that AoE skills, "increases enmity" and shields/HoTs are all good ideas, but apparently not.
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03-20-2017, 04:15 PMVoltyblast
Well the question is easy to answer: the game doesn't really give any hints of how to play, since POTD isn't a good place to learn rotations and FATE grinding isn't helpful either. Dungeons are usually an okay way to learn rotations, since you slowly get introduced to new skills but if you're a dps you're gonna have to suffer half an hour of queuing (While tanks or healers might be stuck with dozens of MSQ to catch on). Only other measure for learning stuff is from outside sources (aka sites) but it should be used for basic learning!
Topping all off with no possible way to see the feedback of any kind such as a damage meter and you get a recipe for disaster. -
03-20-2017, 04:15 PMAma_HamadaShort answer, most people are bad in DF, just takes a bit of effort to notice how much so.Quote:
Originally Posted by AmalonStar
Squishy tank + bad aoe dps = most likey the healer not dpsing at all or people dying because the healer is not used to the tank , taking that much damage.
I had a co heal in dun who refused or did not know how, help raise people, so I had to do it all, who had 270 gear and 275 relic with spell speed and piety as a WHM. This person would sit on 8000+ mp constantly from not knowing how to raise and heal people.
People get carried, and when you try to help them you are flamed, this person called me rude for asking for help to raise and heal because I was explaining I was using all my CDs to help keep mp up while they sat on 8000+ not doing anything. I had to use dissipation and my stacks for drains and healing constantly, trying to save mp for raises. At the end I said I know it is not completely your fault from people standing in bad, but you need improvements. I was called bossy and unkind because of this. if I was unkind I would just slacked off like the rest and let them vote abandon. I do not carry runs to be insulted like that.
There is something wrong with the game if people can be that far ahead gear wise and not know what to do or how to play. -
03-20-2017, 04:25 PMStarkbeaumont
the game just repeats itself. if you are new and did the hall of the novice for your class, you know the basics you need, everything else is just understanding your tooltips and learning on the job. Doesn't matter how fast you level or if you reach lv60 by dungeon, fates, potd or grinding mobs in the field.
that's enough to perform acceptable in the daily content.
those that can't even do that simply don't care. -
03-20-2017, 04:30 PMYeol
Players skill is not determineded by the amount of time they spent playing, but the time they spent learning.
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03-20-2017, 05:05 PMAdireI doubt it. I wasn't even saying everyone who is disabled plays poorly. I myself have severe social anxiety, yet I push myself to excel. Disabilities are oftentimes uncontrollable. If they have a permanent effect on your play, there's nothing you can do. In his little list however, all of those things can be easily avoided if people are simply considerate of their groups.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitaniumVulpes
Unfortunately, it seems some will argue day and night that we should accept that some players won't put in effort. If everyone stopped carrying said players through content, it would be interesting to see the results. -
03-20-2017, 05:35 PMBigRed5392welcome to what I was dealing with. I used my g/f experiences to point out how their behavior/ behavior of others is causing stress and negativity to others, and that people are lashing out with the assumption that everyone is a toxic player. They just gonna talk circles dude. :) I feel ya most of those happen to my g.f and myself one time or another.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doozer
to everyone else, take a step back and look how rude you're being, if not a bit selfish.
No excuse how most of you are replying.... -
03-20-2017, 05:38 PMMejingjard
From what I've seen most of the time in many content, either 24 man raids or dungeons, Often you happen to fall in an underperforming group, that do not do any mechanics, dying to almost everything, and unable to kill anythings, and suddently a wipe occurs, and... how strange, next attempt, no one die, no one loose barely any HP, and bosses goes down in a blink.
In my opinion there is not that much real "bad" players, but, damn, how much lazy one there is.
Worst of it all, is the game catering to those players instead of considering the ones that actually have to carry them.
If you tag in to duties and expect doing nothing, you should not earn anything.
