What Roles would you like for Samurai and Red Mage?

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Originally Posted by Nektulos-Tuor

Samurai should be a hybrid tank/dps.

Red Mage should be a hybrid healer/dps.

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you mean like PLD/WAR/DRK, are hybrid tank/dps?
and SCH/WHM being hybrid healer/dps?

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Originally Posted by TaroMaruRidill

Make Samurai, Red Mage, and Blue Mage able to do multiple roles.
Samurai > Tank or can switch to > Melee DPS
Red Mage > Healer or with can switch to > Ranged DPS
Blue Mage > Tank, Heal, or DPS depending on which monster skills or skill tree they use.
Although it would be cool, there of course would be gear issues lol maybe its not as good of an idea as i thought unless someone can think of something else.

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Originally Posted by Nektulos-Tuor

Red Mage = Melee DPS with heals/nukes.
Please =D

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Originally Posted by RyuSaarva

Red mage: physical melee dps/long range magic dps/healer, however red mage does not regen mp during battles, bards can sing for them though.

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more like Magic Sword - imbue wep with magic, to make attacks.

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Originally Posted by ErikMynhier

Blue Mages... melee/dps-support... new job, starts at level 30..... hails from the continent of Meracydia, home of the Miqo'te... uses skills and abilities derived from the 26 totem animals (some support others dps, more powerful animals power the big skills like lv-50) of the Seekers of the Sun.

Red Mages... magic/dps-support... new job, starts at level 30..... hails from the continent of Meracydia, home of the Miqo'te... uses skills and spell derived from tribal blood magic (dps/en-spells/other skills) of the Keepers of the Moon.


There you go SE.... you're welcome.

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there's no support jobs.

there are no multi-role jobs. All tanks can switch to DPS stance.
healers can switch to atk
neither are as good as real DPS jobs.

why do ppl make up new rules to the game? you're just gonna be disappointed.

SAM should be melee DPS
RDM should be melee-magic - like i stated above, using Magic Sword. Having some ranged magic attacks, like NIN, does.
I mean....WHM is already like red mages, in that they got both whm spells, and damage spells. so i don't see how they would make a job that is both as good at healing as current healers, and good at DPS, as BLM - if they are sub-par on both, no one will want them in pt...sort of like MCH and AST, at launch.
RDM needs to be good at one role, not multiple roles. it could be a DPS like SMN who has heals too, but suck at it. so you'd waste your DPS if you were healing.

I would prefer Samurai to be tank, Red Mage to be a magic DPS (because we need a new magic DPS) and want the new healer to be Dancer. Though I'm not sure how Dancer would work - you wouldn't be able to give them regens or shields for fear of WHM and SCH complaining endlessly that their classes aren't unique anymore.

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Originally Posted by Sessurea

Pure dps classes pls. If tanking was any bit interesting in this game samurai might have been cool tank with manual parrying etc, but this aint that game.

And pls, no more "support dps" either.

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But....

Tanking is more fun than DPS....

Samurai = Tanker with katana who change stance (Japanese Sword Stance Name) for "Full Tank" or "Full DPS" like Warrior
Red Mage = Healer with rapier (no idea about this job now)

Stop add any DPS now. we have 7 Class of DPS now!!!

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Originally Posted by Pimmony

Samurai = Tanker with katana who change stance (Japanese Sword Stance Name) for "Full Tank" or "Full DPS" like Warrior
Red Mage = Healer with rapier (no idea about this job now)

Stop add any DPS now. we have 7 Class of DPS now!!!

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>_> but people like the dps! Though if they make RDM a healer then I demand Dancer be made a melee support >=[

Sam: devs have all but confirmed is going to be a dps when they implement it. I could go either way on it personally.

Rdm: I would love to see them go old school melee caster dps, saber and temper and fast are not foreign abilities to xiv by a long shot and maybe regen as their self heal that they can use on another party member with much higher cooldown obviously.

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Originally Posted by Lollie

Sam devs have all but confirmed is going to be a dps when they implement it. I could go either way on it personally.

Rdm I would love to see them go old school melee caster dps, saber and temper and fast are not foreign abilities to xiv by a long shot and maybe regen as their self heal that they can use on another party member with much higher cooldown obviously.

