Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent. 2.0

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

On my 19th normal raid run and counting to get the blasted chest token so I don't have to use the Piety crafted chest. Token count: 1.
For some reason I see mostly p6 with a bit of p7 and it always ends with some major PvP chaos. And every time there's this melee that thinks it's the best idea ever to use melee lb3 when we're at 40% and people kept dying left and right the entire time, multiple people are down and healers gave in to their Super-Ether addiction and constantly had to hardress.

Melee lb3 is overrated.
It's not a "delete boss" button.
It's not the cool op anime finisher move you think it is.
Use it at the end to speed things up but if it's a clownfiesta run, do not touch the lb3 as a dps. Leave it for healers or even tanks to keep the run going. Not to mention that it's already a gain if it catches 2 people. Hands off the lb3 button.

P7 everyone was down except one tank and me during double autos - I could've just ressed everyone with lb3 if the melee hadn't decided to use it earlier when it was already clear that this is not a smooth run. I would've likely died to the autos unless the other healer reacted extremely fast but one healer vs 6 people is a fair trade off, especially since they're immediately free to move and act.

P6 a whooping 11min run because it was one giant ress fiesta and at one point, only one tank, 2 dps and me were alive, np MP left to ress a tank or healer in time, Super-Ether already on cd - melee lb3 got used at 45% (yep, we were slow). Double tankbuster came and I got nuked. The kill took around 12min.

When I wrote in party chat if the dps could please leave the lb3 to healers I got a "or maybe heal more and not let people die?".
Honey, I can't heal stupid. I babysitted your dumb ass through aoes with 4 stacks, don't blame me if you get nuked while collecting a 5th.

The other p6 runs were chaotic and with lots of death but these 2 were the most memorable ones.

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I know the feeling of people not understanding save lb3 for healers on rough runs. Had a construct 7 with a raid that was struggling, got the boss down to 38% hp 1 alliance down, 1 alliance with 2 people dead and my group with 5 dead. Had lb3 up so decided Hell with it got a chance to save the run. Hit LB3 got my group up roughly 20 seconds later we wiped. As we are making our way back my co-healer and 2 dps blew up in chat about me using it then kicked me. Saying should have saved it for a dps!!! I was thinking to myself how is a lb3 dps going to make a difference when the boss is at 38% hp still and most of the raid is dead. And thats not even counting for the fact that people were dying to stupid left and right. The kick in all honesty was a blessing I got a guess they eventaully end up disbanding cause of all the failure happening.

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

Melee lb3 is overrated.
It's not a "delete boss" button.
It's not the cool op anime finisher move you think it is.
Use it at the end to speed things up but if it's a clownfiesta run, do not touch the lb3 as a dps. Leave it for healers or even tanks to keep the run going. Not to mention that it's already a gain if it catches 2 people. Hands off the lb3 button.

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Well these days i had plenty of wipes at the ex trial bc of that... honestly if we only clear because we fill another LB its pointless anyways... id rather be save then sorry.

honestly very few clear parties ever well clear. Instead they just ted to wipe repeatedly at the early mechanics. for example i keep getting p6s parties that can't get past the first set of puddles

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Originally Posted by Sclair0

To the stunningly confident samurai, who upon failing a mechanic in an expert dungeon ran into my AOE, died, and then proceeded to write "NEXT TIME MOVE" in the chat.

I applaud you.

As Captain America once said sometimes when the whole world tells you to move, its your job to stand firm, jump into the healers AOE and say "NO! YOU MOVE"

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lol

Yeah, when I'm running anything, I always commit to a spot to stand for an AoE or a spot to tank. If anyone wants to follow or run into it and they take some serious damage, die or both...they only have themselves to blame.

Just got out of an Amaurot as PLD where both the SAM and DNC didn't focus the Roils that tether to the healer and lower their healing potency when the were marked with a 1 to kill them first. The DNC also died on every boss, at least once. When we got to the final boss, they both died at least 4 times, each due to not moving out of the Death Ray lines. And we didn't wipe(we had no side platforms left at this point) only because I used Cover on the WHM and popped Hallowed Ground so we could survive the AOE that covers the entire platform.

This isn't really a bad thing, I find it funny tbh, but P6 in DF has been hilarious this week. I queue into one, do the fight, and almost every run I did, one of the tanks died to one of her attacks, and then the next thing that pops up are the tank busters... And I was #2 on aggro, so I get it. Definitely a "well, guess I die" moment.

