Something should be done for players that love a challenge in Alliance Raids.

I think some of us would like something more of a challenge in alliance raids by having extreme Mode with its own sets of achievements and awards and slightly higher earning in Tomestones.

Also make it as a Permanent Weekly Roulette Challenge (Maybe).

I know these Devs. would like to flex their ideas out on what would these Alliance Bosses be like if they were able to let loose a bit more in Extreme. If it turns out popular they can turn the dial up for Savage Versions of the Alliance Raids, and might actually have to think what to do with Adds too besides the bosses, and will be a great experience for players to actually communicate and build with eachother.

However I wouldn't want to be copy-paste like Unreal is, but actually have adds and Bosses have new additional mechanics in each version of the alliance raid.

A man can dream anyway, I just want to see more challenge variations of current content. Not sure how many people here would want to go for something like that.


I know we got our wish recently with 4-Man content though being a new dungeon, but I hope will see something for Alliance raids too. Its more fun when you're partying with more people.

Was actually just talking about this today with some friends. If they had (Unreal) versions of the older alliance raids with mechanics synced up to current ilvl and rewards of like, dyeable versions of the original glams or tokens you could use to buy the glams/minions outright, we thought that would be pretty neat.

That's basically what BA, CLL, Dalriada and DR were. DR even has a Savage version.

Do the Ivalice raider in solo duty finding. Will have the more wipe than the TOP prog.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

That's basically what BA, CLL, Dalriada and DR were. DR even has a Savage version.

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And it was beautiful. Moar of it, moar!

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

That's basically what BA, CLL, Dalriada and DR were. DR even has a Savage version.

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And these were some of the most fun experiences I've had in FF14.

Would definitely enjoy this level of challenge in Alliance Raids.
Currently, Alliance Raids are laughably easy.

With it's own rewards and achievements? The devs can barely make a set of seasonal event gear on time let alone a whole new set just to accommodate a version of casual content fine tuned to be savage so a fraction of the playerbase can feel special for walking out of circles really good.

i like the idea but tbh i dont need special achievements or rewards for it. it doesnt have to be extreme difficulty or let alone criterion difficulty either.... but something between dungeons and extremes... more like normal raids? or bozja, and not whatever we have right now.

My issue with this idea is the same I find in EX trials on Mentor roulettes: Other people.

The reason Alliance Duties are trivial is mostly so, even if your get several people that is running the instance blind or is simply bad, you can still clear them, which makes the DF experience bearable. The more you increase the difficulty, the more impact the dead weights have on the run and, on top of it, you have 23 spots you need to fill with no guarantee they're taken by dead weights.

If they made non-DF Alliance raids in a similar manner to the Bozjan Alliance raids then sure, I'm all for it, as long as they keep a similar system of player scaling, flexible roles and tools to support said flexibility. On those raids, I have at least some power to keep the run going even if the rest of the party dies constantly.

But, first and foremost, SE should rework the entirety of Syrcus Tower raids. They're a poor introduction for new players due to obsolete and uneventful fights and a bane for anyone who wants to do Roulettes normally, as on top of the whole raid being mandatory for MSQ (should've never been imo) you get these lazy people who would rather cheese the roulette through ilvl to get Syrcus AR rather than do AR with some actual semblance of mechanics. They did a decent work on Cutscene Meridianum, they could do the same with Syrcus Tower.

Why do we need casual content turned into hardcore content? Would you be fine with a story mode of the Ultimates that gives a slightly less impressive weapon and title?

It's fine to have things that are just for hardcore players and stuff that's just for casual players. 24 man raids fall under the casual umbrella, and for high player count hardcore content there's BA and DRS already, and any new exploration zone would have a similar high player count hardcore raid.

To be fair, alliance raid are not afraid to kill or 1-shot you. SE gets away with this level of difficulty because they know all the healers, red mages and summoners will rez them constantly. Otherwise alliances raids would not be nearly as deadly as they are.

There is also the minimum item level option. When I did ARR alliance raids with that setting, we were able to tackle it in discord like high-end content and the mechanics were actually that punishing and needed us to tank swap because of lack of cooldowns. You would never expect all this with how transformed it is when you get them synced-but-not-really-synced in roulettes.

I don't know if the ones from expansions would feel quite like high end content doing them MINE, but I know most of them are capable of leaving bodies everywhere in their release state.

