SP nerfed. We were lied to.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Sup, Killing one of the only two or three mob families that currently give above 200 sp?

Also, and I'm just assuming you're talking about your 21 CON... Things go way, WAY, downhill the higher you get.

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Aldgoats, leve mobs, and crabs from what we actually tried. There's probably more. And I did it on my R25 THM proR21LNC

EDIT: Oh and the new beastcamp mobs too :D

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Wrong.

Just wrong.

Also, Yes dungeons are nice. It was a sarcastic response to the guy saying he wants leveling to be the difficult part of the game.

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I never said i wanted leveling to be the most changeling aspect of the game... but cool story bro trying to put words in my mouth... however i do not want progress and leveling handed to me. If you like 0 grinding go play pvp in guild wars, this is a FF where half the fun in the game is the progress you make through stories and leveling.

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Originally Posted by Neko_Yanagi

Going to say this, then drop it because I hate getting involved in these pathetic debates with idiots. Yoshi-P provided SEVERAL NEW WAYS to get sp. He had to decrease it in leves and behests to make up for the additional ways of receiving sp. Sounds like you can use some help identifying the different ways you can receive sp now, so allow me to enlighten you.

Guild Tasks (5k a day if you can hit all the guilds, team up with friends or LS mates and share teleports)
Leves (grouping up with friends or LS mates can help you get the most outta Leves, but solo isn't bad either)
Behests (Try areas that aren't used very often, there is a bonus for that)
Dungeons
Grinding (the new beastmen camps are fun to grind at, and more mobs added just about everywhere)
Side Quests (Very nice bonuses for these now)

There may be even more, but this is what I could think of off the top of my head. I personally have used all of these methods, some I prefer over other but I like having the options. And this is just for the Battle Classes, take a break and do some gathering (gathering leves are AWESOME now). Relax and enjoy the game. And if you're stressing over the changes, maybe this game isn't for you.... Because honestly we don't need players that only complain and are too lazy or impatient to try to improve the way they play.

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I already addressed every one of those ways to get SP in the original message. SP gain is extremely slower now. That's all there is to it.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

I already addressed every one of those ways to get SP in the original message. SP gain is extremely slower now. That's all there is to it.

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If its as slow as you say, show some verifiable proof. I believe the expression is "Put up or Shut Up" Others have provided proof that SP is just fine and my personal experience is the exact opposite of yours. So either your doin' it wrong, or you're just lying/trolling.

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Originally Posted by Bled

I never said i wanted leveling to be the most changeling aspect of the game... but cool story bro trying to put words in my mouth... however i do not want progress and leveling handed to me. If you like 0 grinding go play pvp in guild wars, this is a FF where half the fun in the game is the progress you make through stories and leveling.

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Sorry brah but killing 100,000 mobs or more at 100-140xp each is not my idea of fun. The price paid is the time spent, and that time spent should not make me want to tear my hair out, as it is a GAME after all.

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Originally Posted by Neko_Yanagi

Going to say this, then drop it because I hate getting involved in these pathetic debates with trolls. Yoshi-P provided SEVERAL NEW WAYS to get sp. He had to decrease it in leves and behests to make up for the additional ways of receiving sp. Sounds like you can use some help identifying the different ways you can receive sp now, so allow me to enlighten you.

Guild Tasks (5k a day if you can hit all the guilds, team up with friends or LS mates and share teleports)
Leves (grouping up with friends or LS mates can help you get the most outta Leves, but solo isn't bad either)
Behests (Try areas that aren't used very often, there is a bonus for that)
Dungeons
Grinding (the new beastmen camps are fun to grind at, and more mobs added just about everywhere)
Side Quests (Very nice bonuses for these now)

There may be even more, but this is what I could think of off the top of my head. I personally have used all of these methods, some I prefer over other but I like having the options. And this is just for the Battle Classes, take a break and do some gathering (gathering leves are AWESOME now). Relax and enjoy the game. And if you're stressing over the changes, maybe this game isn't for you.... Because honestly we don't need players that only complain and are too lazy or impatient to try to improve the way they play.

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Must be troll.

Grinding = nerfed, that was covered already several times by several different people.

Behest = nerfed to hell, covered by several people several times.

Leves = nerfed to hell, also covered by several people several times.