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Originally Posted by Sclair0

As Captain America once said sometimes when the whole world tells you to move, its your job to stand firm, jump into the healers AOE and say "NO! YOU MOVE"

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Times like that are when I want the ability to reverse the polarity of the neutron flow on Rescue and turn it into "Yeet". Don't you drop your AoE on me; I parked myself here so that I'd be in a safe spot to hard-cast rez on the black mage, you go take your puddle of Bad over there!

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Originally Posted by Infindox

This isn't really a bad thing, I find it funny tbh, but P6 in DF has been hilarious this week. I queue into one, do the fight, and almost every run I did, one of the tanks died to one of her attacks, and then the next thing that pops up are the tank busters... And I was #2 on aggro, so I get it. Definitely a "well, guess I die" moment.

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Running a lot of P6N and P7N trying to get the orchestrion roll has taught me that it's possible for a sufficiently geared sage to survive the tankbusters in P7N. Just barely, but it is possible.

Permit me to interrupt these Pandaemonium woes with an Urth's Fount moment (six new people, two Medica II mages).

After wiping to Shin-Zantetsuken because everyone got distracted by some unfortunately-timed Gungnir spawns, I habitually took the liberty of mentioning that Medica II doesn't stack when recasted nor is it necessary at that point. One of the WHM's even acknowledges that "everyone is at full health," which makes their actions more confusing, though they follow this up with "should everyone not be at full health?" which is probably what they meant to say initially, albeit still a faux pas.

Before clearing the second time through, I noticed said WHM not attack while the enrage was charging up, even with everyone at full health. Despite the fact that it's a DPS check, the party's HP is irrelevant, and they just witnessed what the move does, it was somehow more appropriate to simply do nothing there. Such habits won't fare well in more unforgiving duties.

Well, this just happened.

Doing Tower of Zot as Dancer, party members are WHM DRG and WAR. WHM is struggling to keep up and dies to the first two bosses, but we do enough damage to kill them before we wipe. NBD so far, WAR is doing their thing and keeping alive, and then me and DRG notice that the WHM has not been Dia/Glaring at all, only using their wings, bubble, and Cure. DRG asks why they're using Cure and note Cure II - no answer. I ask why they're not using lillies - again, no answer. WHM then proceeds to pull the last boss early and we wipe. We get back in there and the WHM is in wherethehecksville during the first big AOE barrage and dies again. We wipe one more time, tell the WHM to follow us and lolnope, they die again, and by this time we've had enough. With a mix of the WAR's skills and mine, we manage to keep the three of us alive to kill the boss. WHM apologizes then dips.

While I appreciate the apology, maybe learn your freaking kit before doing current (expansion) content? WHM is brain dead, there's barely a rotation, it's not hard in the slightest. I imagine they were doing a leveling roulette with a skip potion and just haven't given a damn to actually learn or place their skills optimally. I'm usually overly patient with people when they're willing to learn, but this was just pure ignorance. Just use FATEs to level instead of wasting everyone else's time.

Joined P5S devour/jump prog group. At start no macro/markers so i ask if lead can place marker/macro. Leader says he doesn't have them and just wing the mechs. I already got feeling where this will go but ok might be good group that doesn't need macro/markers. We get thru glow 1 just fine then comes the puddles i run to one on far side got joined by 2 other resulting in 2 puddles not absorbed so wipe inc.
Second pull again died to puddles. Leader says ok got markers and macro. Markers seem fine but macro seem off with M2 not assigned to any puddle, R1 soaking with tank i mention that but everyone is ok with it. Ok we start again. 1st Puddles up and i go to one of outer puddles 2 people already there so i ran to other outer puddle again 2 people there well rip. One person call me out that Ranged seems confused. Well of course i am confused why do melee soak outer puddle.
After 2 more pulls decided not worth it since we haven't got to devour/jumps a single time.

Joined kill party 5 min after since i felt confident in mech and cleared it in about 40 min.

Fell Court of Troia earlier - decent enough team, aside from the Red Mage. Didn't pull their weight, damage was medicore and the team wiped twice at Scarmiglione, partly due to the Red Mage's poor reaction to the mechanics. Red Mage apologised, saying that they were sadly aware that they were a burden to the team, and offerred to leave the instance in the hope that a competent player might replace them. Aside from one of the team replying "don't worry about it" there were no objections, so the Red Mage left.


And the Red Mage in question was me.

I was farming EX4 today. I eventually got my mount, :D but on one of the early runs I made a few too many jokes and lost track of setting things up. We went through the whole fight without realizing I forgot to set a dance partner :o:o:o

Frontline roulette. Spamming it today for $h!ts and giggles.