It's been pointed out already, but we had BA, CLL, DR, DR Savage and Dalriada. Although you can regard CLL, DR and Dalriada as casual content, CLL required a solid group to do a key part of it. CLL and Dalriada were hard enough that there were regularly full wipes to some of the fights, especially CLL. It's fair to say that SE experimented with this idea of large-scale raids. What does them having not continued it this expansion tell us? Maybe they just couldn't think of a way to do it without the relic areas, or maybe they regret doing it.

I'll never understand why we can't have a min ilvl roulette for [stuff]. It's already in the game, basically, could be a nice alternative to all the easy mode roulettes and it would be (!)optional(!).

Personally I'd like to see Extreme versions of the Alliance raids with a flexible group size (12-24 man for example) where the bosses scale depending on the number of players. It would open the door for FC raiding, which would be a lot of fun. The current rigid 8 man Savage structure is just not suited for FC groups.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

That's basically what BA, CLL, Dalriada and DR were. DR even has a Savage version.

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True, but all of those are gated behind grindy stuff that lots of people don't even do. And for the harder ones like BA/DRS, you're expected to use outside resources like discord to even get into a group.
It'd be nice if, much like EX/Savage content for other things, you could simply unlock retweaked/harder versions of existing alliance raid content and then do it without trudging through like 60 hours of FATE grinds or whatever.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

There is also the minimum item level option. When I did ARR alliance raids with that setting, we were able to tackle it in discord like high-end content and the mechanics were actually that punishing and needed us to tank swap because of lack of cooldowns.

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Love doing these, but they're hard to put together since you need to basically create a full group of 24 in the partyfinder to make it happen and most people see 0 reason to join up for that outside of niche groups.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

To be fair, alliance raid are not afraid to kill or 1-shot you. SE gets away with this level of difficulty because they know all the healers, red mages and summoners will rez them constantly. Otherwise alliances raids would not be nearly as deadly as they are.

There is also the minimum item level option. When I did ARR alliance raids with that setting, we were able to tackle it in discord like high-end content and the mechanics were actually that punishing and needed us to tank swap because of lack of cooldowns. You would never expect all this with how transformed it is when you get them synced-but-not-really-synced in roulettes.

I don't know if the ones from expansions would feel quite like high end content doing them MINE, but I know most of them are capable of leaving bodies everywhere in their release state.

It's been pointed out already, but we had BA, CLL, DR, DR Savage and Dalriada. Although you can regard CLL, DR and Dalriada as casual content, CLL required a solid group to do a key part of it. CLL and Dalriada were hard enough that there were regularly full wipes to some of the fights, especially CLL. It's fair to say that SE experimented with this idea of large-scale raids. What does them having not continued it this expansion tell us? Maybe they just couldn't think of a way to do it without the relic areas, or maybe they regret doing it.

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Yes many alliance raids have one shots and wipes are not exactly something unheard of either. The key difference between that and harder content in the game however is having DPS checks. Many times alliance raids can be recovered from near wipes multiple times and develope into drawn out struggles. A hard enrage puts a stop to that. CLL has that (I think on every boss?), Delubrum only has a hard enrage on the chess pieces fight. Interestingly the new alliance raid does have an enrage timer on the twin fight but only as long as they are both alive.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Yes many alliance raids have one shots and wipes are not exactly something unheard of either. The key difference between that and harder content in the game however is having DPS checks. Many times alliance raids can be recovered from near wipes multiple times and develope into drawn out struggles. A hard enrage puts a stop to that. CLL has that (I think on every boss?), Delubrum only has a hard enrage on the chess pieces fight. Interestingly the new alliance raid does have an enrage timer on the twin fight but only as long as they are both alive.

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I believe Halone has a rage timer too.

Could make 4-man version of alliance raids to make them tougher.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

Could make 4-man version of alliance raids to make them tougher.

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That would actually be easier. The biggest danger in alliances is always the other players running around like headless chickens with their AOE markers or stack line markers.

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Originally Posted by Avoidy

True, but all of those are gated behind grindy stuff that lots of people don't even do.

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Speak for yourself. I see Zadnor full almost every week and I pitch in to help people Dalriada when I feel like it.

It wouldn't be easier it be the same difficulty but instead of having 8 per party you would have 4.

Wow...I remember about a year and half ago, the first time I did the Nier raids, they almost made me quit the game. I was still new, and quite bad (still am by a lot of standards) but now I get excited when I get to do a Nier raid for whatever reason, enjoy the challenge and wish there was even more content like that. But I think back to how hard it was for me when I was new. Not sure what the solution is.

