Final Fantasy XIV and a Culture of Enabling

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

Not everyone learns at the same rate, and the game does not really teach you how to play your class at max level. In fact many players get better playing what we consider the wrong way and get decent at playing that way.


It is best not to assume that just because someone levels up to max, that they should know how to play.

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Depending on the job, you can figure out most of your stuff just by reading tooltips to be honest. White mage is partially like it

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

What I am saying, and have been saying for pages upon pages is to stop situations such as that from happening SE needs to put in more roadblocks that make a player look at and interact with their skills. Also that player, if they have no understanding of dots, is a negative gain to whatever party they get paired with.

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I mean they could do that, and people like her and my wife would not play anymore. Mmorpgs are more than just grouping with players.

Why are you playing a game if you are not interacting with the gameplay?

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

Why are you playing a game if you are not interacting with the gameplay?

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Because mmorpgs are more than grouping for content? I mean some players like my wife take what they enjoy about the class and don't use what they don't like.

Some people like my friends are really new to gaming and takes awhile for them to learn, and some just don't care to learn and can have fun without learning. Pick up and play.

Mmorpgs has all types.

I think having actual job tutorial in the game would help. Hall of novice only explains basic stuff and only focuses on roles, soit would be nice if at some points you could do actual job tutorial for some neat rewards

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

It is best not to assume that just because someone levels up to max, that they should know how to play.

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if someone has spent 50+ hours (100+ assuming it's their first/only class) to level it to level cap, they're bound to pick one or two things up either by looking at what their co-healer does, reading their tooltips or getting advise by helpful players
if they do not know how to play their class at a semi competent level at that point it's completely on them, non-gamer or not, that's all what people want from less than optimal players: some basic competency
even if caurcas is playing the hardcore elitist thing up to 1000 at this point (and people fall for it), their message isn't wrong. and I say this as someone who doesn't touch high-end content at all

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

if someone has spent 50+ hours (100+ assuming it's their first/only class) to level it to level cap, they're bound to pick one or two things up either by looking at what their co-healer does, reading their tooltips or getting advise by helpful players
if they do not know how to play their class at a semi competent level at that point it's completely on them, non-gamer or not, that's all what people want from less than optimal players: some basic competency
even if caurcas is playing the hardcore elitist thing up to 1000 at this point (and people fall for it), their message isn't wrong. and I say this as someone who doesn't touch high-end content at all

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I mean it is on them, but if they are having fun and don't care. Who are we to tell them to stop doing that. Like I said, both sides clash on this issue. As long as it is not breaking the rules of the game. Not much players can do about it. And the developers has protected these types of players saying we can't tell them otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Arillyn

Hang on - FFXI and Everquest were hardly failed games. They are old MMOs for sure but not failed at all. Heck, people still play them and FFXI still makes SE plenty of money. So failed? Nah, they aren't.

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Especially EQ. It just got an expansion last year. It's a niche game and it does drive home the idea that certain ideas with older MMOs don't work in the current environment, but it's certainly not failed.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

You can edit your posts to bypass the character limit and put in everything you want to say into one post. I'm guessing you don't know this because of your last few posts. No need to use up your daily post limit so quickly if you edit just one post :)

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There's a daily post limit?

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Originally Posted by Nethereal

There's a daily post limit?

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Yeah it's like 20 posts if you are lv 50 or up or something. It's based off level.

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Originally Posted by Nethereal

There's a daily post limit?

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Yup. for someone like me who loves to talk and give my worthless two cents on a range of subjects. I hit it often.

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

I mean it is on them, but if they are having fun and don't care. Who are we to tell them to stop doing that. Like I said, both sides clash on this issue. As long as it is not breaking the rules of the game. Not much players can do about it. And the developers has protected these types of players saying we can't tell them otherwise.

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that's... exactly what I, or rather, some of us, are saying? that the developers are protecting and pandering to those kind of players instead of trying to find a good average
take bozja's DR for example, the average run is like, 35 to 50 minutes? sometimes even longer
with the majority being halfway competent and using the essences like you're supposed to, it can be done in 25 or less and save a ton of time and the same is true for dungeons:
it's not 'just' 5 minutes extra like the people earlier in the thread said, it's usually 15-30+ minutes or more if people even decide to stick around, just look at the tales of DF thread
playing bad on purpose or playing bad/VERY very sub-optimally because it is 'more fun' is simply griefing, sorry

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

What I am saying, and have been saying for pages upon pages is to stop situations such as that from happening SE needs to put in more roadblocks that make a player look at and interact with their skills. Also that player, if they have no understanding of dots, is a negative gain to whatever party they get paired with.

