To be fair at time of release the weapons you could get were of relevant ilvl and you still get gear tomes or at least they did before, I haven’t checked and see if you get lvl 80 tomes if running with a lvl 80 jobQuote:
Originally Posted by Critical-Limit
Lack of End Game Content
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07-20-2019, 01:57 AMSerLuke
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07-20-2019, 01:59 AMCritical-LimitThanks I should have said savage tier difficulty elsewhere for same Tier rewards cuz yes it’s relevant level. But if your objective is bis. That’s something you could skip and it’s relevance is short lived. Cuz there is already something betterQuote:
Originally Posted by SerLuke
If your talking tomes. That’s just waiting til catch-up patch to equal raid gear. Which isn’t fun cuz it’s mostly just spamming casual content. -
07-20-2019, 02:03 AMKlb600They've made the focus be entirely the gear treadmill, and they set out the path that a person should take to get that gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forever_Learning
Lol is this a joke? Please enlighten me how the gear treadmill isn't anymore prevalent here? What you are now arguing is which is more grindy within the End Game Hardcore Ecosystem.
Whether you enjoy the side content of WoW or not, they still exist just like they do in FFXIV. WoW has always been a Raid centric game and that's what most of the players look too in terms of progression. Saying that the developers "are much more controlling and manipulative with its players", when End game raid progression is what most WoW players look for and actively partake in, is disingenuous.
you have many many many people doing things, that they don't enjoy, just for the eventual carrot down the road.
You mean Like how many people are running the same dungeons over and over again just, farming the same recycled tomes just too have relevant gear, because FFXIV has a system where the top gear is made irrelevant every 2-3 months? You think I do duty roulettes for fun? No I do it in order to optimize my time Vs reward. And by no means am I claiming that I don't fully enjoy FFXIV, but it has its aspects of "things you will have to do even if you don't enjoy"
Recently, for example, they made something that is valuable for PvE, be something you get from PvP.
Another important aspect of WoWs end game is PvP. Doesn't sound too ludicrous too make one append the other. Chocobo racing isn't an integral part of the endgame progression...Irrelevant example
On top of that, they put in so many different timers and time-gate various things, designed to make logging in every day for 1-2 hours and doing very specific things be the most optimal way to play. So, no one is really playing the game, they are just egg timing it (go in, do x, log out), next day (go in, do x, log out), and so on.
You mean like that very thing they do in FFXIV for progression?
Professions are virtually worthless because they ensure people are unable to craft anything too good for raiding as then players could avoid some things.
Again the very same thing they do in this game....
Player agency itself has been completely removed to ensure time and effort won't lead to a player having an advantage over others.
And Yet another thing they do in this very game....
For all these reasons, the themepark mentality is much stronger in FF14.
Yeah no it isn't, you don't get too just define your own benchmark and definition for what is "much more Theme park" and roll with it. The available rides in WOW are there just like they are for FFXIV, however you choose to measure how "enjoyable" these rides are is besides the point. They are however still there. -
07-20-2019, 02:11 AMErryKI'd love to see something like BA with replay-ability value, cuz that stuff had TONS of replay-ability value for me. Just... don't lock the relic weapon behind it, just put a mount like Ozma or something like that that's collectible, titles don't do much.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alucard135
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07-20-2019, 02:31 AMMelichoir
Theyre giving us NG+ so you can replay the game if you want (which I plan on doing). Beyond that, they charged me $60 for the xpac. I played the MSQ, enjoyed it thoroughly. I still have classes to level, side quests to do, lore to enjoy. I dunno about other people but there is still a ton to do, so I dont understand the "There's not enough content." I suppose if your powering through everything, not reading anything, or spending 8+ hours a day in game, yeah there's not gonna be enough. But youre gonna have to show me a game who can keep up with that rate of consumption.