It is unfair to those who have sometimes to be focused twice as normal to carry others, yet seeing these ones going away with loots and succes.
Worst case I saw : one of the healers in Dun Scaith was in /follow the WHOLE raid, we tried to kicked him several times but it was rejected everytime. The other healer struggled to keep us alive the best he could as he was short on gear.
He got nothing at the end of the dungeon while the /follow one got a Healer loot, and the minion at the end. Do you find that kind of situation normal ? That kind of player should not even had the right to roll on anything. That kind of player should not be able to complete a duty where other players had to play better only to compensate a lazy one.
Yoshida is so eager to have everyone succeeding on everything in the game that it allows players being lazy like this. Is this really what we wants here ?
Efforts being almost less awarded than not playing the game ? -
03-20-2017, 05:42 PMBigRed5392Or maybe you should look in a mirror to how you come off?Quote:
Originally Posted by Adire
It is kinda rude, The things he listed can happen at any moment with no control, telling people to leave like you are is pretty rude. And you really have no reason or excuse to be rude.
No one is carrying anybody. Stop using it as a scapegoat, to be rude to someone on the forums.
why do people like the buzzword "carry"? kinda sound immature imo. -
03-20-2017, 06:00 PMStarkbeaumontwhat could the devs do about it though? if the group failed to kick an obvious leecher, that person was probably in there with friends.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mejingjard
and regarding the loot. well what could be done about it. implement a dps check or a heal check, so you have to qualify yourself for the loot each fight? what about tanks? how much did they mitigate? and the OT? -
03-20-2017, 06:14 PMBigRed5392Quote:
Originally Posted by Starkbeaumont
if you take a cold hard look at what is really going on, you will take notice that most people replying are rude/selfish people who make up excuses to be rude/selfish. They don't want to actually help people, but be helped by people, aka "i want my duty done, and people are stopping me from getting it done" refusing to accept they are equally the problem with having a bad attitude.
If you didn't notice most of the replies are very negative to other people, if not picking a fight when called out. Such as the person who said everyone should leave because of random moments.
If you couldn't tell, people overly use the word carried.
fun fact, I never saw a lazy player. Not one so I wonder about who was lazy in their groups, they seem to be the only constant.
They don't/have yet to realize the reason for hostility from other is partly their fault. As in when they offer help and get snapped at. They never consider the person maybe was harassed previously when asking for tips. Or was given bad advice that got them kicked.
People on the NA datacenters like to assume the worst of people, as well as make bad assumptions on how the JP community works.
they don't like dead weight, but they do help each other. they typically have a 3 wipe and abandon rule for content. They see group issues as a group issue with no pointing of fingers.
while the NA side likes to point fingers and vote kick.
Ever consider that the "leecher" may not have been leeching, and you're not paying attention? Have you ever considered that you was the problem not others? -
03-20-2017, 06:38 PMMejingjardWell I was the MT, so if i was slacking of, it would have been seen quickly :DQuote:
Originally Posted by BigRed5392
And yes, when i see a player moving exactly where another one move, and not casting any single heal or dps skill, while the other one has almost no dead time, i dont think I am part of the problem, when I do my best to have the least time without a cd to help that poor healer that had to do everything, when i do my best to sustain my own HP with some of my skills to help again the only healer that was trying to compensate the other one, I dont think i am the problem. When one healer is full MP and the other one is flirting with 0 mana, there is something wrong, and it is not the fault of another player.
Otherwise, I know there is not much to be done for preventing players to go afk in a middle of a fight, except maybe more mechanics like those on Ozma, were someone not paying attention can cause a wipe.
