Is it fair to drop a number on a DPS when there's still no legitimate way to put in a meter? I've read multiple times that adding in a DPS meter by using a 3rd party program (like ACT) violates the ToS. If that's true then you can't fault someone for not monitoring their DPS. And if they don't monitor it, then they're at a disadvantage because they may not know they need to improve.
I think the people who are assigning these numbers should focus their efforts on convincing SE to add in a meter so that we don't have to try and figure out how to do it ourselves.
DPS who do 4k worth of damage = garbage tier
Printable View
-
05-31-2018, 01:55 AMNabril
-
05-31-2018, 02:03 AMMaeroThanks for replying. Yeah i guess it is the price to pay but i was getting rather depressed having the lowest damage out of our group, lolQuote:
Originally Posted by ern815
I think 4.5 is the highest thus far for me and we have not cleared 07S yet -
05-31-2018, 02:38 AMRLofOBFLNo no no. Do not listen to that. If you were to then why would someone take a 4.5k Ninja with a rdps gain of 500 over a SAM that did 6.5k when they can have a 6.5k NIN with 500 rdps. Ninja is a part of the Meta because it does a lot of damage and provides utility, not one or the other. To be extremely blunt, in a fight like O6s with your gear you should be doing a lowball of 5.3k minimum in a bad comp, deathless. Granted NIN imo is hard, as I play it occasionally with less than thrilling dps, but that doesn't excuse doing such low dps. I do 4.5k on my PLD with a bad comp. Practice makes perfect. There are very useful guides out there by just Googling, and dummies are abundant to hit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maero
-
05-31-2018, 02:43 AMIlanWHM emnity is probably a result of the HoT's.Quote:
Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry
Nabril SE wont implement a ingame DMG Meter because they think that the com will become toxic to low dps players. What they don't realise is that a lot of the pc players already parse and only a handfull is a jerk and they'll be that without a parser too. -
05-31-2018, 02:51 AMDaulBanThey won't, full stop. To them it's in their best interest to allow ACT to exist passively by not enforcing the rule and still keep the specter of a ToS violation over people's heads to stop naming and shaming for numbers. In lots of threads throughout the last few years arguments about how effective that strategy is, given that harassment rules still exist and an overwhelming part of the raiding community parses anyways and is open about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabril
SE is more worried about (I presume) people getting nasty in dungeons which could discourage new, particularly leveling, players. People who could quit the game over a snarky comment.
The reason why people establish seemingly arbitrary DPS thresholds for acceptability is somewhat multifaceted on its own.
- Case A
- Case B
In either respect the community itself puts acceptability levels for damage done (~2500 in creator, ~4000 in Delta, ~5000 in sigma) in order to make their fights go by smoother, and then act on people not meeting them in nonpunishable ways. -
05-31-2018, 03:33 AMCrystal_Raven
If you get 4k damage in full BiS as a DPS class, you're terrible at your job. That's not to say you're garbage tier.
The people who belong in the garbage tier are those who are terrible, think they good, and refuse to improve. Those are garbage tier. Someone who knows they are bad, those can be taught and shown how to improve. -
05-31-2018, 03:53 AMMageBlack
This is only reinforcing SE's reasons for not allowing Parsers. Good job.
-
05-31-2018, 04:50 AMkikix12An advice for the future and for all games you decide to play. For others as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by KaivaC
Never delete anything. Never throw away anything. Never give anything to others. Let it stay there even if you decide to not use it. It won't hurt nor cost you anything. If you won't use it...who cares. But if you do delete something and then want to get back to the game...you will regret it. For no reason at all. Deleting stuff to not have what to return to is never going to work. It'll just make the return, which at the point the need for that will pop up again (if it will), that much more painful. -
05-31-2018, 06:26 AMTaranTatsuuchiI aught to unlock the SSS dummies for stormblood and see how well I'm doing on my Samurai, since that's all I have gear for, and even then I'm only at i315 atm...Quote:
Originally Posted by Minako_Nightsong
A parsing program can indeed tell you those things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyro2hell3
But, not in an overlay, it would take going over the full log to show that.
Which is why you don't just look at the dps nuimber when you look up a log.