I've came to witness a rarity (at least to myself) took place: a premade of GNB+DRK+DRG+WAR consistently decimating at least 6+ players from whichever side they picked to nuke, and I kept seeing them getting into same match as I did. It was such an amazing coordination they had (No it's not a sarcasm!) to pull it off almost consistently: DRK charges in to bait with their invuln and drawing in as much targets, then WAR stunning everything in vicinity, while the other two just nuke the rest to oblivion. I think I did managed to kill one of them (i think it was WAR or DRK) after correctly predicting their trick & catching them into my DNC LB. It was a tiiiny victory but hot damn ain't that was veeerrryyy satisfying! Sure it was all a losing matches on my side but I never had this much fun in FL ever!

I tried giving a heads up whichever side I got paired in but of course, considering this IS a frontline, I never expected it to be effective. Funnily enough there was one random who malded hard in the chat for seeing their teammate getting picked on every single time. I mean I get it, but I don't think there's enough reason to start malding though... :shrug:

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

Fell Court of Troia earlier - decent enough team, aside from the Red Mage. Didn't pull their weight, damage was medicore and the team wiped twice at Scarmiglione, partly due to the Red Mage's poor reaction to the mechanics. Red Mage apologised, saying that they were sadly aware that they were a burden to the team, and offerred to leave the instance in the hope that a competent player might replace them. Aside from one of the team replying "don't worry about it" there were no objections, so the Red Mage left.


And the Red Mage in question was me.

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If I have learned one thing in DF, and also PF, it's that it's never just one person's fault and that if you hope for objections when you apologize and offer to leave you will get none.
The majority of people have absolutely no idea what's going on around them and even if something was their fault, they'll just reply with a generic "happens/ no worries/ it's okay" if someone else apologizes. I did it so many times when I was either unsure whether it was really my fault alone or when it was partly my fault but someone else's mistake played a role and I got pretty much always a generic form of "I forgive you" without them chiming in about their own mistake.

And as for the last boss in Troia: there is not a single mechanic where one player can wipe the party. None.
You get puddles and even if two people stack, they get both 2 stacks and zombie status is at 3. So unless the other person already ate something (=their mistake), they can't get zombie'd by you.
You will always have at least one wall to get knocked against unless everyone nuked a wall which would require the tank to deliberale ignore melee range and stand far outside.
The stack during add phase can easily be taken by 3 people, 2 if you push it and have some mitigation on the squishy.
For spread markers even squishies can survive two hits at once so unless you had 3 people (= someone else's mistake too) stacking with spread markers, it can't wipe you either.

Everything else can simply be healed through or worst case, one person dies and gets rezzed and you continue.
So no, it's simply impossible that you alone wiped the party twice.
You may have made mistakes but someone else also had to made mistake and/ or the healer and/ or tank reacted poorly to what was happening too. Because the dot from getting knocked into the wall can be healed, spread markers stacking can be healed, stack with less than 4 can be healed, healer can rezz you. And all 4 tanks have ways to protect/ heal a squishy if something goes wrong. It may not have been their mistake in the first place but it's still poor reaction to let things cause a wipe that can be salvaged.

My patience with the DF has been getting lower and lower over the years, I've now started quitting when I see wipes on stupid mechanics as I'm running the worthless roulettes (i.e. trials and normals raids).
It's so tiring to see the umpteenth burger king tank pointing tankbusters at the party killing four people

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

For spread markers even squishies can survive two hits at once so unless you had 3 people (= someone else's mistake too) stacking with spread markers, it can't wipe you either.

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While I won't argue with a lot of your post, I will actually note that a lot of us outgear casual endgame content -- sometimes dramatically -- and I think we do sometimes take that for granted and forget it is not universally true; I've been in Aglaia and been startled to see a co-healer who had literally 10k less health than me. Differences in health like that can be the difference between "I ate the mechanic and survived" and "don't mind me, I'll just tank the floor for a bit".

So if someone was in there with minimum ilevel gear, I can absolutely believe an overlapped spread marker would just turn them into paste on the floor, whether or not they were healed to full.

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

While I won't argue with a lot of your post, I will actually note that a lot of us outgear casual endgame content -- sometimes dramatically -- and I think we do sometimes take that for granted and forget it is not universally true; I've been in Aglaia and been startled to see a co-healer who had literally 10k less health than me. Differences in health like that can be the difference between "I ate the mechanic and survived" and "don't mind me, I'll just tank the floor for a bit".

So if someone was in there with minimum ilevel gear, I can absolutely believe an overlapped spread marker would just turn them into paste on the floor, whether or not they were healed to full.

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Feel free to argue with everything you disagree with, no reason to hold back if you think something is wrong. That's what forums are for after all.