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lol Sam Devs? I believe you are referencing--somewhat incorrectly--a comment, or better yet a musing, by Yoshida where he was talking about Dark Knight or Samurai would have come to this expansion (3.0) but Dark Knight fit the bill better, he goes on to say that he feels that a Shogun would be more akin to a tank role than a FF Samurai. However that was his feeling, while he is the director of the game and ultimately in charge of the game he is also in charge of balancing said game, like already mentioned there are currently 7 damage dealers, 3 tanks, and 3 healers. If balance is at the heart of their motto, and we do see BLUE MAGE, SAMURAI, and RED MAGE in the next expansion (which were the three jobs teased in The Rising event) then it will undoubtedly be:

Samurai: Tank
Red Mage: Healer
Blue Mage: DPS

I say this primarily because they will more than likely keep the 1:1:1 ratio for each expansion to preserve the "balance" and Blue Mage, being a job that learns monster abilities, can only be a Damage Dealer since roughly 90% of named monster abilities deal damage and making a job that only utilizes 10% of the monster abilities in existence is gonna piss off a lot of players who like the idea of the Blue Mage Job. That whittles us down to two roles left: Healer and Tank. While Red Mage can certainly be a tank and Samurai can kinda be a healer (using spirits and stuff) more than likely they will pick the more traditional of the role for Red Mage. While Black Mage is primarily a Fire/Ice (with a touch of Lightning) and White Mage is primarily Wind/Earth (with a touch of Water) I would like to see Red Mage as a healer that uses the Water Element for healing and the Lightning Element for damage with party buffs mixed in, let it wield a Rapier for a weapon and allow them to equip small shields and make it a front/mid line type job. That would complete the "elemental wheel" in terms of us being able to wield them.

As for Samurai, you need look no further than an idea I posted a while back on the job. In a nutshell its primary way of tanking is through Parry and their exclusive ability: Counter. Because to me, in anime, Japanese culture, and Japanese history, the role of a Samurai was never as an "aggressor" but more of a defender; but that doesn't mean they were not deadly, through defense they created an amazing offensive with countering and destroying those that would cause them or those they swore their allegiance to harm. That is the true role of a Samurai. The link to my idea can be found HERE.

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Originally Posted by Pimmony

Samurai = Tanker with katana who change stance (Japanese Sword Stance Name) for "Full Tank" or "Full DPS" like Warrior
Red Mage = Healer with rapier (no idea about this job now)

Stop add any DPS now. we have 7 Class of DPS now!!!

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More DPS is a good thing actually. Gives more variety to the game cus lets face it. Tankers are going to tank, we saw this with all the people who rank to DRK then immediately dropped it to go back to DPSing. I am not a fan of tanking, at all, it doesn't matter what job you give to the tank position I am very unlikely to pick it up.

And as above, if Red mage gets put as a healer, I will certainly play it but my expectation of it will be shot o.O

Sam needs to be a dps, but I think red mage should be a tank or healer honestly.

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

More DPS is a good thing actually. Gives more variety to the game cus lets face it. Tankers are going to tank, we saw this with all the people who rank to DRK then immediately dropped it to go back to DPSing. I am not a fan of tanking, at all, it doesn't matter what job you give to the tank position I am very unlikely to pick it up.

And as above, if Red mage gets put as a healer, I will certainly play it but my expectation of it will be shot o.O

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I should note if you read the Census info graphs from 2015 and compare them to the 2014 ones, Tanking and Healing actually GREW in percent while DPS shrank, which means that placing attractive jobs in certain roles can and will influence a player's decision, which means that Tanks and healers will probably continue to get the more widely "desirable" jobs added to them to help with the balance, rather than coming out with an expansion that has 3 new tanks and nothing else. (make sense?)

Would be cool if one of the new jobs was a melee focused class that has good AoE (kind of like how SMN has slightly lower ST but amazing AoE).

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Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

I would prefer Samurai to be tank, Red Mage to be a magic DPS (because we need a new magic DPS) and want the new healer to be Dancer. Though I'm not sure how Dancer would work - you wouldn't be able to give them regens or shields for fear of WHM and SCH complaining endlessly that their classes aren't unique anymore.

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A TP based Healer would be unique enough in and ofitself.

What about magic and support for red mage? we don't have such job for now

It's obvious!

Samurai should be a gatherer and RDM a crafter!

^_^

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Originally Posted by jomoru

A TP based Healer would be unique enough in and ofitself.

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I agree, but the forums will still be flooded with whining about how WHM and SCH aren't unique anymore because other healers get HOTs and shields - much like they are right now.

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Originally Posted by Queezy

I personally don't want to see rdm ever implemented, anyhow they put it into this game it would be a disgrace to the job.

