ARR has 600k subscribers

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Originally Posted by Blarp

I'm curious how they sold 1.5 million copies, and only have 600k subscribers though.

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In any MMO, Launch ( Honeymoon phase), has a HUGE spike uprise in players until about the end of the free trial. After that, they don't wanna pay for the subscription for various reasons:

1) They hate the thought of paying for a sub for a game that they own
2) Some people just won't like the game
3) Rushers ( Get to max have nothing to do and quit for a time or perhaps forever)
4) Community/Experience with the Community (either in a good or bad way will determine if they will stay or not, especially if they are new to MMOs)

And so on, for the subs to be at 600k when they were only foreseeing only like 250k is a very big triumph for a game that was on the verge of defeat.

They have 350k more subs then they were originally planning for. In a manner of speaking, they have a lot of sub room to work with!

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Originally Posted by ereskigal

There are also ppl in those numbers like me, I bought both ps3 and PC but only count as one account!

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That's true in any mmorpg as well though. There's people I know on eve who have 6.

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Originally Posted by Yagrush

Guys, the 1.5mil number is counting from the 1.0 days, so its 600k Subs from the 1.5 mil units sold since Sept 30, 2010. Perspective is important.

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iirc XIV 1.0 sold about 625k copies then as well. Hopefully they speed up content updates after 2.1 - I mean, FFXI releases updates almost every month even in small/medium, so hopefully after this "bump" it goes a lot faster since it was supposed to be the larger content additions every x months but smaller updates in between.

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

iirc XIV 1.0 sold about 625k copies then as well. Hopefully they speed up content updates after 2.1 - I mean, FFXI releases updates almost every month even in small/medium, so hopefully after this "bump" it goes a lot faster since it was supposed to be the larger content additions every x months but smaller updates in between.

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Spoiler alert. Yagrush was wrong. They don't count 1.0 units.

SW:ToR had similar bought/subscription ratio after few months. These numbers really does not represent the profitability, would have to see the whole picture.

Got to consider the possibility of people waiting for the PS4 version.

I know a few people who have played out their free trial version, and now they're waiting to upgrade on PS4.

Not sure if this has been posted ye, but oh well.
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/squar...opment/0123831
Just an interesting read.

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Originally Posted by Erana

Not sure if this has been posted ye, but oh well.
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/squar...opment/0123831
Just an interesting read.

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It adds that it “hopes to transform the fixed-price model of online games into variable earnings models".

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Micro-transactions?

MMORPGs are quite profitable unless grossly mismanaged. I remember WoW announced their total operating expenses is around $50 million an year. Assuming a subscriber pays $15X12 months, that expense can be covered by 277K subscribers, and that doesn't even include any box sales or other services. Now, the total staff that is responsible for content development probably requires significantly more money than that, but it's not the customer's problem if a company overpaid its staff. People need to stop buying the lies about how it actually costs money to run a MMORPG. The amount needed to keep the actual infrastructure running is basically irrelevent compared to the money a MMORPG pulls in.

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Originally Posted by Blarp

So 900 thousand people just stopped playing in three months time? It seems like a weird discrepancy to me. In any case, no need to dwell on it as 600k subscribers is excellent.

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Not necessarily. Remember that retail numbers are shipments, not sales.

While this doesn't concern square enix (for them a shipped game is a sold game, no matter of it finds a home or not), not all of those are necessarily players.

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Originally Posted by Reslin

The article is outdated. This same information was posted by other sites on september 30th. We had another article in late october about how final fantasy gained another 500,000 players. Recent articles have all been sporting "1.5 million accounts." This article is using September information when it's currently november. Note, 600,000 is still good even if I'm wrong.

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Actually the document states quite clearly that the subscription numbers are updated to the "most recent date".


To the doom and gloom/free to play creeps. The game now has more paying players than Final Fantasy XI ever did. Final Fantasy XI is the most profitable FF game of all time, and it never went free to play. Do your math.

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Originally Posted by baopee

600000 X 12.99 = 7794000 USD per month, please use some of that to fix the lag.

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This... please!

The in-denial in this thread is strong!

Now can they fix the .3 lag. Impressive numbers though. And get there customer service on par with rest of the industry . Game can be 2 million paid users a month. Then last for the next 10 years and they can keep ff11 running for another decade also.

There's reason to have a doom & gloom because there's a history of MMORPG companies grossly mismanaging their product. The next thing you know you may hear SE trying to resurrect Elvis to do voice acting for Thancred, or that they're using the profits from FF14 to make The FF: The Spirits Within 2. Blizzard pretty much used WoW's immense profitability to support other projects, which is why even though WoW is literally a license to print money you still hear WoW talks about how they need even more money to cover their expenses. There's no doubt FF14 is extremely profitable, but there's also no limit to human stupidity/greed that can easily wipe that profitability out.

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Originally Posted by Astarica

There's reason to have a doom & gloom because there's a history of MMORPG companies grossly mismanaging their product.

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applying unrelated history to a different case is disingenuous.