Guild tasks = done for points/coins/tokens/items, not for xp, as you could get better xp/time via the terrible grinding.

Side Quests = Same as above.

Dungeons are okay, and the only viable option you listed sadly.

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Aldgoats, leve mobs, and crabs from what we actually tried. There's probably more. And I did it on my R25 THM proR21LNC

EDIT: Oh and the new beastcamp mobs too :D

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Leve mobs do not count as with guardians favor (even the new broken one) you get some bonus to SP afaik. And honestly only being able to do 8 every 1.5 days... that is NOT a viable form of xp. It's moreso done for the guild marks and faction credits.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Sorry brah but killing 100,000 mobs or more at 100-140xp each is not my idea of fun. The price paid is the time spent, and that time spent should not make me want to tear my hair out, as it is a GAME after all.

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As much as i hate these sayings they are so perfectly applicable

"Your doing it wrong"

Myself and many other people are not having SP gains that low so *shrug* sucks to be you.

"Take a Break if your getting that stressed out"

like you said this is a game if you cant find the fun in it and your "pulling your hair out" then take a break.

"don't let the door hit you on the way out"

such a pointless "troll saying" but really, with everything you say and your attitude we don't need to you be a part of this community.

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Originally Posted by AarosLunos

If its as slow as you say, show some verifiable proof. I believe the expression is "Put up or Shut Up" Others have provided proof that SP is just fine and my personal experience is the exact opposite of yours. So either your doin' it wrong, or you're just lying/trolling.

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I don't know if you are joking. The only "proof" has been a couple of guys who got a good amount of SP from leves which I don't know if you've heard can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Also, way to ignore all the other posters in this thread and in the forum saying the exact same thing. Want proof? Go do behest, go kill mobs 10 ranks above you then come and tell me you get the same SP as pre-patch. It's very easy to say 1.18 is awesome when you have a R50 ranked up pre-patch. The rest of us will take about 3 times as long if not more to get there.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

I already addressed every one of those ways to get SP in the original message. SP gain is extremely slower now. That's all there is to it.

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You addressed them by saying "it's less" when really, in actuality, it's not by very much. My LS just ran our first leve linking since patch. We got 40k-50k for the 2 camps. we normally get about 60-70k but it was so much faster than usual, so we did a dungeon afterwards. after that, we got our 60-70k for the night, and it was A LOT more fun.

And when it comes to having to go places to gain sp in quests and such, it's better when you have friends to share the ride with. That seems to be your biggest problem right there. I bet you try to do everything solo. You totally can, but it isn't as fun.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Leve mobs do not count as with guardians favor (even the new broken one) you get some bonus to SP afaik. And honestly only being able to do 8 every 1.5 days... that is NOT a viable form of xp. It's moreso done for the guild marks and faction credits.

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Nope, Guardian's Favor doesn't do much.

And you can do 16 every 36 hour period.

Clearly you are doing something very wrong here.

EDIT: Oh and I was doing a R20 leve for the 200+ SP as a R25 THM :P

I wonder how many people Kensei needs to tell him that he's dead wrong before he understands that :D

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Originally Posted by Kensei

It's very easy to say 1.18 is awesome when you have a R50 ranked up pre-patch. The rest of us will take about 3 times as long if not more to get there.

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You know that most of us don't stop at the first or second 50 right?

If any, you have it easy, because you didn't already do most of the story/side quests getting nothing from them.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

It's very easy to say 1.18 is awesome when you have a R50 ranked up pre-patch

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Ah, so that is what this is about. lol

And you do realize they have other ways to SP now. Hell, even the side quests give good SP as rewards now.

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Originally Posted by Neko_Yanagi

You addressed them by saying "it's less" when really, in actuality, it's not by very much. My LS just ran our first leve linking since patch. We got 40k-50k for the 2 camps. we normally get about 60-70k but it was so much faster than usual, so we did a dungeon afterwards. after that, we got our 60-70k for the night, and it was A LOT more fun.

And when it comes to having to go places to gain sp in quests and such, it's better when you have friends to share the ride with. That seems to be your biggest problem right there. I bet you try to do everything solo. You totally can, but it isn't as fun.

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Ranks/Camp/Timeframe?

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Nope, Guardian's Favor doesn't do much.

And you can do 16 every 36 hour period.

Clearly you are doing something very wrong here.