That said, I did the dungeon quite recently with fairly poor gear on this char. No fancy 600 from raiding. 580 with one 590 piece and I grabbed an accessory or two from the normal raid. That's not exactly overgeared, my friend chased me with the spread marker because he really can't resist doing it and I survived. Barely, admittedly, but I survived.
Two people can die from stacked spread markers but only if both people have fairly low ilvl, if no mitigation is up at all and if neither has a shield either. And seeing as they come in a phase where you don't have to squeeze into a tiny safe zone, it would require a bit of chasing to even happen. Which can happen thanks to the delay between what people do and see on their screen, we all had the classic "Stop chasing me! No YOU stop chasing me!" situation for sure.
But then again, that is not a single person's fault either and that was exactly my point: at the last boss in Troia, things have to be far worse than a single dps screwing up mechanics to wipe.

I once got put into a group of Role players who were RP walking into the Dusk Vigil...Ugh!

If you are going to do that sort of thing, please do not use Duty Finder. I have a lot of patience for first timers, the learning tank or healer but not that kind of bs.

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Originally Posted by RocciaSolida

It's so tiring to see the umpteenth burger king tank pointing tankbusters at the party killing four people

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When I get those at lower level, I explain why they should turn the boss away instead of quitting. Usually, they are thankful for the tips. If you can’t tolerate tolerate mistakes and people learning their jobs, then don’t join the “worthless” levelling roulette as you call it.

However I got one of those tanks this past week in P4N while doing my book...he kept taunting and turning the boss towards the group. We’d move away or behind and he would follow. Wiped the raid. We explained things after the wipe and then it went ok. How he got to P4 without learning that is baffling nevertheless. It shouldn’t happen this far in the game, especially not with optional content as turning the boss away is the first thing one should learn when tanking.

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

Fell Court of Troia earlier - decent enough team, aside from the Red Mage. Didn't pull their weight, damage was medicore and the team wiped twice at Scarmiglione, partly due to the Red Mage's poor reaction to the mechanics. Red Mage apologised, saying that they were sadly aware that they were a burden to the team, and offerred to leave the instance in the hope that a competent player might replace them. Aside from one of the team replying "don't worry about it" there were no objections, so the Red Mage left.


And the Red Mage in question was me.

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I've seen you come by here a few times, posting some pretty harsh messages about your own performance. I've never played with you, so I don't know how much of it is due to sheer exaggeration (listening to you, you're an extra mechanic all by yourself! :D )

That being said, two things:

- I can only speak from my own perspective, but I would never want a player who is doing their best to leave the group. Kicking and leaving is, for me, reserved for people who are really unpleasant and AFK people. And... I think many agree with me. We'll bitch sometimes behind our screen, but without particularly wanting you to leave, and without real venom. So don't give up your place so easily: explain, apologize if you feel it's necessary, but continue.

- Beware of self-flagellation. Another forumer has already elaborated before me, but if you have difficulties to manage the mechanics, then you are also part of those who don't have a global vision of the group... And of the origin of the damage that everyone takes. Being aware of your own shortcomings is one thing; taking responsibility for all the mistakes (when you have no idea) is another.

- One way to improve is to learn to prioritize mechanics. What are the ones that you must not take / miss at all costs? If you have to stop dps during this one, then stop dps, consolidate your understanding of those specific mechanics, and make sure you do them correctly.
For the others (the ones that do damage, but don't inflict OS): healers are there for that too. Dungeon content is usually a bit boring for a healer.... And honestly I like it when a player makes a mistake or two, it keeps me from falling asleep.

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Originally Posted by Merrigan

That being said, two things:

- I can only speak from my own perspective, but I would never want a player who is doing their best to leave the group. Kicking and leaving is, for me, reserved for people who are really unpleasant and AFK people. And... I think many agree with me. We'll bitch sometimes behind our screen, but without particularly wanting you to leave, and without real venom. So don't give up your place so easily: explain, apologize if you feel it's necessary, but continue.

- Beware of self-flagellation. Another forumer has already elaborated before me, but if you have difficulties to manage the mechanics, then you are also part of those who don't have a global vision of the group... And of the origin of the damage that everyone takes. Being aware of your own shortcomings is one thing; taking responsibility for all the mistakes (when you have no idea) is another.

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Agreed. They were also on the last boss. I highly doubt that the RDM could have been the sole cause of the wipes (I don’t even see how). There were other weaknesses in that group.

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Originally Posted by Toutatis

Agreed. They were also on the last boss. I highly doubt that the RDM could have been the sole cause of the wipes. There were other weaknesses in that group.

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Most people just don't own up to, that's all.
Always reminds me of students that forgot their homework and just look down and pretend to be not there so the teacher doesn't notice them and are all too happy when the teacher caught someone else and is busy with them. People make mistakes all the time and that's fine but it's rare to see someone say "whups sorry, shouldn't have greeded so hard/ used my mitigation earlier/ healed sooner".