I don't understand how we can defend wanting to get through content without having to play with a minimal lvl of attention :/ -
03-20-2017, 06:39 PMAdireIf calling out people for being lazy and forcing groups to cope with their unnecessary shortcomings is rude, then I'm proud to be rude. You have every right to get high and join a dungeon and be useless, or spend the entire dungeon autoattacking because you want to play with your cat, or whatever, just be ready to deal with the consequences. Part of being an adult is dealing with consequences and not contributing to your group's success may very well have them.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed5392
Really wish self discipline and self improvement were common values in society. It's pretty sad that people find apathy and laziness acceptable behavior in teamwork endeavors. -
03-20-2017, 06:49 PMZhamkyong
Palace of the dead is one side of the problem.
While it's fun and I enjoy it plenty it gives the wrong sensation on how a class is designed and the difficulty you will encounter outside. It also generates a huge problem: instead of spending time leveling with dungeons as we did they level up too fast, gearing themselves too fast to jump into "end game" way faster than any of us did when 2.0 came to live. Everything it's so easy at that point they just take what they've learned inside the Potd as the way the game is to be played.
Try it, send a new player in there, tell him he will be able to level faster with the class he wants and then throw him in a serious dungeon or raid for the first time.
I don't want to generalize, I know everyone it's not like that, I have found players I could talk with, guide them as I could within my knowledge while some learn by themselves looking for information.
But... It's how it has get, by my opinion at least. -
03-20-2017, 06:54 PMRosaLunaCelestia
Sometime Tank can lose aggro because of many reasons :x ilv diffirences with dps, over heal of healer by exemple. But there bad tanks and good tanks. We do all our best ! But i know some people are just lazy to do fully their role.
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03-20-2017, 07:26 PMAntonio_XulOne thing is not every had done the Hall of Novice, because it didn't exist back then and had to figure things out on their own. Another could be someone coming back from a long break and trying to remember how things go. Also, it could be someone just hit 60 and now is learning the rotation with all skills unlocked.Quote:
Originally Posted by AmalonStar
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03-20-2017, 07:30 PMSerilda
I can't blame POTD for this. Or FATEs, or Leves, or anything else. I have a friend who exclusively levels through dungeons, usually getting low ones where most of his skills are locked in the roulette, and every time he gets a job to 60 I have to beg and coax him to understand basic gameplay mechanics. He's been playing for years and considers me a god of healing just because I don't macro my heals (he still does) and can heal way faster than he can even though it's his main. I die avoidably every time I play with him. We're working on it, but some people don't learn no matter how 'correctly' they get from 1-60. Nothing's stopping people doing POTD or FATEs from reading their abilities properly or trying to figure out new ways to use them together. The Netflix show they're watching on the other monitor is stopping that, but people can (and do) successfully run dungeons with exactly the same lack of care.
The game's content is simply very easy, and the actual challenges are in situations where other players can cover for you (full party+ content). Even if you're trying, there's too much going on to figure out optimisations on the go. I'm hyper aware of how I learn since I struggle with things like spatial awareness in games - not to the point of having a recognised handicap so much as a personal weakness - and prefer to be very comfortable with my job to do harder content without burdening anyone. What would help me a lot would be undersizing (not unsyncing) current content so I can go into new fights and learn the arena and phase one mechanics all on my own before dragging a learning party in to study later parts of the fight; the fact that I'm not allowed to perform this very simple self-improvement exercise annoys me.
I think the story fights should always be accessible, but sign me up for actual difficult lowman content (savage dungeons when) to push people to their limits a bit more often, please. A lot of mediocre players aren't interested in raiding in a big group, but they'll hit a wall and learn they need to improve much faster if challenging content is made available to them without needing to find a full party. -
03-20-2017, 09:16 PMVanitasWELCOME TO FINAL FANTASY XIV: MR. BONE'S WILD RIDEQuote:
Originally Posted by AmalonStar
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03-20-2017, 09:31 PMMaero
As a blm main myself i know all to well about your first point, even with Quelling and at times waiting said amount to attack a target.
Actually reading your other points i have come across all 3. From time to time i do offer advice but also feel as though some may get offended so i hesitate also.
Palace is not to blame for bad players, the lack of wanting to be the best at your job and reading the skills is the reason for bad.