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Why in the world would they limit their playerbase like that? The only time the game design expects grouping is random times during the MSQ. And now they have Trusts so someone could just muddle through on their own. They're going to make this game more accessible, not less. Doing otherwise would be an incredibly stupid business decision.

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

that's... exactly what I, or rather, some of us, are saying? that the developers are protecting and pandering to those kind of players instead of trying to find a good average
take bozja's DR for example, the average run is like, 35 to 50 minutes? sometimes even longer
with the majority being halfway competent and using the essences like you're supposed to, it can be done in 25 or less and save a ton of time and the same is true for dungeons:
it's not 'just' 5 minutes extra like the people earlier in the thread said, it's usually 15-30+ minutes or more if people even decide to stick around, just look at the tales of DF thread
playing bad on purpose or playing bad/VERY very sub-optimally because it is 'more fun' is simply griefing, sorry

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and they and developers don't see it as that way. So no matter what stance we take on it. As long as developers and players feel this way. We must adjust and adapt to it. That is the nature of the beast.


I mean I get where both sides are coming from, but we must accept that as long as developers protect and make the rules around these players. That means this is that sort of game. We can voice displeasure like many have, but right now until it changes. The only thing you can do is meet a middle ground with these types of players.

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

take bozja's DR for example, the average run is like, 35 to 50 minutes? sometimes even longer
with the majority being halfway competent and using the essences like you're supposed to, it can be done in 25 or less and save a ton of time and the same is true for dungeons:

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I'm not sure that's the best example because there are many people who are only there because SE put relics behind it and wouldn't be otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

and they and developers don't see it as that way. So no matter what stance we take on it. As long as developers and players feel this way. We must adjust and adapt to it. That is the nature of the beast.


I mean I get where both sides are coming from, but we must accept that as long as developers protect and make the rules around these players. That means this is that sort of game. We can voice displeasure like many have, but right now until it changes. The only thing you can do is meet a middle ground with these types of players.

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I don't think it is necessarily to "protect" those players as much as SE doesn't have a solid grasp on the player base outside of JP. As looking at the data, JP engages more broadly with content under the same ToS. So SE takes this as working, but they neglect how this has wrecked and split the NA and EU communities into essentially two warring tribes.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

I'm not sure that's the best example because there are many people who are only there because SE put relics behind it and wouldn't be otherwise.

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how does that invalidate my point or make it a bad example? I'm only doing DR to get the relic too, but I want it to be over quickly as possible so I use the essences the game throws at you in Bozja
that's like, the very least that should be expected from someone doing DR and only doing it for the relic, imo

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

and they and developers don't see it as that way. So no matter what stance we take on it. As long as developers and players feel this way. We must adjust and adapt to it. That is the nature of the beast.


I mean I get where both sides are coming from, but we must accept that as long as developers protect and make the rules around these players. That means this is that sort of game. We can voice displeasure like many have, but right now until it changes. The only thing you can do is meet a middle ground with these types of players.

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I think that most players do feel very negatively towards players who make no effort or play badly on purpose.
Like if you play a BLM who just spams ice spells because you '' want to be a frost mage '' it won't go over well and people won't want to play with you.

Not having your essence in DR isn't quite as bad but I do see people being all like *sigh* about it.
And people are also entitled to kick you, as far as I understand the line is simply drawn at basically harassment.
But people can still kick you for not playing like the group wants no one is forced to play with them.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

I'm not sure that's the best example because there are many people who are only there because SE put relics behind it and wouldn't be otherwise.

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Honestly the same can be said for basically all content in the game.. even on the simplest level. If you took tombstones away from the roulettes no one would ever do them.. so its safe to say players are only doing them because tomes are put behind them..

Can you imagine the queue times newer players would face if they took the tomes away

Thing is players really don't expect that much. Noone will ever sigh or frown upon you if you queue into your dungeon roulette and don't pop food or pots on boss fights or anything extreme like that. But having a basic understanding of your job really isn't a big ask..