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

Most people just don't own up to, that's all.
Always reminds me of students that forgot their homework and just look down and pretend to be not there so the teacher doesn't notice them and are all too happy when the teacher caught someone else and is busy with them. People make mistakes all the time and that's fine but it's rare to see someone say "whups sorry, shouldn't have greeded so hard/ used my mitigation earlier/ healed sooner".

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It is so tiring in the long run... I tend to apologize when I make a mistake; but as soon as we get into a more demanding content, it ends up in the exact situation you describe:

- Three players make a mistake; only one apologizes.
- The one who apologizes attracts the wrath of the group's nervousness
- He is held as the main culprit by everyone, if only because his name was posted more often in the chat.
- The other culprits wallow in a comfortable, but unconstructive silence.

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

So if someone was in there with minimum ilevel gear, I can absolutely believe an overlapped spread marker would just turn them into paste on the floor, whether or not they were healed to full.

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I like to drop them on friends with Icarus when we're messing around and I can confirm 2 spread markers usually won't kill an undergeared player in dungeons. Individually they tickle.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

I like to drop them on friends with Icarus when we're messing around and I can confirm 2 spread markers usually won't kill an undergeared player in dungeons. Individually they tickle.

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"Kill for friend"

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Originally Posted by Merrigan

I've seen you come by here a few times, posting some pretty harsh messages about your own performance. I've never played with you, so I don't know how much of it is due to sheer exaggeration (listening to you, you're an extra mechanic all by yourself! :D )

That being said, two things:

- I can only speak from my own perspective, but I would never want a player who is doing their best to leave the group. Kicking and leaving is, for me, reserved for people who are really unpleasant and AFK people. And... I think many agree with me. We'll bitch sometimes behind our screen, but without particularly wanting you to leave, and without real venom. So don't give up your place so easily: explain, apologize if you feel it's necessary, but continue.

- Beware of self-flagellation. Another forumer has already elaborated before me, but if you have difficulties to manage the mechanics, then you are also part of those who don't have a global vision of the group... And of the origin of the damage that everyone takes. Being aware of your own shortcomings is one thing; taking responsibility for all the mistakes (when you have no idea) is another.

- One way to improve is to learn to prioritize mechanics. What are the ones that you must not take / miss at all costs? If you have to stop dps during this one, then stop dps, consolidate your understanding of those specific mechanics, and make sure you do them correctly.
For the others (the ones that do damage, but don't inflict OS): healers are there for that too. Dungeon content is usually a bit boring for a healer.... And honestly I like it when a player makes a mistake or two, it keeps me from falling asleep.

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Am harsh about my performance true, but that's beause I don't seem able to adapt to/learn mechancs and keep making stupid mistakes.

I guess it wasn't entirely on me - I just felt that I wasn't really pulling my weight, and it felt as if Scarmiglione's HP was almost static. I also felt like a letdown as the healer dropped at one point and I was KO'ed due to making an attempt to Verraise the healer (I stopped, used Swiftcast, as was about to cast Verraise but was KO'ed before I could).

I guess I'd also have to concede that, as noted, I was playing as Red Mage and haven't done so for some time as I'd chosen to return to my favorite job (Bard) as very much wanted to improve my performance on that job. And actually don't think I'm too terribad as a Bard following tons of practice and reading the rotation guide on 'The Balance'. And for what it's worth, from the experience I have playing 'Fell Court of Troia' thus far, I guess I do die rather a lot less Vs Scarmiglione as a Bard.

Anyway - thank you for the encouragement!

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

If I have learned one thing in DF, and also PF, it's that it's never just one person's fault and that if you hope for objections when you apologize and offer to leave you will get none.
The majority of people have absolutely no idea what's going on around them and even if something was their fault, they'll just reply with a generic "happens/ no worries/ it's okay" if someone else apologizes. I did it so many times when I was either unsure whether it was really my fault alone or when it was partly my fault but someone else's mistake played a role and I got pretty much always a generic form of "I forgive you" without them chiming in about their own mistake.

And as for the last boss in Troia: there is not a single mechanic where one player can wipe the party. None.
You get puddles and even if two people stack, they get both 2 stacks and zombie status is at 3. So unless the other person already ate something (=their mistake), they can't get zombie'd by you.
You will always have at least one wall to get knocked against unless everyone nuked a wall which would require the tank to deliberale ignore melee range and stand far outside.
The stack during add phase can easily be taken by 3 people, 2 if you push it and have some mitigation on the squishy.
For spread markers even squishies can survive two hits at once so unless you had 3 people (= someone else's mistake too) stacking with spread markers, it can't wipe you either.

