INCAP love [DEV1027]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xoo

Even if incapacitating a mobs' head did affect attack/accuracy, the damn things die so quickly it is of no consequence.

---

that is a different issue... It needs to be addressed though, I agree...

believe me i'd love incaps to play a more important role than they do now. we've discussed this many times and like i've told you before it was one of the things that i absolutely loved about the original system was the fact quite a few drops could only be gotten if an incap was done.

Incaps on Ifrit slows his regen. Useful if your dps is lacking. :)

People were saying before that incap didn't affect ifrit drops. Since update though, i wonder if it influences totems though.

Haven't tried since it was taking much longer to break since update.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BeePee

Incaps on Ifrit slows his regen. Useful if your dps is lacking. :)

---

a bit hard if using Lancer, because we need to do on its left (using impulse drive), which is the Conjurer spot. Will get yell if the cracks comes there >.<

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BeePee

Incaps on Ifrit slows his regen. Useful if your dps is lacking. :)

---

proof please

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aion

a bit hard if using Lancer, because we need to do on its left (using impulse drive), which is the Conjurer spot. Will get yell if the cracks comes there >.<

---

In the times I've seen it done, it's generally done right at the beginning and finished as soon as possible to avoid such situations.

bump because the new updated lodestone info says this

Quote:

---

When the body part of an enemy is incapacitated, it will suffer the following effects:

- Weaken the enemy
- Prevent the enemy from using its special attacks
- Influence the type of loot dropped

---

And I'm going to have to call BS on this

Source: Click Here
(The source is updated because it also details combos and new abilities)

If incaps are to be used more in the future, every class should have an ability for every part.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Isaveron

If incaps are to be used more in the future, every class should have an ability for every part.

---

I don't want this... I want it balanced so each class is needed for a different incap... this could stop people from stacking the same classes
Imagine if you could incap each wing and head on Garuda. MNK needed for head, WAR needed fro left wing, DRG needed for right wing..... And this stopped him from doing some super move.... that would make it beneficial to have all classes in

Since reviving old threads seems to be a trend right now, I'm bringing this one back.

We absolutely need further use of the Incapacitation system. It was awesome in Monster Hunter and it can be amazing here. This is one system that could really make boss fights more interesting and it helps with class diversity. C'mon devs, don't forget about this system, it can be used to make some very unique fights.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Since reviving old threads seems to be a trend right now, I'm bringing this one back.

We absolutely need further use of the Incapacitation system. It was awesome in Monster Hunter and it can be amazing here. This is one system that could really make boss fights more interesting and it helps with class diversity. C'mon devs, don't forget about this system, it can be used to make some very unique fights.

---

I just posted about this also.... The incap system fitting into the new BR that is coming back....
I really do feel like it will be awesome....

Also, Arcell... what about compound incaps?
Like you need to break the left arm of some MOB to break the shield before you can incap the head?

Also the idea of magic palings that need to be taken down would be really cool...
It would give the game a more epic offline RPG feel

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

I just posted about this also.... The incap system fitting into the new BR that is coming back....
I really do feel like it will be awesome....

Also, Arcell... what about compound incaps?
Like you need to break the left arm of some MOB to break the shield before you can incap the head?

Also the idea of magic palings that need to be taken down would be really cool...
It would give the game a more epic offline RPG feel

---

Battle Regimen would be a good place to fit an incap, could even combine that with the compound incap idea.

Compound incaps would be good alone too. They could do a lot with that with the legs. Bring down the legs to gain access to an area that can be incapped.

We really need incaps that are visual and practical. Taking out armor pieces to lower defense, damaging limbs to lock out abilities or lower damage or AoE range from certain skills, breaking claws/weapons to lower damage or accuracy, etc... They could really do a ton with the system. Also more incaps that stay through the entire fight would be nice, I hear it's pretty useless on Chimera because they can regenerate.

"Know thy foe, know thy quarry"

-.- I wish a job would get scan, theres not enough info on the wikis and such to know everything about how to combat monsters. Most of us are essentially working on guess and check fighting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Battle Regimen would be a good place to fit an incap, could even combine that with the compound incap idea.

Compound incaps would be good alone too. They could do a lot with that with the legs. Bring down the legs to gain access to an area that can be incapped.