You look through the log and see why that number is what it is. -
05-31-2018, 06:46 AMPyro2hell3you'd think after playing for 3+ years I'd have adjusted to the fact this games players base is far smarter then wows and actually able to use thing correctly most of the timeQuote:
Originally Posted by TaranTatsuuchi
-
05-31-2018, 07:20 AMJojoyaSo what do you do when it isn't getting cleared even though it should be?Quote:
Originally Posted by Araxes
How do you determine where the problem lies if there's no clear mechanics failure by the group leading to the wipes?
Do you just give up and hope the next group ends up better instead of addressing what was causing the problem in the first place?
How do you know you're not the problem that needs to improve their game play so your groups will be less likely to wipe?
Unless MMO game design changes so time isn't a factor in completing an encounter, players will continue to create meters when the game doesn't provide them. People don't want their time wasted. People hate failure. And meters are the only way they have to judge why failure is happening in many cases.
Why are people so afraid of being told they need to improve? Certainly there are wrong ways and right ways to say it but if we are not meeting the standards necessary to get the job done then we either need to improve our game play or accept that we should be doing something else more suited to our skill level instead. -
05-31-2018, 07:40 AMCrystal_RavenI blame this on the whole "i'm special" mentality and snowflake behavior. Most people are happy to celebrate mediocrity rather than find ways to constantly improve. Whoever calls out their mediocrity is immediately deemed toxic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jojoya
-
05-31-2018, 08:41 AMBrill_Failure is a part of life. I often wonder how the people that can't tolerate failure in a video game handle failure in real life. Do they just pout and go home if they don't get their way? What if professional athletes acted like MMO players did when they lose?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jojoya
The problem is not meters, it's how the community uses meters. They don't consider circumstances. If top DPS are putting out 7k, the community expects everyone to put out 7k or they are considered "garbage". I was in 05S a few weeks ago and had a ghost tether. The people that got the headlights, for whatever reason, ran them to the back of the train(ghost boxes 2-4 were already gone, so there was no reason for this). I had to run to the back of the train to get rid of the ghost. If you look at a meter, I would be the bad player because my dps wasn't up to community standards.
Another thing the community does not take into account is skill ceiling. Not everyone is created equal. Not everyone can put out 7k dps. That doesn't stop the community from expecting it and kicking people out that don't put out top dps. Tell people they need to improve all you want. Not everyone is going to achieve the highest standards. Just like most NFL QB's will never be as good as Tom Brady. Circumstances. Something the community will never account for. It's easier to just say "git gud" and vote kick. -
05-31-2018, 08:48 AMBrill_It's a video game. Something some people do for fun, not to be a second job. I go skiing for fun. I don't care that I'll never be as good as an olympic skier. Not everyone cares about getting a top parse in FFlogs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crystal_Raven
-
05-31-2018, 09:06 AMUsho
Who the hell cares about someone else's damage numbers? This is a video game, you play to have fun. This isn't some kind of job or chore, and if you think it is then I think you might need to turn off the game and walk outside for air. Honestly, all these players who obsesses over facts and numbers in a video game make me question if they even have a life in real life.
Play the game, do your best, and if someone's damage is lower than yours then you don't berate them for it and you offering advice in that fashion will make you come off as a *****e. In the end, we're all players and we have our own style and way of playing the game. Accept people's differences, eat a damn snickers and stop with the elitist "I'm better than you so git gud" attitude that this generation of players seem to have.
/2 cents -
05-31-2018, 09:09 AMAwhaI hope you really did not go that far, this is a forum discussion will happen no need to take the things posted on a forum to heart.Quote:
Originally Posted by KaivaC
-
05-31-2018, 09:42 AMMoroMurasakiYeah, facts and numbers have no place in a video game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
Not like there's content that requires a certain level of performa-
Oh, wait. There is. :thinking: -
05-31-2018, 09:52 AMHoodRatI play this game to have fun, not to outdps actual dps as a tank because they can't be botherd to care since people will blindly defend them for some reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill_
This has nothing to do with anything anyone said so...good job there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill_
I'm assuming the people they're grouped with since, contrary to popular belief, most of the content in this game is not single player.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
-
05-31-2018, 11:11 AMRokkeThis game has some content that requires a little more than "being awake at the wheel". If someone telling you to pull your own weight is triggering, kindly avoid said content.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
I’ve had ludicrously low dps bog down mount farming before. That person may have been having a lot of fun mashing whatever buttons they pleased, but everyone else had to work extra hard to drag them across the finish line. Personally, I don't think snickers would have helped the party quite as much as that one player improving their contributions to the farm, but thats just my 2 cents I guess. -
05-31-2018, 11:33 AMDeceptus
As always the metric should be:
Are bosses dying?