Everything else can simply be healed through or worst case, one person dies and gets rezzed and you continue.
So no, it's simply impossible that you alone wiped the party twice.
You may have made mistakes but someone else also had to made mistake and/ or the healer and/ or tank reacted poorly to what was happening too. Because the dot from getting knocked into the wall can be healed, spread markers stacking can be healed, stack with less than 4 can be healed, healer can rezz you. And all 4 tanks have ways to protect/ heal a squishy if something goes wrong. It may not have been their mistake in the first place but it's still poor reaction to let things cause a wipe that can be salvaged.

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Thanks for the advice! :)

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Originally Posted by RocciaSolida

My patience with the DF has been getting lower and lower over the years, I've now started quitting when I see wipes on stupid mechanics as I'm running the worthless roulettes (i.e. trials and normals raids).
It's so tiring to see the umpteenth burger king tank pointing tankbusters at the party killing four people

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No one's perfect, but some tanks are better/worse than others in general. I don't really have a lot of room to talk here. One time I was tanking Diabolos in Dun Scaith and accidentally cleaved the entire raid, killing everyone. Didn't happen again though! lol I learned a hard lesson that day.

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Originally Posted by Majatok

I just had this weird experience in expert roulette today, it was the newest dungeon.
Tank started with this odd explanation of the final boss, at least that's what i think it's supposed to be, and then proceeded with single pulls.
I ask them to do big pulls and at the third pack i used rescue to push them in doing so, tank runs back, but they ended up losing aggro on some enemies which went after the dps.
I tried to keep them alive, but the dps decided to run all the way back to the beginning of the dungeon, so they ended up dying.
At this point i was thinking about leaving, the tank stood still and was wondering how this had happened.

After we regrouped both dps suddenly decided to just go ahead and pull the next pack alone, while the tank was still just standing, i didn't ran with them, so they died.

We were over 5 minutes in this dungeon at this point so i decided to try to kick the tank because there were just standing there and writing the entire time, i didn't believe it would work because it is obvious that this is a premade group but guess what.... it did.
After the tank got kicked, the other 2 dps left with them. The new group had no problems at all to do the dungeon normally.

I know i was acting rude and i do feel bad, but this isn't a super hard dungeon, it's the same as any other, so i thought it was weird that they were making such a huge deal out of it.

Here is the chat when this happened, I played white mage, blue was dark knight, orange was bard and red was summoner.
I checked after the dungeon and all three of them were in the same FC, tank and one of the dps had the same last name.

https://i.imgur.com/MBroj0B.png

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Looks like you ran into Pierre, Guillaume, and Jean-Phillipe.

Someone, somewhere once said "it's always Vanaspati." They were right, it really always is.

Not gonna complain about the DNC because they're new and they can have a pass for that. That GNB though... Couldn't manage aggro on the first two pulls. Me and another DPS are dragging half the pull to them in an attempt to get him to take aggro of it but for some reason he's using a single target combo? They're also one of those tanks that pulls with Provoke but even if they were aware, they did nothing. I healed off 3 people for those pulls because he just wouldn't take aggro what-so-ever.

They figured things out after the first boss, somehow, but even then, they're still not using half their mitis(using certain unearthly tools that YoshiP forbids I can tell you that Heart of Corundum had an up time of 80%). Probably gonna make someone angry here, but unless you're a DRK I shouldn't be running through most of my kit and having to use GCD heals.

Should've just left but didn't feel like leaving the roulette undone before reset.

Edit: Just ran into something better. Ultimate Legend Sage that doesn't know their class nor do they know WoD mechs. Raid was really rough anyways but I just laughed at them dying to a couple of the mechs on their own(prior to tanks fighting over aggro).

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

They're also one of those tanks that pulls with Provoke but even if they were aware, they did nothing. I healed off 3 people for those pulls because he just wouldn't take aggro what-so-ever.

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I'm a tank that sometimes pulls with provoke. Usually because of it's long range so that everything in the pull is coming close enough together to be hit by an AoE right away, rather than waiting for them to get close enough/use my ranged attack as we keep running to try and get them off the healer/DPS that is attacking while we are running to the second group(I still tend to do the ranged attack on the way, but when someone is further back, it makes it harder to get that mob)

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Originally Posted by Avatre

I'm a tank that sometimes pulls with provoke. Usually because of it's long range so that everything in the pull is coming close enough together to be hit by an AoE right away, rather than waiting for them to get close enough/use my ranged attack as we keep running to try and get them off the healer/DPS that is attacking while we are running to the second group(I still tend to do the ranged attack on the way, but when someone is further back, it makes it harder to get that mob)

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Most tanks have dashes at level 54ish+ though. Below that it doesn't really matter if you're using your enmity projectile mixed with aoes to collect the mobs by manually running up, but once you get your dash you should be rushing in.

