Can't make a full premade for Crystal Tower...

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Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

Because they'd rather give it to you now, and fix it so that you can have more people, rather than tell you to wait another 6 months for it to come out in the next patch. yay!

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Except they knew they were making this 24 man content over 2 years ago. One would expect party creation systems to be working properly over that amount of time in development. Not to mention this patch has already been delayed by 30% of a patch 2.5-3 month cycle.

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

I beg to differ. At launch there was incessant crying over the earliest PT content being at level 15, starting city being tied to starting class, and character creation being locked due to servers being full. All of this under the banner of "I can't play with my friends."

And lo, it did not come to pass.

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That's early game though. This is end game. They're very different. That wouldn't deter people's subs, but if the journey at the end cannot be attempted with friends, then that will. Also the game has lost a lot of subs between launch and now as evidenced by the accounts that are registered without subs. So it in fact did happen, albeit for a myriad of other reasons. My point still stands though. If you limit people from playing with eachother, they will quit.

WOW. This is HORRIBLE!!!! SQUARE?! I've been defending you for over a year on this game, and in return you just COMPLETELY KILLED THE PLANS OF 75% OF RAIDING FREE COMPANIES FOR NO REASON!!!

Why would you NOT ALLOW an FC to run Crystal Tower together?!?!?! WHAT POSSIBLE REASON IS THERE FOR THIS OTHER THAN TO DESTROY YOUR PLAYERBASE?!

I have no idea what to think at this point, this is the biggest F.U. I have ever seen at a playerbase in an MMO. This is just bad. REALLY REALLY bad.

I don't see the point in making "alliance" content if it's really just party content topped off with a smidgeon of alliance interaction, especially if you can't even premake the parties you're going in with. So, you go in with an all star party, but then the other 2 parties are terrible, so you're stuck not being able to proceed until they proceed, or what? Or maybe people in those other parties decide, hey screw it, and drop. Then you're waiting for other people to match in and fill those spots? Hoo boy. I can't wait! 4 person dungeon DF is already scary, how is that going to be better when you're absolutely guaranteed 16 randoms?

I'd like to see alliance content where you actually do stuff as an alliance. The best way I've heard this game described is something like "FFXIV - Me and my 7 friends". Wouldn't it be nice if you could do stuff with other people in your FC besides like, 4 man myth runs or something? Haha. Well, too bad! NOPE!

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Originally Posted by Zenogias

WOW. This is HORRIBLE!!!! SQUARE?! I've been defending you for over a year on this game, and in return you just COMPLETELY KILLED THE PLANS OF 75% OF RAIDING FREE COMPANIES FOR NO REASON!!!

Why would you NOT ALLOW an FC to run Crystal Tower together?!?!?! WHAT POSSIBLE REASON IS THERE FOR THIS OTHER THAN TO DESTROY YOUR PLAYERBASE?!

I have no idea what to think at this point, this is the biggest F.U. I have ever seen at a playerbase in an MMO. This is just bad. REALLY REALLY bad.

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It's posts like this that are the reason I wish SE would just shut down the forums. It goes like this.

1. Devs post or say something

2. ADHD community spins it so they have something to butthurt over

3. People read the butthurt and ignore what the devs said. Butthurt expands exponentially.

4. Butthurt is accepted as fact.

Stop it. Learn the whole story before you throw a tantrum.

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

It's posts like this that are the reason I wish SE would just shut down the forums...

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It seems like you are WAY more butthurt and upset than anyone here, the main thing is they actually are upset because they wan't to enjoy the game more and see it improved and did not see it coming that they would not be able to run CT with the FC group they have set up to run together. They actually have a reason to be a little upset and express it, you on the other hand just are just a massive angry troll.

This... REALLY SE? ... Just... come on... I'm trying to have faith in you here. I love the game so far, but why are you even releasing a 24 man raid that you have to pug 2/3 of? I guess it was wrong of us to assume we could run with our free company when we first heard CT was going to be a 24 man. Shame on us for assuming you could do this right. I was actually excited about CT even though BC is giving better loot. But with 2/3 of the raid forced to be duty finder pugs this is just disgustingly terrible planing.