DR is a bit different because the lost actions and essences make a substantial difference and can literally cut the time the duty takes in half And there's literally no reason not to use any. Using them only makes it easier less mechanics to deal with, less chance of getting doomed and killed, less mettle lost... there's literally no reason at all to not use any essences.

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

how does that invalidate my point or make it a bad example? I'm only doing DR to get the relic too, but I want it to be over quickly as possible so I use the essences the game throws at you in Bozja
that's like, the very least that should be expected from someone doing DR and only doing it for the relic, imo

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But wouldn't they only have those if they engaged with Bozja enough to get out and farm the ones needed? If someone isn't interested in doing that, and is only doing DR because their relic is locked behind it, then they may not know/have those essences because they don't want to engage with a piece of optional content to that level.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

Honestly the same can be said for basically all content in the game.. even on the simplest level. If you took tombstones away from the roulettes no one would ever do them.. so its safe to say players are only doing them because tomes are put behind them..

Can you imagine the queue times newer players would face if they took the tomes away

Thing is players really don't expect that much. Noone will ever sigh or frown upon you if you queue into your dungeon roulette and don't pop food or pots on boss fights or anything extreme like that. But having a basic understanding of your job really isn't a big ask..

DR is a bit different because the lost actions and essences make a substantial difference and can literally cut the time the duty takes in half And there's literally no reason not to use any. Using them only makes it easier less mechanics to deal with, less chance of getting doomed and killed, less mettle lost... there's literally no reason at all to not use any essences.

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That's exactly why we have roulettes. They're not there for us vets. Why bother with a system like that when we could get daily missions instead? It's the one guaranteed way they can keep the instances populated.

And as I mentioned to the other poster about DR, you'd need to go out and engage with Bozja a lot more than some might want to to get those essences. I remember when DR first came out and there were threads where people were like "Why aren't they farming essences??" and others were like "Because I don't want to stay in this zone any longer than I have to".

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

But wouldn't they only have those if they engaged with Bozja enough to get out and farm the ones needed? If someone isn't interested in doing that, and is only doing DR because their relic is locked behind it, then they may not know/have those essences because they don't want to engage with a piece of optional content to that level.

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considering you have to be at least rank 10 and have done CLL once to get access to DR? yes, I assume someone engaged long enough to at least get some essences

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Originally Posted by Rinhi

considering you have to be at least rank 10 and have done CLL once to get access to DR? yes, I assume someone engaged long enough to at least get some essences

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Some Essences, sure, but not enough for the 15+ runs you'll need for the relic. I don't really use anything in DR beyond lost cures to attempt to make up for the complete lack of healing I receive.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Some Essences, sure, but not enough for the 15+ runs you'll need for the relic. I don't really use anything in DR beyond lost cures to attempt to make up for the complete lack of healing I receive.

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If lost cure is what you're using as a warrior, you're doing it VERY wrong. You should be using Martialist (+60% damage) at a minimum and your healing via Nascent Flash, Equilibrium, and Storm's path should be more than enough to keep you healed.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

If lost cure is what you're using as a warrior, you're doing it VERY wrong. You should be using Martialist (+60% damage) at a minimum and your healing via Nascent Flash, Equilibrium, and Storm's path should be more than enough to keep you healed.

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Actually running DR as a Ninja, and yea I'm pretty much only using Lost Cures to keep myself and occasionally others alive when no one else is healing. I'm not really a fan of the barrage of gimmick actions I'd have to sort through, and I don't have enough of the good ones to use them every single DR anyways. I'm 100% in it for the relic and only the relic.

The only way to run DR is to run it on DRK with irregular essence combo'd with at least a lost font of power for burst windows.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Some Essences, sure, but not enough for the 15+ runs you'll need for the relic. I don't really use anything in DR beyond lost cures to attempt to make up for the complete lack of healing I receive.

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You can get 100+ of the tank/healer damage essences in like an hour by just running back and forth hitting the mobs directly outside of the spawn hub in bozja. Getting 15 to cover your DR runs is trivial and would take less than 15 minutes.