EDIT: Oh and I was doing a R20 leve for the 200+ SP as a R25 THM :P

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Like I said, I wasnt sure. It's still not impressive.

And... 16? You're counting crafting leves I'm assuming? Which do not benefit your main class at all... Please tell me I'm misunderstanding something there and that's not what you're actually talking about.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

I don't know if you are joking. The only "proof" has been a couple of guys who got a good amount of SP from leves which I don't know if you've heard can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Also, way to ignore all the other posters in this thread and in the forum saying the exact same thing. Want proof? Go do behest, go kill mobs 10 ranks above you then come and tell me you get the same SP as pre-patch. It's very easy to say 1.18 is awesome when you have a R50 ranked up pre-patch. The rest of us will take about 3 times as long if not more to get there.

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LOL THIS IS HILARIOUS. Stop insinuating that just because I have an R50 that I don't have other classes I care about either. But I guess its easier to stereotype anyone with more experience in the game as being elitist.

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Originally Posted by Neko_Yanagi

You addressed them by saying "it's less" when really, in actuality, it's not by very much. My LS just ran our first leve linking since patch. We got 40k-50k for the 2 camps. we normally get about 60-70k but it was so much faster than usual, so we did a dungeon afterwards. after that, we got our 60-70k for the night, and it was A LOT more fun.

And when it comes to having to go places to gain sp in quests and such, it's better when you have friends to share the ride with. That seems to be your biggest problem right there. I bet you try to do everything solo. You totally can, but it isn't as fun.

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You are missing the point altogether. I gave specific numbers in several posts, including the first one. Behest was the main way to rank up pre-patch, it is complete trash now. Your leve numbers are way exaggerated and again stop talking about leves, forget leves, they are only 8 every 36 hours, it's not a sustainable and constant source of SP how many times do I have to say it.

I never solo anything except quests and a friend being with me doesn't magically increase SP/hour rate. I don't think you realize how long it will take to rank up to 50 now. Obviously you have a few R50s already ranked up pre patch. Very easy to be pleased with the patch when you are in that position.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Like I said, I wasnt sure. It's still not impressive.

And... 16? You're counting crafting leves I'm assuming? Which do not benefit your main class at all... Please tell me I'm misunderstanding something there and that's not what you're actually talking about.

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You can do 8 from one city-state, then go to another and get 8 more.

Only problem is you only have enough for 8 from each city-state when you can get R30 leves (there's 2 R30 camps with 3 leves each, so 6 camps with 3 leves = 18 leves to do).

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Originally Posted by AarosLunos

LOL THIS IS HILARIOUS. Stop insinuating that just because I have an R50 that I don't have other classes I care about either. But I guess its easier to stereotype anyone with more experience in the game as being elitist.

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Ok, let's forget about your R50. Now counter everything else I said.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

Ranks/Camp/Timeframe?

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Ranks 43-49 5 stars all leves (8 person pt)
Camp Broken Water and Halatali
2 1/2 hr at the camp (normally takes us up to 3 1/2 -4 hours)
R45 Dungeon afterward. I didn't go as the same job as I did for the leves, but others that did said they got 20k+ for 2 runs we did for fun (wasn't trying to complete it)

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Originally Posted by Kensei

I never solo anything except quests and a friend being with me doesn't magically increase SP/hour rate.

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SOOO OBLIVIOUS! Ok so I guess the per party member SP bonus doesn't exist now either. WOW

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

You can do 8 from one city-state, then go to another and get 8 more.

Only problem is you only have enough for 8 from each city-state when you can get R30 leves (there's 2 R30 camps with 3 leves each, so 6 camps with 3 leves = 18 leves to do).

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It's still a 1.5 day cooldown on picking up new leves though no? All of my completed leve's are grey'd out and it wont let me pick any up. Timer says they'll be ready in 7 hours or so. So I'm not understanding the 16 in 36 hours thing.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

You are missing the point altogether. I gave specific numbers in several posts, including the first one. Behest was the main way to rank up pre-patch, it is complete trash now. Your leve numbers are way exaggerated and again stop talking about leves, forget leves, they are only 8 every 36 hours, it's not a sustainable and constant source of SP how many times do I have to say it.

I never solo anything except quests and a friend being with me doesn't magically increase SP/hour rate. I don't think you realize how long it will take to rank up to 50 now. Obviously you have a few R50s already ranked up pre patch. Very easy to be pleased with the patch when you are in that position.