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Originally Posted by Xaruko_Nexume

Wow...I remember about a year and half ago, the first time I did the Nier raids, they almost made me quit the game. I was still new, and quite bad (still am by a lot of standards) but now I get excited when I get to do a Nier raid for whatever reason, enjoy the challenge and wish there was even more content like that. But I think back to how hard it was for me when I was new. Not sure what the solution is.

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My first 'on content' Alliance was Orbonne Monastery, which was 10x times tougher than Nier on release. Thunder God Cid was basically savage on day one, everyone ragequitting because too many people were failing mechanics, overlapping bubbles or not stacking was an instant wipe, you HAD to pass the tethers in relay or you died, and wiping so many times we'd actually get locked out of the duty, with not enough time left to beat Ultima.

It was brilliant. Wish we had that with Myths of the Realm.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

It wouldn't be easier it be the same difficulty but instead of having 8 per party you would have 4.

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It would also entirely defeat the purpose of getting some more challenge in alliance raids, at that point you're just making another criterion dungeon.

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

Why do we need casual content turned into hardcore content? Would you be fine with a story mode of the Ultimates that gives a slightly less impressive weapon and title?

It's fine to have things that are just for hardcore players and stuff that's just for casual players. 24 man raids fall under the casual umbrella, and for high player count hardcore content there's BA and DRS already, and any new exploration zone would have a similar high player count hardcore raid.

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More content bad, less content good!

Seriously, these takes have been incredibly irritating to read for a while now.

There already is something like that for a far easier ultimate with a "slightly less impressive weapon". It's called Savage

Literally nothing is taken away from you enjoying casual content if we have ex alliance raids. You don't even have to acknowledge its existence. Believe it or not, there are people out there that want a challenge in alliance raids and understand that the standard versions will likely never be as challenging as orbonne again, as much as we wish they were. Not everyone wants to be locked to a faceroll difficulty in the content they enjoy.

BA and DRS are two raids. DRS is practically dead content because there's almost no reason to run it more than once. If anything, their existence proves that people would run ex alliance raids if they're fun to do and the rewards are fitting. BA is still an active thing for that reason despite being beaten into the ground a million times over.

We aren't asking for base alliance raids to be stooped up to EX levels, we are asking for the option to run a harder version of it (via extreme version) with rewards. Whether it's augmenting the normal mode alliance raid gear or simply a 520 weapon, the item to augment the tome weapon to 530, a chance for a mount, more tomes, whatever. However, apparently even that is too much to ask.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

More content bad, less content good!

Seriously, these takes have been incredibly irritating to read for a while now.

There already is something like that for a far easier ultimate with a "slightly less impressive weapon". It's called Savage

Literally nothing is taken away from you enjoying casual content if we have ex alliance raids. You don't even have to acknowledge its existence. Believe it or not, there are people out there that want a challenge in alliance raids and understand that the standard versions will likely never be as challenging as orbonne again, as much as we wish they were. Not everyone wants to be locked to a faceroll difficulty in the content they enjoy.

BA and DRS are two raids. DRS is practically dead content because there's almost no reason to run it more than once. If anything, their existence proves that people would run ex alliance raids if they're fun to do and the rewards are fitting. BA is still an active thing for that reason despite being beaten into the ground a million times over.

We aren't asking for base alliance raids to be stooped up to EX levels, we are asking for the option to run a harder version of it (via extreme version) with rewards. Whether it's augmenting the normal mode alliance raid gear or simply a 520 weapon, the item to augment the tome weapon to 530, a chance for a mount, more tomes, whatever. However, apparently even that is too much to ask.

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You're asking for more time to be spent (likely taken away from another project) on something that will generate (what?) as a reward. There's no room for the content or whatever level of reward because it's already there.

I've yet to even see a clear picture of what this higher challenge is supposed to look like. Fewer players per team? You can already do that via PF. Are there supposed to be limit cuts and clock mechanics added to these fights? Bozja has already shown how messy things get when you have more than 8 people trying something more difficult than the original version. They pulled alliance and normal raid bosses, made them harder and people couldn't handle it. They even have trash mob fights that are easily wiped because people don't know what to do with a donut and a knockback.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

You're asking for more time to be spent (likely taken away from another project) on something that will generate (what?) as a reward. There's no room for the content or whatever level of reward because it's already there.