The reason I see it as important is because provoke is very easy to pop once you're mid pull to peel stray mobs off the rest of your party if necessary while you continue to do your thing. Also the slightly higher range on provoke is nice for using it to peel because you can keep running ahead of your party and continuing to collect the pull.

I tend to be pretty laid back, so I don't tend to get upset at stuff. I only ask that players join my groups in good faith, and listen to advice. If we wipe, and it takes a while to get through content, then it's all good, provided everyone is cool. Same for me too, give me advice if I'm messing up and don't act like a pleb if I don't grasp something new right away.

I only have a few negative stories:

My first attempt at Ramuh Extreme (Synced) was more stressful than it needed to be. I prefer to blind content if at all possible and wanted to do it synced, but struggled to find a synced group who would accept a blind player. So I checked a guide for the essentials, joined a group, explained that it was my first extreme trial, and had checked a guide. All good they said.

I kept getting caught in mechanics, so I was asking questions and trying to figure out what was going on. It's hectic and playing WHM there was a lot to keep check on. After 3 wipes the group leader accused me of lying about reading a guide, which put a sour taste in my mouth and asked me to switch to another job or leave. From the chat I believe they had been going for a few hours, so I get that they were tired, but it felt uncalled-for and if a group has been going for some time then it's usually symptomatic of a broader problem. None the less I did, we ran a few more runs and the mechanics were starting to set in, we were doing fairly well. Then during one run I got some lag and seemed to get the boot.

It made me feel quite insecure about running high end content, but decided to form a group the next day. Discounting getting trolled by 3 players who deliberately wiped us, we cleared him synced with no echo in a few runs - it was surprisingly clean too considering there were a few new players learning the mechanics as we went. Then we went and blind ran Shiva Extreme clearing her in 4 runs. Which goes to show, a little patience with people is all that's needed.

Dear DRKs,

Is it truly that hard to use your mitigations, especially TBN, in 90 content? Even when you mass pull? It's just one button. One single button that reduces your damage taken so you don't immediately explode, and gets your SCH to love you more?

Got out of a Smileton run earlier where the DRK was severely allergic to using TBN, along with other cooldowns, in mass pulls and even on bosses. Occasionally they'd pop one AFTER MOST OF THE MOBS IN THE GROUP WERE DEAD. I only saw TBN get popped twice the entire run. Most pulls I ended up throwing in the kitchen sink just to sustain his squishy self.

Also, tanks, if you ever get O12, for the love of god separate Omega-M and F. Twice we wiped because the PLD decided he wanted to get jiggy with two of them and didn't want the DRK to pull the other away, thereby wiping us to Enhanced Meteor. Third near wipe we pleaded with both tanks to separate them before they got buffed, and thank god they finally listened.

I've set my bar of expectations quite low for random tanks in DF and I'm still left disappointed.

Sincerely,

Your local SCH healer just trying to get their daily tomes

Now that's pretty embarrassing.. Since I had to redo all my bars and hotkeys for my classes, I only recently set up PLD again, and I wasn't very used to the class like I am WHM, DNC, RDM, etc.. to where I can just easily put everything back as they should be. I used the wrong skill trying to turn on tank stance, so I didn't have tank stance on for the first pull initially - I did notice quickly though, and looked back down at my bar and turned it on. Later on, I went into a bit of autopilot, and briefly forgot that I moved my stance onto a hotkey that I had previously used for one of my DPS skills.. I think I was turning my stance on and off briefly, until I realized my error.. This was during a boss fight, so it's not like I was going to lose threat, but it probably looked really bad. Also, definitely lost out on a little bit of DPS.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/jbwsL...=200w.gif&ct=g

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Edit: Just ran into something better. Ultimate Legend Sage that doesn't know their class nor do they know WoD mechs. Raid was really rough anyways but I just laughed at them dying to a couple of the mechs on their own(prior to tanks fighting over aggro).

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Ultimate raids are not WoD. I main sage and have cleared Ultimate and I honestly don't have a clue what half the Alliance raids do because I nearly always run other content and don't need the roulette.

I avoid Alliance like the plague because I'm well aware people like yourself exist who laugh at and ridicule non-sprout players for not doing a flawless run on their first few times. That's honestly far more stress than a Savage or Ultimate where it's steady prog with like-minded players and mistakes are for learning from. Grow up.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Ultimate raids are not WoD. I main sage and have cleared Ultimate and I honestly don't have a clue what half the Alliance raids do because I nearly always run other content and don't need the roulette.