I don't even mind puging people. If the Duty Finder pulled people in exclusively from your own server, I wouldn't mind, because I'm helping people I'll interact with again. But why do I care about people outside of my server community, that I will never have any sort of interaction with again? Sure, they might be awesome people and lo, maybe I'll actually enjoy CT with some groups (given what I can expect from duty finder so far, this seems unlikely). But why do I care and why would I make friends with someone I'm never going to talk to again?

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Originally Posted by Zaiken

Don't see what the problem is, if you doing everything with just Friends and FC, where is the Challenge and fun in that? Like wise, if you just easily down CT after a day of released then will you be complaining of nothing to do? Party with others, make some friends and communicate. You can already que up with 3 of the 4 party already, this almost Garantee a win already.

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This is the dumbest post I've seen in this entire thread. Your idea of challenge is grouping up with random people in the duty finder because you're inevitably going to get grouped with subpar players? How about make the actual content challenging.

Excuse me while I go plant my face into my desk now.

this really annoys the hell out of me, the game should be encouraging banding together with like minded people to do content, also whats wrong with weekly lock outs, i mean wow raiding does it well, and lots of mmos have followed suit, and its a system that works, having 10-14 boss raids are epic, and some bosses may take a few nights of work to get down each, thats how you keep people doing something, you dont need every instance to be cleared in 2 hours. its fine to take like 3-4 months to finally clear the content with no gating

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Originally Posted by Joshyuchiha

"Q10: Will you be able to form your own alliances and enter Crystal Tower?

A10: In patch 2.1 you will not be able to form your own alliance. You can enter with a party of eight."

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After reading this I have completely lost interest in all 2.1 content. It looks like I'll continue to login only twice a week to get Myth tomes and run coil. The disappointment just builds up over and over with this game. I LOVE the game at its core but I'm tired of all the ridiculously flawed mechanics and lack of content for no reason. Please stop re-releasing things that were in the old game like King Moogle Mog. Nobody cares about those silly moogle items. You know why we were excited about every expansion(outside of Abyssea) in FFXI? Because we got upgrades from EVERYTHING. Including the lesser content like the Add on scenarios. If the game continues to move backwards like this it will be dead within the next year and that makes me very sad :(

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

It's posts like this that are the reason I wish SE would just shut down the forums. It goes like this.

1. Devs post or say something

2. ADHD community spins it so they have something to butthurt over

3. People read the butthurt and ignore what the devs said. Butthurt expands exponentially.

4. Butthurt is accepted as fact.

Stop it. Learn the whole story before you throw a tantrum.

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It's rather hard to spin it when they say "You can not form an alliance. You enter with a party of 8."

This is just another slap in the face to anyone trying to run a FC and plan for future content. There is zero reason to join a FC at this this point when a static LS of 8 will get the job done. I'm just gonna assume at this point that we wont ever get any content that will require more than 8 people to complete at the end game level.

Well, I find it strange people are so upset in a way just because CT was junk to begin with... but yeah, for those trying to make a FC 24man capable with intent of running CT in prep for Coils (rather than making them farm philo), big slap I suppose.

I'm extremely disappointed by this. :-\ It pretty much kills my desire to raid CT.

I'm glad I stuck with the monthly subscription. What an incredible disappointment, and such a waste of this game's potential.

My idea is that SE realized that making Crystal Tower a 24 man FC was a mistake considering the after content, Coil, is an 8 man PT. Telling a new formed FC to cut ties of their 24 man and sort them out by favoritism for Coil content is silly. This new system of bringing 8 people in will secure that static party and help them brace up for Coil.

Please Note:

VENT/TEAMSPEAK/MUMBLE/Raidcall - Might not be accessible to these other 16 players and they might be uncooperative.

OR

This could bring the community together in someways and alliances with other FC's across servers or in your own server.

We don't know this yet so we will have to wait.

I guess what they want is for players to be more open minded and trying to bring together the community together.

In FFXI being grouped with random people was what they had to do to win. [FFXI had a strong community]

In FF14 Crystal Towers, players will experience the everyday life of FFXI grouping and they will either hate or love it.