I think people need to diversify their play, btw. A lot of people who get bored quick are people who only consume this game. I dont play just FFXIV, so Ive personally never run into the burn out. -
07-20-2019, 03:34 AMsnarkomaticThis is one thing I like a lot about ESO. (I am sort of balancing play between that and this right now; I keep putting XIV down, then returning to it, because I can't not apparently? Anyway.) The game itself has a lot of flaws, most noticeably when it comes to actual gameplay soundness, but having grown up on WoW it still amazes me how relevant all of the content in ESO feels. I'm up at max level, have done all the content through the latest expansion, but still find myself returning to old base-game dungeons to pick up gear sets I have not yet completed for testing on a new build. And, as you level, all gear drops at your level regardless of when the content was initially unlocked -- so I get the same Generic Set #9 every run, but it drops in relevant stats at level 10, level 30, level 50, and beyond. I was kinda disappointed to discover XIV's leveling roulette dumps you into old dungeons, but actually scales you down, and does not scale rewards up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Critical-Limit
ESO also allows you to achievement-hunt at max level in harder versions of the dungeons you first did while leveling. Three different achievements per dungeon, plus a special gear set unique only to the hard-mode version.
I don't think these elements need a 1:1 exact-copy of themselves in XIV (or any game), but the general concept (horizontal prog. to keep old content relevant) is a solid one that has proven to keep most of the endgame players with whom I keep company very busy and very engaged with the game for years on end. -
07-20-2019, 04:02 AMZabuzaThanks for basically proving my point. While it may be said in a mature and not condescending manner, the message is basically that if I like having raids, I should just play WoW and not voice my opinion in trying to improve the raid scene in this game, because it isn't going to happen. Currently, I don't like WoW at all, and like FF but not the lack of challenging content. I've been unsubbed for probably over half the time between Heavensward to now because I blow through the challenging stuff(minus Ultimate I don't have a dedicated static) and have nothing left to stimulate me. People ask for stuff on this forum that they believe will make the game better all the time. Well, this is what I'm asking for — more difficult battle content than what we have gotten the past 4 years. This system of farming two snoozefest expert dungeons and two ex primals that I can do in my sleep for tomes and totems gets old. This is not to denote anyone else's skill level, everyone has their own pace. But for me, it is like Satasha, as one person stated. No change at all since Heavensward, because you guys eat it up. They give us reskinned primal fights for the raids and you guys cheer. Why would the dev team try to improve when they know they can dish out anything for challenging battle content and you'll be satisfied?Quote:
Originally Posted by Forever_Learning
Why aren't raiders allowed to want something from this game too, without being told to 'go back to WoW'? I'm not trying to hamper your casual gameplay experience, but there is currently no MMO I feel I can go to at the moment where I can have raids that will keep me occupied. This Savage raid thing will only be a 2 month window before it fizzles out for me. The 24 man raid won't even last a week for me. FFXI was my MMO, but they destroyed it with Abyssea. Before that, I always had challenging content to do. Now, there is nowhere to go. The casual MMORPG has taken over the market, and left no room for those who enjoy challenges. We were usurped by the casual crowd, and we get shot down for wanting a shadow of the former challenging content we had. -
07-20-2019, 04:17 AMMonteCristo
To be honest....They should rename this glamour fantasy 14 and allow all the themepark-carebear/level a million classes(for no reason but just level another one after you cap)/collect alot of pointless items type content to run wild.
Alot of this mess isnt even true final fantasy other than the name, likenesses, and settings. Real FF heads know this to be true.....say what you want be mad w/e but deep down its the truth. At this point its my loyalty to the brand that keeps me subbed in hopes "real content" will be added at some point especially given the amount time ive invested....but until then alot of this is soft and deep down i know some understand what im truly saying. -
07-20-2019, 04:25 AMEisenhowerI've said it once and I'll say it again: because the complaint put out there is rarely "I would like more raids" - it's "There's nothing for me to do". For the person making the statement, both phrases point towards the same problem, but...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
When someone states "I would like more X", be it hardcore raids, crafting, glamour, cake, etc. it's quite easy for other people to read it and think "Yeah, more of X would be nice."
