Please Add no bonus option for PF

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Originally Posted by Whiteroom

I always like how one of the big arguments people use against this solution is that, "It doesn't solve the problem of bad players 100%, so it's pointless!"

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Should probably tell the people that are in charge of stopping RMT to pack it up. After all they will never fix 100% of the problems so why bother.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

I'd like to remind you I made a learning party or used Duty Finder instead of sneaking into a party specifically made for farms. Also, I'm not speaking for the whole community when I said they want a free carry, and it's ridiculous to make that assumption, but anyone new who joins a no bonus party is in the wrong here, period. End of. Done.

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Used duty finder for content you can't go into via duty finder? cool.
and i've seen groups with almost full *insert current difficult content* loot, who most often are terrible in their own right.

Is an option to automatically block someone with bonus viable - probably, but will add to the already toxic community feeling.
Is every person with bonus a hinderance to your group - hell no.

Give me a bonus member with skill over someone with no bonus but also no clue any day.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

Big super snip

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No, it's not an appeal to emotion, it's an appeal to common sense. See other posts where i've clearly stated people with bonus should ask if they can join, not just hop in. What i'm pointing out is the fact that many assume no bonus == skill, and bonus == ew get the f*** away you horrible noob, when in fact many people with bonus tend to know the fight a lot better (due to spending hours and many parties practicing intrinsic details of the fight).

TL;DR - Bonus does not equal skill-less, no bonus does not = totally competent.

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Originally Posted by Divine_Intervention

Give me a bonus member with skill over someone with no bonus but also no clue any day.

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The people that want this have no problem with people who haven't cleared it, if they send them a tell with what experience they have in my case I've seen the majority be accepted in and things go ok.

Its a way to speed up getting a group together in the first place that hopefully doesn't fall at the first attempt because someone was new to the fight or didnt have the experience and joined anyway.

We know there are those without a clear that have the skill and know what they are doing to clear it, we aren't saying there isn't. But if you're seriously trying to say that there is a huge crowd without a clear that have something on farm status I don't know what to tell you, you're insane if thats the case.

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Originally Posted by Odett

On top of that, many people can't form or join statics due to their work schedule and RL situation, so yes, the notion that you need to form a static for something that doesn't require one (and the proof is there because you CAN clear EX primals in PF as well as farm when people aren't being dishonest) IS silly.

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It's not silly. It's difficult. Just because forming a static is difficult, and possible too difficult for many... doesn't mean we should put a block option in on PF that will not prevent people who are dishonest about their abilities from joining up anyway.

A static may not be the only thing that prevents dishonest people from joining your group.
A static is also not easier than a block option in PF.
But it's a better solution than the one you're offering because we know that what you're offering won't make a difference.

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You have absolutely no way of knowing this because it's never been implemented. We don't know how it's going to affect things until we try it.

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I know that dishonest people still join PFs without a bonus showing up because dishonest people still join PFs without a bonus showing up. Have you tried PF before for latest EX content? People joining farm groups who are not ready for farm groups happens with or without the bonus announcement all the time.

You're the one who wants to implement a block without showing that the block will actually have any significant impact. While flying in the face of the current facts that do show that the message is irrelevant when trying to find players that are honest about their abilities before joining a PF.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

@raven. Don't change the premise of the topic (what the problem is). It's not that people can't clear the content because people can't do it; the problem is that people are being dishonest about having a clear and balantly ignoring pf descriptions. People that can't clear regardless of achievements will always be a thing, but that's not what the change is for

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Ha ha...

The issue is dishonest players.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

Are you saying that because the solution can't fix all problems its not worth putting in?

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No.
I'm saying that an solution that doesn't make a significant impact and also causing detrimental side-effects is not worth putting in.

Dishonest carried-people will still get in.
People who are better than you will be blocked.

It's a bad solution.

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Originally Posted by Cold_Raven

But it's a better solution than the one you're offering because we know that what you're offering won't make a difference.

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It makes a big difference if it stops just one person that hasn't cleared the fight from joining and wasting your time trying to figure out who it is.

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Originally Posted by Divine_Intervention

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I'll remind you that NOBODY has said that you are bad because you haven't beaten. I respect you for your opinion, but the fact is that we must work with the information given, the one piece of information given, that the player has either cleared or not. If you have cleared, you might suck, but until we go in, there is zero reason to boot someone who has cleared (they'll get booted if its evident they suck), as from face value they meet the requirements.

Someone who has not cleared might be good, but with the facts given, they have not beaten the fight so from a PF stand point, they have not met the requirements, and there is no proof that they have what it takes to farm (in fact counter productive as they havent beaten it once, how are they expected to clear it many times?). Do not get offended by this. There is very little information to go on, and that is the logical thought given the facts presented. If this does not represent you, ADD MORE FACTS, let the party know that you are good enough, let them know how much of the fight you know, and perhaps they will let you in.

This is not a toxicitiy issue, it is a communication issue. If you don't know the fight, make a learning party, get good at the fight, if you know the fight but dont have the practise, join or make a clear party, if you are amazing at the fight but the clear parties arent serving you well, ask POLITELY to join the farm party, this is real common sense, what you are saying is trust nobody, which is counterproductive to everything in a team based game.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

We know there are those without a clear that have the skill and know what they are doing to clear it, we aren't saying there isn't. But if you're seriously trying to say that there is a huge crowd without a clear that have something on farm status I don't know what to tell you, you're insane if thats the case.

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Is an option to automatically block someone with bonus viable - probably, but will add to the already toxic community feeling.
Is every person with bonus a hinderance to your group - hell no.

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See other posts where i've clearly stated people with bonus should ask if they can join, not just hop in.

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I've made my opinion clear on this topic, other people have made theirs clear. I'm for and against it, but i'm not going to use anymore of my daily post limit on this topic xD . Take care o/