I find it weird that some people are ok with this? Have you not played very long with friends with this? I always felt bad that not everyone could join in events because of it being 4-8 man in the linkshell.

The only reason I can see Crystal Tower being 8-man party then the rest duty finder is to make it a pseudo-difficulty. It would be harder to do it because of communication, not everyone use mumble, Ventrilo, etc. It's easier to recover from a mistake when someone can tell you rather than sending a message via party chat.

So because Coil is 8-man we should just make everything 8-man? What kind of thought process is that?
May as well just make the entire game 8-man and have 1,000 FCs with 8 people in each of them on all
the servers. What's the point otherwise?

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Originally Posted by Swishytail

So because Coil is 8-man we should just make everything 8-man? What kind of thought process is that?
May as well just make the entire game 8-man and have 1,000 FCs with 8 people in each of them on all
the servers. What's the point otherwise?

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If they were going to make anything 24 man content it should be AFTER coil not before and have them cut away people for it.
Edit:
It makes no sense for it to be 24 -> 8 man Pt. It should have been 8 man PT -> 24 people.

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

In FFXI being grouped with random people was what they had to do to win. [FFXI had a strong community]

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That same exact formula would not work with the communities of today.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

That same exact formula would not work with the communities of today.

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And why not? This game was brought together by many strong MMO communities. Believe it or not. If your going to sit there and say this game is going to hell because you cannot grasp the existence of other MMO players being competent then your logic is nothing. I did a Titan duty finder the other day and we managed to pull it together and win. Half of these players weren't even geared. It blew my mind, maybe crystal towers will blow yours.

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

And why not? This game was brought together by many strong MMO communities. Believe it or not. If your going to sit there and say this game is going to hell because you cannot grasp the existence of other MMO players being competent then your logic is nothing. I did a Titan duty finder the other day and we managed to pull it together and win. Half of these players weren't even geared. It blew my mind, maybe crystal towers will blow yours.

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Well, your biggest problem is that many of the players playing FFXIV are not XI players, and quite a few of them never had any desire to play XI. Yet you're pitching this like somehow XI is the be-all, end-all of games. The truth is, it's not. FFXIV has already surpassed XI's peak numbers, and XI's peak numbers were never anywhere near the numbers in other MMOs like Everquest, World of Warcraft, Star Wars, or Rift. Many of the players playing XIV are from those MMOs, and have no desire to play a game like XI. After all, if we wanted to play XI, we'd be playing XI...right? Right.

Also, lol, you couldn't pay me to DF Titan HM. Totally not worth my time.

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Originally Posted by Joshyuchiha

"Q10: Will you be able to form your own alliances and enter Crystal Tower?

A10: In patch 2.1 you will not be able to form your own alliance. You can enter with a party of eight."

Dumbest thing ever. I do not want to be forced to use the duty finder to find the other 16 people. Why in the hell wouldn't you be able to enter with your own pre-made group of 24 (or alliance of 3 8-man parties). After hearing this I'm considerably less enthusiastic about Crystal Tower since now you'll have to deal with the nonsense of random people in Duty Finder......

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There really is no excuse for this. The fact that you can't do Duty Roulette with friends is just as outrageous.

It doesn't matter that they're planning to fix it later. There is no excuse for content being released in this state after 3 and a half months.

Can't make a full premade for Crystal Tower RIGHT OFF THE BAT. They'll add it later

holy shit people complaining about everything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

If they were going to make anything 24 man content it should be AFTER coil not before and have them cut away people for it.
Edit:
It makes no sense for it to be 24 -> 8 man Pt. It should have been 8 man PT -> 24 people.

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I understand what you're saying, but eventually it's going to loop around either way.

2.2 = more coil turns = 8 man.
2.3 = more CT floors = 24 man.

So on so forth. So regardless of how it's done, there is going to be both 24 and 8 overlapping each other.
Which is why I don't understand why we are staying limited at 8. From what I understand they are making
24-man alliances possible in the future, which would be great. Right now some people think it sucks, including
myself, which is fine.