When someone states "I have nothing to do", a reader may be compelled to reply "Try doing Y". But since the player in question has no interest of things outside of X, the conversation devolves into a back and forth of suggestions and rejections which ends up being more and more frustrating. It's pretty easy to see how that leads to "Go back to <game>". -
07-20-2019, 04:25 AMMonteCristoIts no use lol.....this thread literally confirmed my worst fears. The tribe has spoken Casual themepark content is king. No point in continuing to beat a dead horse $$$ talks...always has always willQuote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
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07-20-2019, 05:07 AMElciaDeiLinusWell what would you want- them to put 10% of their development time into creating raids that only 1% or less of the community will do? I see a lot of raiders complaining that they aren't getting more development time, and then being mad that players who like other types of content aren't happily saying 'yes SE, please do less for us and more for them'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
The sheer amount of cockiness as you look down on players that don't have time or the skill or the organized group to do 1% challenge content is likely a big part of why, for the last decade plus that I've played MMOs at least- there's always this division.
But no, there is nothing wrong with hardcores and raiders wanting more content- there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. But, you also need to realize there is nothing wrong with casual players wanting more or at least the same level of content- and casual players aren't stupid, despite how raiders tend to treat them, they realize that development resources are limited and if something gets more attention, something else gets less attention. Most casuals have played enough MMOs by now to fully realize that.
So again- there's nothing wrong with you asking for more of something you like, but stop with the pity party when other players say they want resources to go to something they like more than raids. -
07-20-2019, 05:09 AMElciaDeiLinusYeah, it's pretty awful that people want content that they enjoy and are capable of doing- how dare they.Quote:
Originally Posted by MonteCristo
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07-20-2019, 05:18 AMZabuzaThe same level of content? Casuals have far more content to do than raiders by a long shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
SE has made plenty of money off of this game. There is no excuse for having the very same amount of challenging battle content as 4 years ago. Not all raiders look down on casual players. Me stating many things in this game are easy for me is not looking down on you at all. I'm sure there's something else in life that would be simple for you but difficult for me. Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses...I've already said twice that I'm not looking to cripple the casual player's gameplay experiences in any way. Yet a lot of the casual crowd, instead of simply not caring that raiders are asking for more content, are actively against raiders getting more content. Are you so opposed to us having fun? -
07-20-2019, 05:20 AMVahlnirCasual players make up a pretty good sized chunk of the player base, so...obviously they are going to cater more to the audience that pays better. But yeah, hardcore players obviously do deserve content just for them, and they do get it...just not as frequently as they might prefer. And I understand the frustration. But it doesn't need to turn into an "us vs them" scenario like some people are trying to make it. (you know, like the person you quoted)Quote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
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07-20-2019, 05:21 AMMonteCristoBy the gods...this man truly gets it /salute sirQuote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
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07-20-2019, 05:36 AMKlb600This exactly. Its a trend here whenever the hardcore crowd ask for a little more or god forbid anyone suggests anything that deviates from the formula in any way, the hivemind of this forum is quick too come in and shut you down.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
Its interesting because if you read the comments, the casual crowd go on and on about how they are never running out things to do. If that is the case then they seem set. why is it that square shouldn't allocate a little bit of resources to the Hardcore who want a bit more, if there is an abundance of content already keeping the casual crowd busy and they are quote "Never running out of things to do?" -
07-20-2019, 05:50 AMZabuzaThanks. I think a lot of the issues are stemming from the fact that an us versus them mentality is pervasive from both sides. It doesn't need to be that way. SE has enough funds to hire additional resources to give hardcore players something extra, while still pumping out casual content. They already funnel the funds to other games, and this is confirmed. No reason for them not to allocate more to their golden goose(FFXIV).Quote:
Originally Posted by MonteCristo
Good point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Klb600
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07-20-2019, 06:07 AMCatwho
I guess my problem understanding this is - when Savage comes out, and people are doing the world first race, and it takes the rest of the hardcore but non-wf race groups a full month to get through it - at which point is it enough? Even the hardcore groups only give it about a week of serious pushing to clear because after that they need to go to work, and the dance has largely been figured out and it becomes a matter of optimizing. Any more of that and it becomes content that few people have the time and resources to play.