We really need incaps that are visual and practical. Taking out armor pieces to lower defense, damaging limbs to lock out abilities or lower damage or AoE range from certain skills, breaking claws/weapons to lower damage or accuracy, etc... They could really do a ton with the system. Also more incaps that stay through the entire fight would be nice, I hear it's pretty useless on Chimera because they can regenerate.

---

My friend... I wish you were moving to Excalibur

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AceofRains

"Know thy foe, know thy quarry"

-.- I wish a job would get scan, theres not enough info on the wikis and such to know everything about how to combat monsters. Most of us are essentially working on guess and check fighting.

---

thats a GREAT idea.... there was something about a monster Bestiary too... where the more of a MOB you killed... the more info got filled in on the bestiary
Scan could even make it so the info filled in even faster
I'd even be ok with only 1 job getting scan... but everyone in the party benefiting from it
Or materia that increased scan rate

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zantetsuken

BUMP!

If something is incapacitated, then it should have some sort of visual cue.

---

I realize the toad on his back or Coincutter on his butt are examples of large AOE attacks that missed the whole party, but I think they are fantastic examples of how dramatically disabled a monster should be when properly incapacitated.

IMHO the only creature in the game that was entirely done right in this respect was the Great Buffalo. You break a horn? Chance at horn drop. Break 2? chance at 1 or 2 horns. Hack him in the legs enough? He falters for a while, and DD's can ramp up damage.

Incaps elsewhere in XIV ranges from somewhat- to dramatically-less consistent than this NM. Attention to detail, devs. (Yes, please.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duuude007

I realize the toad on his back or Coincutter on his butt are examples of large AOE attacks that missed the whole party, but I think they are fantastic examples of how dramatically disabled a monster should be when properly incapacitated.

IMHO the only creature in the game that was entirely done right in this respect was the Great Buffalo. You break a horn? Chance at horn drop. Break 2? chance at 1 or 2 horns. Hack him in the legs enough? He falters for a while, and DD's can ramp up damage.

Incaps elsewhere in XIV ranges from somewhat- to dramatically-less consistent than this NM. Attention to detail, devs. (Yes, please.)

---

Yes Duuude... yes

When an Eye or a Drake loses a tail... I want to see it gone

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duuude007

I realize the toad on his back or Coincutter on his butt are examples of large AOE attacks that missed the whole party, but I think they are fantastic examples of how dramatically disabled a monster should be when properly incapacitated.

IMHO the only creature in the game that was entirely done right in this respect was the Great Buffalo. You break a horn? Chance at horn drop. Break 2? chance at 1 or 2 horns. Hack him in the legs enough? He falters for a while, and DD's can ramp up damage.

Incaps elsewhere in XIV ranges from somewhat- to dramatically-less consistent than this NM. Attention to detail, devs. (Yes, please.)

---

don't forget how funny it was to knock the head off the skeles.

i love monster hunter. that's all i wanted to add to this convo lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Doho

i love monster hunter. that's all i wanted to add to this convo lol

---

You and me both, Doho... You and me both
It shows that incaps being visible doesnt mean they have to be over the top... sometimes just showing some subtle signs of incap are cool

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

My friend... I wish you were moving to Excalibur



thats a GREAT idea.... there was something about a monster Bestiary too... where the more of a MOB you killed... the more info got filled in on the bestiary
Scan could even make it so the info filled in even faster
I'd even be ok with only 1 job getting scan... but everyone in the party benefiting from it
Or materia that increased scan rate

---

I'm fine with 1 job making the whole team benefit too. I'd say give it to SCH, make SCH into what it SHOULD be. (with increased item potential, and sub access to conjury and thaumaturgy)

Either that or be able to meld a "sensor" to your weapon like customization in FFX

Bestiary would be great to release in a patch with SCH at that!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AceofRains

I'm fine with 1 job making the whole team benefit too. I'd say give it to SCH, make SCH into what it SHOULD be. (with increased item potential, and sub access to conjury and thaumaturgy)

Either that or be able to meld a "sensor" to your weapon like customization in FFX

Bestiary would be great to release in a patch with SCH at that!

---

Here's to hoping the mods pass this on to Akihiko Matsui

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duuude007

I realize the toad on his back or Coincutter on his butt are examples of large AOE attacks that missed the whole party, but I think they are fantastic examples of how dramatically disabled a monster should be when properly incapacitated.

IMHO the only creature in the game that was entirely done right in this respect was the Great Buffalo. You break a horn? Chance at horn drop. Break 2? chance at 1 or 2 horns. Hack him in the legs enough? He falters for a while, and DD's can ramp up damage.