Yes? Don't worry about anything else.
No? Start optimizing small mistakes first. Less deaths always helps. -
05-31-2018, 11:38 AMRiyahArpNotice how "fun" isn't really anywhere in there. Because both options really aren't fun. Trying to get good at a decent level means the opposite, losing your ideas of fun and following others ideas of how to play the game. It's often a lot of work. ANd quitting isnt fun either. Its either you get good for the rewards of it, or you quit for the rewards of it. Fun usually is in short supplyQuote:
Originally Posted by Jojoya
-
05-31-2018, 11:53 AMHyoMinParkI dislike this type of mindset purely because it makes it sound like it’s fine to do the bare minimum and never seek to improve beyond that. I find that a lot of individuals that think like this, think that it’s fine for them to go into a group of players that have a completely different mindset, and expect those others just adapt, because “the boss died, it’s no big deal”. I also disagree with this:Quote:
Originally Posted by Deceptus
...because, again, it implies that the bare minimum effort is all that one should put into things. And, once the boss dies, no more effort is required other than the “small optimization” that was done to go from wiping to clearing. I personally never stop optimizing, even long after I have a piece of content on farm; because that sort of playstyle is fun for me. And I surround myself with like-minded people who enjoy the same thing. If you (general “you”, here) want to play the “minimum effort” way, then okay...but find 7 other likeminded people to do it with instead of joining a group of players that very obviously want and/or expect more than just minimum effort.Quote:
No? Start optimizing small mistakes first. Less deaths always helps.
This is agree with 100%. It is incredibly frustrating for those who want to do fast, quick, and easy clears when they’re farming content, to have to carry another player through the content because that one player doesn’t want to put in the same amount of effort that the others do. It’s fine if you want to play at the bare minimum, but do not join others that very clearly do not think or play that way—no matter what, something is going to clash between the two groups, and it usually does not result in anything pretty. I personally don’t understand the bare minimum mindset, but I know it’s there. Again, I just surround myself with other likeminded people that enjoy optimization.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokke
What is fun is subjective. I find it fun optimizing and min-maxing every time I go into Savage, or even an Extreme primal. Beating my current best is fun for me, because it shows improvement, and improvement is a good thing in my opinion. Different people find different things fun, and that’s fine. But, as I said above, my issues lie with those who do not like this type of playstyle, but they jump into content that very much requires it—or at least more than just a very basic rotation. I do not force my optimized playstyle on people, so I would think it respectful if those who like the “bare minimum” do not try to force it on me by joining my farm groups that very clearly ask for high efficiency.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiyahArp
Nothing I am saying here is that there’s something wrong with being a more laid-back player that doesn’t do hard content or Savage content, or who doesn’t want to min-max—I have plenty of friends in FFXIV that have no interest in Savage, no interest in chasing their damage and min-maxing to the extent that I do, and even some that have never done an Ex primal while playing since ARR Beta. I just don’t like the ones that want to do the bare minimum, and jump into content that very obviously requires more than just the bare minimum (like Savage) while expecting the rest of the party to just carry them because “that’s what I think is fun”. I understand a lot of people don’t want to optimize in the same way I do, but I still cannot understand the mindset of “Well, the boss eventually died, and I’ve done all I need to do...I don’t care about self-improvement or any of that nonsense”. It just doesn’t make any sense to me, but different folks different strokes.
There is also something to be said for individuals that do not participate in high-end content, or care about things like optimization/min-maxing, but they try to butt into conversations concerning just those two things, and acting like they know what they’re talking about when it’s very clear they do not—I have been in a few of these throughout my time here on the OF. I generally do not harbor much ill-will towards them, but I wish that they would not try to speak on things that they clearly do not know much about...or blatantly spread misinformation such as improper use of AST sects or that the enmity meter on your party list is an excellent way to tell who is dealing the most damage in a party.