Or do you mean more midcore endgame content, ala the 24 man raids that will drop in patch 5.1? Because honestly I can agree with that. Their attempts at including this, via Diadem and Eureka, have so far kind of fallen flat. This area definitely needs more work and maybe one of these expansion they will find something that is a challenge without requiring 16 hours of brutal gameplay to enjoy.
"End game" is such a broad concept that you need to be clear what you are actually asking for. The casuals, myself included, make our own challenges, and struggle to understand why anyone could possible get bored. -
07-20-2019, 06:11 AMElciaDeiLinusEverything available to casuals is available to more hardcore players too- even casual players who will eventually do the raid content, even if patches after release. When you have people saying '15 hours a week is super casual', then of course it's going to take a patch for them to do the same amount of content that someone who is super hardcore, which I assume means 40+ hours a week, can do in a third of a patch or less.Quote:
Originally Posted by Klb600
And yeah, casuals do have an abundance of things to do a few weeks into a new xpac.
But at least you're willing to admit that yes, putting resources into hardcore content would take from casual content. To someone who wants that content, of course that seems fine- but you need to understand that for players that feel like they get a good amount of content each xpac- enough to keep them busy, while not so much that they feel they will forever be well behind (such as how I feel about azerite grinding)- for them, how can you expect them to be fine with having resources pulled from what they like to support things they don't?
And please don't act like raiders don't do the same thing- WotLK in WoW had some of the best raids they'd done, excellent hardcore content- but it also was the birth of casual raiding, and meaningful casual endgame content. In that case it didn't even take from the raid content since ICC and Ulduar were fantastic. But, it meant casuals were getting something other than... well, rep grinding and dungeons for vastly inferior gear was pretty much the only endgame before then for casuals.
You keep complaining about a hivemind, as if players wanting something different from you makes their opinion invalid. It's like nothing has changed- you're saying casuals 'shut you down', but by degrading the opinions of anyone else to 'hivemind' you're doing exactly that yourself, shutting down different desires in the game as nothing more than mindless droning, like casuals aren't at all important.
And it isn't like there is no hardcore content- there are savages, extremes, raids, etc... and there's been clear attempts at making alternative hardcore content like BA.
And you can say that raiders don't look down on casual players- but the problem is that the way hardcores and raiders talk about casuals is very hard to interpret any other way. Even the way you constantly degrade casuals' opinions and values in the game to 'mindless hivemind' makes it abundantly obvious there's huge disdain for them. -
07-20-2019, 06:17 AMToniRomo
I haven't played much since I beat the MSQ. There's not much to do. I'm just slowly leveling up another job currently. I do not do extreme raids so the future does not look bright. The game could really use some interesting, repeatable content. Everything feels stale now.
I enjoyed Frontlines and building relics in HW. They killed that with Stormblood with those dumb vehicle PVP maps and Eureka (bleh). I am waiting to see what they do with PVP and relics in this expansion since they haven't really said anything...
Dev team is probably happy though. They have a lot of people like me I imagine who pay each month even if we don't log in a ton. It's cheap. Then there's the savage raiders. And then the horde of people who are happy to stand around town as cat people and emote at each other all day. -
07-20-2019, 06:20 AMMonteCristo
Look up dynamis sea or sky...like casual activities (ex. gold saucer) there was depth and alot of replay-ability with open world fights, huge god fights, and meaningful gear that kept you coming back as opposed to these one shot fights aka savage and ex trials. It gave you a REAL reason to gather your linkshell fc etc. to go do content as a group. All in all it was more to sink your teeth into
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07-20-2019, 06:25 AMNimsThen they need to stop being so self absorbed. This is an MMO with several different groups playing, not everything is going to be dedicated to every group and honestly, their self importance isn't on the hardcore playerbase. I don't really care for crafting, however if they need to take resources to work on it, that's fine. As long as everyone is given an equal bit of something.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
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07-20-2019, 06:36 AMKaylessaPVP would still be horrible. It's regarded as one of the worst PVP systems implemented in an MMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Renato
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07-20-2019, 06:40 AMKlb600Except I don't even see myself as hardcore nor did I ever claim to be, hell the way I am on and off this game, I don't even think I meet the requirement to be a Hardcore. I am just trying to look at both side as objectively as I can.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
Your arguments are completely flawed in that I can just flip it and around and say, oh but the hardcore content is available for the casuals. Casuals act like they are gated out of some content that they deem as "hardcore" because there is some form of "gate keeping" When the majority of players in this game are casuals, they can get together and tackle this content together but they just choose not too because there is some arbitrary reasoning preventing them from doing so.