If you are unwilling to do that to do 60-72% more DPS and help a DR run go significantly faster, you're a leech.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Actually running DR as a Ninja, and yea I'm pretty much only using Lost Cures to keep myself and occasionally others alive when no one else is healing. I'm not really a fan of the barrage of gimmick actions I'd have to sort through, and I don't have enough of the good ones to use them every single DR anyways. I'm 100% in it for the relic and only the relic.

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It is easy to get essences, and I get you are just for the relic but your reason for being is moot. You be willing to do the bare min of just running around to get essences to speed up the process for everyone including yourself.

"I'm only doing it for the relic". I mean no shit? That's the entire point of why DR was made.

I hate using the DF and I'm only doing it for the rewards... doesn't mean I'll refuse to even try making use of my job's kit. Because I know if I half-heart it on purpose I'm wasting these strangers' time. Just like I try to respect other people's time in real life.

Courtesy and effort applies to everything in life. Doesn't mater if it's "just a game". And when it comes with playing with random 3~7 strangers you're a lot more likely to make things unfun for them by "freestyling" or freeloading than by doing the best you can.
You don't have to play like "pro" and you don't have to be called out in-duty. But if that's not the attitude you pull outside of the game, you shouldn't be expecting people to be OK with you pulling it in an online game. It's also a community.
And as a game, if you're not finding it fun to play with the system's bare basics, you shouldn't be doing it at all. There are other kinds of contents in this that do not involve dragging people down in lv80 instances. If only SE didn't lock content completely IRRELEVANT to the pve experience behind progressing in the MSQ, I'm sure this problem would be at the very least reduced a bit.

The attitude that you're entitled to every reward, even if it's for doing content you clearly do not enjoy, is pretty freaking rude too.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

You can get 100+ of the tank/healer damage essences in like an hour by just running back and forth hitting the mobs directly outside of the spawn hub in bozja. Getting 15 to cover your DR runs is trivial and would take less than 15 minutes.

If you are unwilling to do that to do 60-72% more DPS and help a DR run go significantly faster, you're a leech.

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Considering over the course of rank 1-15 I got maybe 3-7 of the "good" essences I needed to stay alive or do extra damage I'm wondering where you're getting all these consistent drops.

It's RNG to get, RNG to "appraise" and you're also expecting hours of grinding ON TOP of the mindless grind to get to 15 and get the weapons or else I'm a "leech"?



Gee.. why do so many people hate Bozja? I wonder.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

Considering over the course of rank 1-15 I got maybe 3-7 of the "good" essences I needed to stay alive or do extra damage I'm wondering where you're getting all these consistent drops.

It's RNG to get, RNG to "appraise" and you're also expecting hours of grinding ON TOP of the mindless grind to get to 15 and get the weapons or else I'm a "leech"?



Gee.. why do so many people hate Bozja? I wonder.

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Grinding for 10h at level 15 is not the same as grinding for 10h between 1-15.

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Originally Posted by Nethereal

Grinding for 10h at level 15 is not the same as grinding for 10h between 1-15.

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So far at 15 I have not noticed an incredible increase in the amount of drops on trash. So now rather than do duties and other content I'm locked to grinding forever in Bozja while making next to no progress on anything just so someone else can save 15 -25 minutes on one or two runs? .. Whee.

If I can manage the mechanics and have my rotation down, I think that's plenty. It ain't savage.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

Considering over the course of rank 1-15 I got maybe 3-7 of the "good" essences I needed to stay alive or do extra damage I'm wondering where you're getting all these consistent drops.

It's RNG to get, RNG to "appraise" and you're also expecting hours of grinding ON TOP of the mindless grind to get to 15 and get the weapons or else I'm a "leech"?



Gee.. why do so many people hate Bozja? I wonder.

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I don't think Bozja is good either, but it's pretty clear you just don't understand how fragments actually drop and where essences come from. Your lack of essences is a direct consequence of your ignorance, not the design of the content in this case.

Mobs in the first area have an increased drop rate to accommodate the first few quests where you need to obtain fragments. Mass pull and kill the plants, orbons and mudpuppys outside of the spawn fort. This is a common method to get the Bozjan Earring, which requires you to appraise 1000 fragments. Getting the 15 essences necessary to cover all of your DR runs should take less than 20 minutes. You can also buy all of these fragments from the marketboard if you don't feel like spending 20 minutes killing mobs.