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It's not my place to speak for the devs but they gave us variant/criterion dungeons this expansion and unreal trials last expansion. So it's my hope that we can get EX alliance raids in the future.

I've already listed some options, but I'll go through them again using the formatting.

• augmenting weekly normal mode alliance gear
• Augmenting tome weapons
• Chance to get a mount. (not sure how they would fail-proof this. maybe 4-5 totems a clear? 1 totem a boss fight?)
• an augmentable weapon (Using current as an example. 520->525 or 530)
• more tomes than normal mode in general

They could do this with future criterion installments too, depending on where they release them in the patch cycle. It is a new installment, after all.

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

It would also entirely defeat the purpose of getting some more challenge in alliance raids, at that point you're just making another criterion dungeon.

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Except it wouldn't defeat the purpose. 4 people per party means nobody can screw up. You're having to play more carefully because there's only 1 healer per group, and 2 DPS per group. Checks become tighter, and everybody has to push themselves. Almost exactly like *gasp* AN UNREAL!

I feel like as we've progressed with 24-man raids, we've moved away from actual party mechanics. Think back to CT and that room after the 1st boss with the 3 different areas for the party - some mini boss thing where 4(?) people had to stand on a switch to let the boss be targetable. There were also more insta-kill mechanics. If the alliance didn't do the mechanic, it was a wipe.

That's pretty much gone in this 24-man and there was only 1 insta-kill mechanic in the previous one (the scales at the final boss). Lots of mechanics don't end in a wipe. And they are very very forgiving now.

Think about the final boss of the new 24-man - we get trapped in ice in 3 areas with a DPS check of sorts. However, even if people don't go to their "designated" group's area and just randomly enter these areas... if a group takes out their DPS check and then the center one, it opens up the "locked one." To be more specific, let's say the 3 areas have 12 players, 8 players and 4 players. Naturally, the 4 player DPS check will still be up by the time the 12 and 8 player ones are taken care of. And it will still be up when the center DPS check is dead... allowing all 24 players to take out the last one.

People don't even bother with A B C markers. You just don't need them. It doesn't take much to survive the 3rd boss's stack markers either. 3-4 people can survive it.

I like the mechanics they did add - but the penalty for failing is just not there. It isn't as punishing as previous expansions' 24-man raids.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

More content bad, less content good!

Seriously, these takes have been incredibly irritating to read for a while now.

There already is something like that for a far easier ultimate with a "slightly less impressive weapon". It's called Savage

Literally nothing is taken away from you enjoying casual content if we have ex alliance raids. You don't even have to acknowledge its existence. Believe it or not, there are people out there that want a challenge in alliance raids and understand that the standard versions will likely never be as challenging as orbonne again, as much as we wish they were. Not everyone wants to be locked to a faceroll difficulty in the content they enjoy.

BA and DRS are two raids. DRS is practically dead content because there's almost no reason to run it more than once. If anything, their existence proves that people would run ex alliance raids if they're fun to do and the rewards are fitting. BA is still an active thing for that reason despite being beaten into the ground a million times over.

We aren't asking for base alliance raids to be stooped up to EX levels, we are asking for the option to run a harder version of it (via extreme version) with rewards. Whether it's augmenting the normal mode alliance raid gear or simply a 520 weapon, the item to augment the tome weapon to 530, a chance for a mount, more tomes, whatever. However, apparently even that is too much to ask.

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Savages are not casual version of the ultimate. I was proposing a casual version of the ultimate fights, give us a casual DSR that gives weapons and titles. It's just more content and doesn't take away from the ultimate or the hardcore player base's content right? More content is good.

That made you upset right? To have someone ask to take content that caters to you and have it reworked into something it was never meant to be?

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

Savages are not casual version of the ultimate. I was proposing a casual version of the ultimate fights, give us a casual DSR that gives weapons and titles. It's just more content and doesn't take away from the ultimate or the hardcore player base's content right? More content is good.

That made you upset right? To have someone ask to take content that caters to you and have it reworked into something it was never meant to be?

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Ultimate having a casual variant isn't even on the same footing as extreme having a casual variant and/or vice versa.

That said, not really. If they were to take ultimate and make a version of it for casuals with less show-offy weapons and titles it wouldn't, and shouldn't, bother much of anyone. It very likely wouldn't have ultimate in the name in any form. All it's doing is letting more people access a piece of content. The hardcore version for the people that enjoy the balls to wall experience of ultimate would still be there.