For your WoW example cool, why not meet the hardcore raiders halfway and come to a suggestion that can benefit the majority? when you dismiss others with the mentality "no this is our Final Fantasy, you can take it as is or leave" That is Hivemind
This is what the previous poster meant on us vs them, so its, again I flip that around and we can go around in circles about how casual are taking a majority of resource allocation. The hardcore raiders pay a sub for this game as well, why should there suggestion hold any less weight then yours? When in fact the "casual" needs have already been met as they themselves boast about..
When someone politely offers some suggestion for diverging content and is meet with snarky responses from the majority of the forum "go to WoW or FFXI" or just outright ignore the crux of the topic and divert him too "Muh glamour, housing and mounts" when they know full well what he is alluding too then that is hivemind. -
07-20-2019, 06:43 AMMinerva-Redwater
Quality > Quantity friend
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07-20-2019, 06:46 AMForever_LearningYou have every right to ask for raids.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zabuza
You asked me if this thread is anti-raiding, no, it’s against the notion that only raiding counts as end-game.
The thread title is lack of end game content, not lack of raids.
Feel free to create a new thread saying you want more raid bosses. -
07-20-2019, 06:49 AMjameseoakesThat's because the more casual players represent most of the games player base, of coarse the lions share of the games resource goes to them, savage clear rates are not that high.Quote:
Originally Posted by Klb600
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07-20-2019, 06:53 AMListrella
the expansion just launched, they'll be plently more endgame content in upcoming patches, if you get bored, why don't you take a break and play something else and come back at 5.1?
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07-20-2019, 06:58 AMElciaDeiLinusAgain, whether you call them self absorbed, hivemind- or whatever else. You're demeaning them for wanting almost literally the same thing- more content that appeals to themselves.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nims
Also... self importance? I don't know an MMO out there were the hardcore raiders don't think they're the most important piece of the playerbase, that don't think they're entitled to a much larger share of development, and much higher quality content with much greater rewards than everyone else.
I also see a lot of new raids, trials- savages, extremes, etc... on a fairly regular basis, always with unique mechanics, making them unique content. It seems that they already are giving a lot of development time to endgame. I don't know if it's enough or too much, I really don't- but I think comparatively, it's more than what's given each patch, in terms of unique content (rather than rewards/recipes) to crafters, gold saucer, pvp, hunts/fates/world content- and is really only outdone by the story content which I think is the central content of the game, and is content for casuals and hardcores. -
07-20-2019, 07:22 AMRufalus
Hello. First time seeing this massive thread (o.o) Personally I'm happy enough about leveling other jobs... However I do think that it's time for the endgame formula to change. Even if something is very good and successful, repeating it for too long will begin to have less and less impact. The formula is almost identical to the last two expansions: two trials to farm for mounts again, four raid bosses, weekly tomes to cap and almost certainly the same alternating pattern of alliance and normal raids on odd and even patch numbers.
I'm pleased that so many people think ShB is the best expansion ever but that is mostly to do with the quality of the writing and the way they withheld the ascian bombshell information until this year, not the unchanging grind activity formula. Thus far innovation and experimentation has been reserved for transient side content while the core content remains the same every year. The ingredients they pour into the mould is of an ever increasing quality and they should be proud of that, but it's filling the same shapes, the same cookie cutter. The linear dungeons with 3 segments, 3 bosses. The alliance raids with 4 bosses, armor rewards, no weapons or accessories. They are adept at making them, they keep getting prettier, but it's a predictable pattern we've seen for many years now, both content and reward design.