Incaps elsewhere in XIV ranges from somewhat- to dramatically-less consistent than this NM. Attention to detail, devs. (Yes, please.)

---

Great Buffalo is one of the better examples. Not only is there a visual cue but it also affects drops. Taking a page out of the Monster Hunter book there. They gave us a reason to break the horns.

I can't remember the last time someone actually asked about incapacitation or we actually used it for anything. It's a great system that's just kind of sitting around not being used enough.

Hopefully this, as with most things, will be addressed in 2.0.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shikaree

Ok, old topic but I'm wondering if anyone else feels the same about this.

Do you think the general art of incapacitating should be simplified a little? Looking at the chart, I find that it's odd that certain moves could incap say a right leg/side but at the same time would not work for the opposite. Head is easy enough, so is the back, but why in the world are the other parts so fickle with what side you have to hit it from with particular weapon skills?

I'd rather just see the breakdown of:
Head
Limbs (either side works), or broken up into arms and legs or front limb/back limb (separate each at this point, let the weaponskill focus on either side of one region)
Back
Tail
Anything that may have been missed.

Besides that, the general idea of using this feature isn't well used at this time.

---

I actually don't mind how they break down the parts... the way you suggested would be fine with me

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Great Buffalo is one of the better examples. Not only is there a visual cue but it also affects drops. Taking a page out of the Monster Hunter book there. They gave us a reason to break the horns.

I can't remember the last time someone actually asked about incapacitation or we actually used it for anything. It's a great system that's just kind of sitting around not being used enough.

Hopefully this, as with most things, will be addressed in 2.0.

---

what are some possible incaps you'd like to see manifested physically?

Me... I'd love to see the tails on Draks and eyes come off... thats my biggest wish....
Also a leg incap should come with either "Bind" or at least "Heavy" status effect
Oh.. and Dodo's have a head incap... how funny would it be to see a mangled beak on a dodo?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

what are some possible incaps you'd like to see manifested physically?

Me... I'd love to see the tails on Draks and eyes come off... thats my biggest wish....
Also a leg incap should come with either "Bind" or at least "Heavy" status effect
Oh.. and Dodo's have a head incap... how funny would it be to see a mangled beak on a dodo?

---

Tails off, claws broken, weapons/armor damage or broken, limping if leg is incapped, arm gone limp if incapped, maybe arrows stuck in a monster for Archer/Bard specific incaps, stuff like that.

All of these should also affect the battle. Status effects, drop rates, damage/defense down, change how skills work, reduce AoE ranges, etc...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Tails off, claws broken, weapons/armor damage or broken, limping if leg is incapped, arm gone limp if incapped, maybe arrows stuck in a monster for Archer/Bard specific incaps, stuff like that.

All of these should also affect the battle. Status effects, drop rates, damage/defense down, change how skills work, reduce AoE ranges, etc...

---

On that note... Archer's with Status effect arrows... and the arrow stays visible on the MOB until the status effect wears off
Reduced AOE range is something I've never heard suggested but I love that...

Gotta call BS SE...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Triairy

こんばんは。
Good evening,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by anjely

イフの角を折るとドロップ率が上がると聞いたことがあります。
I heard if you break Ifrit's horn the drop rate increases.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amane

ドロップ率の変動は都市伝説じゃないですかねー
I think that was a myth about the drop rate change

---

ごめんなさい、都市伝説です…
Sorry, that's a myth...

部位損傷の効果は、
For incap effect,

敵を弱体化させる
Weakens the enemy
敵に特殊技を使えなくさせる
Stops the enemy from using special actions/attacks
倒した後に、手に入る素材を変える（損傷部位による）
When defeating the mob the material obtained changes (depends on part you break)


となり、ドロップ率を変動させる効果はありません。
And so it wont affect the drop rate.

---

What you are telling us is that Incaps on Ifrit mean nothing (Because they don't weaken him, stop any actions, or open up any special loot)
Seriously... incaps could be one of the most interesting parts of the game

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

Gotta call BS SE...



What you are telling us is that Incaps on Ifrit mean nothing (Because they don't weaken him, stop any actions, or open up any special loot)
Seriously... incaps could be one of the most interesting parts of the game

---

No, incapacitating Ifrit does perceivably weaken him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

I really do enjoy incaps.... It's a great system....