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lets use that logic then, when i was solo grinding i was making 200-300SP a kill took about 2 min to get form one kill to another, so that roughly 9000 an hour at best then, then there is the most SP i have received from a old behest at that same level which is about 5000. now back in the day with behest at a 30 min timer that's 10000SP an hour and now with random solo grinding i make 9000SP an hour, see that your right there is a decrease (as minor as it is..). However lets not stop there you will eventually reach surplus with the old SP mechanic and now you have to stop essentially. Whats this now that surplus is gone i can get 9000SP an hour sustained longer!!!!! hot damn!!!!

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Originally Posted by Neko_Yanagi

Ranks 43-49 5 stars all leves (8 person pt)
Camp Broken Water and Halatali
2 1/2 hr at the camp (normally takes us up to 3 1/2 -4 hours)
R45 Dungeon afterward. I didn't go as the same job as I did for the leves, but others that did said they got 20k+ for 2 runs we did for fun (wasn't trying to complete it)

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Thank you.

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Originally Posted by MookiesPM75

It's still a 1.5 day cooldown on picking up new leves though no? All of my completed leve's are grey'd out and it wont let me pick any up. Timer says they'll be ready in 7 hours or so. So I'm not understanding the 16 in 36 hours thing.

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Yep. You can pick up 8 then wait for the next period and pick up 8 more with the trade in.

8 NEW leves, but if you fail the leves the first time, you can pick up 8 more the next day and do 16 leves in one day. Which is how leves ended up giving incredibly broken SP prior to the patch.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

I wonder how many people Kensei needs to tell him that he's dead wrong before he understands that :D



You know that most of us don't stop at the first or second 50 right?

If any, you have it easy, because you didn't already do most of the story/side quests getting nothing from them.

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Nobody has proved me wrong. All they can say is "oh but I got 5k SP that one time in that leve! it's the same!". Meaning they don't understand how much slower ranking up is now. I am well aware that most people rank up multiple classes but with a R50 you can already access all the content in the game. So you have all the time in the world to rank the others little by little and can just use your R50 for NMs, the 45 dungeon etc. It's a much more comfortable position.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Nobody has proved me wrong. All they can say is "oh but I got 5k SP that one time in that leve! it's the same!"

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The irony, it's astounding.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Nobody has proved me wrong. All they can say is "oh but I got 5k SP that one time in that leve! it's the same!". Meaning they don't understand how much slower ranking up is now. I am well aware that most people rank up multiple classes but with a R50 you can already access all the content in the game. So you have all the time in the world to rank the others little by little and can just use your R50 for NMs, the 45 dungeon etc. It's a much more comfortable position.

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Basically, you can say whatever you want, but others can't? lol

I see a lot of envy and very little reasoniong in you, young padawan.

Besides, most of us got our 50s when SP were much, much harder to get than they are now, before or after the patch.

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Originally Posted by Bled

lets use that logic then, when i was solo grinding i was making 200-300SP a kill took about 2 min to get form one kill to another, so that roughly 9000 an hour at best then, then there is the most SP i have received from a old behest at that same level which is about 5000. now back in the day with behest at a 30 min timer that's 10000SP an hour and now with random solo grinding i make 9000SP an hour, see that your right there is a decrease (as minor as it is..). However lets not stop there you will eventually reach surplus with the old SP mechanic and now you have to stop essentially. Whats this now that surplus is gone i can get 9000SP an hour sustained longer!!!!! hot damn!!!!

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Wow you guys did behests in a terrible optimal situation. My average was 9k often 11k. That means 18-22k SP per hour.

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Yep. You can pick up 8 then wait for the next period and pick up 8 more with the trade in.

8 NEW leves, but if you fail the leves the first time, you can pick up 8 more the next day and do 16 leves in one day. Which is how leves ended up giving incredibly broken SP prior to the patch.

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I hate leve failing so much. Its a horribly bad mechanic.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

"oh but I got 5k SP that one time in that leve! it's the same!"

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At first I thought maybe you were just ignorant on the new alternative SP methods that they put into 1.18; and you just haven't discovered them yet. NOW I know your just an official troll.

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Originally Posted by AarosLunos

I hate leve failing so much. Its a horribly bad mechanic.