A lot of people have small FCs that are fine with it, some have 50-100 members that were really looking forward
to being able to FC raid with 24 people. It's just one of "those" topics.

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

snip.

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You'd be surprised how many people pay for a titan win, and that's a waste of time. Also I did not mean FF11 as the be it all, high and mighty. I played FF11 for a good long time, followed by SW/WoW/Aion/Rift etc. I did not mean anything but simply. Everyday there's numerous of people getting things done and progressing. To think Crystal Towers won't bring any of these people in is silly. If CT offers story - I promise you people will go back from Coil to see it. Or just to say they did it. I know I will be. ^^

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

And why not? This game was brought together by many strong MMO communities. Believe it or not. If your going to sit there and say this game is going to hell because you cannot grasp the existence of other MMO players being competent then your logic is nothing. I did a Titan duty finder the other day and we managed to pull it together and win. Half of these players weren't even geared. It blew my mind, maybe crystal towers will blow yours.

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Okay, firstly, stop with the ad hominem. Secondly, I was not referring to skill or anything of that nature. I was referring to how a community functions, with respect, and courtesy towards one another as players. That worked in FFXI because of that particular era. Now-a-days, that kind of behavior is a lot less common.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

Okay, firstly, stop with the ad hominem. Secondly, I was not referring to skill or anything of that nature. I was referring to how a community functions, with respect, and courtesy towards one another as players. That worked in FFXI because of that particular era. Now-a-days, that kind of behavior is a lot less common.

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Well I'm sorry you see it that way. My perspectives of this game has been a breath of fresh air. In WoW when DF came out people out right slammed the person down and would refuse to do anything until that person left. In 14 for me people have not been anything like that - at least the server I'm on - people will try to help you out. I guess it's all about the people you run into.

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Originally Posted by Jean

There really is no excuse for this. The fact that you can't do Duty Roulette with friends is just as outrageous.

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I'm not sure why they *should* make Duty Roulette work with friends. It's a great tool to provide incentive to play and help out random strangers. You don't *NEED* to do the duty roulette to get your weekly myth cap. You can still SR WP with your friends if you like that route. But this gets you helping out others that may need help finding groups for story battles or even just normal dungeon runs.

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

I'm not sure why they *should* make Duty Roulette work with friends. It's a great tool to provide incentive to play and help out random strangers. You don't *NEED* to do the duty roulette to get your weekly myth cap. You can still SR WP with your friends if you like that route. But this gets you helping out others that may need help finding groups for story battles or even just normal dungeon runs.

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What is wrong with having the option?

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Originally Posted by Mirakumi

You'd be surprised how many people pay for a titan win, and that's a waste of time.

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Paying to be carried through Titan for a shiny is not the same as inflicting the Duty Finder on yourself in any capacity.

Quote:

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Also I did not mean FF11 as the be it all, high and mighty. I played FF11 for a good long time, followed by SW/WoW/Aion/Rift etc. I did not mean anything but simply. Everyday there's numerous of people getting things done and progressing. To think Crystal Towers won't bring any of these people in is silly. If CT offers story - I promise you people will go back from Coil to see it. Or just to say they did it. I know I will be. ^^

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You're missing the point. I don't want to queue with 16 other strangers. I wanted to do this dungeon with friends. Now I can't do that.

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Originally Posted by LiadansWhisper

Paying to be carried through Titan for a shiny is not the same as inflicting the Duty Finder on yourself in any capacity.


I wanted to do this dungeon with friends. Now I can't do that.

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Yes - I know - I want the same. I wanted the same. This morning I was so pissy fit over the changes. My FC over the last week has been recruiting for CT. How are we supposed to tell those people, oh looks like were going to have to split! Yet when you look at it. It's coming in the future. Just have to wait a bit more. I HATE saying that. But its how it is, right now.

And people do tell me all the time in my FC, why do you bother going back to Duty finder with random people / Rather than with people for an instant win ?
I guess because I just think of it as fun. I like to go back and experience it. It helps me be more aware of the situation. I like teaching people. It's so frustrating sometimes, but winning makes it worth it. Idk I'm weird. ;p lol

This is friggin lame.