I don’t know. I feel like I’m rambling right now because I am tired and my mind is sort of all over the place at the moment. Hopefully what I have said makes sense. -
05-31-2018, 12:04 PMRiyahArpNo, I understand this. But the problem is that the current definition of bare minimum is actually decently skilled, considering they do this 4k in Savage, which is one hit kill murderland.Quote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
When you talk about improving from this, its a lot of work and very little fun. Usually getting good at a serious level in anything is like that. It's not fun to play chopsticks or play music you hate on the piano because it trains you. It's not fun memorizing chess games till your head swims. It's not fun going to the gym religiously and eating only what is approved for you to eat. There's a strong warning to never let your hobbies or side projects be your job, because you lose the fun part by chasing the mastery part. You do get the rewards from that, beating savage, etc. But people are like "o why dont people git gud" but never really get that past a point for a person, its really tough.
Like try to get gud at something you are mediocre at. Its hard! -
05-31-2018, 12:16 PMHyoMinParkCurrent averages in Savage are actually above 5,700, going upwards of 6,300+ at the 75th percentile; it’s slightly lower at the 50th percentile, with a range of 5,400 to 6,000. 4,000 was the average in Deltascape—I would have to look up the old percentiles to give you the ranges on 75th and 50th. And not everything in Savage is a 1-hit KO; some things are (God Kefka’s Wings of Destruction), but not everything, and party mitigation via shields, SiO, Divine Veil go a long way to make things even more survivable. Now, a DPS taking a tankbuster is going to die, with or without mitigation, but there are things that do not outright kill you unless you fail the mechanic multiple times.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiyahArp
With regards to the 4k damage in Savage remark, I addressed earlier in the thread that the number itself is dependent on a variety of factors, all of which need to be considered before one can truly label it as good or bad, optimized or not optimized. In the scenario of a DPS in full BiS, 4,000 DPS in V8S is poor; there is something that needs to be worked on there. In the scenario of a DPS that is wearing old 330/340 gear, depending on their job 4,000 DPS would not be too terrible—however, they should really seek to gear up a bit before jumping into current Savage to make not only their lives easier, but the lives of their party members; and there is always room for improvement to make the number better.
4,000 DPS also has different levels of acceptability in other content. In more casual content (dungeons, 24-mans, 8-man Normal Modes, or even Extreme primals), I personally wouldn’t consider 4,000 too terrible; it’s about what I would expect out of those pieces of content, and I’m not one to really care about optimization in there outside of “please AOE the trash pulls”, “heal/raise when you need to”, and “if a tankbuster is coming, please use a cooldown/please use your cooldowns in general” (even though I still try to do my personal best because I just can’t help myself). Now, on the other hand, a SAM in TsukuEx with 360/370 gear and the Tsukuyomi weapon...it is a bit unacceptable for them to be sitting at 2,800 DPS against a BRD that, while full BiS, is doing almost 5,000 with a death. There is a huge problem there, and I cannot help but take issue with it (particularly when the SAM is boasting about how good he is, and how the BRD sucks).
Maybe for some, but it isn’t not fun for me. Sure there are failings and/or set backs, but you keep trying. Because, if you don’t, then what was the point of all the effort you put into it? If you decide it’s not worth it, then by all means, drop it and move on. But if you think it is, why not keep at it?Quote:
Originally Posted by RiyahArp
-
05-31-2018, 12:23 PMRokkeFor what its worth, I get you. As someone who was carried by very kind friends back in HW, I know what the scramble of a party trying to cover my weaknesses sound like on discord chat lol If too many people were lagging behind or if the team wasn’t capable of making up the difference and then some, we would very possibly not have gotten the clear. Nowadays I don’t join farm parties till I’ve got the mechanics memorized from clear parties. Personally, I see putting in effort as being polite - I don't want to waste people's time :PQuote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
-
05-31-2018, 12:25 PMMaeka
I'm of mixed minds about this whole kinda thing...