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Thank goodness this patch made it worthless to do that anymore.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Basically, you can say whatever you want, but others can't? lol

I see a lot of envy and very little reasoniong in you, young padawan.

Besides, most of us got our 50s when SP were much, much harder to get than they are now, before or after the patch.

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Everyone can say whatever they want. When have I said the contrary? Also, I'm not doubting that they did in fact get 5+k for those leves, it's just that everyone who uses that as their one argument doesn't understand that I could care less about leves. They can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Not a constant source of SP. The main ranking up source was behest and it's worthless now. Everything else was also reduced. Now it will take far longer than pre-patch to rank up. Yoshi said that wouldn't be the case and it was.

If you fail to comprehend that I don't know how much more simpler I can put it for you.

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Originally Posted by Pulseczar

At first I thought maybe you were just ignorant on the new alternative SP methods that they put into 1.18; and you just haven't discovered them yet. NOW I know your just an official troll.

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That is the only answer I get when I say that SP gain is terribly slower now. What do you want me to say when people can't seem to comprehend simple explanations.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Everyone can say whatever they want. When have I said the contrary? Also, I'm not doubting that they did in fact get 5+k for those leves, it's just that everyone who uses that as their one argument doesn't understand that I could care less about leves. They can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Not a constant source of SP. The main ranking up source was behest and it's worthless now. Everything else was also reduced. Now it will take far longer than pre-patch to rank up. Yoshi said that wouldn't be the case and it was.

If you fail to comprehend that I don't know how much more simpler I can put it for you.

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Main source of ranking up was leves. You must have been doing it way, way wrong.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Everyone can say whatever they want. When have I said the contrary? Also, I'm not doubting that they did in fact get 5+k for those leves, it's just that everyone who uses that as their one argument doesn't understand that I could care less about leves. They can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Not a constant source of SP. The main ranking up source was behest and it's worthless now. Everything else was also reduced. Now it will take far longer than pre-patch to rank up. Yoshi said that wouldn't be the case and it was.

If you fail to comprehend that I don't know how much more simpler I can put it for you.

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I must have missed the portion of the letter where Yoshi said "don't worry Kensei we are not going to touch your Behests"

there are alternatives, you can claim that they are more or less efficient, however you can not argue that pre 1.18 had better sustainable SP as compared to post 1.18... i know you will try but you really cant, good bye surplus.

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Main source of ranking up was leves. You must have been doing it way, way wrong.

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Ok, you officially have no idea what you are talking about. You either never made it past R25 or were playing in an unheard of server.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Ok, you officially have no idea what you are talking about. You either never made it past R25 or were playing in an unheard of server.

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If they weren't, levefailing really wouldn't be a problem.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Everyone can say whatever they want. When have I said the contrary? Also, I'm not doubting that they did in fact get 5+k for those leves, it's just that everyone who uses that as their one argument doesn't understand that I could care less about leves. They can only be done 8 times every 36 hours. Not a constant source of SP. The main ranking up source was behest and it's worthless now. Everything else was also reduced. Now it will take far longer than pre-patch to rank up. Yoshi said that wouldn't be the case and it was.

If you fail to comprehend that I don't know how much more simpler I can put it for you.

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So because ONE source of SP was reduced and it happened to be your favourite (because behest is the only one that got a real reduction), you go out on a limb drooling that Yoshida lied and all that? LOL.

Yoshida never said that Behest would remain the same.

The funny part is that you blatantly lie by telling that "everything else was reduced", when several quests that didn't give ANY SP now give quite a lot, and new ways to earn even more have been introduced.

Just lol.

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Originally Posted by Kensei

Ok, you officially have no idea what you are talking about. You either never made it past R25 or were playing in an unheard of server.

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Actually, he's completely right.

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Originally Posted by Bled

I must have missed the portion of the letter where Yoshi said "don't worry Kensei we are not going to touch your Behests"

there are alternatives, you can claim that they are more or less efficient, however you can not argue that pre 1.18 had better sustainable SP as compared to post 1.18... i know you will try but you really cant, good bye surplus.

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Ok, so you agree pre-patch was faster. That's all I am saying. Like I told you before I know I can get SP now but it will take much longer and Yoshi said ranking up wouldn't be nerfed. Slower SP gain = ranking up is nerfed. How can you not agree?