Bad players have existed before Palace ...
If we go that route then we could also say Fates are to blame for bad players, hunts are also to blame, etc.. -
03-20-2017, 09:44 PMAnaviAnaelCarry is used often because it's applicable. The other day I did a Sohm Al hard where the AST used protect, we started the pull and they went AFK without a word. We wiped. They offered no explanations and it became pretty obvious they were only half paying attention during the entire run. Our PLD had to keep himself alive with Clemency. On the final boss, the AST didn't even bother with mechanics and dropped puddles right next to the boss. Our monk then couldn't hit his positionals.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed5392
A better example would be 24 man content. You and I are both on Aether, so I know you understand what I'm talking about. How often do tanks NOT grab adds, or not grab the boss if the MT dies? How often do DPS go on auto attack and miss stacking mechanics or meteors on Ozma?
I don't enter content so others can watch Netflix or YouTube. If a person wants to mess around on Facebook, they can do it after. When people say "carry" more often than not they're referring to the people like this who want their rewards while putting in no effort. How is that not carrying? -
03-20-2017, 09:50 PMAltena
I think the issue is not with the design of PotD itself, but how squishy, weak and insignificant the levelling floors are.
I am a huge advocate of someone learning how to play their job at level 60, with their entire skillset.
I mean you can grind from 1-30ish on LNC by spamming only a few skills - and be as optimal as the class allows you to be, just as an example.
This to me teaches the player very little, if anything at all. Some roles may benefit from this method - such as a brand new Tank, who has never tanked before, however at least in terms of DPS - EXP lvl 1-50 for the most part is a waste of time.
Give someone the full list of lv 60 skills and they can actually figure out wtf they are meant to do at end game.
The issue with PotD is you just don't need your end game rotations.. The mobs melt before you can even blink. Mobs die almost as fast as you can put your DoTs up as BRD or SMN... You're practically never going to be maintaining Blood on DRG.. You are rarely going to utilize enochain on BLM properly.. You get where I am going with this.. All of this stuff is what makes it near impossible to actually learn how to play at end game in a sufficient manner.
So the issue in my opinion is purely based on how much of a joke the "exp" floors are on PotD, not the PotD system itself.
I would definitely be in agreeance that there seems to be an increased number of players who are clueless as to how to play their jobs at end game. Does this have to do with PotD? Sure, more than likely... However I don't believe the "so many skills thrown at you at once" is the reason. I think the reason is that stuff dies too quick to actually figure out what you're supposed to do when you face content that lasts beyond 4-5 skills / spells.
Even in levelling dungeons, stuff generally stays alive long enough for you to get a rotation off.. Whether that be large pulls, or single packs. You face bosses more frequently, and you generally have to utilize your skills more efficiently in general. Personally I doze off in the lower PotD floors (1-100), and choose to stick to the old fashioned dungeon crawl. So I don't really know what people are doing for EXP these days so I may be speaking from a bit of misinformation here.. So what are people doing to level? Just spamming floors 51-60 over and over?
To me, the exp floors of PotD are about as difficult as FATEs. You can do anything in there and get by.. Buff the difficulty to compete with dungeon difficulty for the higher floors and I imagine the level of player skill will increase by a significant enough portion to notice.
The word is generally warranted.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed5392
For every "thing" that a player in a dungeon isn't doing, the other players have to make up for it.
Think about it like this. If you are carrying a table, and it requires a certain amount of strength to carry that table 100 metres.. Then someone suddenly decides to only use one arm and put in half the effort, that means the 3 other people carrying that table would have to do more work to get that table 100 metres.
Each person carrying that table is responsible for a certain portion of the weight of that table.