How do incaps work?
It's easy really.... Stand in the appropriate place on the appropriate MOB and use the appropriate weaponskill to do the appropriate amount of damage and you will incapacitate that part.

That sounds complicated
It's not really... once you start doing it, it's pretty simple

OK, Mr Smug.... So what place, MOB and weaponskill are appropriate?
I'll let SE tell you that
http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com.../battle02.html
Lodestone incap page, A good page to bookmark

There are 7 categories of breakable monster parts
The head Need to be standing in FRONT of MOB
Left Arm Standing on the MOB's LEFT
Right Arm Standing on the MOBs RIGHT
Lower (legs) Standing anywhere in range of the MOB
Left Other Standing on the MOB's LEFT
Right Other Standing on the MOBs RIGHT
Outer Other Standing at the REAR of the MOB... pervert

I'm still confused... I need an example
ok... Let's look at an Opo-Opo (Which means the Opo-Opo family, all monkey looking MOBs, so Lemur's and Galago also)
Let's use this on a Lemur near Treespeak in The Black Shroud
On the bottom table of the Lodestone incap page, we see Lemurs (Opo-Opo) have 2 incaps.... HEAD and LEGS

Let's aim for the head
To hit the head you have to stand in front of the Lemur. You 'll know you're in the front because your damage will say "Normal Attack hits Lemur from the front for 58 damage"

What weaponskill am I using again?
On the second to last table on that page, we see that 3 classes have head incap moves.... Pugilist has Concussive Blow, Marauder has Skull Sunder and Archers have Bloodletter

That doesn't sound too tough...
Its not... stand in front of a Lemur and use Concussive Blow. The text will say "Your Concussive Blow hits the Lemur's Head for 211 damage"

So his head should be incapped, right?
Maybe.... Each breakable part on each MOB has a different amount of damage that needs to be done to incap that part. So you may have to execute more than 1 Concussive Blow to break the head. The amount of damage needed to incap a certain part is now referred to as the "Damage threshold."

How do I know when it's done?
The text will say "Lemur's Head is incapacitated"

OK, that was fun but now I have a ton of questions for you
1.Does the incap increase Drop rates for certain or all loot?
2. Does it open up an entirely new loot pool, like a rare drop is ONLY OBTAINED with the right incap?
3. Does it limit certain weaponskills or abilities that the MOB could use?
4. Does it lower any of the MOB's stats, such as lowering defense or attack?

I'll be honest... in a perfect world, each incap should do any combination of those 4 things. I call these "The 4 possible results of Incaps"

That is one of the issues with incaps. This one might not be a flaw though. Every incap could definitely do at least one of those things... we just don't know...
From my experience, breaking the horns off of a goat (HEAD incap) definitely makes horns drop more often....
and breaking the ore cluster on a Doblyn (Outer Other incap) seems to make them weaker, but none of this is backed by empirical data
If all (or at least most) incaps don't have one of the 4 effects, then I think they really should
If all incaps already have one of the 4 results and we just have yet to prove it or figure it out, then I'd be fine.
SE, you don't have to give us specifics, I'd be fine if Yoshi-P just said "Yes, all incaps serve a purpose and fall into at least one of the 4 results"

Anything you'd change to make incaps better?
Yes, Incaps should be more visible.
When you break horns on goats or buffalo, head on skeletons, ore cluster on Doblyns and a few others, you can see the visual effects of the incap
But break the head on a Goblin, the legs on a Dodo, the shell of crab, all incaps for human and beast tribe... and MANY MANY MORE.... you see absolutely no physical difference... This is one I'd like to borrow from Monster Hunter. There is a dragon called "Rathalos" and when you break its head, the scales on it just look a little damaged or broken just on the actual head of the wyvern though.
I would love to break an Amalj'aa's right arm and just see lacerations and such to show that it has been broken.... Maybe a limp when the legs have been broken
Edit: as of 1.19 Beastman (Amalj'aa, Ixali, Goblin, Kobold, Sylph, Skeleton and Humanoid) can longer be incapped but the idea remains the same...

One last thing to keep in mind, I am unsure of how MOB's with regen work with incaps. This is mainly in regards to the NM's. I've killed all of them quite a few times and have received every rare drop. I've incapped every part possible on the big NM's.

With that being said, the following is supposition and not at all tested or proven so take it with a grain of salt... or call me an idiot for believing this, I don't mind...
It seems as if the amount of damage needed for an INCAP regens if the monsters HP regens.