First, yeah I can understand the players running Roulettes, Delta/Sigma and junk for stuff like mounts, and they get frustrated if things are taking too long. Hey I get that. But on the other hand...
The Game doesn't come with any kind of way for a player to know their own DPS, and your average player is probably not going to mess around with parsing, especially if they have no intention of ever stepping foot into a Savage Raid, and in fact, some players might be leery of using such programs because of SE's repeated "Don't use 3rd Party Software with the game!" warnings.
I'm not saying someone would get banned over parsing, as people have obviously been using said tools for quite awhile now and they don't get banned, but yet I could understand how a Sprout might be intimidated, and decide to play it safe and not mess with such stuff.
And as others have said, there are so many factors into what makes your DPS. Your weapon, for example. SE consistently makes weapons the hardest things to get because they have such a huge impact on your performance. But yet, if you're some unlucky joe who can never seem to get drops anywhere and you're not really enjoying the wipefests at the Ex Primals (I am hesitant to try one myself because I don't really enjoy that kind of play where you have to play almost perfectly to clear it) and maybe they don't want to wait 7 weeks to get 7 crystalloids, and maybe falling asleep at the NM train at Eureka isn't the most fun thing to do either...... how ELSE are you supposed to get a weapon, then? Kinda wish SE wasn't so stingy with weapons.
So, those joes with the 330 deltascape weapons... yeah I can understand if they are doing crap DPS even if they're wearing full 345 with the rest of their gear.
As someone mentioned above... Casters.
I've not gotten one to 70 yet, but Dear Lord, the AoE dodging is ANNOYING for anything that has to stand and cast. Start casting, circle appears under your feet. Oop, gotta move. Start casting, another circle appears under your feet. How exactly am I supposed to do any DPS, again? One of the reasons I've not been playing BLM, to be honest. I got it to some Lv40 and some of the bosses in the dungeons were just plain annoying because you have to keep dodging and it screws up your casting constantly.
I couldn't imagine trying to do something like Castrum Fluminis as a caster. No thanks. You can count me out on that.
Now, nowhere in this am I saying that one shouldn't try to improve, at least a little, if they are doing subpar DPS for their gear level... but yet at the same time, I don't like to shame people, because honestly we all come to a video game to have fun, and when you sign up for DF, you should always be prepared to get into a random with clueless people or people who do nothing but mash buttons.
Every time I Q up for a dungeon, I am prepared to carry people, and I generally tend to not get annoyed if I have to carry somebody, as long as we're not constantly wiping. A few wipes I can understand, but I would hope to see improvement. If not, well... they'll probably ragequit and we'll get better replacements, lol -
05-31-2018, 12:47 PMJijifliI'll remember your wise words the next time I get the Aeolian Edge only NIN from Doma Castle. It's just his playstyle, so I shouldn't tell him how to play properly. I'm just some elitist who wanted to not take 15 extra minutes through the dungeon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
-
05-31-2018, 12:52 PMAlarayThe game doesn't really teach players too well, no, but there is an in-game way to gauge whether or not your damage output is going to be alright for pieces of content you want to do (Stone, Sea and Sky). Yes, the game does not actually take you directly to it, but it is a good tool and it's normally one I'd recommend for someone who can't use a parsing tool/doesn't wish to use a parsing tool.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maeka
Generally, if you can kill the dummy you know your class and rotation well enough to go into that encounter. Of course, in the encounter, things like optimization come into play (as do other things, like melds, food, potions, raid buffs, etc...) and one major optimization tool is finding ways to increase uptime on the boss. In a learning environment, damage in general will be a lot lower as people are still learning the mechanics and that's fine.
In a farm party, however, it'll be expected that a player can pull their weight in the group and not hold it back. And, generally, a lot of people consider 5k~ the base minimum for pulling weight as a DPS for the current tier of gear. Since the goal of a farm party is to quickly and efficiently kill the boss, and if someone enters into one without being prepared to do that, then they shouldn't have gone into that group.