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but there's also no limit to human stupidity/greed that can easily wipe that profitability out.

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I'm pretty sure Yoshida&Co know better about how to make a game profitable than some random people ranting on a forum.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

I'm pretty sure Yoshida&Co know better about how to make a game profitable than some random people ranting on a forum.

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After reading countless threads a day. Yep, this sums it up pretty well lol.

My problem with this chart is it has Rift listed at 600k subs, when Trion is a private company that has never given out subscription information that I've seen anywhere.

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Originally Posted by Blarp

That's awesome news. The dedication SE has shown to this game deserves to be rewarded IMO. I'm curious how they sold 1.5 million copies, and only have 600k subscribers though.

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I think 600k is more a record mark for SE, set by FF XI. And FF XIV broke this record. So it is more than 600k

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It’s also mentioned that the number of paying subscibers “broke through” 600,000, surpassing the peak amount attained by its predecessor, Final Fantasy XI.

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Originally Posted by Felis

I think 600k is more a record mark for SE, set by FF XI. And FF XIV broke this record. So it is more than 600k

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That's exactly what it looks like. It's not very realistic to expect precise subscriber numbers this early after launch, especially in a financial results slide relative to one month after launch.

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Originally Posted by Bearssi

SW:ToR had similar bought/subscription ratio after few months. These numbers really does not represent the profitability, would have to see the whole picture.

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No it didn't. SWTOR lost over 500,000 players with 3 months. We went up in 3 months. In 3 months SWTOR was bleeding out.

They may have 600,000 subscribers, but they only have the infrastructure for half of that.

Something has got to give.

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Originally Posted by Pocus

They may have 600,000 subscribers, but they only have the infrastructure for half of that.

Something has got to give.

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Which is why we have like every other day maintenance to try to resolve the situation XD.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Which is why we have like every other day maintenance to try to resolve the situation XD.

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I don't blame them for not spending money to support the initial influx of new players and tire kickers. Every new mmo goes through this time. It all comes down to them rolling the dice hoping the number of subs meet their expectations once things subside vs. losing all the momentum they have and issues they are suffering now make the customers over correct and move on.

It's bidness, it's not some noble art or science of making and enjoying games.

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Originally Posted by Pocus

I don't blame them for not spending money to support the initial influx of new players and tire kickers. Every new mmo goes through this time. It all comes down to them rolling the dice hoping the number of subs meet their expectations once things subside vs. losing all the momentum they have and issues they are suffering now make the customers over correct and move on.

It's bidness, it's not some noble art or science of making and enjoying games.

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True, but I believe that they will retain a healthy 400k ( like they originally predicted), but it could def. be a major hit as well. It wouldn't hurt to have the extra room.

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Originally Posted by Reslin

No it didn't. SWTOR lost over 500,000 players with 3 months. We went up in 3 months. In 3 months SWTOR was bleeding out.

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Kind of whats happening here...

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Originally Posted by SynMaris

Kind of whats happening here...

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I kinda don't see that currently on my server at least.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

I kinda don't see that currently on my server at least.

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Same. Just loggen in. Got another queue, like every day.

Game's doing fine, and the doomsayers are mad.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Same. Just loggen in. Got another queue, like every day.

Game's doing fine, and the doomsayers are mad.

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I mean sure FFXIV:ARR will lose players, but I don't see majority of the players getting to 50 and complaining on the forums. As long as there is content for those players ( Majority) to do, then the game will be fine.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Same. Just loggen in. Got another queue, like every day.

Game's doing fine, and the doomsayers are mad.

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I'm just going off the information being presented to me. If we were at 1.5mil and now 600k that's almost a 1mil drop off. I am enjoying the game don't get me wrong, I was just pointing out that what happened to SWTOR is also happening here.

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Originally Posted by SynMaris

I'm just going off the information being presented to me. If we were at 1.5mil and now 600k that's almost a 1mil drop off. I am enjoying the game don't get me wrong, I was just pointing out that what happened to SWTOR is also happening here.

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All MMOs ( Sub based especially) Play their free month out ( Like it, hate subs) ( Hate it period) then it's almost certain most MMOs go through the "Initial" Drop. Now we are left with 600k+ subs ( that have put up their 12-74.99 depending on length and plan)

We may see a little more of a drop, but I am fairly sure it will not drop past their prediction (400k). FFXIV:ARR will do just fine.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

All MMOs ( Sub based especially) Play their free month out ( Like it, hate subs) ( Hate it period) then it's almost certain most MMOs go through the "Initial" Drop. Now we are left with 600k+ subs ( that have put up their 12-74.99 depending on length and plan)

We may see a little more of a drop, but I am fairly sure it will not drop past their prediction (400k). FFXIV:ARR will do just fine.

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If they don't beef things up a bit I can see it dipping below that, but I made a commitment to at least tough it out through the first few big patches, its just hard being Legacy having a lot of 50s to begin with and having to spam a lot of the content over and over again. Here is hoping they get their act together.