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Same here, I loved it in FF1 and 5, had fun with it in 11, but with the current role/team setups, it just wouldn't be what it should be. Better off creating a whole new job than butchering a classic IMO.

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Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK

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ehm, they have also said they will never release 3 jobs at the same time, again, cause of balancing 3 jobs, simultaneously, is a nightmare.
also the rising event hints at puppet-master and dancer, as well.
it's not exactly as if the game is *missing* tanks and healers. it doesn't matter if they add 10 more tanks, there's still going to be same amount of people playing as tanks.
the game already has a 2h-sword-tank, so it would be kind of -.- if SAM would be tank - and as i said, they don't need to release all the jobs at the same time
there's no particular reason they need to keep the 1:1:1 ratio - SMN/SCH/NIN, were all released before HW, no tanks - so HW releasing 1 of each, isn't really any indication they will keep it that way.
none of these jobs, have been confirmed either.

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Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK

I should note if you read the Census info graphs from 2015 and compare them to the 2014 ones, Tanking and Healing actually GREW in percent while DPS shrank, which means that placing attractive jobs in certain roles can and will influence a player's decision, which means that Tanks and healers will probably continue to get the more widely "desirable" jobs added to them to help with the balance, rather than coming out with an expansion that has 3 new tanks and nothing else. (make sense?)

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people will level DRK, cause....DRK. they won't necessarily make it main - you know, the whole thing with wave of DRK doing FATEs, at launch.

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Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK

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My appologies I fixed the punctuation so you could see they were intended to be bulletpions defining the content of their respective categories. Now on to your actual grips.

http://www.cgmagonline.com/articles/...-with-yoshi-p/ Heres your sitation link interpret it as you will.

Also the new job ration and ongoing is 1:1:2 they released nin early to appease fans it was origionally slated for much later release. Anyone can look at the character screen in game and see this, with dps having the slight lead due to the dual roles on acn. The fallicy in your statement also is yes there is going to be a tank in the next set, does not mean sam has to be that tank though.

For the record I've seen you sam as tank post one of those likes is actually from me, does not mean I think it will happen though.

I'd guess Samurai (whether dps or tank) will be released 1st.

Since it was in consideration for the tank slot I'm sure they atleast have concepts on SAM

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Originally Posted by Lollie

My appologies I fixed the punctuation so you could see they were intended to be bulletpions defining the content of their respective categories. Now on to your actual grips.

http://www.cgmagonline.com/articles/...-with-yoshi-p/ Heres your sitation link interpret it as you will.
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thank you for posting that article and shows how Samurai is most likely to be Dps due to fan feedback- feedback im trying to get for SAM and RD MGE so the devs can see it clearly.

SAM as tank. Everyone played it as a DPS in XI when SE initially made it with a tank role in mind, but we didn't need another blood tank and ninja made a really really good evasion tank, so.... I think a mitigation based tank that buffs the party would be kind of fun - their own damage would be on par with PLD, but they can add damage boosts to others.

RDM as a sword wielding healer that can melee DPS too. I'd love to see something different, like an Encure spell that tosses a regen on any melee who attacks a mob (sort of like how DNC's indirect cures worked in XI). Give them a pure melee stance, kind of like Cleric's, that swaps out MND for STR so they can go full DPS whenever they want. Also give them an auto-attack trait that continues even through spell casts so the DPS is not totally hurt while tossing the occasional cure spell.

I'd also enjoy blue mage in it's XI form almost exactly. Although farming spells would be a pain!

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Originally Posted by AzraelX

thank you for posting that article and shows how Samurai is most likely to be Dps due to fan feedback- feedback im trying to get for SAM and RD MGE so the devs can see it clearly.

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I, for one, was almost certain it would be a Melee DPS, they had to choose one to be a tank, DRK or SAM, and they choose DRK, so it would be utterly silly for them at this point to make SAM anything other then a DPS, especially considering people have been asking for a Sword style DPS job.

RDM on the other hand...Caster, most likely. AST already took the support/healer role and we are due for a new caster job. i have high expectations that it will be a Caster job. How it works, however, is up for debate of course.

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Originally Posted by AltanRapsied

What about magic dps and support for red mage?

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Everyone ignoring me :c

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Originally Posted by AltanRapsied

Everyone ignoring me :c

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Not hard to guess, it would mean a DPS caster version of BRD,

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Originally Posted by Blood-Aki

Not hard to guess, it would mean a DPS caster version of BRD,

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I would like that. I don't really get why they made MCH a support as we already have a physical ranged support. I don't get why we have 3 melee DPS fulfilling essentially the same niche.