Weapon is a factor to consider, as is gear in general. You can do fantastic damage output with what tools and gear you have available for that ilvl, but does that mean someone in 330 gear should go into O8S? No.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maeka
If you're in gear that's too low for the content, then you won't be able to perform in the content because it's not tuned to that gear level. It's not a player issue at that point, but just a situation of needing to utilize available avenues to gear oneself up (Crafted gear/Sigma Normal gear/Eureka gear/Byakko Weapons/Tomestone items/Tsukiyomi weapons/etc...)
This doesn't have something to do with a skill-level, this is just a "you need to take steps 1 through 10 before jumping from 0 to 11."
There are players who are able to do extremely well on these encounters who play casters, from what I'm reading, it just seems to me that the particular role isn't one you'd enjoy to play at that level -- and that's fine, everyone has different preferences for playstyle and that's why there's a multitude of classes that offer different ones to choose from. But it doesn't mean "casters must really suck here" it's just a different approach to the fight and different things to learn through the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maeka
To be honest, dungeons/normal trials/normal raids I never really care about the performance of the people around me. There's no enrage in these encounters (well, I guess besides the Steps of Faith?) and I'm aware of what I signed up for when I queued in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maeka
But a lot of this discussion is centered around higher-end content (EX Primals > Savage at least), and those fights are a DPS race (they all, generally, have an enrage on them) and some bosses have miniature DPS checks (O7S/Phantom Train for example). And if DPS in the encounter cannot pass the bar for those mechanics, or for the enrage, then in order to complete the encounter they should work to improve their own gameplay and take the time to practice on the dummies made available.
At the end of the day, yes tanks hold the boss and mitigate hits. Healers are expected to use their healing buttons at some point, and DPS are expected to output enough damage to offset the likelihood for enrage. (at the basic level and only considering the roles themselves).
Granted, I'm sure people would not enjoy running content with a tank who doesn't know how to generate adequate threat, I'm also sure people would not enjoy content where a healer is not healing the party at all and everyone is dying. Everyone, ultimately, contributes to the success of a party and it's not fun in a higher-tier piece of content to feel like you're carrying someone the entire time when you're working on yourself still. -
05-31-2018, 01:13 PMMirielleLavandre
One of the main issues here is that people need to rely on others to complete/'get good'. Unlike Dark Souls or Bloodborne, where your own skill will either lead to your death or your success, here - you have to hope the other 7 or so people are on par with what the fights entail. I don't raid in FF14 (and haven't in WoW for quite awhile due to not having time to commit to statics b/c of 4 boys). but I firmly believe that if there was a way for all players to see their own performance (via a non-ACT parser), then we'd all be better off. DS3 and such let you know how well or how bad you're doing by death -- FF14 not so much since you can be carried. If people don't know they're doing 4k dps in 360+ gear since they're on PS4 or not running programs, how else can they learn to improve?
' -
05-31-2018, 01:14 PMMaeka
Well, yeah, if you're talking about Savage, EX, or hardcore raiding, then yeah.
You gotta know your stuff before you go in there, absolutely.
There's a reason why I don't go there. One, my gear blows. Two, I don't really have hours to spend in doing the things I'd need to do to get ready for such content. And three, when I sit down to play, it's usually when I'm tired, or there's always Something wrong. Lately my left shoulder has been giving me all kinds of problem and there's rarely a time where I don't feel a bunch of dull soreness from it.
Or a couple months ago, I was having headaches rather often.
That kinda thing.
So yeah, I won't enter the more hardcore endgame content because I know I'm not cut out for it. I'll stick to my normal Duty Finder, which I know I can do well enough in that hardly anybody notices or says anything. In fact, I get commendations rather often. Pushing 800 by now, out of 550 dungeons. So apparently, I don't suck That bad, lol. I've even gotten a few even when playing DPS (which I do rather rarely). -
05-31-2018, 01:21 PMRiyahArpWell, I mean people usually find fun apart from that, or have a goal that offsets it. Like you may put up with gitting gud because you really like your static, or the end goal is to beat savage and get the impressive gear or mount, or you do it to sell runs to make money, or similar. It's just that you have to go from a mindset to playing for fun, to playing to improve, and that can be very unfun.Quote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
I mean, if you are shy, you have to get over that and get on discord, especially to call out mechanics or what have you. If you hate farming or making gil, you have to because you need money for the best potions/infusions and food. You can't ditch your static when you want to, and maybe even you change and gear up jobs. I think it can be worse in other endeavors, but there's a lot sometimes it asks of people that doesn't get acknowledged. Its tough if you play for fun to get into the whole "i am only one of 8 people" thing. -
05-31-2018, 01:35 PMPenthea
Anyone who thinks they can accurately define a player merely by their numbers doesn't know much about raiding.