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Originally Posted by SynMaris

If they don't beef things up a bit I can see it dipping below that, but I made a commitment to at least tough it out through the first few big patches, its just hard being Legacy having a lot of 50s to begin with and having to spam a lot of the content over and over again. Here is hoping they get their act together.

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Only about 20k of those 600k+ are Legacy ( All 50's) I am one of them, but I decided to make a new character because it's a new game personally. 580k of those people roughly are new to the game. New MMO's generally come with not a lot of content to begin with, but this MMO has more to offer for a launch personally.

Personally for a launch I am happy with it. 1.0 Launch I was not happy at all, but I stuck it through the whole ride. By this time next year there should be a lot of content and possibly an expansion. MMO's need time to grow.

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Originally Posted by Xenobius

Every "big title" MMO has it's launch hype. Even the ones that come out really, really bad in the long run, like SWTOR.
For FFXIV, 2.1 will be the decisive sink or swim factor. If done right, it may yet hold. If not... Well, we all know where it goes for the "do nots".
In it's current form, though, the game has very little to offer save for more of the same, repetitive grind, be it Tomestones or otherwise.

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actually, SWTOR had a drastic decrease right after launch and is NOW, 'in the long run' as you put it, doing great.

just saying. falling for the trap that is 'everyone hates it so it must do badly' ;)
(then again everyone supposedly hates WoW and tries to act like the game's a failure for not having 12 mio subs anyway. lol)

How they get you is by having Myth caps.
If they didn't put a limit, people would of quit already....a lot more than they have now.
I have to wait like...3 weeks till I get my AF2 Robe lol if I capped it so I need to sub a few more times to reach that gear...
But I don't because I don't feel like dealing with it. Hope the game stays healthy, the later patches depend on it.
I'm personally not as hyped for 2.1 anymore with the housing ordeal...but someday...someday.

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

Funny thing is, people reported the 1.5 million number SE reported not too long as subs and fought against anyone who said otherwise. 600,000? Cute, now if they maintain it is gain more is the real test, FFXI held onto 500,000k from 750k peak for numerous years.

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You always lose a lot of people after a launch's free trials end. ARR's retention rate is actually pretty high. Also, XI's peak was 500k, im not aware of it ever being 750k.

Why aren't people just happy about the numbers in general? There's something humorously pathetic about people who bought a game with a monthly fee, pay that fee, but speak negatively about something as generic as subscription numbers.

You see, the number of unhappy residents of these forums does not reflect a consensus of the actual 'majority' logged in and enjoying the game. While there maybe many 50's with nothing much to do, there are many more still levelling up or trying their hand at crafting/gathering.

The only unique circumstance is the transition from 1.0, which I would have foreseen them adding more classes/jobs at launch to give former players more to play around with. Personally, that was the only thing that disappointed me when Arcanist came with SCH/SMN while the others came with only one specialisation.

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Originally Posted by Dannythm

Well Well, so much for the sinking ship.

It sold 1.45M copies also until September 30.

Info seen here:

http://www.dualshockers.com/2013/11/...g-subscribers/

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600k subs this early in the game's life cycle is not so good, especially since that's like a two-thirds drop-off from initial customers. And they had the great fortune to launch in an environment where all the other top-tier games are either not finished yet or ending the life cycle of their current expansions.

Then again, I guess I'm colored by WoW expectations (though I doubt any game can get their soon). If you're happy with a second-rate game like SWTOR, then I guess they're on track for that? We'll be treated to endless new gears to purchase in the marketplace and hardly any other content ever.

Why is it so impossible to find an MMO that can commit to new content on any kind of regular schedule? This game didn't even launch with the bare bones content (Crystal Palace, PvP) that was both promised or expected by this point.

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Originally Posted by Dliver

If you're happy with a second-rate game like SWTOR, then I guess they're on track for that? We'll be treated to endless new gears to purchase in the marketplace and hardly any other content ever.

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not sure where you get your information from but SWTOR currently has 4 different end-game operations and that is NOT including the ones for lvl 50 (where most guilds still haven't beaten the nightmare version of the last one of those and are still stuck at the operations that were introduced BEFORE the last two that came out, not forgetting to mention the new add-on that is coming out next month. lol)
and you can NOT buy any kind of gear needed in the cash shop (you can buy gear shells that have zero stats which obviously helps you exactly not at all in endgame)

my goodness, where do you get your information from and why the hell does everyone who wants ARR to fail have to make false claims about SW:TOR? lol. are you trying to scare people into cancelling their subscriptions just because OTHES don't like a game? lol



ps: it was pretty clear fairly early on that PVP would not be included at release, yet alone ever be a 'major' part of this game. they do have plans for pvp, yes, but if you want actually competative 'quality pvp' this game will never be your game of choice. it's not like SE is known for 'good' pvp, either (though I did have fun in besieged in XI but that's beside the point :P)

from what i heard from my friends, ff14-ARR is going to launch in china with a chinese translated version and it will definitely boost the number of active players or subscribers (if the game is still P2P).