And even with that said, it would only apply to that one specific instanced encounter. Those fights still exist outside of ultimate in separate encounters with normal versions (if you don't count savage door-bosses) outside of coils because they predate raid difficulties.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

It's not my place to speak for the devs but they gave us variant/criterion dungeons this expansion and unreal trials last expansion. So it's my hope that we can get EX alliance raids in the future.

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There was also no exploration zone in this expansion, so what are we supposed to give up for this dream and what does it even entail?

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I've already listed some options, but I'll go through them again using the formatting.

• augmenting weekly normal mode alliance gear
• Augmenting tome weapons
• Chance to get a mount. (not sure how they would fail-proof this. maybe 4-5 totems a clear? 1 totem a boss fight?)
• an augmentable weapon (Using current as an example. 520->525 or 530)
• more tomes than normal mode in general

They could do this with future criterion installments too, depending on where they release them in the patch cycle. It is a new installment, after all.

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Those rewards already exist in other content, so it would be redundant. That's why criterion offers what little it does. Unreal isn't offering anything like that either, so I don't know how there's an expectation for more upgrades from something like this.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

There was also no exploration zone in this expansion, so what are we supposed to give up for this dream and what does it even entail?

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Who's to say we have to give up anything? I'm sure there's multiple factors as to why we don't have something like eureka and bozja this expansion. Deep Dungeon will end up making it up for me personally.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

Those rewards already exist in other content, so it would be redundant. That's why criterion offers what little it does.

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Sure, but it still makes it easier to get up alt jobs regardless. In a game where it's prided on being able to play every job on one character, it takes almost ridiculously long to get max IL on every job if you aren't spamming hunt trains endlessly when the odd number patch hits, this hits weapons the largest, namely.

Though speaking on that, I would prefer if the relics also were higher on the IL side when new phases drop, so it's not just purely cosmetic until the final phase where it becomes BiS. Using current as an example, the first stage could have been 520 while the stage coming out in .35 would be 530.

This wouldn't necessarily make tome weapons irrelevant either, since ideally you would get one tome weapon before .X5 patches land to begin with.

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

Why do we need casual content turned into hardcore content? Would you be fine with a story mode of the Ultimates that gives a slightly less impressive weapon and title?

It's fine to have things that are just for hardcore players and stuff that's just for casual players. 24 man raids fall under the casual umbrella, and for high player count hardcore content there's BA and DRS already, and any new exploration zone would have a similar high player count hardcore raid.

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Nobody is asking for it to be hardcore nor do they want an easier version removed from casual players. A lot of people are simply disappointed Euphrosyne and Aglaia are so ridiculously easy you pretty much can't wipe outside of day one when no one knows what's happening. I shouldn't be able to survive with three vuln stacks in Nophica but I absolutely can. The OP is simply proposing a situation where you can still have an easier version of say, Euphrosyne but those of us who want something that does more than tickle without going up to the Savage level would have an option.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Nobody is asking for it to be hardcore nor do they want an easier version removed from casual players. A lot of people are simply disappointed Euphrosyne and Aglaia are so ridiculously easy you pretty much can't wipe outside of day one when no one knows what's happening. I shouldn't be able to survive with three vuln stacks in Nophica but I absolutely can. The OP is simply proposing a situation where you can still have an easier version of say, Euphrosyne but those of us who want something that does more than tickle without going up to the Savage level would have an option.

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The person responding to me is asking exactly that, so it's pretty disngenuous to say no one is asking for this. Making hardcore/Savage content out of casual content is pretty weird, the balance right now between the two is pretty good in that the odd patches are for the casuals and the even patches are for the raiders. Why upset that by asking for more savage level fights made out of casual content?

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

The person responding to me is asking exactly that, so it's pretty disngenuous to say no one is asking for this. Making hardcore/Savage content out of casual content is pretty weird, the balance right now between the two is pretty good in that the odd patches are for the casuals and the even patches are for the raiders. Why upset that by asking for more savage level fights made out of casual content?

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Because we aren't asking for savage alliance raids, we're asking for ex alliance raids. That "balance" isn't really a set-in-stone idea either. It's just when those particular types of content are released. Every major patch we get an ex trial, so that logic is already flawed.