Eventually there has to be a decline when people begin to show disinterest in the familiar and move onto the next game which offers a paradigm shift in design philosophy. For FF XIV's next expansion I wish for the experimentation they deliver in side content to permeate into the core content and shake up the very foundation. Even the field zones should offer a new kind of experience. Dungeons don't all need to be straight lines with exactly 3 bosses. Highest item level gear doesn't need to be limited to only tomestone and raid. Every pattern that exists deserves some consideration and reimagining to offer something that feels fresh and suprising. But thank you for everything you've given us so far, it's been an amazing journey. -
07-20-2019, 07:28 AMTint
Okay, lets compare the endgame battle content of Stormblood...
Harcore players got 12 savage raidturns, 2 ultimate raids and 7 extreme primals in SB. All with unique rewards. On top of that we have the difficult floors of deep dungeon and Baldesions Arsenal.
Casuals got 10 Expert Dungeons, 12 normal raidturns, 3 24-man-raids and 4 Eureka maps with unique rewards (lots of them actually).
And yeah, some primals with 0 replay ability...
Casuals actually lost 2 Dungeons and basically the whole deep dungeon compared to HW, so hardcore players can have ultimate raids and reach the harder floors in deep dungeon faster.
Shall we look into PvP content too? Well, better not I guess...
Actually I am not even mad about the loss of 2 dungeons, they are boring and serve no real purpose anymore without the old style relic tomestone grind... Wich also means they are questionable in their position as "endgame content". But well, expert roulette once a day does count I think.
My conclusion: Please increase the replay ability of casual content! Why do hardcore players get all the shinys? There is nothing to do besides expert roulette once a day and getting the weapon token from the 8 man / the upgrade token from the 24 man raid. The only real endgame content is the relic grind and that's simply not enough to keep us casuals busy! -
07-20-2019, 07:54 AMCorbinDallasIf you have half a brain then you can easily do all of the extremes and at minimum the first 2 Savage floors of each tier. They're roughly of the same difficulty, just grow a pair and dive in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tint
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07-20-2019, 08:10 AMNimsFalse, I'm demeaning them because if they think that just because they don't want something means no one should get it, that's disgusting. Again, in mmos resources and or time will always be taken from one thing to implement something new and will cycle through like this (depending on the size of the team).Quote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
Savages and Extremes are basically all the hardcore group has and it takes next to no time to down to them. People have asked for a higher difficulty, only for selfish people to shoot it down because they don't have time or the skill to do it. -
07-20-2019, 08:36 AMMitracia
I mean it's been a problem ever since Heavensward, and now it surfaces?
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07-20-2019, 08:51 AMElciaDeiLinusReally? I must have missed the post where people were saying to remove savages/extremes. Look, if it's selfish for casuals to want to not lose content in order to appease a group that I think this thread has proven beyond a doubt hates them- then it's doubly so for hardcores to want more and more development time at the expense of everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nims
You call people disgusting and selfish, hivemind- mock their skill, look down on their play time even though what most people consider 'casual' play in an mmo would be considered fairly hardcore dedication with any other hobby.
Savages and extremes aren't all HC players have, anymore than Gold Saucer is all mini game players have- it's perhaps all they choose to take part in, but if we were to look at the amount of time people spend in extremes/savages to gold saucer, or crafting, or whatever else to the amount of time spent developing new content each patch- I would imagine far less player time is spent on the former, while far more dev time is spent on the former.
Doesn't that make you the selfish one for wanting more content than is already given- when there's several other larger niches in the game that get less? Why have raiders always felt they deserve to have far more of the dev's time than any other part of the game, even parts with far more players doing it?
But even so, despite the insults and to use your term 'disgusting' way raiders look down on casuals- I don't think there's anything wrong with you wanting more content at the expense of other players, there's nothing wrong with asking for it and for defending it. But if you want to convince the majority to not view you as elites that consider all non-elites to be garbage-
"If you have half a brain then you can easily do all of the extremes and at minimum the first 2 Savage floors of each tier. They're roughly of the same difficulty, just grow a pair and dive in."