If one person slacks off, then the others have to carry the weight for the other person. -
03-20-2017, 10:32 PMAma_Hamadaread my story, that is a good example of carrying. I had to put a lot of extra effort because somehow a pure 270 gear WHM with piety/ spell speed melds and a 275 relic could not fulfill basic functions of healing, putting a lot more weight on my shoulders, using cooldowns that is not intended (using dissipation for mp) just to make up for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRed5392
If you see me use the word carry, there is a damn well good reason for it.
another simple example that is common in leveling DFs even past 50 ones, me doing the most dps as a healer... -
03-20-2017, 10:34 PMArriusUnless the NA/EU community improve their expectations and actually enforce them via (successful) Vote Kicks at places where underperforming is not acceptable, nothing will change on that level.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adire
And everyone needs to pull their weight when it comes to this issue.
It already worked in a similar way in certain Warring Triad Ex trials. -
03-20-2017, 10:41 PMFaliandraThank you. You just perfectly put my opinion into words and I couldnt agree more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altena
This is spot on. -
03-20-2017, 11:07 PMxbahax92Where did I hear that again... Oh right, last Q&A. Hahah.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altena
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03-20-2017, 11:13 PMAltena*Enochian..Quote:
Originally Posted by xbahax92
Same diff. I don't BLM. -
03-20-2017, 11:17 PMKaethra
To be quite honest, I think some of you are working on the agenda that PotD took away from some of the playerbase of dungeons, and you'd like for that to be alleviated in some form. The issues you all are saying it created or exacerbated were around long before PotD was a thing. And I'll dare say that it hasn't gotten worse. I've ran some of the Heavensward dungeons and it appears most know the mechanics. Some better than I do (simply because its my first time in some of those dungeons after coming back with 2 years of a break).
I did level 100 content in Everquest about 2 years ago. EQ is well known for not being very forgiving if you don't know exactly what you are doing. Even then, even still we had players on these trial dungeons not play their roles properly. When I was running them with a buddy of mine, if he wasn't tanking, and I wasn't healing. We knew the run was going to be a bit interesting. And that was part of the reason we left. We got pigeonholed into two roles because we couldn't find anyone good enough to allow us to play support or dps.
WoW:Legion was similar. But not as bad. But still noticeable. You run a random heroic and you just sometimes get someone in a role that causes the group some issues. They've had to do 90 to 100 levels of dungeons and grinding to get where they are. And there they are.. not knowing a damn thing to what they are supposed to do.
The system cannot, will never teach a player their class, job, or role. I mean the little mission thing in front of every dungeon helps by telling players to throw their shield at stuff. But that begs the question if they needed the game to tell them specifically when to use a skill, how competent can you expect them to be? You all are confusing practice (as we know practice makes perfect) with raw talent. You are getting nostalgic to a time when some dungeon used to be hard for you because you didn't have the practice.
But I'm willing to wager you all could have handled hardmode HW dungeons in 2014 in 2.0 back when AK/WP were the only two dungeons. A few wipes learning something new sure. But you'd get it. Probably even before you ran out of time on the duty. There are some players that just cannot do that. Making them take 5 years to get from 1-60 won't help. I know this, I've seen someone damn near take that long to reach max level in a game. They don't play their role well at all.
Then you have laziness. You can't help that either. Well you can, you avoid the PUG's and run with friends. Many of us do this already. I normally run with a buddy or two so when we run into a detrimental player, we just remove them. Newbies we help, I like the newbies, especially the ones willing to learn. I feel bad for the ones who want to learn and just can't. But even after everything I've said above.. these players actually aren't that common in the queues.
A few pages back, I explained that those players usually avoid queuing for things. Its only things like Praetorium and The Vault normal that you'll see them. Well they have to go there to finish the story. IMO that's where the mistake is. You're putting solo oriented players with groupers. That shouldn't be done. The skill and talent just isn't there. And never will be. Its for this reason I don't pressure my friend (the one who took years in EQ to get to a decent level) to play FFXIV.
That'd be a horrible experience for them. They'd have to do several dungeons and primal normal fights as well as MSQ. And they'd likely want to play a Warrior for the RP. Instead I leave them playing the game they enjoy playing. They've been playing it a little over a year and haven't hit max level yet. Thankfully in ESO they don't have to do the dungeons. They can solo to their hearts content.