Basically "Screw all your friends" is what I'm hearing.

It SHOULD work like this:

You can't queue unless you have a full party of 8 (correct jobs) OR a full alliance.

It sounds like a good idea in theory, and I hope for the best, but if people have a lot of friends in this game and want to play with them instead, then you should let them regardless of the content. If I had any RL friends who play this game, or some cool people I've met on my server, then I sure would prefer to play with those people over people i don't know, but again I'm hoping for the best here.

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Originally Posted by Ispen

Vote to kick is coming in 2.1 learn to read please. It's abit silly their doing this, i get they want to promote DF but they shouldn't do it at the expense of FCs that wanna run 24 man groups.

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I'm just curious how it going to work. It obviously looks like it can't be abuse like in games like WoW, but I'm still curious.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

What is wrong with having the option?

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Because you can do any of those dungeons/battles in the Duty Roulette with your friends if you want to. You just don't get the bonuses because you premade your party instead of playing with all randoms.

Ideally playing with friends should allow you to work together, clear the dungeons and earn the rewards faster than you would have by playing with randoms so it's balanced in that regard.

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

Because you can do any of those dungeons/battles in the Duty Roulette with your friends if you want to. You just don't get the bonuses because you premade your party instead of playing with all randoms.

Ideally playing with friends should allow you to work together, clear the dungeons and earn the rewards faster than you would have by playing with randoms so it's balanced in that regard.

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Q36: Can you use with the Duty Roulette with a party of 2-3 people?

A36: This is a feature that can currently only be used solo. We will be updating this in the future to support parties with multiple people.

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The developers see no issue with having the option. They're just failing to implement it in 2.1 with no given reason.

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Originally Posted by Taika

What I expected CT to be was content all our FC members would do. Something that wouldn't require the gear and skill and commitment level Coil does and something that would bring both Coil runners and fresh relic (or even pre-relic) members together. A FC event these members could take part in. These people have already waited for a long time to have any casual endgame raiding content they could do with the FC. Now they get the message they'll be waiting for months more.

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^This, right here. It's beyond disappointing with this game. :\

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

I'm not sure why they *should* make Duty Roulette work with friends. It's a great tool to provide incentive to play and help out random strangers. You don't *NEED* to do the duty roulette to get your weekly myth cap. You can still SR WP with your friends if you like that route. But this gets you helping out others that may need help finding groups for story battles or even just normal dungeon runs.

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So what if you don't need it? Why should one option of content be blocked off from you if you want to play with friends? It shouldn't. This is an MMO. We should not be forced to solo queue for content in an MMO. And yes, the duty roulette is in and of itself content, as it is a new means of obtaining end game tokens. You don't get tokens by doing guildhests or lower level dungeons with your friends, therefore content is blocked from us.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

This is friggin lame.

Basically "Screw all your friends" is what I'm hearing.

It SHOULD work like this:

You can't queue unless you have a full party of 8 (correct jobs) OR a full alliance.

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Its suppose to be the casual dungeon they already said this. I don't know why people keep expecting some sort of hardcore must get 24 people to run this. There are a lot of people who aren't in big linkshells that will solo queue for this so it makes no sense to have a minimim requirement to queue for casual endgame content. There is no lockout on this so you can do it as many times as you want.

Wait, they'll implement duty roulette with friends? Wut? To me this sounds like the perfect method to, with some smart programming (Whoops, we're talking SE here) to have high lvls do a daily run in a low lvl dungeon that, at that time, needs people. What the hell is the point when 3/4 spots in said dungeon are taken by high lvls doing the dungeon roulette lol.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Its suppose to be the casual dungeon they already said this. I don't know why people keep expecting some sort of hardcore must get 24 people to run this. There are a lot of people who aren't in big linkshells that will solo queue for this so it makes no sense to have a minimim requirement to queue for casual endgame content. There is no lockout on this so you can do it as many times as you want.

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It's also supposed to be the big 24 man alliance content. So much for that part huh. It's not must get, it's simply that a lot of FCs had this in mind when they were planning and building and now they suddenly get to hear that part got scratched for now.