There are so many variables to consider; experience, gear, melds, party buffs available, the encounter itself, if other people playing badly interfered with them, latency, bugs in the encounter or if they happen to be having a bad day. You can't find out all this information by merely glancing at dps numbers.
To add to this: a person who knows full well they're playing badly but make no effort to remedy it even though they're aware it's causing severe problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunaxia
Some people play to get carried. That's true garbage. -
05-31-2018, 03:20 PMSaitoHikariThis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry
Whoever is expecting you to hit 6k+ in an expert roulette of all things (in a purely single target setting) has very unrealistic standards, because most DPS classes will not hit that high without very specific party comps (or are using food/potions for whatever reason) no matter what.
I find the only DPS that can consistently pull that off without any regards to party composition are MNK, SAM, BLM, and maybe SMN. Everyone else is either too reliant on RNG or specific comps. -
05-31-2018, 03:24 PMMyrhn
Im ilvl336 and i constatly do 4.4k with sam on bosses. Does that is consider garbage?
-
05-31-2018, 04:43 PMGin_GrayNo context to go off of, read some of the comments on the tread but too many factors determine why you're doing whatever number your saying. Deaths,comp, rotation etc I could say that's low/average but without more information it's pointless.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myrhn
-
05-31-2018, 04:56 PMRubissTake a few 4k DPS into God Kefka and let you know how that works out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
4k in this tier as a DPS is absolutely terrible. -
05-31-2018, 05:04 PMTaranTatsuuchiThat is fun to some people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Usho
They just like figuring out systems, one of the 'explorer' personality types iirc.
I see a bit of myself in these descriptions.Quote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
I always try to do as well as I can when I'm doing content, especially when I'm playing with other people.
I definitely feel I'm more laid back than otherwise, I've barely passed 4.0's msq.
But, I'm doing that concurrently with my sister so scheduling is difficult.
I wouldn't mind trying my hand at harder stuff, and with the raid roulette I feel like I can actually try the alexander and omega raids for the first time when I get the chance to run them.
I think the only EXs I've done have been some of the arr primals.
I do recall doing at least the original three back before heavensward.
And, was trying to do the coils back then too with a friend, that was probably the most difficult stuff I've been in while it was 'relevant'.
Didn't manage to down Twintania at the time, but we were close!
At this point in time though.
I don't feel confident, or geared, to try and take on anything difficult.
I've not had much time to play recently and while I've looked up rotational advice for Samurai in the past and have a good idea of the priorities, I just don't have the practice in.
I've saved a picture guide to my phone for reference.
Should take some time to practice the opener some more to get it down.
I feel I was in a better place practice wise with Ninja during Heavensward.
But, I'm liking Samurai a lot and think I'm going to stick with it for my initial main job.
I really have no idea how well I can do at this point.
I know I still have a ways to go, but I also know I could go more should I desire it.
And that's what really matters.
The willingness to improve yourself, and to accept that you may have more to learn. -
05-31-2018, 05:59 PMRita1989For i336 ilvl with no materia on your gear that seems kinda average(still better then like 80% of random DF Sam were at that ilvl) , if you were 360 and had materia you could probably do 5k+ easily.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myrhn
-
05-31-2018, 08:22 PMKaliesto
Whenever new content is launched that we all had to start from the bottom and work ourselves up together, people calling others garbage tier have no clue what they're saying.
-
05-31-2018, 09:13 PMMaeroYes and like i said i admitted i could be a better Nin, and all honesty i do not care for for the job overly much but the group needed a mellee as we had too many casters. Had i went caster i would expect to have easily be in the 5 to 6K Range.Quote:
Originally Posted by RLofOBFL
I did have better numbers last night, got more gear (after we raided, go figure) and have joined balance discord to see what i can do better.