It would be nice to have a
melee/physical/dps/support -
ranged/physical/dps/support - MCH + BRD
melee/magical/dps/support -
ranged/magical/dps/support -
melee/physical/dps - NIN, DRG, MNK
melee/magical/dps -
ranged/physical/dps -
ranged/magical/dps - SMN, BLM

melee/physical/tank - WAR, PLD
melee/magical/tank - DRK
melee/evasion/tank -

ranged/magical/shields heals - SCH
ranged/magical/regen heals - WHM
ranged/magical/buffs and CC heals - AST, sort of.

I'd like to see less duplicates and more variety into these different niches. To add to some of the above:
It would be great if instead of being a WHM/SCH hybrid, AST primarily did buffs combined with CC. It would be neat if they could alter the course of incoming damage - i.e. an attack is about to hit the tank and the AST sends a shooting star to intercept, scattering the damage away and only letting X% through to hit the tank. It would be a bit like shields, but it'd be something that's not pre-emptive like a shield that lasts for 30 seconds, but is rewarded by blocking more damage.

For evasion tank, I am thinking something along the lines of Warrior tank from Tera.

On topic
I'd like to see SAM as melee/dps/support/physical OR evasion tank

I'd like to see RDM as melee/magical/support/dps OR ranged/magical/support/dps

Samurai = Melee DPS/Tank Support
Weapon = Katana (duh)
Uses plate giving a second melee dps that uses plate (like Dragoon).

Taking a page out of FFTactics instead of learning Class skills at a certain level, a Samurai must soulbind certain Katana's given to them from their class quest in order to be able to evoke the "soul of the katana" or aether if you will on command.
Kind of like a Melee Bard, but instead of "Aura's" the Samurai can imbue the soul of a legendary Katana into an attack buffing players in a certain radius around the Samurai (which due to distance will mostly be other Melee dps/tanks).

Red Mage
Weapon - Magitek Gunblade

Master trickster, with range or melee at his/her disposal anything could be up their sleeve, Master debuffer, Mage support, dps.

Red Mage = Support (use heals to support healers, debuffs to support DD and tanks)
Blue Mage = Control (make use of abilities like Bad Breath to control crowds, may have ability to puppeteer single monsters).
Samurai = Tank

Considering how homogenized things are becoming, I'll be very agitated if red mage and blue mage somehow get shoehorned into the three basic roles. At least samurai could legitimately go either tank or DD given its background. DD would be a better fit historically, though. They need to break free from just aping previous MMORPGs and do something that better fits the franchise (in moderation).

I am personally so in love with the Samurai tank from Log Horizon, that I cannot imagine it being anything other than a tank job. FFXIV already has a bucket load of dps jobs, so why not add Samurai to the tank department as yet another incentive to make players play more tank jobs? From my queues to this day I still have to wait for a tank unless I play one myself, (Resulting in an instant duty pop) so there's no surprise that they're in high demand.

As for Red Mage, I imagine it a melee magic job with support capabilities. However I do find the idea of a melee healer job very appealing too. If Dancer never gets introduced, I can totally see Red Mage taking on the role of the first melee healer job.

tl:dr
Samurai - tank
Red Mage - melee healer

Samurai - dps or tank
Red mage - melee/magic dps or a healer
For a 3rd class could add rune fencer or dancer as a tank or as dps

The poll won't be accurate, because you say pick 2, but anyone could put a check mark in all choices, But I chose RDM Healer, SAM Tank.
We have enough DPS.

I can appreciate that maybe these jobs might make an appearance, but as many have said, the battle system needs to open up a bit to the solo sphere in order to accommodate new different jobs.

RDM - We don't have a melee caster, but in making this gel with the fast paced combat, the cast times would have to be short. Somewhere between what bards have? (I have only seen bards in action but it was against a dummy so no moving). They would need to combo with themselves so positionals would be out. ( I hope)

SAM - This one is a doozy. Because of the fast paced combat, SE would commit seppuku by releasing a slow, hard hitting melee dps. We have been spoiled too much in the speed department (and i love it). As much as I would love to see the weapons, gear and abilities, It would either being a DRG clone (like Marth and Lucina in Smash lol) or it would need to have a ton of oGCD abilities. Remember, it cant be counter based because as we learned from DRK there is very little Mob-dps (or OT) interaction.