Would be nice... right now in the last two expansions it has been more like whack a mole rather than having to deal with problems the way eg. Dun Scaith, Weeping City of Mhach did.... and so on and so forth.

funny how every time people ask for midtier content, other people come and talk something about savage (or sometimes mythic +) as if they dont even know about the differences in these things

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

Nobody is asking for it to be hardcore nor do they want an easier version removed from casual players. A lot of people are simply disappointed Euphrosyne and Aglaia are so ridiculously easy you pretty much can't wipe outside of day one when no one knows what's happening. I shouldn't be able to survive with three vuln stacks in Nophica but I absolutely can. The OP is simply proposing a situation where you can still have an easier version of say, Euphrosyne but those of us who want something that does more than tickle without going up to the Savage level would have an option.

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Not easy to wipe =/= easy raid. And if you're inflicted with three vuln stacks, you're either not as good as you think you are, or you're ignoring non-lethal mechanics with healer help. Even as MNK or SAM in the current raid, I will not survive getting hit with a vuln stack unless a healer tops me up, or I use my self-sustain tools to give me just enough HP and defense to take it. Just depends on which mechanic I failed. For Nophica in particular, most of her mechanics hit me for 60-80% of my HP depending on mitigation. There is no way I'm surviving two consecutive hits as a non-tank.

Now I'm not saying Aglaia and Euphrosyne are not easy to clear, but alliance raids have been surefire clears for a very long time now. Gone are the days of WoD and Orbonne, and they seem to have gone away from allowing one player to wipe the entire alliance. Though tanks and other stack marker holders can still easily kill a lot of players.

This does not mean that optional 24-man content cannot be released for players who do want more of a challenge. They could easily make Euphrosyne evil AF by stacking some of these mechanics together, reducing safe spots, one-shot kills and so forth. I would be all for that. These players would need incentive to do it though, and more developer time would be required as well.

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

The person responding to me is asking exactly that, so it's pretty disngenuous to say no one is asking for this. Making hardcore/Savage content out of casual content is pretty weird, the balance right now between the two is pretty good in that the odd patches are for the casuals and the even patches are for the raiders. Why upset that by asking for more savage level fights made out of casual content?

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They said exactly what the OP did: a separate version of Alliance raids with a higher difficulty moniker. Zairava, you're welcome to correct me if I'm misinterpreting your post but I'm assuming you meant something along the lines of Euphrosyne Unreal or Extreme that is essentially the same fights but scaled to be more difficult. Where that difficulty falls is debatable but enough to challenge

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Not easy to wipe =/= easy raid. And if you're inflicted with three vuln stacks, you're either not as good as you think you are, or you're ignoring non-lethal mechanics with healer help. Even as MNK or SAM in the current raid, I will not survive getting hit with a vuln stack unless a healer tops me up, or I use my self-sustain tools to give me just enough HP and defense to take it. Just depends on which mechanic I failed. For Nophica in particular, most of her mechanics hit me for 60-80% of my HP depending on mitigation. There is no way I'm surviving two consecutive hits as a non-tank.

Now I'm not saying Aglaia and Euphrosyne are not easy to clear, but alliance raids have been surefire clears for a very long time now. Gone are the days of WoD and Orbonne, and they seem to have gone away from allowing one player to wipe the entire alliance. Though tanks and other stack marker holders can still easily kill a lot of players.

This does not mean that optional 24-man content cannot be released for players who do want more of a challenge. They could easily make Euphrosyne evil AF by stacking some of these mechanics together, reducing safe spots, one-shot kills and so forth. I would be all for that. These players would need incentive to do it though, and more developer time would be required as well.

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If none of the bosses have even the slightest chance of wiping you outside of day one shenanigans or mostly new players unfamiliar with the mechanics, then it does make them easy. Both Aglaia and Euphrosyne suffer in this regard. In fact, we're so far above their scaling you can outright skip mechanics on release. A tank can easily live through three vuln stacks without any concern. If you're dying to a single vuln on Melee DPS, either you aren't using any defensives or have exceptionally low gear considering I've lived a vuln on Red Mage of all jobs.

I'm aware of the eased difficulty on alliance raids. Which is why even some of the casual demographic is complaining. It gives them almost no staying power despite being one of the major sources of content for six weeks. You mention needing incentives but Orbonne, Weeping City and Dun Scaith never needed any and remained populated throughout their entire life cycle. And no, Orbonne was not nerfed until well over a year after it's release—in Shadowbringers. The reduced difficulty has nothing to do with incentive but the decision by the dev team to make everything easier in these last two expansions. At least when it comes to casual content.