The real solution is to divorce solo and group content. Yes we'll still have players who don't know their roles slip through. But at least it will get to a point where you won't see them in higher stuff because they cannot complete the lower stuff. Let the content itself filter them. Because lets face it. The 1-59 game, slow or fast. Dungeon or not. Won't teach you what you need to do at 60. Even veteran players or decent players like us have that issue. All job rotations and how you apply them change drastically from 49 to 50 and 59 to 60.
In many ways the game starts at 60. How fast or slow you got there doesn't matter. -
03-20-2017, 11:39 PMAltenaI mean, it's your experience vs. mine in the instance that I am going to mention here.. However the skill level of players has definitely significantly decreased.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaethra
At least from my experience. I won't discount your opinion though, as this is rather subjective and nearly impossible to physically measure.
I am not saying that skill level was always better though - as we did see this back when Bluefog FATE spam was a thing.. However there was a time between this where the skill level of players seemed generally higher to me - and this was after they buffed Dungeon EXP and before the release of PotD.
There are definitely people that take longer to learn content than others, and there always has been. There is no argument there.. However we aren't specifically talking about first timers or people that are new to the dungeon - many of the people I have personally run into that don't pull their own weight, have multiple classes levelled and have done the duty quite a number of times. There seems to be a bit of a trend going on, where people jump into a dungeon with no clue how to use their skills on mobs that survive longer than 10 seconds. I would point the blame on PotD but I don't think the whole system is to blame.
This brings me back to my argument on my last post.
I am a big fan of having your entire set of skills at your disposal to figure out how to play your class - however the learning medium isn't there.
I argue that PotD is a great system as it allows people explore their class at end game.. However the issue with it is that the content is just far too faceroll and requires a similar thought process to that of a Bluefog FATE. The difficulty is just far too easy. Experience aside, AK and WP at iLvl sync is still much "harder" than PotD. I can say that much for certain. -
03-21-2017, 12:24 AMAmalonStar
Ok now I've read a bunch of the comments after waking up, with this issue of the amount of players that play very poorly it is caused by a combination of a few things I think.
1) Potd- yes its true that bad players existed before this but it certainly doesn't help the issue, new players using this to lv so they can get up to higher lv content faster they get all these skills and abilities thrown at them and have no idea how to use them let alone set up a efficient hot bar set up.
2) Duty Finder- as convenient as this is it doesn't encourage ppl to learn their jobs or to play better simply because they can get into what ever duty they want with it, yes there is the kick option but alot of ppl won't kick a healer or a tank because sometimes the wait time to get a replacement can take forever. So most ppl will just try to get through the content and finish that run.
3) Solo content- There is too much content for soloing and they can play how they want so when they do have to do group content where there are certain expectations everyone is expected to meet at a minimum level of skill some of these player are not able to meet them. No this isn't an elitist point of view on this I actually expect anyone I play with to make some mistakes just because its human to make mistakes and just have an off day, elitists tend to expect that you don't make a single mistake and if you do they go off on you about it.
There are probably more factors that contribute to poor players. I come from ff XI we had no duty finder finder on there and you were expected to know the basic's of your job, if you developed a bad reputation for not doing what was expected of the job you were playing or would go afk alot while in parties or other things like that you would have trouble finding a party to join because unless you were the only one seeking a party on that job they would go to the next person. You could only solo so far into the game before you would run out of mobs you could solo and get exp from, at around lv 10-13 you could get into your first leveling party, I usually solo'd up to lv 20 to avoid an area I referred to as 'the dooms' because that was where ppl were still learning their jobs and I found I could lv faster soloing than in a party with the down time due to wipes.