Alternatively, you can cluster farm in a dedicated group and easily buy a ton of pure essences, which are even more powerful than standard essences.

I've seen 55 minute runs of DR, and I've seen 25 minute runs of DR. I've had entire runs of Lacus Litore be forced to abort because 5 essence-less DPS volunteer for Lyon and wiped the raid. The difference essences bring for the ease they can obtained is staggering.

Anyone who refuses to put in 15-20 minutes of preparation to pull their weight in the ~10 hours they are going to spend in DR doing 15 runs, they are absolutely a leech.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

So far at 15 I have not noticed an incredible increase in the amount of drops on trash. So now rather than do duties and other content I'm locked to grinding forever in Bozja while making next to no progress on anything just so someone else can save 15 -25 minutes on one or two runs? .. Whee.

If I can manage the mechanics and have my rotation down, I think that's plenty. It ain't savage.

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That's because those frags have fixed drop rate from certain mobs. They don't and have never changed. They are not exactly random either. Know what you're farming for and the mobs that drops 'em. Shout in chat to form a full frag farming group and you'll walk out with at least 80-100 if not, more useable essences after roughly an hour of farming.

All you need to get started is to have 1 puller (properly equipped with correct setup) and 1-2 mob clearer to farm in one specific area. In a party of 8 you can have 3 separate group (3/3/2) to farm in 3 different area and still get ALL of the spoils. Heck if you're short of manpower, a BLM can solo farm one area by slapping an Essence of Beast and stay in Umbral Ice mode to spam Lost Flare Star.

Then, there are also few outliers (myself included): I solo farm frags randomly while waiting for CLL mostly. I'd do CE sometimes to take a break from the monotonous farm and by some chance I'd land myself in a party in said CE. Past CE, I went back to my frag farming spot and does not leave the party. They can enjoy the free loots, Idm. There is literally no downside in staying in a party, but 9 out of 10 times I would see these players simply leaving the party despite meeting again and again from subsequent CEs. Yo, they could've enjoyed those free loots I'm farming if they stayed. Sadly they don't. They could've asked if I want to register the subsequent CE spawns to make sure they can enter in case I don't wish to enter together---again, sadly they don't.

Don't like forming a group for the sake of solo enjoyment? There's Bozjan Nepenthe (and another type of rank I mob just outside of the home base) for skill fragments, and Red Chocobo (and another type of rank II mob next to their area) for awakening fragments, they are all soloable with reasonable pull size. What usually occurs however, are players usually plain lazy, doesn't invest enough time, or simply doing it wrong. That's it.
/shrug

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

That's because those frags have fixed drop rate from certain mobs. They don't and have never changed. They are not exactly random either. Know what you're farming for and the mobs that drops 'em. Shout in chat to form a full frag farming group and you'll walk out with at least 80-100 if not, more useable essences after roughly an hour of farming.

All you need to get started is to have 1 puller (properly equipped with correct setup) and 1-2 mob clearer to farm in one specific area. In a party of 8 you can have 3 separate group (3/3/2) to farm in 3 different area and still get ALL of the spoils. Heck if you're short of manpower, a BLM can solo farm one area by slapping an Essence of Beast and stay in Umbral Ice mode to spam Lost Flare Star.

Don't like forming a group for the sake of solo enjoyment? There's Bozjan Nepenthe (and another type of rank I mob just outside of the home base) for skill fragments, and Red Chocobo (and another type of rank II mob next to their area) for awakening fragments, they are all soloable with reasonable pull size. What usually occurs however, are players usually plain lazy, doesn't invest enough time, or simply doing it wrong. That's it.
/shrug

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

I don't think Bozja is good either, but it's pretty clear you just don't understand how fragments actually drop and where essences come from. Your lack of essences is a direct consequence of your ignorance, not the design of the content in this case.

Mobs in the first area have an increased drop rate to accommodate the first few quests where you need to obtain fragments. Mass pull and kill the plants, orbons and mudpuppys outside of the spawn fort. This is a common method to get the Bozjan Earring, which requires you to appraise 1000 fragments. Getting the 15 essences necessary to cover all of your DR runs should take less than 20 minutes. You can also buy all of these fragments from the marketboard if you don't feel like spending 20 minutes killing mobs.