-Maybe stop talking about them in ways like this. -
07-20-2019, 08:54 AMNoodle_TrinidadHeavensward will always have the benefit of being the first Expansion that had a increase of quality at the cost of quantity, which isn't bad per say, but repeating the cycle 3 times wears thin on players especially when SE claims player growth with each expansion. At one point you must come to question where the increase of revenue is going given the game has essentially been rehashing Heavensward for 3 expansions now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitracia
One of the valid criticisms that WoW gets its is need to reinvent the wheel with each Expansion and in turn fuels the notion of how XIV is great because it doesn't do that but I'd argue that XIV suffers the exact opposite in which they let things stagnant and conform to something safe rather than build upon things. We're essentially hitting a variation of what led to 1.0, overconfidence and the notion that their static design is the best. The benefit XIV has at the time being is Ishikawa and Soken providing great atmosphere with their story and music but at some point that will give out.
As for the lack of endgame content honestly this is an issue with having a foundation based on modern WoW and keeping to a strict iLvl treadmill in which stats offer no real depth to ones playstyle. You would have to lift that system from the ground up to justify a myriad of content that requires a multitude of armor choices and fluid rotations. At this point what real character progression can be offered that will shake up the "Do I wear the Tomestone or Savage Gear in regards to <x>'s stat weights?" -
07-20-2019, 09:12 AMNimsQuote:
Originally Posted by ElciaDeiLinus
This is what I'm talking about. There's a ton of things in this game that I don't like but other people do, I still support it because at the end of the day not everything is about me and people with my playstyle. Which is something "casuals" need to understand as well, not everything is about you.Quote:
how can you expect them to be fine with having resources pulled from what they like to support things they don't?
I'm also not calling people disgusting based off playstyle or play skill, not sure why you're trying to push that narrative. I'm calling people disgusting that thinks it's ok to block something simply because it's not something they would play/do. That goes for literally anyone in any play group.
For starters, I didn't say that, secondly why do you want people to be nice here when you're pretty much saying it's ok that raiders don't get anything.Quote:
Maybe stop talking about them in ways like this.
Not sure where you're getting this from. Things were fine with Coil as it was an actual raid, casuals said they wanted to see the story but didn't want to actually do the raid. Hence story mode raids, then casuals still complained and now we have the arena boss fights that we have now.Quote:
Why have raiders always felt they deserve to have far more of the dev's time than any other part of the game, even parts with far more players doing it?
Raiders have asked for harder fights, casual community tells them no.
So now they're asking for more fights or more tiers but I guess the casual community is going to say no to that too?
Anything =/= enough which is what people are asking for. Either more fights or harder fights where it lasts a bit longer.Quote:
Originally Posted by jameseoakes
Edit: I miss read what you're talking about, I get that raiders do get things, however how that other poster is coming off is as if raiders shouldn't get anything at all or even less than what's offered now. -
07-20-2019, 09:17 AMjameseoakesHigh end raiders are about to get a fresh set of content in a week, the game does do regular updates for the higher end players, you can't push the idea that raiders don't get anything. They might not get as much as you like but the idea you don't get anything just isn't true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nims
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07-20-2019, 09:18 AMEnjudenHardcore players get all the shinies because casual players have to be coddled. I'm sorry, but that is the truth. There is no desire for casual players to learn anything about their class, and are constantly behind by at LEAST two major patches, even going back to old expansion content. Until that changes, or SE decides to say 'too bad' when it comes to players who refuse to learn complaining that content is too hard, I doubt anything will change, for both casual and hardcore. You have to force casual players to learn if you want to break this cycle, which is a monumental task that I know people still try to do. On top of this, saying that hardcore get all the shinies is not only objectively wrong, but absurd.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tint
On top of this, hardcore players have 14 fights. That's it. Casuals are able to do EX primals, if they are willing to learn and still be casual. You want replayability? You want more content? Learn to play. -
07-20-2019, 09:22 AMZabuzaQuote:
Originally Posted by jameseoakes
Ahh, the fresh content that consists of two primals I've fought multiple times before.
The fresh content that will be finished within 2 months, at which point 4 months will just be me unsubbing. For world first contenders, I bet the shelf life is a couple weeks at best. Meanwhile casuals have basically neverending content to do. Endless jobs/crafts to level. Countless achievements and a great number of glamour options.