I've heard similar stories like this from other ppl from other games too. Like I'm good and like to learn each job I play properly so I'm not just dead weight but have never been an elitist, on ff XI we had elitist types on there too and like I said they expect ppl to play to the maximum potential your selected job can and are the ones with those third party apps that calculates each players dmg and you get kicked if you don't have extremely high dps. -
03-21-2017, 01:53 AMLaerune
Aside from the players who do not want to learn their role and class, the game itself does not teach you alot about playing your class/role. When leveling, you do not need to use damage/healing/defensive buffs, because the leveling content does not require them. When players play with a playstyle where certain skills are not required, then its no suprise that they repeat what they were doing at low level at endgame.
The sad part is even if SE improves these issues a big part still relies on the players motivation to want to improve. You can lead a horse to water (but you can't make him/it drink). -
03-21-2017, 03:07 AMAma_HamadaI agree with this. I been seeing more and more gear level dodging (why I been posting a few threads on making stricter guidelines on entry for DF) I just had a DF with someone with 49 rings in darkness. People do not know how to AoE, people do not know how to tank, People do not even know how to basic function as a healer in dun despite having max gear (270 all slots and 275 relic) It is really getting old.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altena
Also the people that usually have skill problems to pass the content are usually people that have all jobs locked out cept one being 15 that is required for w/e they have at 60. -
03-21-2017, 03:49 AMBourne_EndeavorTo be fair, PotD only exasperated an already existing problem. The game is simply too damn easy at lower levels. What incentives do new players really have to upgrade gear when they can still queue into content? I frequently criticise Xelphatol and GGH for this precise reason. ilvl 210 was outdated over a year ago yet it's considered relevant for 3.4? Unless people have preexisting aspirations for Savage or EX Primals, they simply aren't going to focus on gear when the game itself doesn't give them a reason to. It's one of my biggest concerns when the devs keep going on about closing the skill gap. You can't keep making content easier lest you bore everyone else. Now I want to clarify, you cannot go too far in the opposite direction or we end up with Gordias. But content should push players to think "hmm, maybe I need some better gear" or "why aren't these abilities as strong anymore?" That's how you get better. Sadly, the game doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ama_Hamada
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03-21-2017, 04:45 AMRiritaBack then dungeons were much harder than today, holding aggro was harder so even DPS was usually aware of what that little bar next to their name meant, trash mobs hit harder, jobs didn't have the countless buffs that accumultated through the years, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverquick
This is the problem with increasing level caps, it will be even worse as the level cap increases again and mid levels are even faster or, heavens forbid, we get jump potions. -
03-21-2017, 04:57 AMmatteoxyz
Are you sure you're not exaggerating a bit?
I only occasionally encounter any of these issues. The vast majority of PUGs I join are competent, swift and the players courteous. -
03-21-2017, 05:04 AMAeeninwen_Taldel
When I lose aggro, it's basically because my gear isn't as good as it should. As I'm still lowish level, and haven't actually hit 60 yet on any class. For the most part, people are understanding and give me tips to help try to keep aggro. For the most part, I can hold it fairly decently, but there's some cases where it's proven more difficult that it should be. In the end, it is what it is.
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03-21-2017, 05:07 AMAdireI had a summoner in a Hullbreaker Hard Mode run the other day with an ilvl 55 weapon. I did more damage than them as a PLD. While in Shield Oath. My tolerance is running out, I'm going to start showing people the back of the queue line.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ama_Hamada
I'd have to guess that you're an unusual case. There's a reason PUGs have a bad reputation in pretty much every game. I have worse luck with them in this game than any other one I've played.Quote:
Originally Posted by matteoxyz
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03-21-2017, 05:10 AMFaliandraQuote:
Originally Posted by matteoxyz
You're on Tonberry according to your info. Thats a japanese Datacenter, I believe the vast majority in here is from NA/EU datacenter.
We already know how JP handles things differently. -
03-21-2017, 05:38 AMFalmer
These type of threads remind me of...................... lol
http://49.media.tumblr.com/3acbc8041...09ido4_250.gif