Alternatively, you can cluster farm in a dedicated group and easily buy a ton of pure essences, which are even more powerful than standard essences.

I've seen 55 minute runs of DR, and I've seen 25 minute runs of DR. I've had entire runs of Lacus Litore be forced to abort because 5 essence-less DPS volunteer for Lyon and wiped the raid. The difference essences bring for the ease they can obtained is staggering.

Anyone who refuses to put in 15-20 minutes of preparation to pull their weight in the ~10 hours they are going to spend in DR doing 15 runs, they are absolutely a leech.

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Both of these posts being very helpful and showing again, how bad the content is and the disconnect between someone who lives it and someone who does it because it's locking what they want behind it.

Thank you both for your assistance and this should make this easier... though not any more enjoyable.

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Originally Posted by Awha

It is easy to get essences, and I get you are just for the relic but your reason for being is moot. You be willing to do the bare min of just running around to get essences to speed up the process for everyone including yourself.

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First, I don't think the essences for DPS classes are a significant DPS increase. They mainly seem to just make DPS tankier; which is kind of moot since I'm not really dying much. The few I've gotten that do increase my DPS seem trivial, so I'm not going to sit around Bozja farming them.

This is what happens when you tie the relic to a dumb gimmick zone most people don't enjoy; they're going to do the bare minimum. If showing up with only Lost Cures stops working I'll consider either spending more time in Bozja or dropping the relic entirely. Until then, the situation is what it is.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

You can get 100+ of the tank/healer damage essences in like an hour by just running back and forth hitting the mobs directly outside of the spawn hub in bozja. Getting 15 to cover your DR runs is trivial and would take less than 15 minutes.

If you are unwilling to do that to do 60-72% more DPS and help a DR run go significantly faster, you're a leech.

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I'm level 14 in Bozja and I only have like 10 of the tank damage essences. You're either lying or lucky. Either way I'm not running DR as a tank class.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

First, I don't think the essences for DPS classes are a significant DPS increase. They mainly seem to just make DPS tankier; which is kind of moot since I'm not really dying much. The few I've gotten that do increase my DPS seem trivial, so I'm not going to sit around Bozja farming them.

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DPS have...
Essence of Skirmisher
Increases damage dealt by 20% and critical hit rate by 15%

If that much is still not 'significant' by your standard then I'm unsure how large do you want an increase to be, considering DPSes already have their own damage increasing traits. I'm not even going to type the rest of DPS' essences because they are either harder to farm (Deep Essences and Pure Essences) or rather scarce by comparison (again, Deep Essences). Even that, regular Skirmisher is already a potent buff.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

I'm level 14 in Bozja and I only have like 10 of the tank damage essences. You're either lying or lucky. Either way I'm not running DR as a tank class.

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I'll use LittleImp's post since you're quoting them:

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

I don't think Bozja is good either, but it's pretty clear you just don't understand how fragments actually drop and where essences come from. Your lack of essences is a direct consequence of your ignorance, not the design of the content in this case.

Mobs in the first area have an increased drop rate to accommodate the first few quests where you need to obtain fragments. Mass pull and kill the plants, orbons and mudpuppys outside of the spawn fort. This is a common method to get the Bozjan Earring, which requires you to appraise 1000 fragments. Getting the 15 essences necessary to cover all of your DR runs should take less than 20 minutes. You can also buy all of these fragments from the marketboard if you don't feel like spending 20 minutes killing mobs.

Alternatively, you can cluster farm in a dedicated group and easily buy a ton of pure essences, which are even more powerful than standard essences.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

First, I don't think the essences for DPS classes are a significant DPS increase. They mainly seem to just make DPS tankier; which is kind of moot since I'm not really dying much. The few I've gotten that do increase my DPS seem trivial, so I'm not going to sit around Bozja farming them.

This is what happens when you tie the relic to a dumb gimmick zone most people don't enjoy; they're going to do the bare minimum. If showing up with only Lost Cures stops working I'll consider either spending more time in Bozja or dropping the relic entirely. Until then, the situation is what it is.

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Bruh the DR essences are huge buffs.

Running Castrum right now with a a50 Conj. Why? They didn’t see class quests necessary