What does that mean for us?
It just means for the big NM's, you want to do all the incap damage in rapid succession...
For instance, say the buffalo horn needs 1000 hp worth of damage to break, you do 800 damage to the right horn and then later in the fight do another 200 damage to the right horn, you may not break it because the horn's damage threshold has regened...

All in all I LOVE incaps, it gives us something to aim for in big battles... It's fun and it's just the right mix of simplicity and complexity
I would love to see how combos, battle regimen and incapacitation fit in with the new battle system...

Lastly, sorry this took so long... but LIKE THIS if you want SE to create more visual cues for incaps, and make it so all incaps result in one of the big 4 results

---

Nice post. +1 for this

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scarface

Nice post. +1 for this

---

well thank you

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Answa

No, incapacitating Ifrit does perceivably weaken him.

---

so Yoshi mentioning the incap in the live letter was kind of a troll.. nice work Yoshi

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

On that note... Archer's with Status effect arrows... and the arrow stays visible on the MOB until the status effect wears off
Reduced AOE range is something I've never heard suggested but I love that...

---

Arrows with different effects were part of the original plan for the game, they were never included though. Hell I think you can even still see it on the official FFXIV site lol. Status arrows would be good, or any ranged class dealing status effects would be nice.

Reduction of AoE radius was kind of in Monster Hunter with the tail swipe. If you cut the tail off, the radius would be reduced due to the now smaller tail. It wasn't super noticable but in some cases you could tell it was definitely reduced.

Seems like there are myths spreading about incapacitation increasing drop rates? Sounds like a bully beating up a kid for his lunch money to me. Unfortunately, this is in fact only a myth.

Below are the true effects of incapacitation:

• Enfeebles the enemy
• Prevents the enemy from using special abilities
• Alters the materials that are obtainable after defeat (depends on the incapacitation)

Yep. What people want to increase drop rate would be the introduction of the Abyssea Stagger system, which some people seem to hate since they hate forcing items, key items, gear and etc to drop..for some reason.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Arrows with different effects were part of the original plan for the game.

---

Got a link to support this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coglin

Got a link to support this?

---

The only thing that was mentioned were different arrow types would be useful in different situations, much like in FFXI you had Slashing/Piercing/Blunt etc that had obvious pros and cons on certain enemies, but in FFXIV due to the way the stats work in this game it's barely noticable currently.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Seems like there are myths spreading about incapacitation increasing drop rates? Sounds like a bully beating up a kid for his lunch money to me. Unfortunately, this is in fact only a myth.

Below are the true effects of incapacitation:

• Enfeebles the enemy
• Prevents the enemy from using special abilities
• Alters the materials that are obtainable after defeat (depends on the incapacitation)

---

Can you say without exception that every incap in the game definitely does one of these three things?
And if most are just enfeebling effects... is the enfeeble drastic?
Lastly... will they be more visual in the future?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rydin

Can you say without exception that every incap in the game definitely does one of these three things?
And if most are just enfeebling effects... is the enfeeble drastic?
Lastly... will they be more visual in the future?

---

+ dunno if it's only on JP version but incap info isn't displayed on the action help message, you have to actually know it or check the Lodestone to find out...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reinheart

+ dunno if it's only on JP version but incap info isn't displayed on the action help message, you have to actually know it or check the Lodestone to find out...

---

English client is the same way... I hope incap system is still a priority in the new battle system

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Elexia

The only thing that was mentioned were different arrow types would be useful in different situations, much like in FFXI you had Slashing/Piercing/Blunt etc that had obvious pros and cons on certain enemies, but in FFXIV due to the way the stats work in this game it's barely noticable currently.

---

They went into detail and listed out the different arrow types and everything. I'm at work atm and am blocked from most every gaming site.. but I believe it was originally posted on the official ffxiv.com or ffxiv.en.com or something like that. This was around the initial launch but I remember checking up on the site a few months back and the same old information was still there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Seems like there are myths spreading about incapacitation increasing drop rates? Sounds like a bully beating up a kid for his lunch money to me. Unfortunately, this is in fact only a myth.

Below are the true effects of incapacitation:

• Enfeebles the enemy
• Prevents the enemy from using special abilities
• Alters the materials that are obtainable after defeat (depends on the incapacitation)

---

way to ruin some hope.. Yoshi-p or someone was discussing the many many myth/theories and strictly told us that he was not going to say anything because he wants the players to believe in what they believe to provide some hope and motivation :D lol