I avoid Alliance like the plague because I'm well aware people like yourself exist who laugh at and ridicule non-sprout players for not doing a flawless run on their first few times. That's honestly far more stress than a Savage or Ultimate where it's steady prog with like-minded players and mistakes are for learning from. Grow up.

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Being brutally honest, I find it very difficult to believe someone who has cleared an ultimate would find any of the alliance raids stressful.
Even WoD before the recent clarity updates was a breeze to anyone who has done basically any other content in the game before.

The obvious solution to not knowing what to do is, much like progging an ultimate, to run it until you learn the mechanics. And there are far less, and far simpler mechanics in WoD that in any ultimate.

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Originally Posted by Iyrnthota

Being brutally honest, I find it very difficult to believe someone who has cleared an ultimate would find any of the alliance raids stressful.
Even WoD before the recent clarity updates was a breeze to anyone who has done basically any other content in the game before.

The obvious solution to not knowing what to do is, much like progging an ultimate, to run it until you learn the mechanics. And there are far less, and far simpler mechanics in WoD that in any ultimate.

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You don't understand. The chains were ACROSS the room! lol
Though you do have to admit that there are one or two mechanics in WoD that can wreck you if you are not paying attention (Hound out of hell and the Atmos thing if the other PTs are not keeping up with their button pressing).

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Originally Posted by Raoabolic

You don't understand. The chains were ACROSS the room! lol
Though you do have to admit that there are one or two mechanics in WoD that can wreck you if you are not paying attention (Hound out of hell and the Atmos thing if the other PTs are not keeping up with their button pressing).

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Oh absolutely, and I'll be the first to admit that I get myself killed repeatedly in araids I've ran before, due to greed or just switching my brain off and not paying attention. It's just not that difficult to figure out what killed me, or how I killed me.

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Originally Posted by Iyrnthota

Being brutally honest, I find it very difficult to believe someone who has cleared an ultimate would find any of the alliance raids stressful.
Even WoD before the recent clarity updates was a breeze to anyone who has done basically any other content in the game before.

The obvious solution to not knowing what to do is, much like progging an ultimate, to run it until you learn the mechanics. And there are far less, and far simpler mechanics in WoD that in any ultimate.

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But then again, why would someone do that? Just to please strangers that see a Legend title and are ready to mentally ridicule them for failing something?
If someone is not interested in that type of content, why push learning it? I ran Aglaia a few times for the coin and apart from that I don't care about alliance raids, I don't even do the roulette. So why should I run it until I learned when I don't plan to participate in the content? I'll probably notice what killed me after failing something but what's done is done, I already failed it and if I don't plan on running it repeatedly it's unlikely to stick.

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Originally Posted by Rilifane

But then again, why would someone do that? Just to please strangers that see a Legend title and are ready to mentally ridicule them for failing something?
If someone is not interested in that type of content, why push learning it? I ran Aglaia a few times for the coin and apart from that I don't care about alliance raids, I don't even do the roulette. So why should I run it until I learned when I don't plan to participate in the content? I'll probably notice what killed me after failing something but what's done is done, I already failed it and if I don't plan on running it repeatedly it's unlikely to stick.

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I ain't here to police what content someone does or does not do. They're free to avoid them completely if they so choose.

I'm just pointing out the clear discrepancy between someone who has the skill to prog an ultimate but is stressed by araid mechanics.
Any skills used to clear an ultimate are directly transferable to any of the araids, and the araids are far simpler by comparison.

It's like clearing a new EX week 1 but avoiding Expert roulette cause failing the dungeon mechanics stresses you out too much. I just can't fathom it.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Ultimate raids are not WoD. I main sage and have cleared Ultimate and I honestly don't have a clue what half the Alliance raids do because I nearly always run other content and don't need the roulette.

I avoid Alliance like the plague because I'm well aware people like yourself exist who laugh at and ridicule non-sprout players for not doing a flawless run on their first few times. That's honestly far more stress than a Savage or Ultimate where it's steady prog with like-minded players and mistakes are for learning from. Grow up.

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I didn't ridicule them in-game, but it also wasn't just them not knowing araid mechanics. They literally had no idea how to play a class that they had maxed out and had i605 gear on. No Kardia, no Eukrasian Dosis or Eukrasian Diagnosis(they manually cast Diagnosis), didn't use any Addersgall abilities. And again, I mentioned they had no idea how to play their own class.

Sounds to me like you're just defending someone who probably bought their clears. Maybe you sympathize with them a little bit? Perhaps you know exactly how they feel?