Love this conversation. Keep up the brewing :D

SAM - melee dps. Making a second two-hand sword tank would be absurd. The above suggestion to make the job more focused on off-GCD rotations is an interesting one.

RDM - melee caster/support. Ideally I would like to see this as a combination class with weaker instant attacks (like current melee) and extremely potent spells with casting times, with the focus being on alternating between the two during the flow of combat.

RDM could be designed as a melee caster with buffs/debuffs focus with rapiers <3

SAM would likely be rolled as a tank (if they use heavy armor) but looking at the current tanks, things don't look enticing enough for SAM to be a tank so I'll say they might become a DPS with cloth armor instead. Maybe something like Kenshin or Vergil?

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Originally Posted by AzraelX

thank you for posting that article and shows how Samurai is most likely to be Dps due to fan feedback- feedback im trying to get for SAM and RD MGE so the devs can see it clearly.

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Well its actually more split down the middle in terms of Samurai being a tank or a DPS from the fan community. I've seen quite a few people in the game as well as in the forums supporting it as a tank and quite a few supporting it as a DPS. However when it all boils down it will be put into a role that will help the Duty Finder the best; just watch, it's all about the balance and the wait times.

Given the current jobs, I think RDM can sit perfectly as the 3rd DPS/Support. Slotting wise, they can provide more DPS than BRD/MCH, but less TP/MP support, while being able to buff/debuff/heal more than those two.

SAM would be the 2nd medium armor Melee DPS (along with DRG).

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Originally Posted by SpecialKK

Given the current jobs, I think RDM can sit perfectly as the 3rd DPS/Support. Slotting wise, they can provide more DPS than BRD/MCH, but less TP/MP support, while being able to buff/debuff/heal more than those two.

SAM would be the 2nd medium armor Melee DPS (along with DRG).

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Yeah but we already have a 2-handed DPS and an Eastern Themed DPS (two of them really: MNK and NIN).

Oh, and I propose to the community that are saying things like what I just said: You know if BLU is added it will more than likely use a sword (scimitar class) and RDM will use a sword as well (rapier class) IF all three come in the next expansion and each fulfill a different role that all three roles will be filled sword-wielding type jobs...so your argument on too many sword types in the tanking role is a bit moot and a more valid concern would be having all three of the traditionally Eastern themed jobs DPS.

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SAM would likely be rolled as a tank (if they use heavy armor) but looking at the current tanks, things don't look enticing enough for SAM to be a tank so I'll say they might become a DPS with cloth armor instead. Maybe something like Kenshin or Vergil?

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So basically a single handed Ninja? Or a branching combo type like Monk? I feel it would offer a lot more diversity if it were rolled as a Tank instead of a DPS. Also those hoping for SAM (which I believe a lot of people are) to be like the FFXI SAM, you have to remember that a majority of those defining abilities are already in use by other jobs, they might be renamed but their function is the same, and SAM in XI was a Burst Damage Dealer, something that Dragoon in this game currently occupies, and I would rather them not make a clone job and instead work on a unique job instead.

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Originally Posted by OMEGA_HACK

Well its actually more split down the middle in terms of Samurai being a tank or a DPS from the fan community. I've seen quite a few people in the game as well as in the forums supporting it as a tank and quite a few supporting it as a DPS. However when it all boils down it will be put into a role that will help the Duty Finder the best; just watch, it's all about the balance and the wait times.

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I have this poll on reddit and it seems like majority - 58-60% want SAM as a DPS n RD as a melee/caster DPS

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Originally Posted by SpecialKK

Given the current jobs, I think RDM can sit perfectly as the 3rd DPS/Support. Slotting wise, they can provide more DPS than BRD/MCH, but less TP/MP support, while being able to buff/debuff/heal more than those two.

SAM would be the 2nd medium armor Melee DPS (along with DRG).

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They have it out a role that uses dragoon armor if not that's not fully utilizing resources.
After reading that article I'm 90% sure SAM will be a DPS. Rd will be the wild card

Seems like ff14 takes ideas from tactics and SAM IN THAT GAME used busier/ sword spirits to do attacks.

Aurom in ffx was a Samarui with moves like armor break / magic break.
SAM in ff use a toss Gil move as well

So I think SAM as sword- melee DPS will have some unique elements

Spear and Katana are so different I don't even know why you bring it up, especially when SAM world bring more duplicity at tank. Parry? War has it. Self heal? Drk and war. 2h sword? DrK.

Not to mention balancing 4 tanking jobs is tougher than DPS